Speaking *as*, apologies.

#1. Who is Dorris?

#2. Your comments about the documentary appear to be unrepresentative.

First, here is a link an overview setting out the dramatis personae on all sides (including Eoghan Harris as a supporter of Nirris later position as I understand the piece, not one who’d spring to mind when support for alleged pederasts is mentioned)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairytale_of_Kathmandu

Senator David Norris defended Ó Searcaigh in Seanad Éireann: “An attempt has been made to create such a firestorm of hostile publicity that justice may never retrospectively be done.”[19]

Second, the ‘full monte’ so to speak -

http://www.senatordavidnorris.ie/blogger/2008/03/order-of-business-11th-march-2008.html

Of which the relevant excerpts appear to be as follows -

“I refer to the film, “Fairytale of Kathmandu”, which purports to document the exploitation of young men in Nepal by the Donegal poet Cathal Ó Searcaigh. Having seen this work, I have grave concerns about the motives and methods employed. It is proposed to transmit the film on RTE tonight. As public money has been spent on the film, we are entitled to know the truth wherever it leads. Therefore, I call for its exhibition to be postponed until a full investigation by those qualified in the analysis of film has established the truth or falsehood of the techniques used in its production and the conclusions reached in it. The correct forum for such an investigation is the Joint Committee on Communications, Energy and Natural Resources.”

“While it has been denied, it is clear that systematic creative editing has taken place. For example, the most disturbing image in the film is a sequence showing Mr. Ó Searcaigh lovingly straightening the tie of what appears to be a 14 or 15 year old schoolboy with a satchel on his back. While Narang is indeed boyish looking, he is a 20 year old physics student in a third level college. His words need to be heard. He was over the age of 18 when the film was made. In an interview voluntarily given, he alleges he was told he had been abandoned by Cathal Ó Searcaigh. He was naturally angry. He claims to have been pressurised into giving the answers the film-makers wanted. He has since said: “They make me say things, they twist their questions and make me say Cathal was not a good man”. Is Narang’s voice to be smothered?”

“I call for this film to be referred to the Joint Committee on Communications, Energy and Natural Resources so that the truth can be established with the assistance of experts.”

———————————–

Only an incredibly stupid right wing religious homophobe would declare there was anything wrong in preventing such a defamation taking place on television in Ireland.
To allow such a defamation to occur could have prevented any court case taking place in this jurisdiction as it would have unfairly biased the jury.

If people genuinely want to bring pederasts to trial, they need to understand the pitfalls of the airwaves.
The very exposition they seek may taint a latter meaningful legal action, however well founded in fact.

Norris, in preventing the screening of what sounds like a biased documentary, actually paved the way for a legal action should it go forward.
People repeating others’ comments should do their research and understand the legal implications of what they are alleging.

——————————————-

BTW, a word about David Norris actual work.

From the same day as the above comments, the Seanad Order of Business
http://www.senatordavidnorris.ie/blogger/2008/03/order-of-business-11th-march-2008.html

15. ‘‘In the light of the European Parliament Report on Extraordinary Rendition which
calls on the Irish Government to establish a Committee of Inquiry into the role played
by Shannon Airport in this illegal process, that Seanad E´ ireann immediately
recommence moves initiated in 2006 to establish a Special Committee to look into
this matter and that in the light of further disclosures about ‘CIA Rendition Flights’
to torture destinations and the involvement in these practises as victims of women
and children, condemns such activities in the most unequivocal manner; and calls for
the establishment of an International War Crimes Tribunal to determine the guilt or
innocence of the most senior US and British personnel.’’
—Senators David Norris, Ivana Bacik, Joe O’Toole.
[13 September, 2007]

His consistent and insistent line on human rights is the main reason why I have supported and will continue to support David Norris for president.

Exactly. I really cannot see how more people are not outraged by the fact that he asked for clemency for someone who raped a child?

My reading of the letter was that the prosecutors had ‘trapped’ Ezra or led him to make a statement that could be used in evidence him. I didn’t get the impression there was any suggestion of a honey trap. My reading.

A fifteen year old is not a child. Learn the meaning of “prepubescent”.

I’m leaning toward the Michael D camp myself. He’s a bit left wing for my taste, but that’s no bad thing for an office which should be inclusive anyway.

He’s also unfettered as far as I know by any taint of the usual grubby political stuff; but then again, I thought the same of Norris a few months ago…

Michael D is an unambiguous supporter of human rights and I am certain had nothing to do with recent revelations about David Norris. He’d be a president Ireland could be proud of. Imagine that… Actually proud of a public representative.

