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Comment #5263228 by Harry

Harry Jul 12th 2016, 6:27 AM #

It’s 2016 why aren’t these displays of venomous bigotry banned

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Three houses set ablaze in Belfast after bonfire burns out of control

Three houses set ablaze in Belfast after bonfire burns out of control

Today marks the anniversary of the victory of Dutch Prince William of Orange over the Catholic King James II at the Battle of the Boyne in 1690.

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    Favourite James Darcy
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    Jul 12th 2016, 6:39 AM

    I suppose to ban them is to incite them to further behaviour. To let them do it the hope is they fade to extinction.

    362
    Favourite fiachra29
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    Jul 12th 2016, 6:58 AM

    Wow Bobby you must be seriously deluded if you think left wing groups have a lot in common with the Orange Order. The Orange Order are as right wing as the KKK, also I think those people marching have a deeper hatred for Irish people of native descent rather than the church itself of which they probably know very little about.

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    Favourite Bigus Diccus
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    Jul 12th 2016, 7:11 AM

    It’s a well-known fact that the pivotal moment of the Battle of the Boyne was King William III employed a wall of burning tyres and pallets to create a smokescreen, which left the Jacobite forces totally unaware of the assembling cavalry on their flank. The charge, when it came, was totally unexpected and utterly devastating.

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    Favourite Alan Scott
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    Jul 12th 2016, 7:14 AM

    James only when there’s a united Ireland will they disappear for good . I cannot see that happening in anytime soon.

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    Favourite fiachra29
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    Jul 12th 2016, 7:24 AM

    They’re not going to give it up anytime soon it’s pretty much the only thing they have that marks them as a distinct cultural group. Every other aspect of their culture is basically is copied from English and Scottish culture.

    253
    Favourite Joe Bloggs
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    Jul 12th 2016, 7:26 AM

    That’s very niave Alan. If there was a united Ireland these 12th celebrations would be even more prevalent.

    138
    Favourite Greg Kelly
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    Jul 12th 2016, 7:29 AM

    Stay classy Orangemen! I am no fan of SF but burning their posters on a bonfire is just s*umbag behaviour.

    Burning the tricolour and images of catholic images were also seen on some bonfires showing the mentality of some loyalists

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    Favourite ktsiwot
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    Jul 12th 2016, 7:57 AM

    let the bigotry begin, they come across as such an insecure people rooted to another time, to be fair to the decent ones they get out of the north for the week

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    Favourite Gerald Kelleher
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    Jul 12th 2016, 8:28 AM

    There is a little hypocrisy here in Southern Ireland every bit as awful as that displayed by men walking the Shankhill road today. A few weeks ago Pat Kenny cheerfully announced that the ‘British Isles’ is a geographical term and is therefore a valid description of the two combined islands notwithstanding that the Irish countryside and British countryside are geographical terms partitioning sovereign territories. Some will contend that it doesn’t matter in the scheme of things and it just an academic issue however the Battle of the Boyne date is hugely significant as it is a testament to the British academic bigotry which refused to acknowledge observed scientific facts.

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    Favourite brian boru
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    Jul 12th 2016, 8:41 AM

    Easier to under stand the world for your simple mind Bobby if you place people with views that don’t agree with your interpretation of the world in to little boxes ?

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    Favourite brian boru
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    Jul 12th 2016, 8:43 AM

    May this night pass peacefully for all in the six counties.

    Always a worrying time of year,

    101
    Favourite jane
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    Jul 12th 2016, 9:08 AM

    Still a long way to go up there. There’s just no way it should be allowed.

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    Favourite Juan Franc
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    Jul 12th 2016, 9:29 AM

    Great credit is due to the police for making sure no one was in the houses when the bonfire fell over….policing at finest.

    62
    Favourite Palbears
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    Jul 12th 2016, 9:53 AM

    Why wouldn’t they just go to the pub instead and have a few drinks to King Billy?

    A Paddys Day of their own.

    This nonsense every year makes you wonder wtf goes on in their heads.

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    Favourite Bobby Phelan
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    Jul 12th 2016, 9:55 AM

    maybe they want to be an ethnic minority.what a waste of timber

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    Favourite Stephen murphy
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    Jul 12th 2016, 10:04 AM

    I could’ve built a few houses, with all those pallets and what a disgraceful waste of good timber.

