I was listening to a fuel trader this evening and he was saying he expected a drop of eight dollars a barrel soon , the price of the barrel depends on circumstances on a worldwide scale not the FF handling of the economy and might I remind you that under repeated FF led governments when there was nearly full employment and a feel good factor FF was returned for 16 years to govern and probably some of the detractors here were also returning FF to govern .

@Mark: some of us have learned from our mistakes – never again!

move on to the here and now!

Believe it or not, you can more on to the here and now without forgetting about the past.

FF is opposition is like watching somebody who lost a house because they burnt it down moan about someone else not cleaning the mess up the way they want.

In Timmy defense, he probably doesn’t even know that FF are no longer in power. Timmy is only a danger to himself.

I agree Jerry and what FF are proposing is a good idea and it’s that idiot noonan who has no clue on economics how he is finance minister is beyond me…..cop yourself on noonan

People are fed up and angry .,they have every right to be. They also have a right to express themselves . Let the moderators do the moderation.

Martin you are too funny, read Jerry’s post again. You agree with him, as I do, but then your own post is the complete opposite to what you are agreeing with…

The Traitor has always been despised in Irish society, same as the thief. People associate both with FF, so it is understandable that they are hated.

What is really mind blowing is that some people still support FF in spite of the facts.

@ Rob: And yet they are failing to say from where they would cut the €145m necessary to pay for this measure. It’s false to suggest that that it would the €145m being spent in the economy would make up the €145m difference in the budget. While some consumers might save the money they save on petrol, most would spend it and only the VAT part of that (23% maximum) would be returned to the Exchequer.

They are putting an option out there, but not a realisable one unless somewhere is affected.

they are still right though.. petrol is far too expensive

Aye. It’s only a few months since they gave Bertie and Cowen a standing ovation, their National Exec. refused to condemn Ahern and Flynn in any way, only referring to the payments in a round about way. They are refusing to co-operate with CAB in to the money Pee Flynn took from the party, 50k in punts. Why couln’t they report him if he does not pay it to a charity.

They know that aul Pee pot would start talking if he is under threat and that he would end up sending a very large no. of FF TD’s from the last 30 years to the courthouse.

Fagan, Ahern did not get a standing ovation at the Ard Fheis. That is dishonest. Nat. Exec. had motions to expel them down (and expulsion is the most they could do after all) but the bold Bert and Pee resigning as members days before the meeting stopped the vote taking place (you can’t expel people that aren’t members after all). The party has said time and again that any investigation shall get the full co-operation of the party. CAB haven’t even been called on yet. The DPP is still considering the Mahon report as far as I am aware. And if you check it up, FF asked the government to hand the report to the DPP for full investigation (including the IR£50,000).

So please, if you feel the need to FF bash in every thread you are most welcome to. The party has many questions to answer and bad policy to be apologetic for, but that’s no excuse for you Fagan to be blatantly making things up/misrepresenting the facts!

Niall. FF are the aggrieved party in the 50k donation. Unless they report it to the Guards, then it does not matter what the Govt. decides. I could report it to the Guards and they would tell me that unless FF do so, then nothing will happen. I suspect that you know this as well as I do. FF’s Nat. Exec could have issued a statement condemning Ahern and Pee Flynn, of course one cannot expel people who have left. A firm statement could have been issued though, it was not. They only spoke of fund raising issues. FF are hoping to absolve themselves of any responsibility for the actions of its members, try to blame it on the Guards, the DPP or the present Govt. They are the only ones that have the legal right to do so.

Ironically if they did report them, it would mark FF as moving away from tolerating and having a sneaking regard for corruption and theft, but if they do and people start to talk then there will be many many well known names in the party of the last 30 years that will be in and out of court for years to come.

We both know that as well!

Meant to say Eoin. Gabh mo leithscéal.

Well, it costs a lot less to run the country now than it did when Fianna Failed was running the place into the ground.

Ye. Roll on don’t ask questions about past , bank robberies, missing people SF.

The vast majority of the people hate FF. I am just an ordinary decent citizen. Now how about that FFer?

Nah, ye made such a balls of the country we are going to enjoy hating ye for a good while yet.

It does not take effort to hate FF by the look of it. I think peoples faith in politics across the board is somewhat diminished to put it lightly. FF are not offering a solution here ?? Just politics..

If FF took some effort to admit that they banjaxed the country it might be a start. You could say Lenihan was misled and cornered by the banks, but the real damaged was done pre-2007 during aherns time with the growth of public service, the HSE, misleading those that bought into crazy house prices – remember aherns suicide speech, and let’s not forget the Drumcondra drainage port tunnel that will flood this week and cost us €3billion by the time it’s closed in the 2020’s.

