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Dublin: 9 °C Sunday 26 May, 2013

Poll: Should Ireland legislate against internet trolls?

The Government has no specific plans to follow the UK’s crackdown on internet “trolls”. How do you feel about the issue?

Image: eurobas via Creative Commons/Flickr

IRELAND’S GOVERNMENT HAS no specific plans to follow the UK’s crackdown on internet “trolls”.

“Trolls” are online commenters that post inflammatory, defamatory, extraneous or off-topic messages on an internet forum – usually with the primary purpose of eliciting an emotional response from other users.

Yesterday, it was announced that changes to the UK’s Defamation Bill could give people who operate websites a defence against libel by allowing operators to identify a person/s behind an alleged defamation.

While the changes could not stop commenters from simply antagonising others, they would include measures to prevent people making false claims and would provide greater legal protection to internet service providers.

However, the Department of Justice and Equality told TheJournal.ie that while it was aware of the UK intentions, it had no specific comment to offer “until adequate consideration has been given to the relevant proposals”.

We’d like to know what you think about it: should Ireland legislate against internet trolls?


Poll Results:





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Comments (74 Comments)

  • What would become of The Journals comment section if we didnt have trolls?

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  • I never troll but 90% of trolling is pretty harmless, if we keep all this pc malarkey up it will soon be 1984.

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    • I think this is the end game Julian and I fully agree with your statement. People will be frightened to post anything on the internet for fear of offending someone and being labelled a troll. I think it’s part of the goal to completely regulate and control the net.

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  • People should not be free to libel others just because it’s the internet.

    People should be free to troll others because it’s the internet.

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  • And to think, people were up on their high horses about China censoring the internet.

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  • they see me trolling they hating!!

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  • Its very simple….block them, ignore them, remove them, junk mail them…its very easy if you dont want to hear from the idiots again. The internet is about freedom of speech. If you dont like what someone says just ignore them. Trolls hate being ignored & blocked.

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  • The UK is fast becoming a nanny state, Ireland must not follow!

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  • Okay, let’s try that again, again.

    There are different things going on here. On the one hand there are the traditional internet trolls who have been around for 20 years or so who:

    “Post inflammatory, defamatory, extraneous or off-topic messages on an internet forum – usually with the primary purpose of eliciting an emotional response from other users.”

    This is largely harmless. Most people online will indulge in such trollage from time to time. Suggesting, just as a random example, that maybe there’s something wrong with the Ireland squad relying on a component from the UK under the grandfather rule. That maybe if Irish people hadn’t spent the last 40 years funnelling their money into UK teams but rather had put into local teams then that might not be necessary and that you’d have enough homegrown talent to create a world class squad.

    And that sort of low level trolling does little harm, it’s fairly tongue in cheek and as the story drifts onto the second page we all move on and forget about it.

    But then there’s what trolling has come to mean. The darker, more sinister and unpleasant sort of trolling.

    Like sending an email threatening someone’s children.
    Like stealing someone’s online identity and setting up accounts in their name on social networking sites using those accounts to make it look like this person wants to put young children at risk.
    Like hassling some poor kid every time they go online until take their own life.

    That sort of thing needs to be dealt with and eradicated.

    Thanks to the journal for figuring it out.

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  • Internet freedom of speech is an important thing that should be protected no matter what someone says. Unlike the real world, if you don’t like what someone is saying then you can block/mute/ban/de friend them.

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    • In the real world you can choose to ignore people too.

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    • I agree with u Gavin. if someone doesn’t like what someone else says, the option to turn off or mute or ban is always there.

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    • Not liking what Some one is saying is not the same as trolling.

      If the post is defamatory there should be a to identify the poster. AFAIK Distilled Media’s T&C’s state that if the post is defamatory it can be removed.

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    • Internet freedom is one thing and posting untrue nasty and hateful comments about someone is another. I think the vision of Internet freedom was before the advent of the masses had access to the internet. I think people are also only now realizing that whats posted on the net stays there for ever. Its more that just ignoring some thing it the equivalant of printing something in the newspapers.

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    • personally, I think its your own fault if you react to the stupid things that little nobodies put up on forums. they are looking for attention and giving in to them is exactly what they want. printing something in a newspaper, and writing them on some forum somewhere on the internet ate 2 completely different things. In a newspaper, I agree that its there forever, and its written by people who are regularly heard on that stage. But posting on an internet forum is different. It can be removed, and it is more than likely written by someone that has no following and will never be heard from again.
      Anyway…. It’s just not something I think needs legal attention is all I’m saying.

