That’s right. Too much self interest at stake in these lack of opportunity times for them to fail. Also, next election is too hard to call with all parties disliked in equal amounts.

it will be us who will decide if the government last the full term or not!! we are the people keeping them in this fanciful position where they’re making a pure mockery of us all

We will not decide whether or not they run full term as we have already made that decision by voting them into power in the first place. There was no doubting that FF were not going to make it last time but still FG and Labour made promises they either knew they could not keep or were dizzy with the certainty that they were going to be in power at long last. Their manifestos were designed to get maximum seats for themselves which is to be expected from any party. In the case of Labour they thought they could be the biggest party in government while FG thought they were in with a shout of absolute majority and so instead of being honest with the people of the country, they decided to play the auctioneer politics game that we have become used to in this country. There was a golden opportunity for a party to be at last honest with the people. To tell them that there was indeed awful austerity on the way but that it would be really fair and not tokenistic as it is now. That those that caused the mess would never again get the chance to ruin the country as they have and that if they do try it that the penalties will be severe and brutal. That banks would never again be able to hold the country and its people to ransom again and the suits in those banks would not ride off into the sunset with their pensions topped up from public funds, regardless of the contracts they had signed up with their banks. That overpaid civil servants and top politicians would take a real cut in their bloated wages and pensions and there was a great opportunity to put in all sorts of changes that would make the lot of the ordinary man and woman somewhat easier. But no. Its far easier to pit public servants against private sector against people on welfare. That results in a situation where no-one gets to work together to build up momentum.

But we take it again and again and again. We tolerate a situation where the so-called leader of the country disappears for large periods of time so that his obvious inability to think on his feet is not tested. We tolerate a minister for Finance who has shares in German banks and thinks that emigration is not such a bad thing ‘sure, even his own children had to do it’. We tolerate Labour junior ministers qualifying for raises in their wages to the amount of €17k so that they can attend two extra meetings at which they cannot speak. Suck it up ladies and gentlemen because FF are on the way back and though they have made some changes to their line-up, it is the same party of chancers that largely support the policies of the current government. Time for the Second Republic.

it will lastc Labour is just like the Greens the last time. no back bone getting lots of money from the unions as well

replace them with helper monkeys from dublin zoo they will work for cheaper, do what there told……and lets be honest are far more capable, smarter and better looking than the current breed in power

Labour won’t jump ship anytime soon. Even they know its too late for that. Why would they give up huge salaries and perks, when they know that a general election would virtually wipe them out? The only way an early election will happen is if the ordinary people of Ireland demand it.

Are you available, Thomas?

I’d do their job for €188 a week and work 19 hours a day to make sure all the best ideas from all forward thinking countries in the world are introduced here.

@vincent well its like this the dog on the street is a hell of a better option then ur buddy enda if he took his head of the sand or angelas backside long enough to see exactly what saving bankers and paying bondholders can do to irish society he might change his ways

@thomas- once the word “bondholders” comes out I know exactly the person in dealing with….

@vincent yes ur dealing with someone whos living in the real world of the recession not this fantasy political world the lads in leinster house live where they spout muck like the recession is over and things are getting better maybe you should look around at the state of the country first and start doing what we the people put them in power to do rein in the high spending earners in the banks, public and semi-state and stop rewarding mis management

@ Thomas- depends on the metrics you use. If you use indisputable financial / economic metrics, the country is out of recession, the markets view us more positively and we’re paying less for finance, then yes the country is better off. If you work off the amount of whining coming out of criers, than yes- things might be getting worse

@Vincent

I find I need a hot shower after reading your comments. Maybe crawl back under your rock, yeah?

Fine Gael have absolutely adhered to the spirit of their election promises. FG voters expected belt tightening and a stabilisation of the national finances and that’s what we got.

Fine Gael promised us 100,000 jobs Vincent. They also promised to burn bond holders. You tell me when at any stage they’ve adhered to these statements.

No FG specifically said they would not be introducing an annual recurring charge on the Family home. Are you going to say their Labour partners forced them to introduce a property tax?

They also promise to reduce the amount of quangos,provide a score card for each minister at the end of its first term,sack ministers not up to the job (james reilly),cut the number of TDS and advisors,longer sittings of the dail.provide 1000000 new jobs, reduce unemployment,5 point plan,burn the bondholders not one cent more for toxic banks (leo veradker).As for labour one word liars

http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/energy-quango-pays-735000-bonus-to-staff-as-bills-rocket-3350478.html

I expected a bit of belt tightning but I didn’t expect to be strangled with it!

