i think you do a disservice to gimps……

Still and all he must not be feeling very happy with the poor response to the bullying tactics he used …because they have not worked . 1,000,000 householods have not paid , that must be a source of some disappointment to him.

Are they not going to let him outa the post room till we’ve all paid. That should stop those late payments. ;)

Actually lock Enda and Eamonn in there with Phil. How were these local services funded before you might ask. They were funded from our taxes. The local services portion of our taxes has been reallocated to pour money down a bank hole and fill the coffers of the banks. Banks that flooded this country with cheap loaned money which fuelled the Housing Market which in turn led to the destruction of the Irish economy!

With less than 50% of household refusing to pay this tax the government has no mandate to continue with this fiasco. Would this foolish government scrap this tax immediately and refund those who have registered or paid.

Following on from our 10,000 attended Protest at the Fine Gael Ard Fheis on 31st March, we are holding a similar protest at the Labour Party Conference in Galway this coming Saturday 14th April. We shall be gathering at Eyre Square. After the Labour Party’s disregard for their core voters you are welcome to attend to show your dissatisfaction. Contrary to what was highlighted on news coverage of the Fine Gael Ard Fheis it was a very good humoured Protest March, of men, women and children.

The staged walkthrough of 5 Fine Gael delegates conveniently followed by TV cameras was a brief and comic distraction for all and didn’t fool anybody! Nice to see RTE showing themselves as the state sponsored propaganda machine!

Fools No More!

Hear hear . Fools no more !
I am going on Sat , with a large group of family .

He’s checking for the 153,000 payments which are supposedly in the post! Well according to what the government would have you believe.

Don’t start singing the “We’re all going to Galway” joke Suzy. Not in front of your children. :D

And meeting more family and friends from all over the country too Susie

They will never do that …. It is all spin doctoring !

And how come in some of the photos many of the mail bags are marked Great Britain. Did the PR company run out of Irish bags to stuff full of paper?

@ Richard Keogh

No! Post comes from the UK in those bags and eventually they will go back with post from here to there! But yes, Richard, for the moment they could be filled with shreaded paper by the Bull Hogan to pretend that they’re payments! hee hee

Jimbo. I am the same as self employed. Its a complete disgrace the way the self employed are treated in this country and yet we are expected to be the ones to bring the country back from the brink yet (1) We get charged employer PRSI for giving someone a job compared to the net gain off someone off the dole and having a better income which can boost the economy (2) We pay income tax at circa €8K compared to staff (and other PAYE workers) at circa €16K as we do not get the PAYE allowance. (3) We are (well I am) constantly writing cheques for Government Agencies who are trying to justify their existence and charge indirect tax for their “services”. You and I know there are other things too as the list is endless.

I am not telling people to pay or not pay the HHC. I paid it as I see it as a tax and therefor in order to get a Tax Clearance Cert as far as I am aware it must be paid. The Tax Clearance Cert is so important these days and invaluable..

I honestly don’t know how I will vote the referendum. Part of me things yes as its control but then again we had this in previuos treaties and Germany and France were the first to break it so is it worth anything and then the otherside is if it is enforced it probably is not a bad thing as it will force Government’s to live within the means of a states tax system so we don’t have a repeat of the mess.

But the thing is Eugene, you say it will force the administration to live within its means, but the politicians will continue to have plenty of “means” to live on while the rest of us will have no means to live on.

Ann, Not necersarily, politicians have shelf life of max 5 years if the people decide and people forget that. If people want reform demand it of your politicians and if you don’t get it don’t vote them next time. We are the ones who keep them in there job so a lot has to be said about the Irish public for voting in (1) Tax Cheats (2) Perjurors etc. We get what we elect. Do we sit back and say same old same old or drive change by contacting TD’s and demanding changes such as if found guilty of corruption you lose pension etc and SEVERE FINES/PENALTIES up to 5 years salary as thats the term in office and if it goes back to 15 years in office then 15 years salary. No public represensative should be allowed to profit from corruption and thats the message we need to demand. This is a republic owned by the people but the people do not exercise their voices enough. The sit in houses. coffee shops, bars and winge and moan but how many have actually contacted TD’s to try and drive change, very few I would say. The other thing is people believe things they hear from politicians from the Government and the opposition without looking for the facts themselves. Each side will spin it in their favour. Take Primetime the other week in relation to HHC, a Sinn Fein Councillor came rightly out and said that they support rates in the North as people don’t have to pay for school books, NHS etc but what was not said is that Westminster pumps in something like £7Bn pounds a year. If they removed the £7Bn pounds from Westminster people would be paying for everything like the republic and it would be far more expensive. On the otherside the Government spins things in their favour too all the time it up to people to read and find the truth.

