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Comment #4796642 by jane

jane Feb 20th 2016, 9:02 AM #

She has been a disaster in the leaders debates.

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'The one thing I'm certain of is that we're not at 4%' - Howlin plays down latest opinion poll

'The one thing I'm certain of is that we're not at 4%' - Howlin plays down latest opinion poll

Results of the poll appeared online last night and indicate support for Fine Gael is at 30% while Fianna Fáil was at 22%.

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    Favourite jane
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:10 AM

    You’d have to wonder who’s advising her. After the first debate I thought she’d reign in the screeching a bit. Maybe she just can’t help herself.

    639
    Favourite Dave Murray
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:13 AM

    She knows the games up Jane, so she’s going down…well….screeching.

    565
    Favourite Patlyndo
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:17 AM

    Agree Jane, Eamon Gilmore must be chuckling away to himself…….

    403
    Favourite Deborah Behan
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:17 AM

    Just shows how much power and delusion has corrupted the Labour Party. Bye bye.

    560
    Favourite Luke Kelly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:20 AM

    She has totally given up and is already feeling sorry for herself. What a weasel. The death knell was working class women in her own constituency deserting her en masse. At this point all eyes should be on the next ‘leader’ of Lab.

    387
    Favourite For Connolly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:24 AM

    Much as I’m looking forward to labours annihilation last weekend, I’m finding it hard to believe that they’ve effectively lost half of their remaining die hard supporters in a couple of weeks. Something stinks here, especially with so close to an election a poll appearing on the pollsters website for a few mins, then being pulled.

    There’s two more polls out this weekend, but of course the only poll that counts is right around the corner.

    349
    Favourite Dermot Lane
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:25 AM

    Luke her body language looks like someone who has already given up.

    241
    Favourite Tom Kelly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:26 AM

    As high as that?

    176
    Favourite Bobby Connolly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:26 AM

    Luke……. there’ll BE a “next” labour? ???????

    127
    Favourite North Korean General
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:27 AM

    No so much the bad performances that are sinking Labour but 5 years of lies and broken promises.

    337
    Favourite Dermot Lane
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:27 AM

    Jammin, her two TV debates cost her big time, I’d say the poll reflects people opinion of Joan and her performances as much as anything else

    244
    Favourite For Connolly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:33 AM

    Dermo, an exit poll at the last election showed something like 3-4% of people cast their vote based on party leader. Don’t get me wrong, I’d love to think they lost half their remaining support based on her abysmal performance, but she has been pretty abysmal for a long long time.

    224
    Favourite David Murphey
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:35 AM

    I used to admire Joan Burton, though I’m not a Labour Party supporter.

    She didn’t come from a privileged background. She studied hard, got a qualification. Got elected, became a minister, and then Tanaiste. That’s not easy.

    I still think she’s a decent person, but she has been a disaster over the last couple of years. Hopeless.

    299
    Favourite doorhandler
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:36 AM

    M.M. performance so far is pulling back the voters that left F.F. in 2011. I presume they will increase a little more before polling. The undecided between S.F. and F.F. may be swayed to vote F.F. after Paul Williams comment on the Late late show last night.

    144
    Favourite Garwig
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:40 AM

    Brilliant for the Traitor Judas Party.

    154
    Favourite Awkward Seal
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:43 AM

    @For Connolly All those 2-3% changes in support are meaningless because they probably fall within the margin of error (I don’t actually know because they don’t actually tell us what it is!). A poll is meaningless without the margin of error because any change within it is statistically insignificant. Only a large change or small changes over time in one direction can be shown to be statically significant. I’m willing to accept there’s been a drop in Labour support but it’s not necessarily 50%. A single poll change within a week is not enough to make any such conclusions. If the next poll has them at 6% the headline will read “jump in support for Labour”. It’s absolute nonsense. The Journal should be ashamed of themselves for this shoddy journalism.

    74
    Favourite Dave cullen
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:44 AM

    She’s the perfect spitting image character with that scream and mad aunty thing she has perfected.Good to see the wretch on the ropes after the damage she’s done to the country.

