Another dodgy story from this chap, this is down there with the one about the faulty lift…

*are* even, damn iPhone!

Surely if you enter the country without a visa or declaring your status and presence in the country then you ate illegally. Try doing that in the US and see what happens!

Oops typo ’5,000 asylum seekers’

Yea Mark, you and your liberal agenda.

Barry your stats are off the wall man. WE have the lowest rates of providing asylum in the EU and possibly the lowest in the planet.

By the way im not a liberal. I find the idea that any human being ca be labelled illegal as intrinsically bollix. Used to be legal to lock up women in this country cos they where women so excuse me if my compass of understanding the world doesnt find magnetism with the rules of this state. You’d want to be a head the ball, given the situation we are in to think that legality is anything ohter than a useful guide to the state of a nations culture.

Mark – apart from the grammar and spelling mistakes, WELL SAID, MATE! :)

Mark,

If people do not have the right to be here then they are illegal. If I break any laws of the land its an illegal act. We can sugar coat this and call these people anything, but the fact will always remain. People here without legal authorisation are illegals. There is a distinction I believe, because people seeking asylum are technically not illegal. However, if people seeking asylum here try to gain entry to UK this seems fairly possible without the passport controls.

We need to get tight on security, too many terrorists cross though the borders as has been highlighted in UK.

I seen people “floating” around in Gatwick airport. The man was not coming from Ireland and was detected by Border Control when he was asked to produce his passport. He was in the Ireland queue, when he never actually came from Ireland.

Ireland need to embrace stricter immigration laws. I miss the days when Michael McDowell was Minister for Justice.

Mark,
You had better email the Dept of Justice if you consider my data ‘off the wall’.
It is directly from their reports.

The low figures you mention are of those who got through the asylum process NOT those who claimed asylum.

It seems to me that you believe that we should allow refugees or asylum seekers into Ireland with a less rigorous process than we currently have?
I fundamentally disagree.

You present no cogent argumentation for the reasons to allow this immigration ?
-Ireland provides substantial overseas aid to many countries and so we are playing our part.
-Ireland social welfare system is finding it impossible to cope with the draw on it as it is.
-Ireland needs medium and high skilled labour to replace the indigenous labour we have lost to emmigration.

If people arrive here claiming refugee or asylum, there is a process they go through. If they don’t like that process they are welcome to withdraw from it and leave.
I make no apology for protecting our borders from anyone attempting to enter this country illegally or with the intention of being a welfare tourist.

And yes, I would apply the same rigour to eliminating local welfare fraud too.

Thats where we differ entirely. Your clearly a nationalist, and also a bit bonkers to think that your identity is provided by an ability to pay a state to give you legitimacy. If you had any idea of the circumstances in which people leave countries youmight not be so hard nosed. But as i said above, the right wingers are never far away in ireland.

Hi Mark,

The provision of a passport does indeed confer legitimacy onto the bearer. I do not know if this is the same legitimacy you are referring too. I would love to live in a world of no frontiers, where people can pass through without any checks. This is not going to work. I am in no way hardnosed – I do support asylum for genuine cases. There are a number of applications each year to the Refugee Applications Commissioner. Some are meritorious and others as we have seen in the Supreme Court frivolous or fraudulent.

I do not advocate closed borders as you suggest elsewhere. I do support tight immigration control. If we were to allow anyone come into Ireland we would be bonkers alright. We are trying to combat terrorism and forms of fraud. By allowing anyone in this opens the floodgates to abusers.

As I said, I think we should allow genuine refugees into Ireland. I do believe there are a number of applications as I said which deserve asylum status or at least careful consideration. There will always be the odd chancer who wishes to come here with less than plausible motives.

In relation to legitimacy, this is conferred by way of our constitution Bunreacht na hEireann. Citizenship is bestowed through a legal mechanism, be it by birth or naturalisation. But this is besides the point.

If we abolish passports, should be depend on the honesty of travellers to make full disclosures? We have seen how fraudulent cases ended up in the highest court of the land. Total abuse of process and a total waste of tax payers money.

Thats the only one that ‘springs to mind’ . You dont seem to have much of an understanding on reasons of migration and situation people are leaving from

Actually I do Mark. I have no problem with anyone entering Ireland and trying to make a go of it so long as they do it within the law. If people come in here and abuse the situation by falsely claiming asylum then they put real asylum seekers in danger. People leave for a variety of reasons and this can be seen in the flight from Ireland to the US, Australia and elsewhere. The vast majority enter the country legally and work legally and obey the laws of the host country. If they break those laws they are arrest and deported with no great fuss or burden on the taxpayer.

Over here it was seen as “cool” to be welcoming so called “asylum seekers” who came up with every cock and bull story you could think of. Anybody who was a realist about the situation was bullied and called a “racist” just because they didn’t follow the “compassionate” line and their reasoned arguments didn’t sit well with the hysterical shrieking’s of the PC brigade.

I think that the best way to sum the while thing up is the dismissive attitude that you have of anyone that disagrees with you. You assert the Darren O’Neill is a Nationalist and “Bonkers” for reasons that are beyond me. You assert that I don’t understand the reasons for migration etc based on the five sentences that I posted previously! You are either the best personality profiler that I have ever come across or you haven’t a clue what you are talking about. I will let the jury of my fellow posters decide that.

Mark,

We are aware of the hardship people are leaving. What we are also aware of is the abuse by some to our immigration system. Its quite plausible to see you’re such a strong advocate of asylum seekers.

If you ask me the system is in need of a major overhaul. The borders are way too loose.

The only people with a tight or strict immigration problem are those who like to use the legal loopholes to abuse the system. If one is legally entitled to be on this Island they he or she has no need to fear immigration.

The people who should fear it, and rightly so, are the abusers. Who are not welcome anyway.

The USA is surrounded by water??? It has one of the longest land borders of any country on the planet dude

Amount of money saved is little or none in comparison to what your council and political representative squandered through bad decisions and no challenge from electorate.
150 Jewish children where accepted into Irish state as illegal emigrants during holocaust, boats sent back to European countries that where later appeased by Nazis.
How many farms in Texas and other border states would survive without illegal emigration. Like all movement of people some will benefit state by becoming business tycoons and some will be a burden.
To say we have emigration problem is ridiculous in context of numbers entering state.
Very soon a few of us will be illegal when jobs dry up in Ireland and GB and EU. I hope to greet you all in my adopted country by the letter of the law, 8 hours queuing and a full body search. No paddy’s need apply for my job.

If their presence here contravenes the law then what would you say their status was?

Eoin,

Maybe we would have a higher rate of successful application if the number of frivolous cases did not outweigh the genuine ones.

These bodies dealing with refugee claims are established by law and amenable to judicial review. Although we seen how that process was exhausted recently when the refugee applicant submitted forgeries in her application to the Supreme Court.

What international body are you talking about? The UN? If so, I wont be drawn on a discussion on that organisation.

And to add to this. I do believe there is a difference between illegal immigrant and asylum seeker. Someone awarded refugee status is not illegal because their presence here is lawful. However, someone who has a deportation order against them is illegal because if their status was not illegal they would be entitled to stay in this country.

I am also expressing opinions, I am aware of the basis of this story.

That’s some curious logic right there for a law graduate.