I am undecided about the treaty myself as I said but I will have to make up my mind in the next few weeks. As I said the idea is good but the practicallity is different. So many people know how much they have cut back because of the lack of money coming in and not be able to borrow to refinance debt etc in the last few years and that is the route of the problem. We (as a nation) just borrowed and borrowed and it has hit us in the face like a train. It might not mean more austerity as people are paying off their debts now more than ever and savings are through the roof in the banks so if that policy was applied to the running of the country it may mean short term pain for long term gain but on the other side I am unsure how much more pain the country can take.

:)

…and maybe those who did pay against their better judgement , might consider those of us who are protesting the charge.

@Eamonn let’s see how your tune changes when you are asked for 300 to 600 in the next year or two when they bring a proper council tax in.

Not all people who paid it , did so willingly . A Lot were bullied by hogan and his minions. We saw them at the FG Ard Fheis . A lot of elderly people or people struggling and in fear of more bills paid this charge.We will still speak up for them, even if they have paid.
Bullying is what Hogan seems to be good at.

Congrats on being able to afford to pay. So can most of us. How able a little solidarity with those who can’t? In my opinion the people who paid either support the government and it’s policies or ARE weak. You can’t have it both ways. Pick a side and show some moral courage.

You said it, you can afford it and you don’t care if it goes into a black hole, your exactly what the government needs. You should really start to care about what is going on in your country. Your post is actually freaky

Its alright Eamon, I got a lot of red thumbs :-) im just surprised at the level of hatred been aimed at people who have paid, it shocks me if im honest. Anyway have I nice evening.

An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.

Louise
I resent the fact that you accuse any of us of hatred, I do not ”do ” hatred . It is for love of each other and of our country that we object to this charge. It is called solidarity ,and standing up for injustices . But you go ahead and keep your head buried in the sand and have others stand up for you . Maybe you should come to a public meeting and or protest , I guarantee you will meet decent law abiding people ( Unless there are FG ”agents provocateurs there too as there were in Dublin at the conf centre) :)

Divide and conquer.. I am
Not registering and I have many valid reasons for not doing so, but none more important than me standing with the huge amount of people whom cannot afford to pay the charge!
I respect the decision of anyone who chose to pay.. Thats democracy for you, however I expect the same respect in return and not being abused and being labeled by people who chose to pay! They are certainly not ‘carrying me’ I can tell you.I’ve paid as much taxes than anyone in the past few years

Susie, seriously the school yard name calling is getting old!!! In my opinion which I am allowed to have these is a lot of online hate towards people who have paid, I have never said anything bad about the people who havent and I would expect the same respect from them however its not the case here, we are all adults here and some need to grow up. By the way you say you’re law abiding and tax compliant, well I have to burst your bubble but if you were due to pay the tax and you havent your neither of the above, now thats your choice but you can’t have it both ways, you’ll have to take that one on the chin

Louise
You are mistaken . I do not do hate or name calling . It is a long time since I was in a school yard too and even then I do not recall myself being a name caller ….. However, I am law abiding and tax compliant . This Household charge is wrong and I will continue to see it as wrong and dispute it .
Louise , dear , you have a nice day .Thank you for your comments to me but we will have to agree to disagree(especially on the name calling bit ! ) Bye bye :)

Really sick of this now. I paid and anyone who has the balls to call me these names to my face just ask for an address and lets see if it happens…. I am disgusted with the louts that have not paid… And Susie, leave it out with the partiot stuff….who do you think you are…

Declan Cotter
What is your problem ? Are you missing your friends ? Where are they all now that the deadline is passed ? I will tell you . They were not real . You came on here and spoke for your self and you were used . I admire you for standing for what you believe in , BUT you have been left out on a limb. They disappeared because they were names in cyberspace , and do not exist. They were used to bully and scare people into paying this unfair charge . It says alot about them behind the names. Anyway , You live in Galway , I think thats what you told me before . Come along and meet us . Honestly we do not bite. We feel just as let down.
Bring mcbab and Eugene too .