    79
    Favourite funkytown
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    Jul 12th 2016, 10:57 AM

    And I think the tyres were remould’s!

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    Favourite Cosmo Kramer
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    Jul 12th 2016, 10:58 AM

    I even seen one bonfire that was going to burn a statue of the Virgin Mary.. Could you imagine the outcry if a picture or anything of the Prophet Mohammed was burned in a Christian celebration.. Irish flags and pictures of SF politicians also being burned surly is a hate crime and should be banned..

    138
    Favourite dublinlad
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    Jul 12th 2016, 11:35 AM

    Gerald, you lost me there with “scientific facts”? Since when does science come into history?

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    Favourite Gerald Kelleher
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    Jul 12th 2016, 12:19 PM

    Well Dublinlad, I see I got a fair few thumbs down for pointing out that the ‘British Isles’ ceased to have any meaning since we became a Sovereign nation and that the Irish countryside is the only geographical term that is worth anything. The readers here complaining about the bigots of the Shankhill Road will just as quickly acknowledge that Ireland is one of the British Isles because a few academics in the British Ordnance still believe the two islands combined as one exists -

    https://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/blog/2011/08/whats-the-difference-between-uk-britain-and-british-isles/

    You probably miss the point that the 12th July represents British eccentricity and the inability to change even when the world has changed around them. We are not exempt either so when you stroll along the Liffey Dublinlad, remember you are not any part of Britain but in Ireland.

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    Favourite Tony McCoy O'Grady
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    Jul 12th 2016, 12:28 PM

    They’ve been marching for centuries – with and without the single aim of arrogant crappies-lie-down triumphalism over their non-Orange neighbours.
    They don’t show any signs of extinction.

    Better idea — if you can’t beat them,m join them. Let the non-loyalists append themselves to these marches and play their own tunes – make a family day out of it. That would really piss the loyalists off.

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    Favourite Alien8
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    Jul 12th 2016, 12:39 PM

    Ger, you missed the fact that the map is an old .co.uk map, that features a country called “Republic of Ireland” that has never existed and the UK (the only country that used the term) officially supported using it years ago. That aside, there is nothing British about the culture in Northern Ireland, it is entirely a b4stardised version of Scots-Irish culture with a mediaeval loyalty element to the title of the English crown. It was never “British” and never will be, but it is a title that they have kept without really knowing that it means Scottish obedience to England.

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    Favourite Ciarán Nestor
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    Jul 12th 2016, 12:51 PM

    Excellent.

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    Favourite Nigel O'Neill
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    Jul 12th 2016, 1:05 PM

    @Harry..what really happens is not what you generally see on Sky News you know?!?! Plus the bonfires that burn items that offend are generally done so by a small minority of thugs who have no real association with or understanding of the Orange culture and heritage. I can tell you that many many Protestants in the north have no time for that carry on or the violence that errupts in Belfast sometimes also. 95% of them march along a non-contentious route and enjoy a peaceful, fun day out celebrating Their heritage and tradition..which they and any part of society are allowed to do within a democracy and free society. Until you experience a normal genuine orange parade in one of the country areas listed, dont be so quick to comment or judge on the blind

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    Favourite Nigel O'Neill
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    Jul 12th 2016, 1:07 PM

    @Greg true buddy but those burning posters on bonfires are not real ‘Orangemen’ ..just thugs who get drunk for a whole week before and dont even attend an actual Orange parade or celebration

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    Favourite Nigel O'Neill
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    Jul 12th 2016, 1:09 PM

    @Jane …why should the Parade celebrations of the 12th not be allowed Jane? Are you saying there should be no Paddys day parades in Belfast and Derry also!? Have you ever seen one yourself even..apart from what you soak up from Sky News!??!?

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    Favourite Gerald Kelleher
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    Jul 12th 2016, 1:21 PM

    Well Alien8, for you and the rest who are so quick to give a thumbs down, the difference between the orangemen and you is that they are secure in the fact that they are British while the Irish are not sure if they are from Britain/British,after all, that is what it means to come from the ‘British Isles’.

