Kenny has no shame at all …. If you were a Labour TD sitting listening to this rubbish, you would wat to get up and walk out in protest … but these Labour TDs are getting very well paid to sit there and be good boys and girls … Money, power are great mistresses…. Enjoy it while you all can, there is a cold wind coming from the East, and it sure as hell wont be so cosy after the next election… Make sure you squirrel away all you can right now, because once you greedy traitors are out of power, all the assets you accrued during your term of pillaging, will be stripped away.
I, for one, am not afraid to tell you, your emperor has no clothes… and is running bollock naked of creativity and ability to help this country. He is taking 100% direction from Europe, and couldn’t care less about the average person, as long as he has all the money he has coming in every year. The rest of us are the host that this leech feeds on.

Been explained over and over, when will you actually listen?

It hasn’t been explained over and over again. We are told all the same things as we were before Lisbon. Other than that they keep repeating how scary it will be if we vote no. This is despite the fact that almost every economist says that the treaty is a bit of a fudge that wont fix any of our problems but wont really do any harm either so we might as well vote for it. If they spent less time trying to scare people into it and just explained it properly, without all the spin which is a big ask I know, they would find it much easier to convince people.

@Daniel Kelly Doran:
One look at your FB and we have another FG Youth trying again to peddle the party line.
David H taking a back seat on this one or do ye now tag each other in?

At 32 I am a bit too old for YFG!

In that case daniel, you should be well able to explain it for us all. How is committing to a further 6 billion in cuts ABOVE what we’re committed to cutting already, and agreeing to fines if we do not make targets which are beyond our control, a good thing.

Instead of the soundbites like ‘yes for a working Ireland’, please expalin to us why we should vote ‘yes’.

Pretty simple actually. Vote yes so we can access the ESM fund, vote yes so no future government can spend more than it takes in tax. Most importantly, voting yes means less austerity, not more. A no vote would mean a much more austerity as it would mean a very quick and very harsh correction to balance the exchequer.

LOL! There we have it, the blackmail again. See, thats all the ‘yes’ side have, the threat that they had to manufacture which did not exist before it bevcame apparent the irish people would get our say.

Do you not think it says something, daniel, when your party colludes to have a blackmail clause inserted because they know people will not vote for this treaty on its own merits? That fine gael are so cretinous that they allow our guarantee of access to the esm to be withdrawn and now made conditional on us voting the way we’re told to?

Are you happy to be a member of a political party that is blackmailing and threatening the irish people, that interferes with a democratic vote of the people in order to coerce the result they want?

You happy about that daniel?

It’s not blackmail, it’s a matter of fact. You can’t spend more than you take in. If you make €2000 a month, and you can’t spend €3000 a month. That’s not really debatable, debating that would be akin to debating if you need oxygen to breathe.

If there is no loan facility the only source of funding the country will be tax revenue. Right now we overspend by, what, 17 billion annually. If we could not loan that money then obviously austerity would be harsher.

Oh, but you see there is a loan facility, its called the ESM. You may have heard of it, we were going to have access to it before fine gael allowed that guarantee to be removed so they could coerce a yes vote.

If you want to agree to allowing our people, YOUR people, to be blackmailed and threatened daniel, it’s your own business. But call it what it is, blackmail. And at least have the decency to put your hand up and admit that your political party is knee deep in allowing this blackmail to happen and continue.

As I understand it (and I’m a fairly average Joe when it comes to this stuff I think):

Vote ‘yes’ for funding stability with a high risk of gradual and long term breakdown of our economy and society due to the impact of austerity. No big shocks just a nice steady decline. Everything stays as it is politically with no big changes.

Vote ‘no’ for funding instability and a medium-high risk a massive correction due to the inability to secure funding (it is not guaranteed this will happen if we vote no but it is fairly likely). The immediate pain will be fairly horrendous from an economic and social point if view but the recovery will begone sooner. Radical political changes will occur (not necessarily for the better).

But I still don’t know which horse to back. Which one is better for my kids?

Sorry, if we vote no we will not have access to the ESM. Fact.

Your statement that FG put this on the treaty is false.