Declan Cotter
I am not a lout . I am a patriot . And who the f**k do you think you are speaking to me or any one like that ? You and your buddies have me so scared ! Do your worst .

Hey Dec,
Go on, give us your address so :-)

Taidi

That would be an “ESTIMATED” 890,000 subservients as just UNDER 650,000 households had been processed up to yesterday morning. There is still an “ESTIMATED” 153,000 postal applications to be processed, while it is “BELIEVED” that there are 74,000 registration forms in local authority offices. (however it doest not say that these 74,000 forms have actually been filled in)

I “ESTIMATE” that the majority of households did not register and I “BELIEVE” that what we are being told by the administration is a big fat lie.

Spending that money for the trip will go alot further than it will in the governments coffers, plus we get value for money and see it working..
Thank you have a nice night…

What’s it got to do with you mcbab, how people spend their money?! You seriously have a distinct dislike towards Susie and Reada! Why?!? Afraid of strong minded and willed women?! I’ll tell you, if there were more like them we’d be in a much better place.!

mcbab missing the point again. One day you’ll wake up and realise these people are not the enemy.

mcbab I could afford to pay this charge as could my family. We have decided to give our support to people in Ireland who cannot afford this payment. I’d rather burn my €100 than give it to this spineless government that has decided to put bondholders and big business before the interests of its citizens.

I’ve made my feeling clear above. But no mcbab you prefer to leave snide remarks about me instead. As your pal Shitter said to me and 10000 protesters outside the FG Árd Fheis “Get A Life!”

Mcbab
I never said I can or can not afford the €100. But it is my money I will be spending and nobody will tell me how I should do so .I am protesting the charge because it is unfair. I will be contributing to the Economy however and providing work for the busdriver / company . What is your €100 doing for your community ? Oh and I am not spending anywhere near €100, and I am guaranteed to meet good decent people.

mcnab… trying to plan a counter demonstration….show these muppets up

Yeah declan, good luck with that!!

Oh, and quit smokin the crack :-)

@Mcbab

100 euros to Galway, WTF…………………do you fly 1st class????????. I’ll be using my state issued free travel pass to get to Galway on Saturday, so it wont cost me a single cent!
And before you start banging on about welfare scroungers, I eared my free travel when I was healthy enough to work and paid the higher rate tax, as a well paid single woman with a great career and a fulfilling social life.

Dont know if thats the real number, the goverment are being very cagey about exemptions and how they are counted. We are doing well. He looks like he is scared to open that sack, dont blame him, god only knows wot people posted to him. ;)

I am not a backstabber or a weakling thank you very much!!! I am only someone who obeys the law, now cut it with your insults, its getting boring.

Don’t worry Louise, we’ll do our best to get you a refund! ;)

Hey Louise
You might consider joining the campaign to support us in getting you that refund ! :)

Louise, our Government is handing over 1,500,000,000 euro to AIB unsecured unguaranteed bondholders this week. They thank you for your 100 euro contribution.

Truly stupid backstabbing idiots who already pay a USC. What a bunch of stupid sheep, if they had of said €200 these idiots still wound have paid.

Thanks Rèada.
That was a kind gesture to make to Louise.
She is obviously a law abiding citizen.
Louise…?
Will you still obey the law when they ask you for a couple of thousand Euro in property tax next year?
I admire you for your simplistic outlook on the terms “law abiding”.
I am law abiding too but if you push me too far I try and do something about it.
Anyway…best of luck Louise.

God lads, everyone is entitled to their opinion, I understand why people are angry and I dont think the tax is fair but all I was saying really was that I was sick of been called names because I paid, I’m not saying anything hurtful to you guys who havent paid, each to their own, I think ye should just leave of the name calling cause it only comes across as bad as others trying to bully people into paying. Now thanks for all your offers of help to get a refund when the time comes but im good thanks and paying 100quid is cheaper here than paying 1400 as it is in other European countries, now I think ill leave it there, enjoy your evenings

Jesus Joe!! Get a grip, there is no need for that carry on!!

Sorry, over the top maybe but being called a back stabber and alike for paying the charge isnt fair. Ps i wouldn actually rip someones head off. Maybe a clatter instead.

Wrong target for your anger Joe McDermott. It’s too late to grow a spine now, but there’s always next year.