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    • Am I the only one wondering what all the fuss is about when we already have this? If there’s a defamation case underway, you can serve the ISP or website involved with a section 8 order to disclose this information. Take a peek at Boards.ie’s legal page for more information:
      http://www.boards.ie/legal/

      And most half-decent forums will have this sort of thing spelled out for you in the basic rules for those forums. For example, the shooting forum on boards has it as rule 5 : http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=66892670&postcount=5

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    • this shouldnt about if offensive comments sgould be blockwd but if you really want the government to have the right to block whatever comments they want to

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    • I don’t agree with some of you on this issue. Like the issue with the recent legislation discussed in the Seanad re paedophilia in the online environment. As much as I despise these individuals, as an advocate of internet freedom I condemned the proposals made on this issue and made my voice heard on that particular article on The Journal. Unfortunately with regulation online it seems that it has a snowball effect. The gates are opened and the government in question continues to pile on legislation.
      Where would this stop? Could you see business use this to identify a negative reviewer in order to file a lawsuit. Something that comes to mind is the case between Boards.ie and MCD when Boards.ie refused to hand over the real name of a poster who was extremely negative about Oxygen and the security staff who looked after the event.
      If you truly believe in freedom of speech and the right to anonymity online then you would oppose such legislation in Ireland.

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    • Gavin, that’s not how the Boards-v-MCD case happened. Read Tom Murphy’s post on it:
      http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=76688804&postcount=105

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    • Oh haven’t seen that post yet. Thanks for sharing.

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  • I blame feminists.
    They always seem to stir some crap up somewhere!

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  • dev 13/06/12 #

    Some of the best comedy I have ever read came from Internet trolls. Don’t like it ignore it

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  • Steve Hughes does a great routine about this namby-pamby hyper-precious attitude people seem to have about being “offended” these days.
    If you are one of those who feels the need to legislate against potential offence, why not do the rest of us a favour and wrap yourself in cotton wool and stay indoors for the rest of your life.
    That way you’ll never be offended again, and the rest of us can get on with our lives without your constant interference.

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    • Stephen
      There is nothing wrong with showing some empathy and manners when it comes to posting comments , unless you are evenly matched !!! Maybe it is the only outlet some people may have in being able to comment or even converse with other people ….
      Leave well enough alone .

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    • there are already reasonable ways to combat trolling. I think any sort of legislation of this sort would be very liable to abuse. better leave the internet open, there’s plenty of cyberspace for everyone.

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  • People just need to learn when they’re being trolled and deal with like an adult and ignore it.

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    • Your mum.

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    • Exactly.
      This is people with too much of an emotional attachment to what other people say on the internet.

      Personally I find trolls a great laugh – is that not unfair on me if they decided to legislate their ban?
      What defines a troll aswell?

      If I don’t like a comment – I thumb it down.
      That’s how it should work.

      Also, who the fk bothered bringing this to the attention of the UK Government?
      “Dear UK Gov, a person said that I have sex with pigs on a website today. This is not true, please ban any funny comments that I can’t take seriously from now on. Tnx”

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  • As an internet troll I feel it my responsibility to come forward on behalf of the trolling community and make a stand.

    Over two decades ago the internet came as a beacon of light and hope to millions of internet trolls who had been seared in the flames of the playground and sports pitch. It came as a joyous daybreak to end the long night of captivity.

    But twenty one years later, we must face the tragic fact that the internet troll is still not free. Twenty one years later, the life of the internet troll is still sadly crippled by the manacles of online moderators and the chains of fora charters. Twenty one years later, the internet troll lives on a lonely internet domain of censorship in the midst of a vast ocean of threads and posts. Twenty one years later, the internet troll is still languishing in the corners of internet society and finds himself an exile in his own world wide web. So I have come here today to dramatize an appalling condition.

    There is something that I must say to my fellow trolls on this comments page. In the process of gaining our rightful place we must not be guilty of wrongful deeds. Let us not seek to satisfy our thirst for trolling by drinking from the cup of libel and slander. I have a dream that one day my posts will not be judged by the trolling that they extol but by the humour they contain.

    God bless the internet!

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  • Then again, would people say these things in public to someones face, alot of the time no! Its like in a car, people dnt act like that in supermarkets, usuallyn

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    • I dunno.. Trolls to me are very similar to those groups of people who feel its their job to pass comment on you if you happen to cross their field of vision..
      Y’know, the ones who insist on shouting their poorly informed assumptions at you as you walk by because somehow it makes them feel better about themselves, or they’re just really bored and looking for excitement..

      Why give them the satisfaction?

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  • If it does happen then it will reduce the comments on this site by about 70%…

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    • I dunno.. This site clearly states in the comments policy that ad hominem attacks are against the rules, and yet I’ve seen you engage in them quite frequently.. Indeed, I would be more inclined to label you a troll for this precise type of behaviour.. But you have a name that sounds like it could be real, so you can’t possibly be a troll can you?

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    • I am sure you are mistaken.. If anything I pull people up when they make rude or ignorant comments about others. I find it hard to stand by and let people throw abuse and insults at anyone really… people on these forums think they can call anyone in public life anything they like. Check my comments and see if I have every done that…You will find i have not… I meerly call the people that do to order.

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    • I dunno, I know I clicked report comment on you once or twice as they were clearly ad hominems, which are against the rules and the only reason I would ever use that function.