In any case you’ve by proxy agreed with me that we need the ESM, so I suspect you’ll be voting yes now?

You’ve invalidated your own argument.

Daniel, i dont negotiate with Terrorists … therefore i reject the treaty. We will get by on our own… watch, it wont be the end of the world. Especially once we ditch the 70 billion banking debt, The ECB can take that debt and shove it.

@ Daniel. Stephen Donnelly TD wrote to michael noonan 3 times requesting information on whether or not noonan, who was in the room with the other eurpoean ministers when the blackmail clause was concocted, agreed to its insertion. Noonan answered, on the third request for this information “Well I didn’t not agree/Well I didn’t disagree” (it was one phrase or the other). In other words fine gael allowed the blackmail to come about, and why not, sure they desperately needed one good reason to tell people why they shouldn’t vote no.

And they got it. They could have blocked it, they did not. This is fine gael in action, or rather inaction . Blackmail, manipulation, collusion, threats.

Unless you’re calling Stephen Donnelly a liar?

@Daniel Kelly Doran, Thank you. Enlightening those who comment on here is a thankless task. Fair play to you. I dont envy you though, people are narrow minded and think this is a vote on the government.

So that explains it, I was wondering what was going on with all you FG psychics. When you sign up to FG you recieve a free signed crystal ball from Edna. You could have told me that David Higgins.

Worth a little read:
“The European Stabilization Mechanism, Or How Goldman Sachs Captured Europe”"
http://globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=30403

It hasn’t been explained over and over.

Kenny and co have been indulging in rhetoric about “lethal injections” and other scaremongering tactics, while failing to address any of the legitimate questions about how this will help us recover from the crisis.

Remember, these are the people who insist that we won’t need a second bailout.

Daniel

Keep talking, keep writing, and please upload as many of your comments on the fiscal treaty as is possible. You are just what the “No” side need to help us on our way…a talking parrot with a gift for bullshit rhetoric from the Fine Gael “yes” camp. Yes indeed you are one gifted bird.

Fine Gael needs your support like I need a hole in the head. But keep squawking, please.

LOL FF and FG getting all cosy together…birds of a feather and all that…LOL .
To misquote John Coffey from The Green Mile – “Yes sir boss… we’re Fianna fail only not spelled the same” :P

Cormac Lucey. Adviser to Micheal McDowell, he man who kept Bertie Ahern and FF in power, backed the financial free for all that was the last 10 years.

If we are reduced to listening and acting on the likes of him, then we truly are finished.

I’m a no voter btw.

” Kneel before me. I said, KNEEL! Is not this simpler? Is this not your natural state? Its the unspoken truth of humanity that you crave subjugation. The bright lure of freedom diminishes your lifes joy in a mad scramble for power. For identity. You were made to be ruled. In the end, you will always kneel.”
The Avengers

I read it in the paper in which it was published and I though the only reason a no vote is being advocated so that a sledgehammer can be taken to public services. Who let him out…..

Sean, Cormac Lucey is pointing the fastest route to recovery is to reject the fiscal compact and further bailouts. Ireland attempted borrowing itself out of trouble in the past and ended up in deeper trouble. You might now be familar with the cliche that a nation cannot borrow itself out of a debt crisis.
“The Irishman of the 20th Century (and former governor of the Central Bank), Dr TK Whitaker, made an important point in a 2007 interview with Magill magazine when he said that “In the 1970s we really dealt with the oil crisis in a rather absurd way. We thought we could borrow money to keep everything going as before, to imagine that it didn’t happen.” Access to the ESM would only allow us repeat this folly. 

In the fifth year of this crisis, voting “No” is the only way to preserve meaningful national independence by blocking the development of an EU essentially run by Germany and France. And it is the only way we can force our bloated class of politicians and public servants to finally face up to financial reality and reject their EUtopian dreams. It would mean rejecting “Extend and Pretend” as a strategy and instead facing reality and accelerating the process of economic adjustment but thereby accelerating the day when we can finally escape that pain. ”

I didn’t see any mention of sledgehammers or public services.