    155
    Favourite For Connolly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:50 AM

    @ awkward Seal: The MOE for the leaked poll was 3.1%, according to people discussing it last night.

    Incidentally, can anyone else remember a poll being posted to the polling company’s official site a day early, then being withdrawn a few mins later?

    127
    Favourite Greg Kelly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:52 AM

    Yes FC cause all those socialist communist countries that you want Ireland to be like have been lovely for their citizens . Venezula, Cuba, North Korea and Zimbabwe ( and how we all long for the old Eastern European communist block to be back). We miss those days don’t we ?

    56
    Favourite Iúrach
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:52 AM

    The announcement of Irish Water was the proverbial hanging for the Judas party.

    For all the time since, they have been slowly asphyxiating.

    214
    Favourite Jho Harris
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:54 AM

    Firstly when took over this country was in ruins. Seriously though we might all have be on the ball next weekend, I mean I thought we’d have wait until Saturday evening to see the first one eliminated, it looks like they could all be gone by tea time and there will be nothing to look toward to on Sunday either.

    96
    Favourite Awkward Seal
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:55 AM

    Thanks Connolly. I don’t know why The Journal doesn’t report that! It should be interesting to see what other polls have them at. The moment Labour got into power and began by attacking their own base they started digging their own grave.

    149
    Favourite For Connolly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:57 AM

    @ greg: The fact you use the phrase “socialist communist” indicates that you have no clue what you’re on about.

    When you’re back in college Monday, ask your lecturer to explain the difference.

    Good lad.

    169
    Favourite richard kenny
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    Feb 20th 2016, 9:57 AM

    Well time 2 get rid of her,a terrible lookin sketch to have as our deputy prime minister of our little country. How can we be taken seriously abroad??

    113
    Favourite prop joe
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:06 AM

    I would say this poll is down to the Luas strike. Siptu and the drivers asking for a 50% raise. Start living in the real world. The red c sbp poll is probably the most reliable so it will be interesting to see there numbers in that. But Jack O Connors comments this week probably don’t help either. Makes it look labour is run directly by siptu.

    100
    Favourite Not Neo, not Trinity
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:10 AM

    Because Twitter & Facebook are a barometer of the country, just as the journal is. And regardless of where the guy who confronted MMD worked/works, his views are valid and his vote is as a valid as anyone’s. I like the way the Shinnerbots attack the person, not the message; but that’s typical. Paul Williams hit the nail on the head last night with his comments re SF and their cult following.

    Time to get moving jamming, there’s a little parade on today. Tell Ogle to take a running jump; it appears some of your would be supporters can’t afford to get to Dublin due to the high transport costs; Ogle helped them out with that one.

    41
    Favourite Greg Kelly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:11 AM

    But FC Sinn Fein are part of the GUE/NGL party grouping in the EU made up of socialist and communist parties like Portuguese Communist Party, Syriza of Greece, Communist Party of Bohemia and Moravia from Czech Republic, French Communist Party to name a few and are based on a mix of socialist and communist principles.

    31
    Favourite gerry o donell
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:14 AM

    Because having Edna isn’t embarrassing enough.

    106
    Favourite Patlyndo
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:15 AM

    How long FC, since you voted for them in 2011? That long?

    13
    Favourite gerry o donell
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:17 AM

    So it turns out the concerned citizen is a liar who is only interested in whats in it for me. No wonder he supports finegael.

    137
    Favourite gerry o donell
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:20 AM

    Isnt paul Williams a friend of the criminals the ones he reports on (as opposed to the ones inside the dail who don’t get a mention) doesn’t he crave their crimes so he can take advantage of the victims and abuse and misrepresent them while trying to make money selling his bulshit stories

    142
    Favourite Nosmo King
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:28 AM

    Jack O’ Connor of S.I.P.T.U would be one of those advising her . So hopefully union members will soon see the light and insist that their hard earned union dues no longer go to prop up a defunct Labour Party.