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    • Getting a ‘report comment’ on here just means the other person does not like your point of view… I have read your comments often and seldom like what you say but I refrain from reporting you… Funny enough I have never been blocked or delected so I must not have gone that overboard…
      What I do admit to doing 100% is challenging people when they insult using comment such as ‘fat’ or ‘baldy’ or cammenting on the fact that they are a teacher or whatever… Its rife on here and i for 1 think its out of order..

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  • I like cake.

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  • Rule 1 of the internet. Don’t feed the Trolls.

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  • Only against children.

    If adults don’t like what’s being said they can move on.

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  • Methinks I came across a few government trolls during the referendum campaign … you know who you are!

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  • Simply ignore them, giving them the hint of attention is what fuels them so why bother!

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  • Why don’t we give the government permission to censor free speech. That’s the real question in your poll and as of this post half of the people are saying yes to it. There’s no point getting angry about censorship because these people want our government to decide what we can and can’t say. Who gets to decide whether someone is trolling or being sarcastic. Oh I don’t know let’s invade that persons privacy through Orwellian laws to see if hes joking or if he’s a terrorist. Do not give away your free speech.

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  • Damocles 13/06/12 #

    Why do so many people in Europe think they have US style freedom speech anyway?

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  • I would say NO because there is adequate recourse at the moment.

    If there is a bona fide case of defamation or cyber-bullying then all that is required for the web site to hand over the details to the authorities on foot of whatever the relevant warrant is. I can’t see why, for example, The Journal, would have any interest in shielding these people and these people should be aware that “freedom of speech” needs to be used wisely.

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  • This is more censoring of the internet.

    Can people listen to themselves “He said nasty things about” BUILD A BRIDGE PRINCESS

    Sticks and stones will break your bones but words will never hurt you!!!

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    • Except, maybe, when they’re defamatory. Freedom of speech is not being endangered here: we are all still able to speak our minds. The proposal is to strip away the cowardly anonymity that the internet provides to, for instance, bullies. Free speech will still be there: you will just be required to own what you say. A little integrity goes a long way.

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    • Unfortunately, that is not true. Bullying has lead to many suicides and many more dark, depressed spells. It can be as debilitating as a physical attack.

      You also need to be aware of different levels of trolling. Targeted campaigns would not be allowed in real life, why on the internet? Ditto for libel.

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  • Yes trolls can be annoying, but they are easily ignored. If anyone gets offended by a trolls comments then you obviously are not mature enough to post on the Internet where these things are common place. If someone is directly threatened on the Internet then that is a completely different story however. This legislation in britain is just the PC brigade going completely insane again. People cannot go through life without being offended end of!

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    • Exactly, what’s to say that these new rules aren’t offensive to somebody?
      I find being bombarded with Christian imagery, bells and music on a daily basis offensive – but I’m not calling for it to be banned.. I can just look the other way or put on my own music to drown out their noise..

      Why people get so offended by trolls is beyond me.. Often they provide the comic relief on an otherwise very serious thread.

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  • All ur base are belong to us.

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  • Damocles 13/06/12 #

    “IRELAND’S GOVERNMENT HAS no specific plans”

    Very true.

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  • Vote yes.

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  • How do you distinguish between trolls and simply a disgruntled customer, or people who just like to complain about everything? I do not think you can legislate in the sector as how and who would decide on each forum if the person was really a troll?

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  • If we’re going to legislate for minor internet annoyances, a law to combat shitposting should be a greater priority than a law against trolling.

    If you allow your jimmies to be rustled it’s your own fault.

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  • Damocles 13/06/12 #

    I seem to be getting pre-modded on this topic.

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  • Don’t hate the player,hate the game

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  • i like sexy cake!

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  • Damocles 13/06/12 #

    As I can’t make my on topic comment here. I’ve made it here: http://wp.me/p1aRUP-86

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  • Internet trolls? What about real trolls–the ones that spend their sorry lives under bridges except when they’re up on someone trying to scare the crap out of them. Now THOSE are trolls–hairy, foul-smelling, knuckle-dragging, snaggle-toothed little beings.
    Why, they aren’t even Irish—they’re Scandanavian—and even Danish. OMFG. They came over in the long ships, they did. Headed straight for the bridges, they did. Well, maybe they had to wait util some suitable bridges were built first, but I’m sure it wasn’t long before they were camping under every bridge, draw-type and otherwise on the whole island.
    Do they contribute? No. Do they have jobs? No. Just another troll on the dole, as the saying goes. All they seem to do is scare people, lay about and milk the dole for all they’re worth. Hmmm–that sounds a little like….awww never mind.

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  • Freedom of speech should not be used as an excuse to make anonymous base defamatory statements online which would result in legal proceedings in any other forum. If someone has something to say, you shouldn’t be able to hide behind some avatar to avoid censure for your comments if they are unjustifiable.

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  • I’m a huge believer in freedom of speech even though I have a very low tolerance of cr*p. Bot who is going to censor these trolls? At least for now I have the decision who to ignore – who’s going to make that decision for me??

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  • why i agree with freedom of speech i think they’re should be controls on it because they could lead to cyberbullying and what follows can be tragic

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