Frank. There is no evidence to suggest that Lenihan was not aware of the true positions of the banks. He was a willful accomplice to them. If he hadn’t been misfortunate in his health, he would now be as reviled as Ahern. The debate will go on as to whether he was a shyster, which the evidence suggests or just the most incompetent Minister that we have ever had, and continuously unlucky, and that by co-incidence his party’s donors were consistently lucky.

Fagan there’s no evidence to say that he knew the full position no more than FG Labour the Shinners or any of the other people he feared would lose their pay cheque should the banks have closed their doors. The state of the nation is due to Ahern not Lenihan. Martin and Harney also have questions to answer to why they let Ahern have his way. Lenihan wasn’t part of the cabinet per 2007. In my mind he gave his life for Ireland and should rightly be regarded as a true patriot. The rest of the FF shower sold Ireland away for their lifestyles.

In between working on solutions to the situation that FF created, I still hate FF and will never forget what they did to our country. Traitors!

censored… calling ff traitors is a big statement, were they not founded on a principal of bringing about a united ireland, the economic policies of the last decade are negligent at worst, based on bad advice and a sure element of cronyism, but traitorous is not a suitable insult in this case is it? As I said in earlier post, they were voted in democratically time after time, …best of a bad lot if you like, so therefore the represented and executed the will of the people of Ireland. the housing policy was definitely incompetent at the very least, and is reprehensible, …as has been the case, but this article is about a proposal for a 5c reduction in fuel tax as i understand it, so as has been mentioned by other above, at least look at this case on its merits, I for one drive a car and would appreciate the hepl in getting from a to b.

Mahon tribunal report (including the evidence and findings against Pee Flynn) has been passed to the DPP at the request of all parties in the Dáil including Fianna Fáil. It’s a matter for the DPP now.

They rode the country into the ground..and how in the name of god did they get into power? ah yes, they were voted in time after time. People get the government the deserve. The country is in a sh*t, as is every industrialized nation bar a few who are rich in sought after natural resources. I agree with whoever said above that FF have a lot to answer for, and I think the ard fheis was a good starting point, but the opposition have also, if FG were in power for the last 15 years would things be any different.,..?! answer that one honestly.

No arguments from me as regards FG Padraigh….voted for them for years but it’ll be a long time before I vote for them in the future. There’s absolutely no difference between the two (FG & FF) which is a very worrying thing because it raises the question who to vote for next time?? But FF piping up with this kind of s**t regarding cutting fuel prices just smacks of them brown nosing the Irish people…I’d love if the excise on fuel was cut by 5 cent..but cutting from fuel means they’ll take it back somewhere else…the sooner FF realise they’re a broken party the better.

Seriously Mark you have to admit that that standing ovation for Cowan was pure stupidity even though it may not have been for Ahern. The sooner FF look at themselves in the mirror and admit their mistakes, kick out those fools and crooks that have bankrupted this country, the better it will be for this county.

Did he get a sitting ovation?

No point commenting so ?

There is that tendency but sure it’s great crack.

Jerry – I can’t let that comment stand without two points:

i) We never – never – ‘whip’ stories from other outlets. If we ever follow a story that originally appears elsewhere, that outlet is fully credited, and the story tries to move on from the original.

ii) We don’t deliberately post stuff simply to whip readers into a frenzy (they’re quite capable of doing that themselves, boom boom, etc). In all seriousness, though, a story with a frenzy of comments only creates more work for us. Put it this way: having been in work from 9:30 to 6 today I’d rather not be sat up in bed at 11:40pm moderating comments.

Another FF apologist. Why can’t FF accept it is all over for them and disband? Do us all a good turn.

A FF apologist ? Sorry David I like you voted Labour last time but I have no loyalty to any of them & I would suggest to you that you should vote for who appeals to you & not who your daddy voted for…give it a try next time you will feel better & you won’t have to defend the indefensible all the time.

I am my own man and vote according to my conscience – you can flip flop if you want – I will tough it out and keep my principles intact.

Good lad

Cut in the tax and excise the government takes would benefit the consumer (Irish citizens) AlanG and wouldn’t make a blind bit of difference to what the foreign oil producers get.

Yes it would. It would increase what foreign oil producers would get as demand for fuel would go up in Ireland and so we would import more fuel, thus improving their exports. What I’m saying is that if opposition parties are going to suggest cutting tax (which let’s face it, is not going to happen) at least they should target tax cuts that may benefit Irish industries and the Irish people, not just as customers, but also as workers in these sectors.

They increased tax on petrol and diesel in the budget and also vat so its pretty connect the dots clear where a large part of the hike of 15+c came from compared to feul prices last year.

The problem with all biofuels is that they take up so much agricultural land. Wind, wave and nuclear is the way to go.