    112
    Favourite Joe Smith
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:32 AM

    As a matter of interest can you show how you know this guy is anything but a concerned citizen, Excuse me if I think this is just the sf stooges doing a hatchet job on him.
    How do you know he manages a €15 billion hedge fund ?

    27
    Favourite Fear Uisce
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:32 AM

    Or just quit SIPTU

    49
    Favourite watersedge
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:33 AM

    Pearce Doherty has called on Micheal Noonan to release his figures from the dept of finance on his 5 year plan to phase out the u.s.c. He has also called on him to engage in a one on one debate. Let’s see if either happens.

    130
    Favourite Greg Kelly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:34 AM

    FC please don’t bring his brother into this. As another poster said below when Gerry Adam’s brother did wrong it was unfair to tarnish Adams with the same brush, so don’t bring his brother into this either.

    24
    Favourite Patlyndo
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:34 AM

    Ah, so his brother is apparently an ex FG TD?

    While Gerry’s brother is definitely a convicted child abuser?

    Oh, I see……..

    27
    Favourite John Joseph McDermott
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:34 AM

    Problem is;with Labour out of the way the people still have to contend with a Fianna Fail/ Fine Gael coalition.
    The lot of ordinary people will not be improved by having the country governed by two teachers and two parties whose principal support base is farmers and speculators- big and small..
    They will repress the people even more, with a continuation of stealth taxes and water charges to maintain their privileges.
    Remember that the water taxes are a non issue for almost one third of the nation- the one off “McMansion” dwellers who have private wells or cheap group schemes.
    The property taxes are also a minor intrusion on their pockets as they only pay on a valuation basis and a mansion in Kerry is worth less than a three bedroom semi in Dublin or Cork

    65
    Favourite james walsh
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:35 AM

    Agreed finipops, But at the price of the party’s core supporters, this motley crew have cemented the Labour Party to the history books.
    Short term gain (monetary), long term loss (support) has destined the party to the history books.
    #nofgliebour

    68
    Favourite Patlyndo
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:36 AM

    Sorry Greg, I did because the level of hypocrisy from the usual suspects is pretty astonishing.

    Any person who dares to criticise SF are then subjected to intense investigations and every area of their life used against them.

    26
    Favourite Paddy o'brien
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:40 AM

    Her whining voice reminds me of the hated and reviled tatcher of uk fame

    77
    Favourite von
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:47 AM

    For Connelly. I hope when FG and Lab lose the GE that said billionaire will take himself back to Malta. But first pay of his loans in Irish banks.

    90
    Favourite C O'Neill
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:48 AM

    “I think she is a decent person.’ Yeah, right.

    56
    Favourite Sally Saucer
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:51 AM

    How does water come out of private wells? With a bucket or something?

    13
    Favourite Luke Kelly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:51 AM

    Doherty vs Noonan? No contest. Noonan would wipe the floor with him as long as the debate was an actual debate and not soundbites.

    29
    Favourite Kevin Carroll
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:54 AM

    Bye bye Frankfurt party

    78
    Favourite Paige Turners
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:54 AM

    Jesus the vitiol directed at Joan Burton is really horrible. There’s a feeling of a mob off this.

    36
    Favourite Luke Kelly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:57 AM

    Burton has betryed her own base and ran the Labour party head first off a cliff. The Burton bounce amounted to getting a slap of a water balloon in the face and that’s about it.

    88
    Favourite Paige Turners
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:59 AM

    Noonan would wipe the floor with Doherty. Doherty calls for it so he can be seen as a peer if Noonan agrees (he’s not) or afraid of the debate if he doesn’t (he isn’t). This is standard political posturing in an election cycle.

    26
    Favourite Luke Kelly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 11:00 AM

    And Paige, according to this poll 96% of the electorate don’t want Lab either so what’s happening here on these boards seems to be reflected nationally.

    So the “mob” are arguably the entire population.

    83
    Favourite Joe blogs
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    Feb 20th 2016, 11:02 AM

    Why don’t you mention the Scandinavian countries when looking for the model that our left parties most resemble?? Because they are successful socialist countries?