@martin- this is the rubbish I have to listen to on here. The last Dail term was the longest ever, unemployment has stabilised and is beginning to decrease, Quango’s have been cut, Ministerial score carding has been done. At least get your facts right.

Quit the FG spin VD, you don’t have the chops for it. Unemployment has not ‘stabilsed’, the figures have stopped increasing because tens of thousands are leaving the dole queue each year to emigrate to find work and are replaced by newly unemployed people. Until the employment figures stabilise, you cannot contest unemployment has stabilised.

Of course unemployment is stabilising, the numbers leaving the country and so leaving the live register are staggering. Emigration is not a jobs strategy.

Werejammin- actually the figures of people leaving is mostly balanced by immigrants. So you were saying?

Vincent actually the figures don’t balance. CSO figures show a net outward flow of people of 34,400 up to April 2012, the most up to date figures.
http://www.cso.ie/en/media/csoie/releasespublications/documents/latestheadlinefigures/popmig_2012.pdf

Kenny actually gives us a weekly update Stephen. You can see by the amount of time given to Irish issues where his priorities lie though. http://www.facebook.com/FineGaelParty#!/notes/enda-kenny/weekly-message-from-an-taoiseach-enda-kenny/473594516020733

I mean a tv address.

I’m sure doesn’t even know his Facebook password.

His password is……$e77IrelandT0Eur0pe.

Iceland is ruined…..read a little and not just the Irish Star

We are all ” ruined ” , but they took proper control and are striving where we are being strangled

Personally speaking, I think they are completely amazed that there has been no significant backlash regarding last months budget. That in itself will give them huge confidence to implement even more harsh measures against ordinary Irish people. We just have to be the most tolerant people that ever graced this earth. By not organising ourselves as a credible fighting force, we have given them a licence to wipe us out completely. These lads are only getting warmed up.

Yes. Because both parties promised a veritable Nirvana when they got elected, didn’t they? They never mentioned that tough years lay ahead or cuts would have to be made. Oh wait….

True blue Vincent. You can’t see the wood for the trees.

We inherited this mess…..blah blah blah…..FF started the truck but FG are happy to drive it over the cliff!

@mark- actually Mark- I’m just not a whinger.

@ryan- the truck was started, driven over the cliff, hit the ground, exploded , shattered into pieces and had a Garda cordon placed around it long before this Government got near it.

We need to get them out before they do more damage and tell more lies. We need to send a message that we expect more, and won’t accept everything thrown at us.

D.D.I
Direct Democracy Ireland

Have you not got the answer to that damo? It’s all you ever ask. Who would you go for that’s the only thing that matters not what others are doing!

The answer varies, as does the degree of hysteria, which each asking.

So your here to test people’s hysteria. I didn’t have you down as a troll.

FF pushed the country into a grave.
FG/LAB merrily went about filling us in.
Have we ever had a Taoiseach with a beard I wonder???

No I’m here to ask the questions.

Who exactly are DDI Jackie? I’m curious.

Hahaha DDI dont make me laugh

A fairer taxation system where wealthy people pay their fare share.

Oh look at Fianna Fails Paul Anthony Ward getting all excited at the prospect of the Government falling! You guys really do feel as though ye have a divine right to be in Government buildings, don’t ye? I wonder what might bring it about? Maybe the Taoiseach will launch a botched cabinet reshuffle like the last one did? Or maybe they will bring the country to the edge of economic oblivion like the last one did? Or maybe they will surrender our sovereignty that took 700 years to establish like the last one did? We’ll have to wait & see. Of course FF supporters would be happy enough for any of these things to happen because its always party first. The thirst for power….

Vincent, I’ve disagreed with with pretty much all you’ve said regarding FG.
But you are spot on in your analysis of FF. Party before country. I really hope the people don’t forget what they did to us.

I’m beginning to think we are no longer governed by the people that we voted for , but are ruled by a regime made up by the Troika and vultures only interested in bleeding this country dry at the expense of the sick, the unemployed, the low paid and our children… or in a nutshell, anyone without an expenses account.