Not to mention fines for breaching the parameters of the fiscal compact treaty which for us, considering our GDP, structural deficit and outlook, is going to be unavoidable! Why would anyone want this?

Its “Enda”. And you have the audacity to tell others to get an education.

@enoughofthisalready

Nope its neither. The day after FG won the election one of the European newspapers said his name was EDNA and we all know that Europe is always right!!!

Ann reddin giving me the giggles ! ;)

A laugh a day keeps the doctor at bay :o)

Ha ha . Ann , Ryan you two bhave me laughing now :) :) :) Now now enoughofthisalready …I don’t recall telling you to get an education BUT if the cap fits ….. I like to have a little light jocularity in these times of exceptional austerity ..:)

the truth is Kenny knows he’s made a arse of himself and can’t go back on his word so the logical thing for him to do is lash out at Adams

Satire Nucky?

No Ann, we need your vote to share in the wealth!

It’s as credible as you charging 3250 euro’s to host Dick Roche’s website. lol

Stephen, even your own Eamonn O’Cuiv is against your own party… i despise the man for his involvement in the destruction of our country, that has seen more people commit suicide as a direct result of the desperation and lack of hope you left our people in the last 5 years than in the previous 25 years, but at least O’Cuiv has the cop on to know that he made mistakes, and when to put his hands up. The rest of your party however, are a disgrace, and all you can do, is come on here and talk about a war that ended in the last century. You guys have no shame, no remorse and must never be allowed near Government ever again. It has always been party first, and it still is. The Irish people will never forgive you. Shame, shame, shame … Bertie was welcomed at the recent FFailure Ard Fheis as a hero, it says everything about your party. Please do the Irish people a service (instead of the other way around) and disband. We never want to hear FF in our life-times again. History will not be kind to you, you bunch of money grabbing, corrupt, evil, self-serving cretins.

Cal you obviously missed the recent poll where 36% wanted FF to return to being an alternative party of Govt. Why? Because people want pragmatic opposition with real policies, and reject the perpetual, populist protest of others. Also Bertie didn’t receive any such welcome.

FF in Mayo recently thanked and commended Pee Flynn for his service. Not one mention was made of the 50k he took from the party in the early 90′s, when it was nearly 5 times the average salary.

They are a party utterly devoid of ethics and morality. In a normal functioning group, he would be reported to CAB or the fraud squad. In FF they refuse to contemplate it, he nicked it fair and square, as far as they are concerned.

A party of traitors, run for thieves, and staffed by fools.

Don’t feed the FF troll

Adams never overcharged the country for putting up an information website. You did! FF thieves and cause of all this mess. #shameonyouFF

Does it Ronan? Hollande has already said he will not ratify the fiscal compact unless it is changed either it’s text or by an addendum. What will Holland do now he is president elect of France?. The Dutch government fell because of the fiscal compact. They will be holding elections soon what will their attitude to the fiscal compact be once a new government is formed? What will happen in Greece and what will the side affects of that have on this compact or the Euro itself? Today the largest political party in the Italian parliament called for the fiscal compact to be reopened. Why the hell are we voting on something that we do not know the full content of. Do you sign legal documents after only reading half of the document? Seems to me that is what we are being asked to do by Kenny & Gilmore. Why the big hurry to hold the referendum? The compact only comes into force in 2013. Would we not be better off waiting until we know what the whole fiscal compact looks like before voting on it?

Too right. otherwise Sinn Fein’s name will ring all too true and it will be ‘ourselves alone’, very very alone and without friends and money!! I suppose thats what they want!! Makes the state ripe for a hostile take over.

Well Ronan you DID type your post in capital letters. Guess that settles it better than actually explaining why people should vote yes.

yes vote = continuation of failed austerity policies, no growth. second bailout to fund Enda’s pension, inevitable default on crushing debt, collapse of the euro ….

vote no for deeper recession, negative growth, enormous cuts across the board and a quicker end to the euro which will lead to devaluation of our currency and destruction of peoples savings and pensions.

vote yes for deeper recession, negative growth, enormous cuts across the board and a quick end to the euro!