    55
    Favourite For Connolly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 11:06 AM

    “Doherty vs Noonan? No contest. Noonan would wipe the floor with him as long as the debate was an actual debate and not soundbites.”

    I take it you didn’t hear noonan vs FFs finance spokesman argue on RTE radio about whose figures were the least wrong, in that case.

    87
    Favourite Will J. Browne
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    Feb 20th 2016, 11:09 AM

    @Dave cullen It’s striking how many people in this country are angry at the government for the efforts they had to make to fix the financial crisis but have forgotten how we got into such a mess in the first place. It was predictable that all these new populist bullshitters would come out of the woodwork to take advantage; What’s surprisng is that, instead of learning the lessons of the crisis, people are still gullible enough to swallow everything they’re being fed by them.

    13
    Favourite OneTrueVoice
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    Feb 20th 2016, 11:13 AM

    Sinn Fein’s ‘who are you to question me’ policy seems to mean no citizen is allowed to ask Mary Lou a question about her illogical ‘in the round’ bs economics.

    The dissenters will be silenced.

    At least they won’t suffer physical injury I suppose. Some things have improved over the past decade.

    31
    Favourite For Connolly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 11:23 AM

    “Sinn Fein’s ‘who are you to question me’ policy seems to mean no citizen is allowed to ask Mary Lou a question about her illogical ‘in the round’ bs economics.”

    I guess you missed the bit where he asked her questions and received answers, in that case.

    92
    Favourite Josephine Sweeney
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    Feb 20th 2016, 11:29 AM

    she looks nothing like her election poster

    45
    Favourite Sally Saucer
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    Feb 20th 2016, 11:31 AM

    Someone has just told me that the wells are not the same as the wells in “Ding Dong Dell”They are expensive water pumps that need to be replaced every ten years (or sooner if affected by frost and snow). These pumps are run by electricity.
    Local authorities should offer tax credits for these water “expenses” and maybe more people might decide to drill their own wells and the local authorities would have less water to treat.

    19
    Favourite Seán O'Ceallaghan
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    Feb 20th 2016, 11:32 AM

    Hardly Adams didn’t do outstanding either

    11
    Favourite Patlyndo
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    Feb 20th 2016, 11:34 AM

    Until the “machine” went into overdrive and did what you are doing, putting who you think he is, before what he said.

    Deflection at its best – no emphasis on what he was saying.

    8
    Favourite Josephine Sweeney
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    Feb 20th 2016, 11:36 AM

    who will repair all the broken concrete for the temporary water meters?

    33
    Favourite Luke Kelly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 11:37 AM

    @Dermot Lane

    “Luke her body language looks like someone who has already given up”

    Don;t you know it’s sexist to say that according to Joan and feminiazis?

    36
    Favourite Diarmuid
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    Feb 20th 2016, 11:46 AM

    Awesome rearguard action shinnertroll James Connolly.

    Still too brainwashed to admit Gerry Adams’ recent performances have been mangled train wrecks?

    19
    Favourite Chris Kirk
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    Feb 20th 2016, 11:53 AM

    I would say that it was embarrasment that caused the pollsters to pull the poll. Nobody really wants the Labour party to be annihilated, but with support for so many other small socialist parties to choose from this has caused labour to become irrelevant in this election. Where their past achievements in government will be credited to the larger government party anyway.

    9
    Favourite Bren MC
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    Feb 20th 2016, 11:54 AM

    I didn’t believe in the banshee until I saw Burton.

    51
    Favourite Motherofdivinejebus
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:02 PM

    Early shift Dear Mud? – are you moving back up the food chain in the FG HQ?
    Or are you doing overtime on your night shift, I`ll give you a wave as we pass by on the protest, want a coffee brought in?

    43
    Favourite For Connolly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:03 PM

    “Nobody really wants the Labour party to be annihilated”

    Wanna bet?

