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Dublin: 9 °C Sunday 19 May, 2013

Column: New restructuring targets for banks don’t go far enough to help distressed borrowers

Banks need strict supervision – they have crippled us and can’t be allowed run free, writes David Hall.

David Hall

EVER SINCE RECORDS were first begun by the Central Bank, the numbers of those in mortgage arrears has increased quarter by quarter. While families and individuals were being torn apart by the strain of over indebtedness, Government and the Central Bank stood idly by. Their sole contribution to the issue was stating the obvious: that banks were not doing enough. This has been a constant mantra for the past five ears.

Yesterday white smoke – well, grey smoke – appeared from Government Buildings in the form of new restructuring targets to be met by banks. These targets will be overseen at arm’s length, it would appear, by the Central Bank. But this is only applicable for the six banks: AIB, Bank Of Ireland, PTSB, Ulster Bank, ACC and KBC.

Restructuring

They will have to “restructure” 20 per cent of their mortgage arrears book by July this year, and 30 per cent by end of the third quarter this year, with a total of 50 per cent of mortgages in arrears on their books having to be “restructured” by the end of 2013.

The non-prescriptive nature of this type of restructuring of loans is a massive mistake.

In addition, the banks will be given an assurance that the legal lacuna that exists around repossession will be fixed, and they will have strengthened powers against the borrower in the form of being able to quickly define a borrower as being “uncooperative”. Both tools allow the bank deal aggressively with the borrower and repossess their home. No such powers should have been given to the banks until there had been a proven record of dealing with the mortgage crisis.

The problem is that, having done nothing for the past five years, the banks are still in control of the process. Recent history should have shown us that if you allow the banks be in charge then they will do nothing. It is unclear as to the seriousness of the sanction for non-adherence to these targets.

Also it is important to note that many borrowers were preyed upon by subprime lenders and their agents; those lenders are not covered by these “targets”. Nor are the shared housing schemes owned by local authorities.

Banks need supervision, borrowers need protection

Banks need strict supervision, they have crippled us and can’t be allowed run free. Borrowers need protection; they have been left out in the cold and have been left to fend for themselves. Banks, on the other hand, have funding and power. This imbalance needs to be urgently addressed, especially with the uncharted waters ahead – the insolvency process – which will be full of more sharks.

Today, the Government and Central Bank have the banks’ power to stand on, which they have effectively kicked down the street for so long.

Maybe it’s time that all advocates and organisations providing services and advice to mortgage holders should come together and provide services and representation to over indebted mortgage holders.

David Hall was one of the co-founders of New Beginning in 2010. In July 2012, David and other concerned citizens established the Irish Mortgage Holders Organisation (IMHO) to help consumers tackle the increasing burden of personal debt. In addition to IMHO, David owns and runs Lifeline Ambulance Service. David also founded the Make-A-Wish Foundation in 1992.

Read more articles by David Hall here>

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Comments (56 Comments)

  • The sharks are circling the Irish Sea smells of blood. Irish debt selling like hot cake. The people are defenseless and the sharks know it. This must be worst government in world.

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    • They accept that the banks reckless lending and disregard for proper practice, has beggared our country, yet the now intend to change the law to facilitate those same banks in repossessing homes they should never have given mortgages for in the first place.. What government in the modern world would change it laws for a group of private instructions , who is running this country, Europe , the Banks, ? It’s not those who were elected by the people of Ireland anyway . It seems they are totally compromised , what have the Bankers got on them, ?

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    • They need to be removed before we have no money left in our wages or roof above our heads they are a disgrace

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    • No, its the same ‘government’ as everywhere else. Its all Rothchild owned. What the Banksters have on them is probably the same thing that Jimmy Savile (So-vile) had on the English establishment. Politicians are a breed apart, they all eat at the same trough and they all share the same self-interests. The truth is nearly out-The illegitimate ‘Queen’ and Pope wanted for child abuse, the governments not listening to the people etc etc, the perfect storm is gathering-will be be for freedom or tyranny?

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    • I’d say the banks have a lot on them( political class ) I wonder how many polititions had debt wrote off with this bank bailout as has happened with previous financial institution bail outs. The Garda and Cab should probaly investigate.

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    • Join the Anti Eviction Taskforce.Stop Repossessions. http://www.facebook.com/AntiEvictionTaskforce

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  • Despite the spin, this has nothing to do with helping distressed borrowers and everything to do with cleaning up the balance sheets of the banks.

    It is astonishing that the Government and bank regulators are spinning this as the banks problem, whilst they themselves have been sitting on their hands doing nothing about the Dunne judgement.
    Furthermore the new insolvency law, flawed as it is, is taking forever to implement.