    The orangemen can’t adapt and turn their parades into a celebration of their culture but more remarkable, the Irish can’t adapt in the same way to the fact that the British Isles is no more and nothing attached to this land is attached to Britain/British.

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    Favourite M Bowe
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    Jul 12th 2016, 1:39 PM

    Nigel when we see and hear that 95% you speak of openly condemn and distance them self from this blatant sectarianism and hatred then they cannot be looked at in any other light than that which the accept and keep within their ranks lol

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    Favourite Palbears
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    Jul 12th 2016, 3:32 PM

    I’m probably taking the bait here. But what do you mean ‘ceased to have any meaning’?

    The term is still in use. Always was.

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    Favourite Palbears
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    Jul 12th 2016, 3:41 PM

    Looked it up.
    Yep
    All islands are still there.
    Guess you’re just stirring things up.
    Cheerio
    Have fun

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    Favourite Gerald Kelleher
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    Jul 12th 2016, 3:42 PM

    If I have to explain that the ‘British Isles’ which included the Ireland of Ireland ceased to have any meaning with the emergence of the Sovereign State of Ireland then I am already losing but then again I see a proportion of 10 to 1 support (using thumbs down as a gauge) have a huge identity crisis unlike the orangemen who at least know they are British. It must be great calling the orangemen bigots who won’t recognize their identity within the island of Ireland while the Irish themselves want to retain direct association with Britain via the ‘British Isles.

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    Favourite whereisspace
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    Jul 12th 2016, 3:50 PM

    Genuine question…are there laws in NI to hold people accountable for this type of abuse towards their fellow citizens? Surely it is a “hate crime” or is it ok because the vast majority of people who would be offended by this are white?

    Why is the Irish government standing aside and letting the burning happen without at least an explanation from the PSNI?

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    Favourite Gerald Kelleher
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    Jul 12th 2016, 3:55 PM

    Oops, meant the island of Ireland .

    I believe the IDA sent people to America after Brexit to remind American companies that Ireland is not part of Britain despite the almost 10 to 1 support in the Journal readership for a return of the ‘British Isles’ . Doesn’t exist and never will.

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    Favourite Nigel O'Neill
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    Jul 12th 2016, 4:18 PM

    @M Bowe…and how do you plan on seeing that? Through Sky News again!?!!?!?

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    Favourite Firefeind
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    Jul 12th 2016, 4:40 PM

    Atlantic archipelago/Celtic isles u mean. British isles extremely archaic term

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    Favourite Firefeind
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    Jul 12th 2016, 4:43 PM

    Celtic isles/antlantic archipelago are much more common and modern terms in use rather than the archaic british Isles which is not a recognised term internationally.

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    Favourite Palbears
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    Jul 12th 2016, 7:22 PM

    Please stop

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    Favourite Gerald Kelleher
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    Jul 12th 2016, 8:16 PM

    I have seen enough cowardice and stupidity for one day, after all, a majority of readers in the Journal openly supporting the ‘British Isles’ with Ireland included is no place for me.

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    Favourite Bobby wilson
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    Jul 12th 2016, 11:36 PM

    Fiachra… as some who has grown up in north belfast i have a good insight into Orangism on what it thinks of catholics and its church…

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    Favourite Harry Whitehead
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    Jul 13th 2016, 1:25 AM

    Firefeind, the term ‘British Isles’ is and always has been nothing more than a geographical term. It existed long before ‘Britain’ existed as a political unit. Even at the very highest and mightiest point of the British Empire, the UK was only ever styled ‘the UNITED Kingdom of Great Britain AND Ireland’, never as ‘the Kingdom of the British Isles’. You’ll find you’re wrong however about it being considered ‘archaic’ among the international community – it’s still very much in use. Don’t believe me? Look up the term on Wikipedia and then use the feature allowing you to look at the equivalents on Wikipedia’s non-English editions – virtually every one apart from Gaeilge uses the direct equivalent of ‘British isles’. Even the Basques (Euskara) use the term.

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    Favourite TehJurolan
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    Jul 13th 2016, 8:12 AM

    @Gerald probably best to avoid mirrors for the rest of the day then.

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