It’s sickening the way our government capitulates to these unelected leeches. You expect that venality from the right wing parties, but in my stupidity I thought Labour would have more of a moral centre.

Ryan- you keep saying that Fine Gael have kicked the middle class in the face. Substantiate please. Income tax has been ring fenced as promised. The all out assault on people who have the temerity to earn a decent living advocated by SF, the ULA and Labour has been prevented. Employment has stabilised. So what are you talking about?

Vincent, just give it up please. The government are a bunch of gangsters strangling the little man do death – period

Well said.

stay strong Karolyn

The problem with this country is that for way too long we had it easy, government pumping money at everybody financing it with taxes from an unsustainable property boom. An entire generation of Irish people grew up thinking that they were entitled to easy money, any job they wanted and luxury lifestyles based on debt.

The reality is that like any pendulum that swings one way, it’s now swung back way in the other direction. Eventually it will swing back again towards prosperity. We just have to hope that with some of the policies being implemented will prevent any government (of any make-up) fuelling another unrealistic boom.

But that also depends on Irish voters getting over their desire for populist policies and acccepting that you can’t have it all. Sadly I don’t see that happening anytime soon.

@karolyn- there are airports in Dublin, Waterford, Cork, Kerry, Galway and Belfast. Don’t feel at all obliged to stay.

There is zero chance of a snap election this year. None. Why go to the people when you’re at your weakest? Labour walking away from Government at this time would result in electoral annihilation. This Government will go full term. Fine Gael will go to the people pointing to a Bank Deal, the withdrawal of the Troika from Ireland, a growing economy and the harshest budgets two years behind them. Labour will go to the people, as all smaller coalition partners do, promising to keep the larger party honest and will maximise their vote.

Vincent why do you insist the Troika will leave,only the IMF will leave if at all.The Fiscal Treaty FG coerced the people into accepting makes the other 2members of the Troika a permanant fixture here.

Very optimistic Vinccent but I can’t see it happening.
I think it will collapse under public pressure.

FG can point to a bank deal all they want.
1: Not likely to get it (“paddy pays his way”-Enda Kenny)
2: A write down even a partial one is needed again not likely to happen (“paddy pays his way even if the debt is not his”- Enda Kenny)

this government would never go to the people, rather the people will go after the government i reckon

That would be interesting but who is there left to vote for? :(
The media are soft on the government who claim a mandate by lied to get it

@norman- well done on spotting that we’re a member of the European Union. When I refer to the Troika leaving I refer to all three coming over to check we did our homework properly before they release the next tranche of our bailout. That ends with the bailout. But you knew that’s what I meant. What you’re referring to is the enhanced European oversight of all member states budgets as part of increased monetary union. That’s a very different thing. If only because its a two way street. And you know that too.

What public pressure would that be, Mike? You think this Government ever thought it would be popular?

It doesn’t say ‘would you like the Government to run its full term’, yet some of the usual pessimistic moaners seem to have interpreted that way.

You really need to direct you anger at those that created this mess and the banking deal which led to our bankruptcy. Yet I see no one attacking Fianna Fail? Indeed they have RISEN in the polls !

Thats the problem with democracy, give everyone a vote and many haven’t a clue about what they are voting for or the democratic process

A benign dictatorship is what we need

How much damage has been done? How’s your memory! We just voted out the most damaging government ever and now we are on the right track to recovery! Snap election would cripple the country! We would have FF or SF in a coalition! Now that’s a bad government!

Vincent did i hit a nerve?Having gone to visit alot of news sites,no influence from our government.It appears our German friends have been advised we well need a second bailout.Try seeking the truth instead of spin.Further i suspect you would describe the Sindo as a rag but Colm McCrathy has a very interesting piece in it.

@norman- amazing how you construe “the truth” as being anything that agrees with your argument while everything else is “spin”. Unlike you, I work on the basis of fact rather than conjecture. All signs point to the market warming to Ireland. The Taoiseach himself has said it will require a bank deal to make it happen. A difference between you and I is that I want it to happen. You for done reason seem to relish the idea of Ireland in the poorhouse?

No matter who is in government, people will never be happy.

Vincent as always you attack the person not the arguement,i don’t trust government spin.There has been a deluge of good news lately with nothing to back it up.
Finally i would like my country to get a deal on the debt and for recovery to happen,but lies,spin and bs won’t make it so.