    A proper insolvency law, where bankrupt borrowers had the prospect of discharge after 12 months, together with a straightforward court processes for repossession would do more to force banks to help distressed mortgage holders than all the disingenous platitudes spouted by ineffectual regulators and out of touch politicians.

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  • Another pathetic can kicking excercise. My understanding is most of these mortgages have already been restructured. When will Noonan and co realise that the banks haven’t a hope in hell of ever getting all their money back?

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    • So what do you suggest?? Let a hundred thousand people off with not paying their debts?? Its is there debt by the way… They bought the house. The bank did not force them to do it??
      I think yoiu might find if there was a referendum on ‘debt forgiveness’ in relation to destressed morgage holders, the opinion among the public might not be as one sided as the media might think. I suggest such a option would be rejected by the irish people

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    • Maybe they didn’t force us to get a house but they are forcing all of us to pay a debt by taking more money from our pay packet ,that wasn’t there when we first bought our homes. You can’t take extra money from us and expect people not to go into debt its simple maths .these clowns have no idea or don’t care what the average person pays out as long as there masters are happy. Read George Orwell animal farm that’s what this government done pre election .

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    • Tom, I am confused… If people have kept their jobs and 1.9 million of us still have them, and you borrowed money to buy a home…did people borrow that close to the bone that the additional taxes (approx 10%) are enough to go from the lavish insanity of 2006 to the desperation in 2013? If the buy to let group are taken out of this equation what is the real rate?

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    • And good old reliable Cotter rides to the defense of his beloved Fine Gael except that this time he also nails his colours to the mast with regard to bankers. The simple fact is that w/bankers wrecked this country with their actions and while thousands of good honest people are tormented every day, these w/bankers escaped with the loot. None of them are in jail. The control is now in the hands of banks and they have escaped scot free over their blatant bad advise that they gave to people whose greatest crime was to buy a home, not an investment, a home. Now Mr. Cotter, things might be super duper up there in your ivory tower but the people are almost at breaking point and you and your ilk will never get to hold the reins of power again. I hope those people that you shit on as you climbed the moral ladder are not too hard on you as you make your way back down.

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    • You’re confused Declen? You certainly are. You don’t approve of private citizens noy paying their debts and yot I don’t see you complaining about bailing out the gamblers who have ruined this country. Did the banks force all those unsecured bondholders to take a risk on the banks?

      It’s a old cliché, Declan but it applies to you; if you’re not part of the solution you’re part of the problem.

      Reply
  • It comes down to what type of society we want to live in. Of course people will take advantage of a debt forgiveness policy, but I would suggest that it would be a small percentage compared to those who it would genuinely help. Are we prepared to allow our neighbours, our friends to suffer indefinitely? What type of society do we want? The elite have already had their slice. Lets fight for ourselves and for those who are really in trouble. Time to tell the banks and the government to GFT.

    Reply
    • Ben Gunn 14/03/13 #

      There seems to be a belief that debt forgiveness wii allow borrowers to see debt cancelled and stay in their homes.

      What it will actually mean is that, in certain cases, debt remaining AFTER property repossession and forced sale, may be written off under the new insolvency law.

      No one will have mortgage debt forgiven and remain in the mortgaged property.

      Reply
  • this gov, has no interest whatsoever in looking after the people who elected them
    theyre there for themselves and the power and the money

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  • The political parties both in opposition and serving as government in ireland are the worst government in the world. They have done nothing to help the irish people and have not got a shred of credibility left. Taoiseach says banks wont or dont have the power to repossess homes? Sure thats pure shite.

    Reply
  • Well said Tom Keating -

    There was a bird on newstalk who was a doctor who was having trouble with the mortgage she and her husband took out in D4.

    It was pointed out that she could easily downsize and move. She said that it would be stressful for her family to move to an area that was less well off , the con artist got away with it and the banks froze her payments.

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  • Question; How many people who have a mortgage actually handed over real notes in hard cash.versus those who just signed forms ?

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  • FF on par with them

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  • harpulee –

    You should learn to accept and not expect things in life. If you are in distress downsize or retrain and get a better paying job so you can afford your life choices and one of those was the gaff you (or others) bought.

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    • Hello Troll lol sad sad

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    • Scarr 14/03/13 #

      @brass – I was reading a report recently that people who troll on the Internet usually suffer from low self esteem or have issues in their work or personal life they are unhappy with. Do you suffer with any of these?

      Reply
    • You will also find that they dream of being a bully and have a need to compensate.
      Sad pathetic loosers.