Louise @
I am a law abiding and Tax compliant . You paid this charge willingly , from your comments . There are people who were bullied into paying it against their better judgement so , don’t come across all coy now. It is my duty to oppose a bad law . this is a bad law .
Joe Mc Dermot @
Maybe you and stray can meet up at the lab party conf on sat , It is a while since I have seen a proper straightener …. ha ha . Or maybe Joe you should just learn to take it on the chin ! After all you hve paid that charge so you should be used to doiong as you are told .

@ Louise
I hope you won’t have to eat your words , because even the thug Hogan said property tax will increase at least threefold next year .

Susie. You crack me up! You are on fire again today. What’s your secret? Is tusa Gráinne Mhaol!

Calling people backstabber for paying for services we all avail of … Seriously get over it it’s 100 euro! The USC is a central gov charge totally different I’m so sick of you all going on and on about this when you haven’t even taken time to read what it is about! We are one of the only countries in Europe who don’t pay a similar tax. And to be so petty as to say the gov are using it pay the bond holders come off it get on the back of another conspiracy theory as this one simply does not exist! I’m sure all of you people were giving out just as much about the last government as u are about this one! We’re in a situation that needs to be rectified for our children so they have a future out of debt so instead of moaning and groaning its about time people stood up and do what is needed to be done to get us out of the mess the PREVIOUS government got us into!

Stray Mutt…Call to my home and call me a backstabber in person….lets see how that works out…. Truly sick to the teeth of Reada, Susie and the SF gang banging on… Think i might go to Galway to protest against your protest Reada…get right in your faces…..

Kathy Tuck
You are the one who hasn’t got a clue . We know the previous gov got us into this but the present gov are not doing anything to get us out of it like they promised …. The children of today are my children and I am damned if I am going to sit back and do nothing to preserve their security . Why don’t you rfead something other than the party rag ,and open your mind to alternatives .
Declan Cotter @
Likewise I am sure. However get your facts straight . I am not SF , or any other political party member . I am a non party activist for the Campaignagainst the household tax (and any and all austerity measures… )

Declan Cotter
Sure come along , We make everyone welcome !

Declan cotter. I have never insulted anyone unprovoked. You can go where ever you like. But god help you if you think you can intimidate me by protesting right in my face. If you’re timid enough to toe the line, you’re no match for me!

@ Louise I made a general comment about the assumptions you were all making about those who chose to pay Why do u need to make your response personal?? I did read what the government put out I also read a lot of what the opposition put out and I like many other made the decision to pay for the services the my family utilise. Im sure u are aware as are the rest of the people of Ireland the gov had no choice in implementing this tax it was set in the IMF deal. Get a new cause because those of us who paid don’t care what u think!

Hey Kath, I hope you ment that for Susie and not of

sorry yeah of course it was ment for Susie sorry Louise i copletely agree with you and what you are saying!

Kathy
You read what the government put out …. Well the rest of us would have loved the opportunity .Where did you read this information ? All i got was a card in the door with about 5 short paragraphs and soft pictures and ”final notice” printed across the front of it. Not really what anyone would call information ! You” made a general comment about the assumptions you were all making about those who chose to pay ”
This is not an issue for generalising , it is not a game ,people are suffering . Do you realise that ?
Have you really looked at your neighbours , how they are coping ?
”Im sure u are aware as are the rest of the people of Ireland the gov had no choice in implementing this tax it was set in the IMF deal” How are YOU sure ? because I know this government are not doing their best . They have lied from the word go , they are looking after big business and corporations and they follow orders from Europe or Germany to be precise. I do not ”do ” causes. This household charge is personal to me . I will continue to fight it until it is abolished. I voted this government in , gave them my number one . NEVER again. They will never abuse my trust again.
It might be good for every one if from time to time if they found a cause they could take up :)

Sussie that’s fine that’s your cause. We are all entitled to have an opinion. My opinion was that it was right to pay this charge and I feel that it’s unfair for people to be called backstabbing for doing so! Good luck with your cause :-)

What would you stand up for?

Eamonn
This is why we are objecting now , because if we all went like sheep and paid the charge and next year cant afford it then we will not have a leg to stand on . I will not pay it and I will not be a hypocrite .

Ask Bertie Ahern, former Taoiseach if you hadn’t noticed.. How doesn’t even have a tax clearance cert!!