    55
    Favourite Stephen Brady
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:04 PM

    Margin of error is 3%. Labour are deep in the dodo.

    45
    Favourite Chris Kirk
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:06 PM

    I wish that our county council would provide an answer when we write to them, it is ony good manners afterall.

    14
    Favourite prop joe
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:13 PM

    @nosmo I think labours problem is that they are to close to siptu. Jack O Connor wants labour in government with ff or Fg. That’s why labour will be routed in the next election.

    33
    Favourite Stephen Brady
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:13 PM

    Joe Google sarasin partners Dublin. Look in the our team section and lo and behold there is our concerned citizen. He is the CEO.

    36
    Favourite Chris Kirk
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:13 PM

    FC, tell us why you support SF and want the Labour party annihilated. Surely you can recognise the disaster SF have made in West Belfast. I have no doubt the Gerry Adams will probably top the poll in Louth, but what has he done for the people who live there.

    13
    Favourite Doc
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:19 PM

    FC, rambling on with his usual vacuous utterances, nothing changes, a SF mule, I feel sorry for Labour, a party of substance and I know history will be kind to them unlike FF and the legacy that they have perpetrated on our children, in emigration, increased cost of living and levies such as insurance and pension levies and that’s not mentioning the hated USC, FF, never ever forget what they have done to our country, they talk about making mistakes, they say that it occurred 5 years ago but what they don’t mention is the legacy that they have bestowed on our children and let me tell you this, SF will do the very same thing and if you are a middle income earner you will be continued to be screwed by this taxation party

    10
    Favourite Derek Lyster
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:32 PM

    @ Diarmuid,he may not be the best at debates but he still performed better than burton and kenny

    36
    Favourite Patlyndo
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:32 PM

    Yep they served their purpose well for you, protected your pension. They can sling their hooks now.

    3
    Favourite Patlyndo
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:33 PM

    Quick spot there Stephen, nothing escapes you.

    2
    Favourite Luke Kelly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:34 PM

    @John Bennett. It wasn;t a mistake to get rid of Gilmore. It was a mistake to elect another old giard face in his place. Alex White perhaps, or better again Arthur Spring (youth and fresh faced) rather than a moaning arrogant whinger like Burton.

    Lab signed their own death warrant in that leadership contest.

    31
    Favourite Garwig
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:39 PM

    Anything on the bailed out banker Fergus Crawford posing as a concerned citizen and heckling TD’S. Some neck.

    41
    Favourite Garwig
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:41 PM

    It’s part of the FEAR Strategy we are being threatened with. They are trying to sway voters.

    32
    Favourite For Connolly
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:43 PM

    “FC, tell us why you support SF and want the Labour party annihilated. ”

    I support the principles of the Labour partys founders, which are closer to the 1916 proclamation and right2change policys than the abomination labour have become by a country mile.

    I’m supporting PBP, SF and our constituency’s R2C independent.

    You had your chance when Gilmore quit. You needed a Corbyn, you chose a thatcher. Labour needs to go.

    49
    Favourite goo
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:44 PM

    Cancelled deduction from siptu to Labour Party years ago ! The should change their name to traitor party power hungry and forget about people who put them there !

    37
    Favourite Doc
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:50 PM

    For Connolly is a state employed individual who happens to be a SF mule and stooge, the irony of it.

    8
    Favourite Chris Kirk
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    Feb 20th 2016, 12:59 PM

    FC -I could say I supported the principals of Brian Boru but it wouldn’t do much good today. Clinging on to the principals of Connolly (a Scottish agitator) suggests that you have little national pride as a nation builder. Ireland sold its national sovereignty to the EU and now has to toe the line to get what it can. I don’t know what good it will do to vote for SF or the small parties, they certainly won’t make much difference to most of us, particularly in rural Ireland.

    10
    Favourite Powerabbey
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    Feb 20th 2016, 1:08 PM

    Poor Jammin is in full flow today trying to undo the damage that Gerry did during the week.

    No doubt the electorate will be clever enough not to vote for IRA/SF.