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    • Scarr to be fair, somebody has to try and balance the off the wall views that are held by the majority on these forums.. How come anyone who does not hold the same opinion as the ‘click’ that infests these forums is known as a troll.. The brass rat’s opinion is one shared by a great deal outside of the saftey of j.ie.. The general public are not in favour of some kind of blanket debt forgivness..

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    • Declan. You are obviously completely insulated from the real problems within this country. Debt forgiveness needs to be pursued so as to get the economy back on track. This will ultimately benefit everyone! Selfish people like yourself can’t see past the end of their noses. Think about future generations. Is it not worth some short term pain to ensure a better future for our kids? I personally have a tiny mortgage that takes up around 6% of my net income, so as you can see, I’m not campaigning for personal gain in all this. We need a country led by people that care, not the usual self serving crooks that we’ve been putting up with for years.

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    • If you get a free house do you also get a free car with it or would that be asking too much?

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    • @rodrigo – I see this “getting the economy back on track” argument all the time, but it’s never, ever backed up with any evidence. If you forgive a hundred grand of debt, then the bank is a hundred grand down on its balance sheet. Since the taxpayers own the banks, that is a hundred grand out of taxpayers’ pockets. In other words, what you are looking at is a transfer from taxpayer to borrower, with no evidence at all that this will benefit the wider economy.

      If you want to argue that it’s “fair” to do this, then fine. Make that case. Just don’t pretend that it economically benefits those who don’t have mortgage arrears.

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    • LOl That the problem , Irish too accepting tahts why we in this mess .

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    • As a taxpayer who did not overextend myself or collaborate with reckless banks to borrow recklessly, and did not join the property ladder greedy train.

      I object 100% to having my taxes used to pay other peoples mortgages who were irresponsible, there needs to be an analysis of each case and anyone who took out mortgages of ridiculous values against small incomes or loose employment should be left to reap what the sowed.

      Anyone complaining about negative equity should wait another decade or so before complaining, the mortgage term they signed up to will include fluctuations. And they were buying a property with a plan to stay there for 30 years…..if not they were speculating on property and were part of the bubble and deserve what they get.

      Harsh but people blaming everyone else but themselves really piss me off, and expecting me to pay there mortgages for them is unacceptable

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  • As a taxpayer who did not overextend myself or collaborate with reckless banks to borrow recklessly, and did not join the property ladder greedy train.
    I object 100% to having my taxes used to pay other peoples mortgages who were irresponsible, there needs to be an analysis of each case and anyone who took out mortgages of ridiculous values against small incomes or loose employment should be left to reap what the sowed.
    Anyone complaining about negative equity should wait another decade or so before complaining, the mortgage term they signed up to will include fluctuations. And they were buying a property with a plan to stay there for 30 years…..if not they were speculating on property and were part of the bubble and deserve what they get.
    Harsh but people blaming everyone else but themselves really piss me off, and expecting me to pay there mortgages for them is unacceptable

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    • Ure great ,Blue peter badge on the way to you Mr google .

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    • I notice you didn’t mention being against using your taxes to pay commercial bank debt.

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    • The banks were nationalised, and yes taxes have been used to pay there debts, once they are back in operation and are sold into the private market, we will recoup some of that “investment”.

      Secondly, the debts were payments to protect further european banks from the contagion of irish property greed and property bubble, which our government, regulators, bankers, and reckless borrowers, and mortgagers created. So some responsibility is rightly on us.
      I expect some to be shared by european taxpayers once stability returns, and repayment for our responsibility in taking them on.

      This is very separate from mortgage holders, who are in 2 groups

      1. Speculators who overextended buying houses they couldn’t afford, hoping against reason that property would increase, allowing them to release equity, and that money grows on trees, and not considering the debt realistically, massaging their income etc…..and being greedy.
      2. People who purchased what they could afford, and had job security etc, and now only suffer from negative equity, which is not a problem at all. If they are paying their mortgage and living in the house they decided on for the long term, then they are fine.

      Writing down 100,000 – 150,000 on a mortgage is equivalent to giving people 10 years income tax.
      If this is done for any individual at all it needs to be done for all.

      Reply
    • Introduce 2 new tax rates:

      1. A new high rate / levy for all people who contributed to the property bubble, speculating on houses, from banking officials to ministers, to individual mortgage holders who were clearly speculating for profit.
      this should be used to pay the costs, and punish the irresponsible behaviour.

      2. Introduce a new lower rate for all individuals who were not irresponsible, to relive them of the burden of paying for the mistakes of greedy people. also as encouragement.

      Otherwise you are rewarding irresponsible borrowing, allowing people to keep illegitimate assets, and punishing and robbing money from those who were not idiots.