Eugene be honest, who do you work for/support?
This is being brought in at the wrong time, its very obviously inflammatory as the goverment are asking us to pay €100 to register for future hikes in charges. At this moment in time many of us are in negative equity, struggling to pay mortgages on properties that are poorly built and mostly unsellable. We have also paid massive amounts of stamp duty and/or council levy. Now we are in the shit. And every single one of those who got us here walk around like they own the place. Some of them are even paid a salary by nama of €200,000 to administer their own developments that are currently on the state books. And all the while our much idolised unsecured bondholders are being paid.
Now the goverment made huge mistakes with this charge. they didn’t tie it to reform. They are happy to implement a new charge without explaining what is going to improve (which is nothing) and the waste will continue. They also excluded council tenants which is blatantly discriminating and singling out mortgage payers, we all use these public services, why single out the tax payers who are simply trying to pay their way and ensure a bit of stability, and also a product (the house) which they have already paid tax on in various guises.
Next problem is the fact that a home does not provide an income. Why should it be taxed?
We already pay several taxes…that have covered the funding for councils for the past fifty years, so what has changed? Oh yeah, we bailed out the banks. Therefore this money is not going to the councils, it is going straight back into the exchequer to pay off the gambling mistakes of a bunch of criminals who are still walking free. This recession has not affected them but it has dramatically affected the vast majority of middle earners and beyond.
Considering a million have not paid goes to disprove ur idea that the non payers are losing ground. I can’t pay and I won’t pay.
If our goverment saw the light and stopped paying unsecured bondholders and seriously moved on with pressing charges against the gangsters that got us here people would feel slightly less aggravated about being used as cash machines.

Hi Niamh, I am self employed the last 3 years after I was made redundant in 2009 and don’t support any party. I have always voted who I think will do the best job running the country at any time. I don’t agree with the charge but we are really screwed and I just want to get the country back on track and if €100 means that it will help then so be it, I have nieces and nephews who had absolutely nothing to do with the mess which if we are being honest we all played a roll. We had blocklayers on over €100K a year, you couldn’t get a plumber to put a hose in your back yard as it was not worthwhile for them, people were changing jobs non-stop, the list is endless.

I myself am in negative equity like so many (and regardless what people say “it doesn’t matter unless your selling” I do not agree with this as it is a horrible place to be). I also have to pay the 2nd home charge of €200 on the property as it was an apartment which no longer suits my needs so I have rented a house and rented out my apartment and even though I do not own a second property I have to pay the €200 charge aswel. A lot of people who are doing similar to me are unaware of this and the penalties are huge if you do not pay. I have to pay these charges as self employed and need a Tax Clearance Cert each year.

The point is Niamh what are the alternatives? Burn the bondholders? Sounds great and yes I would be in favour of it to a degree but step back and think for a minute. Lets say the bondholder was a credit union or an Irish Company (doing well at present with AA Status etc) and (1) we get to know who the bondholders are (2) we decide to burn them so (1) We know who they are and so does the shareholders so guess they will be pulling there money out as fast as they can or selling shares (2) we decide to burn them so we destroy a viable company and lose the jobs in that company and say there was 200 people employed there as no one would invest in them. It is a gamble and a very dangerous gamble one which I am unsure is worth it.

I agree with you excluding Social Housing is wrong and I am livid as I live in Wicklow and only a few weeks ago just under €6 million was awarded for doing up social housing and the people living in social housing are exempt. I have written to my local TD over this saying its a disgrace the people who are exempt are the first to benefit and also about the 2nd home tax for people in my situation or similar such as people who rented out their home as they could not afford the repayments, people who bought with family or friends and who are moving on with there lives whether its getting married or moving because of jobs and also couple that bought apartments (1 beds in particular) who are now starting a family and the property is not suitable. I know he is working on it for me and will be back in a couple of weeks or else he will be getting another load of grief.

On the NAMA thing its not really NAMA paying them. What is allowed there is the company continues trading with the same people at the top (only agreed by NAMA if proven not to mess around) and they are allowed to draw a salary from there company so in affect NAMA is not paying them it is there own company. It’s a very thin line on it and if any of the people who are doing this are found to be lying then the book should be thrown at them. People seem to forget that not all developers had a choice about NAMA. The loan book was sold to NAMA from the bank once it was over a certain size and regardless if the company was viable or not in you went which I think is terrible as now good developers (there are a few) are tainted as bad as they are in NAMA.