Such hypocrisy!! Was really surprised to hear that Maureen O’Sullivan and Stephen Donnelly were still supporting David Norris – they have to know that he does not stand a chance of being nominated now! What are they playing at? Who do they think they are fooling?! I have far more respect for those who declared that they needed more time to find out the truth about the situation!! Blindly supporting a colleague out of misplaced loyalty – I thought that had gone out with Brian Cowen!! How naive of me!!!!

So by your view any means that inform the electorate are acceptable, even underhanded ones, used by private interests to political ends or for profit… How about phone-hacking?

Either the site is being its buggy self, or comments have been removed, Maria.

I share your surprise, however.

@Maria
I totally agree with you, I initially supported DN, but this just takes the biscuit so to speak. It’s disgusting carry on, regardless that he’s gay, that’s nothing got to do with it for me, someone who is guilty of raping a minor, is scum full stop. Clerics included!

I think you’re blowing this very much out of proportion. What senator Norris did, was make a plea of clemency in a personal capacity to a foreign states judiciary, as was his right, and to vouch for the otherwise good reputation of his partner Ezra. He wasn’t trying to have the case overturned or quashed, and would have had no authority in a foreign court to do so, so there isn’t really an argument for the abuse of power. The portion of the letter that was addressed to the judges was not written on seanad headed paper, so I don’t see any indication there that he is trying to use his position as part of the legislature to achieve his goal, or that the rest of the seanad or government were supporting his plea.

Ultimately, this looks more like the actions of a lover and partner asking a judge to show mercy to the person that he loves, because although he has committed a crime, Norris still believes that he is genuinely still a good person.

Politicians lobby for people who committed crimes far worse than Nawi. Learn the reality of what you’re talking about.

@conor can u not understand he tried to protect / support a pedo under age sex is against the law full stop nothing that anyone can say can change that it’s wrong and sick that a grown man would first of all have sex with a 15 year old and then his partner would support that! I do not want my kids growing up with a prez that supports this. It’s sick and if mr Norris supports pedo’s he might as well join the church than run for prez

http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/0730/norrisletter.pdf

just in case people were looking

What I’m struggling to grasp is the inability to see David Norris’ intervention as much more than a mere character reference. His address to the judges was almost like a legal defence. He quoted from Canadian law on sentencing with mention of mitigating circumstances where the victim consents or may even be the instigator. Have we not heard this sort of line before- a predator claiming that he was seduced. I abhor any attempt that would even try to put any hint of blame on a 15 year old victim. A 15 year old, by any stretch of the imagination is a child and, in my book, all sexual abuse of children should be condemned without reservation. As Fergus Finlay mentioned today on Newstalk- a young teenager cannot consent to having sex with a much older, more mature adult. The effects of this sort of ” consent” can remain with a child and result in emotional or psychological damage. Our primary concern has to be the child, not the efforts of an individual to become President.

Absolutely Conor – the allegations of “pedo-supporter” shows just how damaging a case of statutory rape can be once its on the statute books. While I do not condone sex with fifteen year olds – even with other fifteen year olds – I support Norris right to offer evidence of his partners otherwise good character and humanitarian works. The fact that he at no point sought to influence the case and instead offered his plea for clemency on unheaded paper via the defence counsel shows he not only understood what he did but also the correct way to do it.

President of Ireland. You should perhaps examine the complexities of political power and governance before simply dismissing the office. Bad enough that the Government will not reform the Senead and instead proposes its removal (and thus the additional oversight) but now are we to lose a position that, though not powerful, has and remains quite outside of the executive-dominated house, the guardian of the constitution?? The executive has already taken much of the power and parliament is already ineffective enough.

It is up to us, the citizens, to do what we can with whatever time we might have to spare to engage in politics and bring about what change we can through collective effort. No more deference!

Again and again people rush for the easy option, abolishment. Indeed just as people were happy with the easy option of electing , in 2007, a government which was already under severe question because it was the easy option.

You can never get a good plumber when you need one…

There are none so blind as those who will not see….apart from that……words fail me! :(

Deluded!

I wholeheartedly endorse your words Damien and don’t mind the “no” signs mounting up. That’s just the sad sacks of faux-homophobes looking for attention, trying to derail David Norris’ campaign.

They are so afraid that he will win and actually represent the people that they are doing everything they can to derail the process and so undermine democracy. Its a disgrace and those who fail to stand by him at this point are mere hypocrites.

Very good Paul did u come up with that statement all on your own?

Mr. G, you’re an idiot.

In support of what I have said above, I quote from a comment on another article regarding Mr. David Norris. Elaine says:

“1/ In his letter, Senator Norris asked for the judge for the most lenient punishment within the Israeli penal code, i.e. there is a tariff that the judge can choose from, ranging from non-custodial to custodial sentences. He did not ask for Ezra Nawi *not* to be punished.