We’re a country of 4 million so we have a limited pool to draw from when we go to vote but what really gets me is their grotesque sense of entitlement

What do you mean “probably” believes in Santa?

we don’t have to sit around waiting for them though!! we are the ones with the power and if we all hit the streets the government is finished! anybody who was at the very large siptu protest Nov 2010 to demand Fianna Fail out helped stick the knife in the party who lead us to where we are today https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CD41JHIriI4 and if we have to come together again to force out these current feicers then so be it

Agreed. An effort to sway the public discourse.

Funny that as the FG minions keep referring to polls as their barometer

Depressing how much you ache for Ireland not to get a Bank Deal.

Ah Vincent I thought you’d be a man of integrity, no? Surely, we should pay back every penny we owe with glee. Surely Vincent doesn’t believe in write downs when we still have so much more to give??

Vincent, you know what’s coming for FG and just can’t handle the truth. I’d love a Bank Debt Deal to happen, but FG/Labour won’t have anything to do with it or it’ll because of them. But they’ll take credit for it, even when its obviously not their doing. So Vincent, you’re a minority defending these lowlifes!

@stephen- the Government would suggest I’m not in the minority.

@karolyn- you see that’s (one of the many) differences between you & I. I’m a realist living in the real world. You’re a fantasist living in the land of make believe. While your economic strategy involves mimicking a 5 year old lying on the floor of Tesco’s with flailing arms and legs screaming “I won’t pay the bondholders, I won’t!, I won’t!”…I think we’re better off assessing what can realistically be achieved without walking the country into economic oblivion and working towards that. You think there’s a quick fix. I know there’s not. That doesn’t mean I’m any happier about it than you. I just reserve my venom for those who caused it. Whereas you are content in hitting out at anyone. Much like a petulant child….

Labour would be decimated if they pulled out of government at this point. Like it or not they are wedded to this government and know that it’s in their interests to go the full term. Even the most anti-Gilmore member of the party knows that the public will not suddenly forgive them if they rebelled and withdrew from Government and caused a general election.

The government’s strategy will be to look for a deal on bank debt this year. Any deal on that will allow them to frame a softer budget this year and still meet deficit targets because the current deficit target includes the Anglo promissory note payment. A deal on that will give them a huge boost to their financial position.

Thereafter they will hope that growth allows them to introduce two budgets in 2014 and 2015 which will ease back in some of the cuts which have taken place over the last two years. They will also hope that unemployment will be on its way down by mid-2014 so that we have over a year of job growth towards the end of the Dail term.

Assuming that they get this then they will look towards an March/April 2016 election campaigning on the slogan that they got the mess sorted and it would be dangerous to elect either FF because of their dodgy past or SF/ULA because of their risky unproven politics.

Jim- spot on.

Lol as if! Have u forgotten how stupid the Irish are?

FF’s come back is evidence of that. We deserve what we get, no wonder politicians are corrupt!

Finally, a sane and reasoned answer. Well said Bo bo. There is no alternative, even though we’d like to attain perfection. If cuts could be avoided, any government would be happy to do so. For the love of Reason, don’t let FF or SF or Green Looneys or Leftie idiots anywhere near the levers of power in the near or distant future. We’d really find out then what it’s like to be screwed.

What decisions? Do you mean the ones taken to screw the least fortunate, protect their own core voters, do the banks bidding and spin an economic recovery that simply isn’t happening. I won’t even mention their performance re negotiations on bank debt. Puppets and deceitful ones at that.

The bank debt is there because of FF dont forget that.

We are 2 years into a 4 year term how can u reform a whole country in 24 months tough decisions have to be made dot get me wrong all they could be doing more and should be doing more but to throw them out to vote i. Who ???

FF .. Caused this mess

SF couldnt implment a third of the populist rubbish they spout

ULA. I wouldnt let run a bath

DDi… That would be they biggest everyone looking after their own interests the country has ever seen

Jay- When they abandoned their election promises, faster than a rat on a sinking ship after being elected. That sealed their fate, they’ll get a worse hammering than FF!

and every one of the 160+ in Leinster House do, do they???????????????????

The election promisess that were abandond were a small price to pay for a step closer to stability

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
That is exactly the problem. I can’t believe you just posted that. You think it’s ok to publicly lie to gain power then change the game rules when in??!!