    Now, you guys in IRA/SF headquarters give me all the red thumbs you wish.

    10
    Favourite Dave cullen
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    Feb 20th 2016, 1:26 PM

    Will,Still blaming ff there,their disastrous leadership will go down as one of the worst ever but for you to say fg labour have done anything for the people of this country is waffle.Any party could have taxed and levied the blood from us to appease Europe.The contempt by these people for us will be shown next Friday.

    26
    Favourite Will J. Browne
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    Feb 20th 2016, 1:40 PM

    I’m not just blaming FF. I’m blaming populist politicians who tell us we can get everything we want without having to have to pay for anything and the eejits who vote them in. FG/Labour haven’t done anything for us? What have they ever done for us apart from make the country solvent again, show the door to the Troika, reduce unemployment from 15.2% and rising to 8.6% and falling, lower taxes for low and middle-income workers in the last budget and increase spending on services, and fix the financial deficit so you might just get a state pension when you retire? Apart from all that, yeah, they haven’t done much.

    2
    Favourite Joe Smith
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    Feb 20th 2016, 4:52 PM

    Eventually powerabbey the penny will drop with them, manipulating the comments section here is not manipulating how people view republican gangsterism

    5
    Favourite Ronan Leonard
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    Feb 20th 2016, 5:34 PM

    What did Paul Williams say last night?

    2
    Favourite Charles McCormack
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    Feb 20th 2016, 6:51 PM

    We,(as a country,and and electorate,) would be better off if so called “Labour Party ceased to exist,) in UK also, “Labour” in both countries are so far removed from founders,Hardie,(UK,) Connolly etc,(here,) it’s difficult to see differences between “Left” and “Right”, capitalists all under different labels now, I think.

    4
    Favourite Gary Delaney
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    Feb 20th 2016, 7:47 PM

    White’s political career is over:
    His own Sec General, at the recent PAC Eircode hearing, confirmed that Minister White had lied on the subject of the EC investigation into the €50m Eircode fiasco. The EC had found that EC regulations aimed at supporting the participation of SME’s in public procurement were not followed and Minister White had repeatedly denied any adverse findings at all. The same PAC hearing exposed C&AG findings that many of the normally expected procurement standards/regulations were not followed for Eircode and the end result is that the taxpayer did not get value for money. Minister White had stated on the record of the Dáil on 15th June 2015 when trying to get new privacy legislation for the Eircode postcode over the line,m that the Eircode procurement was the height of “Robustness & Correctness” when he already knew of the serious issues raised by the EC, who at that time were chasing his Department to provide evidence of corrective action that they required as a result!
    Minister White’s governance was so poor that he failed to heed warnings from professionals in relation to critical flaws in Eircode and these warnings are now being borne out as consultation has now commenced to redesign the so called postcode that even An Post is not using.
    The relationship between An Post’s protectionism, the CWU and the Labour party, through Pat Rabbitte and Alex White, cannot be ignored in this case!

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    Favourite Pol Ó Muireadhaigh
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    Feb 20th 2016, 10:05 PM

    Dermot her failure to turn up for the Peoples Debate in Dublin West was her Waving the White Flag. Stick a fork in her shes done

    4
    Favourite Rashers Tierney
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    Feb 21st 2016, 12:39 AM

    You can see for yourself on LinkedIn, amongst other sources, Mr Smith

    2
    Favourite Paul Gurney
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    Feb 21st 2016, 10:51 AM

    Would it be the advisor who she gave the 52k top up to????not so worth it after all then!!

    1
    Favourite Paul Gurney
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    Feb 21st 2016, 11:01 AM

    @ NOT NEO
    Sinn Fein attack the person????how do you think this article came about Neo and even after the persons identity was revealed INM still reported a” mystery man “confronting MMD.The govt lack of grey matter very apparent on this one…they cant even do a stitch up without shooting themselves in the foot.
    And as for Paul williams….The fact that he careers as a SENSATIONALIST crime writer probably excludes him from the Wikipedia reference of all things true and factual.

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