2/ His letter was written on Seanad / Leinster House notepaper; of course it was, it’s ridiculous to suggest that he wouldn’t – to be facetious, there’s little point writing a serious letter on one’s niece’s ladybird note paper and referring to one’s vast experience in marble collecting & or one’s role as Minutes Secretary for the Musical Society. Of course Senator Norris referred to his background, his experience, his research, his campaigning etc. It’s preposterous to think he shouldn’t.”

The plea was not against the verdict but a plea for leniency in relation to the punishment. And it was made to a government and, by extension, a nation that seems to be, at least, behind when it comes to matters relating to homosexual male relations.

For the record, I am not gay and neither am I a big fan of Israel. I do however, respect the choices that Mr. Norris has made in this instance.

If I was in love with someone I might indeed do everything to help them, even if they committed the most heinous of crimes. However having abused my position, I would have the common sense to then give up any aspiration to being the Head of State.

No abuse occurred. The appeal text was on plain paper and submitted to his partner’s defence counsel. Politicians regularly write in support of all kinds of people in trouble, including convicted criminals. Learn the realities of life before you comment.

…yes it’s 2011 and hey! that means it’s OK to make special pleas for rapists of boys? God, I wish it down with the cool kids.

I thought it was illegal to use your position to try gain leverage in the way he did, he should not have gone about it how he did and he let his supporters down. Nothing at all to do with sexual preference.

@Racheal just because he is gay does not mean he can use it as a get out of jail free card to be honest I’m sick of gays and blacks using the race/sexuality card wake up it’s not because he is gay it’s because he supported a rapist/child abuser and has funny ideas about under age sex, do u want a man who supports this in office as prez? If a straight white man done this, it would be totally different or would it?

Gerard – how exactly is he using his position to gain leverage? As a member of the seanad he has absolutely no authority or influence in the Israeli judiciary.

I see the right wing, defamatory, religious homophobes have been busy through the night clicking the “dislikes” on the pro-Norris Comments.

How worried they must be that Norris will get on the ticket and a democratic vote will occur.

it will show what a reactionary shower of spineless craven inbred gombeen men scumbags we have in elected positions if he cannot get onto the ballot paper.

Norris is an erudite and intelligent man. Common sense is another matter I won’t go in to.

Point being, he made no mistake, in that he knew exactly what he was doing, and like most of us, he is the captain of his own decisions. The decision to make that plea was his own, and fits perfectly with his wooly approach to the age of consent, and pederasty in general, as can be cited in this case, his own recorded opinions, and his high profile support of the likes of Cathal O’ Searcaigh.

In one part of the communication to the Israeli court, he makes the assertion that the age of consent has a different bearing in a homosexual context. I fail to see how.

His charm and well spoken nature bely what is at the crux of it, a very sinister and opportunistic attitude to minors.

Audrey we all like to give people a chance, but he is up shit creek without a paddle…

@ Audrey as you can see the Labour supporters and pseudo-Homophobes trying to derail the Norris campaign are infesting the Journal.

This is clear from the disproportionate amount of negative comments here about Norris and the results of the pole taken this morning which puts Norris in a commanding lead.

These people are making political capital and smearing Norris because he has defended gay rights, not because they think he’s actually unsuitable, but because even now, if he gets on the ticket he’ll win by a landslide.

Its simply a dirty tricks campaign for another candidate and given the revelations about the provenance of the leaks, it seems to be Labour-related, but this could be a clever double-smear by another candidate trying to blacken Michael D Higgins chances also, who is the second runner in some poles.

Look at the dark horses in this campaign to see where all this crap might be coming from.

how many people on the comments have actually defined their sexuality?

Mr G you appear to be obsessed with gay people. Steady on.

I’m heterosexual and I think Norris should allowed to go forward to stand for election. After that, its the will of the people. Which is why the right-wing religious homophobes and the supporters of marginal candidates have their panties in a twist. They’re afraid that IF THEY LET THE PEOPLE VOTE DEMOCRATICALLY Norris will win.

Learn the meaning of “prepubescent” before you allege that someone is a pedophile or a supporter of pedophiles.

People are defending Norris because of his qualities as a senator and a man, not his support for his partner.

Deliberately twisting the facts as you have just done seems to be typical of the Anti-Norris Campaign.

It’s not clear that what O’Brien was doing wasn’t right. There’s a qualification threshold in place for a reason, to eliminate any dubious, populist candidate becoming head of state. Let’s not forget that the constitution was drafted when fascism was rife and populist candidates were coming into power all over Europe.

Thankfully out system which means all candidates need to have the support and a set number of people with a democratic mandate is in place and has worked on this occasion. If Norris had had his 20 nominators, the whole campaign would have disintegrated into a mud slinging battle about child abuse. The fact that he won’t be, is a good day for the country.

Got a decent reference Abi?