Spot on, it’s hard to belive it’s 2012 with this nonsense going on.
If people are owed money they should be paid, if the boss has to sell his car to do it then so be it, he’ll still have his pension..

Not much doubt about that I’d say! Hopefully we might get the full story one day…
Just a thought – could use of agri-diesel in the border area be a factor?

There is s lot of.talk about agri diesel being used. Yes there are companies using it but I dont think its that big an issue. Agri diesel is a different product to road diesel & even if its not washed modern truck engines dont like it. The sulphur content is too high.Also if someone is buying a lot of green diesel its easily flagged by revenue & your accountant is reponsible to notify revenue why large amounts are used. It not a great money saving activity as its not that easy to put in your returns. Using it really is an act of desparation. If it gets to practising this type of activity really its too late to keep going.

@Mjhint
I could be wrong, but my understanding is that there is absolutely no difference between agri-diesel and road diesel apart from the added dye.
The only reason illegal diesel has a high sulphur content is because sulphuric acid is used by criminals to bleach the dye.

And in fact someone can be prosecuted for using laundered diesel on the basis of high-sulphur content alone:
http://www.independentlaboratory.ie/fuel_spin.html

hear hear,still swanning around the dail without a care in the world

what has that got to do with this case if you dont mind me asking

Makes perfect sense to the great outraged though!

Hit the target.

The thought did enter my head I must admit…I believe there is a colorful history at the back of all of this..

Damien. Lets get one thing straight. Revenue did not close the company down…. Mr McBrien did!!! What did he not bring in an administrator??? Serious questions alright but for Mr McBrien….

Declan, IF and I say IF as stated by Mr McBrien in the journal that they we closed down for failing to pay on wednesday rather than friday questions need to be answered by the Revenue as they state that they will try and accomodate people who make the effort to pay.

Unless Seamus McBrien surrenders his right to privacy, they can’t. I won’t hold my breath.

Do you really believe that Damien….That the Revenue would just send 400 people to the dole for the sake of 80k….Come again….Besides…Mr McBrien is the one who closed the company….he had options…such as administration??? Nah…There is way more to this….And the the people of Ireland know…..The general vibe on here and on the street is that the blame lies with the company management and owners…

No, shocking that the company would not pay the tax due on time. We complain all the time that people get away with this sort of thing and then when revenue say no more… we complain that they are too harsh. There are people all over the country putting in long days and nights to keep their business afloat while paying their taxes and monies due. It makes a mockery of them that the MD of Target can say Revenue was being harsh and the country rolls in behind him. How long did he have to sort this out? We don’t know so we can’t judge the revenue on this. I feel for the workers here and their families but we cannot have companies paying tax when they feel like it and missing deadlines or we rally will be the next Greece and riddled with a massive black-market with no respect for the authorities and the tax system. As much as anyone else I am fed up with the high taxes and tough times but we all have to pay our dues. Besides, why was Target sponsoring the Tyrone team if times were so tough?

@Ross
There could be lots of reasons that target could not pay Revenue demands on time. Maybe their creditors are finding the current trading environment tough and cannot meet some of their bills on time because they pay the revenue first and have little left for anyone else – that’s the way business is at the moment, profit margins are being squeezed at the minute especially in the logistics business where running cost have gone through the roof in line with fuel prices. The revenue commissioners are absolutely ruthless at the moment, their attitude is pay up on time or close down now. They don’t look at the bigger picture like the cost to the state of another 400 people unemployed for a year, their attitude is that if one company is not fully compliant then business will move to the next one that is. The problem here is that jobs generally don’t move with the business, bigger business (normally multinational ) get the extra work and the economy loses out because the profits are taken out of the country – think Tesco! Every euro spent into local small business is worth 4 times more to the economy than if given to a company like Tesco. Unless the revenue attach a human element to their business we are going to end up with a system where only the big survive, family run enterprise will be gone – the rich will be richer and the poor will have no choices.

Frank,

I understand a can see exactly where you are coming from. However the “human element” is usually the bit that invites in corruption, dodging of duties and backhanders. In an ideal world; yes treat each case individually, but we cannot afford this and we cannot be too sympathetic to a company that let things to this far without informing its customers its’ vendors and more importantly its staff that it was up that creek without a paddle.

@ Ross
It’s the revenue that I suggested need to add a ‘human element’ not target or any other company in trouble. I don’t know why this would lend to dodgy dealings. I will guess that you are perhaps working for revenue or a revenue sheriff from your response. Like I said in the previous post there are a number of reasons perhaps other than shady dealings that may have sent this company into difficulties – I have been there and I know that there are more elements to this than we are being told right now. I understand Mick Wallaces reason for under declaration although I don’t agree with it or the revenue attitude to this. If target express had under declared and paid the lesser amount would they be any worse than one of our TDs?

@ Frank, look at the bigger picture, why did target not call in an administrator, that way the company would have continued trading and paid its employees all the while under court protection from its creditors while the administrator looks for an investor. Instead target owner walked away from the company and gave 2 fingers to the staff who are now left in limbo.

Tell me this, how many cases have you heard of the revenue shutting down a business(putting it in receivership), i have heard of very little, its usually always other creditors / banks that move in

@ Stone walled
Agreed that if they knew situation that they should have acted appropriately to protect the interests of their employees first and foremost. I have dealt with revenue and I know how completely ruthless they can be – I have been on the receiving end of this. My point was now in particular about Target but more as a general view of how they act and treat people in business. There needs to be a bit more flexibility with people who are waiting on their own creditors to pay them.

Just doesnt make sense..you put 390 out of work and so that’s 390 people who need to claim social protection which could take anywhere from €3.9 million to up to €10 million a year from the exchequer(depending on how many kids the men or women have etc etc).It will cost the state in the longer term as the chances of all 390 finding a job is virtually impossible!These jobs should have been saved at all costs!!

YES the company should have paid their tax on time but leeway, give-and-take is paramount in an economic depression that we are in, is the only way jobs can be kept!

So what have the revenue got now? A court case to squeeze €500k out of a defaulted business and 390 unemployed people…great job folks!

Barry. Having just listened to the 6.1 news on RTE I think you owe revenue an apology.

Absolutely agree.

What trucks. They dont have any. They are all gone back.

And the stock belongs to third parties, not Target, but apart from that it was a good idea…

Thats not the point of this at all John…. The employer is responsible for the welfare of the employee’s and he was obviously not doing a great job of that…By not paying the tax he was putting all their jobs at risk…

So the loss of 400 jobs is now justified?

He tried paying it back and look what happened. If the revenue were serious about getting the money back, none of this should have happened.

I’m only pointing out that the cost to the people of Ireland could be 8 million per annum should there not have been intervention prior to this event of closure

John, Its a disaster that these people lose their jobs….But we can’t have revenue making exceptions for people like Mr McBrien…He knew the risk he was taking……I beleve the general consensus around the coutry is that the owners of the company are to blame here…Just look at the thumbs guys….

Worse than the KGB? Get a grip…