I think everyone in the country wants people locked up but we live in a democracy and at present I honestly don’t know if the people who brought the country to its knees did anything illegal. It is not illegal for a business to fail. We will have to wait and see what happens but I do have faith in the Gardai investigating the files as they have had there fair share of cuts in salaries so will be looking very closely on what they can charge them on and I will say it will be something we are not even thinking of at the moment. We live in hope as its the one thing that keeps us going each day.

Eugene that is a very honest response and I genuinely respect you for it. I think you along with a lot of people feel very despondent about our situation. You seem to think that by paying this hhc all will work out, it won’t. There needs to be a radical shake up of thinking and ideas as to where cuts or taxes are implemented, the hhc is so uninspiring in its originality that it is just plain lazy. And the fact that the goverment thought that they could just slide it in and we wouldn’t notice or object is so arrogant and typical.
It is €100 this year but at what point will you not be able to afford it? Or at what point will you say this isn’t value for money, why am I paying this? Or at what point will you just say this is not right, the majority of people are struggling to put food on the table and to keep a roof over their heads, I will stand in solidarity with them?

Niamh, The HHC is a complete shambles as set out. People who are on the dole and six months plus in mortgage arrears have to pay it while people working in social housing are exempt, it is nuts and I know of people in social housing who want to pay the HHC as solidarity with there family and friends.

I do not think for one second the HHC will sort out the problem, it was far larger than that and real reform is needed in taxes, Civil Service but I think mostly in the people of Ireland. We need to look at what we can do instead of what we can’t do. Reform can be stop kicking ourselves down all the time and see if there is openings for business ideas etc that can help the country grow again instead of waiting for a job to come to you. The whole mind set of what can we get out of them and Ireland is a shithole needs to change FAST. This is a fantastic country with great people who I think are our biggest asset but for some reason they don’t push themselves sometimes. I seen in when I lived abroad and Irish were always looking for work and the same people arrived back in Ireland staright to the dole and ah I will get a job next month………

Well said Eugene..

I would welcome all bankers, developers and politicians who got us into this hell hole being referred to the dpp to be charged, convicted and sent to prison. Then people will be a lot more amenable to paying a household charge.

Off you go gingerman . We are still not going to pay.

Gingerman, shame on you! You want people who cannot afford to pay punished by the Revenue, yet I don’t see you calling for same for Bertie, Michael Fingleton, Lowry et al!!? You are a microcosm of the underlying problem in this country now.. You’d probably walk over your neighbour,starving on the ground, to get into the shop to buy your Ice cream!!

Its a ”let them eat cake ”arguement . Nonsense.

Don’t believe it’s a Revenue matter anyway. A charge not a tax. Anyway Revenue will be too busy with Bertie and Peeeeeeee Flynn

mcbab
You should come along and join us . So many decent good people , much nicer than yer one (The one with the dirty fingers) at the FG Ard Fheis.

Right so,
I’ll do it tomorrow.
Wait….shit….i can’t, i have to sign on tomorrow…

Tell ya what i’ll do it the next.
Wait…shit….i cant, i have a SF meeting to go to.

I know.. I’ll do it the day after.
Oh oh… can’t, have some protest to go to.

The following week, ok,..,,..
…if i don’t have anything on….ya know yerself….bud!?!

Ah fook it, what am i sayin,
sure you ya muppet,
yer already payin it for me.

Thanks For That :-)

THe ”mickey money ” is once a month and it goes towards bills already ! I have not paid the HHC , I am not a free loader , or a moocher ? I do not sponge , I aint on the dole, I am not a member of SF or any other political party . So give over your temper tantrums A N Other ….Nice name :)

A N Other – I’ll be using me government issued free travel pass to get to Galway on Saturday :O)))) Yaaaaaaaaaaay

PS – I shower daily and my house is spotless clean, ner a bit of dust or dirt in sight, I use some of me social welfare to buy soap and polish :O)). I live on 188 euros welfare payment Yaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyy – NOT!!

Hahahahaha. Your feckin hilarious. By far the funniest comment ever. Now if your going to get involved try and contribute something constructive. Shinners and scroungers…. Ah that’s brill.