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    • My old man is property developer. I remember one time( and I was with him that day) he went in for a medium size loan and the bank manager offered him 4 times the amount he wanted at a special rate . My dad refused point blank but the manager kept trying the hard sell . i knew from that day I should be saving and it was only a matter of time before the it went belly up.

      Reply
    • We all have anecdotes about this sort of thing but I too know a wealthy business man who wanted an overdraft of €50k to finish a job and came out with an offer of €650k! He told them where to go. He is still in business today.

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    • neilo 16/03/13 #

      @hellogoogle Tracking. How do you know people were being reckless. Seems to me that many bought houses to live in that are now worth an awful lot less due to “market forces”. Many of these poor suckers have now lost their jobs/ gotten significant pay cuts and are suffering. Where do you get off labeling them as “reckless”. The real crime is that many would be quite happy to give the bank back the house and rent somewhere they could afford, but of course, your debt follows you even when the house is gone. Your calvinist approach doesn’t show much empathy mate! Your thumbs up for the bailing out of the banks also seems a little dim, pay off the billionaire bondholders their speculation money and swallow the rubbish that is all down to the refulator/ banks in Ireland ONLY. Easy to land the muggs in Ireland with all the debt so, right!? I think ye might need to look at this a bit closer…

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    • @neillo
      You make some fair points and I will answer them
      1. I am not talking about unfortunate sensible people who purchased family homes and were not speculating or counting on property inflation to allow reselling in short term and sizing up etc. they may have had what they considered secure employment and expected to be able to pay their mortgage, and want to pay. These people should be offered a breathing space by banks to find new employment and then resume payments. They should not have they value of mortgage written down with my taxes, and in effect be granted a decade of free income tax with the bill being left to me. Do you understand?
      2. There are another group who overspent, falsified their accounts to get mortgages for properties that were overpriced and they people involved were speculating, remember all that craziness.
      Those people are responsible for there debt and why should taxpayers pay their mortgage?
      3. Bond holder
      There are 2 types, secured and unsecured. Our banks were nationalised (I don’t agree with that but it happened) We have no choice about the secured debt, has to be paid, there is some scope not to pay unsecured. I have great sympathy with the point of view hat says they gambled and lost, tough. However in our situation requiring borrowing to keep our country afloat, we cannot afford to gain the rep of not paying our debt…..also the EU will refund it to us once we demonstrate we can run our country again….just watch and see.

      Reply
  • Trust me on this , you will find in 6 months time every single Tom,Dick and Harry coming out saying he is in distress on his mortgage and looking for a way out of his or her own financial mess.

    The state still takes a hit folks, ah but my fellow paddy doesn’t give a shite once they are getting something out of it.

    Reply
    • how do you know you arsehole whatabout genuine people juggling between eating or heating their homes
      shows your way of thinking is ti jump on the bandwagon

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    • Harpurlee, when you say “genuine person” are you referring to someone/family that lived within their means and bought a house that was affordable but unfortunately are struggling as a job was lost or are you referring to the family/person who purchased a house well outside their means, ran up 1 to 2 car loans etc.., and is now blaming the banks/government for their own stupidity because they are now struggling to pay it? I hope you are referring the first one?

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    • Well Genuine people who are juggling between eating and heating the home will now have a 3rd choice. Feed the family and heat the home and then you’ll have a case for distressed mortgage. I know what I would do if i was in that situation. And sure why not, them and their children will be paying for this mess for years to come, so why not exploit the loop holes.

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    • Harpurlee.. Please refrain from such ignornat insults. You don’t like brass rat and that is fine… but refrain from ‘you a******e’ type comments..

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    • Brass rat I hope someday you feel the hardship of having your family home ripped from you by the bank and know what it is like to go hungry on the street as many our in this country thanks to our banks and government running wild with greed!

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    • Why would you wish that on him. Sounds like he made some good decisions in the past and is not currently a burden to the state and tax payer( ie YOU), yet you want him to feel hardship for his views on this. If here were to buy a house and get kicked out of it. you would probably bear some of that burden, why would you wish this on yourself too?

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    • mohamad – Who borrowed the money in the first place ???

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    • In Iceland the bondholders took a hit per capita that would equate to somewhere in the region of 900 billion in Ireland…………… the debt aint real folks the greed is though and you are either on the side that pays it or takes it !….
      “Only the coinmaker makes money all others take it !”

      Reply
    • neilo 16/03/13 #

      Bitter little Troll. Not sure ye sound as smart as you think ye do…

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  • Too many lefties on this … Debt forgiveness would see Everyone trying to get there debt written of.. We are a greedy nation and the sooner we all accept it and stop blaming government for our problems the better :)

    Reply
  • Hitchcock reincarnated!

    Reply

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