Sacrifice my arse!

Jay
Don’t know what the alternative is because as things stand the system here is broken when it comes to party politics. I would only vote for what I would consider a capable independent candidate at the moment and God knows they’re few and far between.
Curious though as to why you think we’re a step closer to stability under this Government since they’ve reneged on the promises they made?

Jay,
You are wasting your time with those who miss the glory days of nice lifestyles while we wee hurtling down the drainpipe to bankruptcy.

They are annoyed at what has happened while choosing to completely ignore the reasons it happened or those who were responsible.
They will blame *everything* and *everyone* in their redirected anger.

@ryan- I hate to point this out to you…but this country’s electorate rewards those who lie to get into power. It was FF’s modus operandi for decades. And it’s why we as a people were complicit in the excesses of the Celtic Tiger. We kept voting in FF to keep the good times coming. So spare me the moral indignation. If Enda Kenny had stood up before the election and said – we’re absolutely f*cked- get ready for open wallet surgery, Fianna Fáil would still be in power. Ask Alan Dukes what being honest with the Irish people does for you electorally. Overall, though they have stuck to the spirit of what they promised and are delivering in terms of economic revival.

@Rommel so youve alot to say about te current government without any alternative its not a country you need its some sort of utopia free money trees in every garden

@ryan i dont belive FG realised the full extent of the mess left by the previous lot and after full investigation into the complete mess they did have to make sacrifices what would you prefer all the manefsto stuck to 100% and the country worse off or a government wit enough tack to say well now after assesment. We need to do this instead of that ….

Jay
I’m saying the main parties here all offer alternatives but when they have to walk the walk they all get shown up as spoofers. I have no preference for any of them as none have shown any evidence of standing up for the Irish electorate when the opportunity arises.
As regards utopian money trees, those have always available to the select few regardless of who is in power here, I don’t see any of our politicians sharing the pain do you? I don’t expect any thing for nothing but i do expect proportionate burden sharing in this so called republic.
You still haven’t said why you think we’re a step closer to stability btw.

The fact that weve gone to the markets this year and each time theyve nearly snapped our arm off trying to buy our bonds thats a step towards stability unemployment stabilising

All the main parties say they have alternatives to what te current government are doing at the monent but as a realist its clear to me that the country would be in a depression if it was implamented .. Im not pro FG or Anti FG but i do feel they are doing whats needed to be done

Jay if you were looking for money off me and I knew you were going to pay me back no matter what happened, even if it meant you and your family going hungry, and give me a decent interest rate, i’ld snap your hand off too to give you the money. Why wouldn’t the bond holders buy bonds from us? They know now that they will get back every last cent, along with a handsome profit. So much for “not another red cent”.

@Jay
Yes, FF have a lot to answer for. But they weren’t committing economic terrorism. Fine Gael and Labour made the decision to continue paying unguaranteed, unsecured bondholders; NOT FF. Sure, the FF may have done anyhow; but FG/Lab were voted in because there were going to stop paying faceless unsecured debt. And yet we’ve since payed tens of billions of euro to unnamed, unsecured, gambling bondholders. “Not one red cent”. Remember that?

Second, you seem pretty glad that FG/Lab are taking decisions to hit anyone except the elite and the bankers that caused the problem in the first place. People die of cold because they can’t afford heat, yet Mr Kenny earns more than the US president, and is the third highest paid politician in Europe – and we’re one of the smallest countries to boot! You are happy then, that the people who are paying the most for the mistakes of the wealthy and the banks, are the working class, the poor, and the weak? Noonan himself has stated that the top 10% of earners are paying less tax than they have in over 25 years… is this one of those “decisons[sic] that should have been mede[sic] a long time ago”? Really??

Third, you seem to be very comfortable that Ireland is carrying 42% of the Eurocrisis debt value. 42%. There are approximately 700 million people in Europe that are affected by the debt crisis. 42% of that debt is being paid by 5% of the EU population. That’s one of those “decisons[sic] that should have been mede[sic] a long time ago”?

Holy cow. No wonder the idiots are still in charge in this country… we have people like you standing in their corner!

I’ll have what you’re smoking or snorting?

Somebody call a doctor

You mark my words!

Yeah, and Hitler was the savior of the Jewish nation, and the tooth fairy is actually Hogan in disguise..