because their hungry, forest, woods are being destroyed by mankind for making more cities, homes etc …

So we should starve and not build cites so foxes will be happier?

starve… why do you eat Foxes ??

That comment really shows your superior intellect.

The journal deleted my first comment so ill go easy on you this time. What made you make a comment like that? I’d suggest you read about man and civilisation not look at colour pictures. Then research fox hunting (not colour books and pictures) and come back with a structured sentence that makes sense. Good lad.

At James atley

pheeew….thought it was me ! :))

We ate horses, maybe we should try fox burgers as well. Mmmm… could be nice with curry

Why would you be thinking about eating foxes? I assumed you were thinking about how we have cleared land to grow crops and in the process disturbed their habitat so they come to the city for food. Maybe I was wrong to think you had thought it through.

Ollie, who was talking about hunting? Stick to the point like a good lad.

Haha. Another poorly conceived comment heaped upon the public James. I was merely showing the plight of the fox as opposed to the human baby population which is doing pretty well. Healthcare and protection by its parents seems to do the job.

I like you James, your funny. :)

Where exactly did you do that? I can’t seem to see where you pointed that out. Did you just imagine you did?

Ollie you come across as quite a pompous intellectual snob.

One fox attack in the last 3 years. Is that not tiny? I bet there are far more dog attacks icluding fatal attacks. A bigger issue is how we handle the waste that draws the animals from the country into the city and what actions homeowners take that enable creaturess like foxes to get intothe house

That was my thought… How are the foxes getting into the houses?? I would think if ya knew there was a possible predator outside (human or animal) and ya have children in the house, why would you leave a door/window open??? That’s just not safe period. Solution for mauled babies: shut the doors and windows!!

Real being what? Fox attacks are rare as hens teeth or as a partially separate argument the fact I’ve hunted all my life and have shot foxes in the country. Be more specific and ill answer your charges. You better have your facts aswell.

The charge is being a pompous ass which you have more than proven in almost everyone of your comments. You choose to attack a person’s comment because of their lack of proper grammar and use of the English language. I’m pretty sure if you would stop the personal attacks folks would be more willing to take you more seriously. Opinions are like bums mate… Everybody has one and some stink more than others. But I respect your right to have your opinion and state it freely. But I would highly suggest ya stop with attacks and quit being the grammar police and be respectful and perhaps your arrogance wouldn’t overshadow your thoughts and ideas. It’s not your argument I necessarily disagree with… It’s your way of presenting it.

Ok Jillian point taken. Ill be more gentle in future. Is that pragmatic enough for you?

I find it hard to deal with people who condone cruelty to those who can not speak for themselves. Those are the animals we SHARE this planet with. I won’t deal with those ignorant to reason and evidence and post really crap comments that show ignorance.

This article is a political ruse in England by Boris Johnson for reason outlined above. It is not about children and their safety. It would be suitable if the media disregarded this non issue and focused on real world issues like poverty and disease.

I wasn’t referring to you above by the way. I respect those that use their real names. Good night jillian.

And I completely agree sir :) I like animals more than I like most people and would never condone harming ANY animal. My original comment was just a simple observation. If we as humans would simply take the necessary steps to protect ourselves (shutting doors and windows), these poor animals wouldn’t even be an issue. My point was to wonder how is it the foxes’ fault when they’re doin what is natural to them… Hunt. A fox isn’t gonna think “hey wait a second… This is illegally entering a premises if I go thru this open window…” It is OUR responsibility as humans to take those precautions since we encroached on their territory ;) see Ollie?? We agree!! ;) nite nite

Yes. There’s billions of us.

Taking even!

love it ! ..:))

My thoughts exactly, why was a 4 week left alone in a room to begin with the window open in the middle of winter

Only animal that’s ever broken into my house was a cat. And cats can do some damage if they wish – should we ban cats too?
Mind you I don’t expect much more from Boris Johnson, the guy seems to be a bit of a joke..

Shanti, read these about cats before asking that (it’s not lots, it’s 15% of the total bird population in the US annually):
http://www.livescience.com/26670-cats-kill-billions-animals.html

And ultimately who is to blame for that?
People like to keep cats as pets and they don’t bother getting them neutered and leave them roam.. Cue massive over population of semi domestic cats, which will hunt no matter what – it’s what they do. It’s the humans fault. If we weren’t arrogant enough to think that we can control nature we wouldn’t be overpopulating some species and making others extinct.

@ Shanti I have two cats, a boy and a girl .. both are netured, I have two dogs …both are netured , .. I have a husband ..Now theres a problem …!!! ha ha …

Michelle it’s good to see that there are some responsible pet owners out there – but sadly a cat needs to roam.. We might like to think we own a cat, but really a cat decides whether or not it likes your home. For this reason Im quite torn on the idea of keeping them as pets.

your right Shantie ,a cat picks you,you dont pick a cat ..and my two go out to roam but sleeps in at night and first thing in the morning they both cry at the back door to go out .. Cats are good for a few reasons..keeping one calm just by rubbing them they keep stress at bay and there good company but the best one is keeping mice away ! …we havent had a mouse this year YET !! ..go on you would be doing a furry little animal a good turn …a loving home ..:) ps let us know how you get on ….

Oh, that’s alright then. So we should just let them eat our babies… What about the rats? They were also here long before you.

I love animals. I used to keep chickens, but more than once a fox got into the coop (despite fencing) and broke all of the chicken’s necks. Every single one. Just for fun because it couldn’t possibly eat them all. It then just left the cadavers there to rot. Caught on CCTV. I was heartbroken as they were all rescue hens that I had saved from battery farms and spent months nursing back to health.

Kitty I bet you’ve eaten a few baby animals in fairness but its ok if they’ve been skinned and cut up is it?

Fine, feed your baby to the foxes so.

Your giving foxes intelligence too much credit kitty. Im sure it ate something, they don’t do it just for the craic.

im sorry to hear that, that wasnt a nice thing to experience maybe electric fencing to consider in future if your thinking of doing same …

So your experience has led you to a biased opinion on foxs? I wonder what the incidence rate in Ireland is for these attacks on humans? I’d say Nil based on reports but this is not certain. Now I wonder how many foxes are killed by humans every year in ireland I’d say at least 6000. Shooting, den digging with multiple dogs, poisoning, etc.

What is the population of London by the way? One fox bite!!!! Get serious!!!! What about all the murders and rapes in that city every day. Boris Johnson rears up because his very rich friends want hunting with hounds reintroduced. He’s angling at foxes because of this. Get sense. This is very very very rare!!!!!!!

..kitty !!!! thats a dreadful thing to say especially from a female ! im shocked..how old are you ?..

@ kitty

So you saved battery hens from a 2 year life of misery (that’s the time period of profitability). I commend you. So instead the fox instead , a survival predator that shuns humans of any kind, you want it to endure the misery of being shot, torn apart or poisoned? Am I right? Would you support that.
why did you save those hens? Simple unassuming question.

I will not feed my children to the foxes kitty, ill sacrifice myself if someone has to be eaten.

@Super: I’m happy enough with that proposition. ;)

I saved the chickens because I wanted them to have a little bit of a nice life before they died. They are a lot of work, but it made me feel good inside if I’m honest.

I am old enough to have a small baby of my own and the thought of this happening terrifies me. I just do not understand why Super thinks its okay for foxes to eat meat, including humans and chickens, but it’s not okay for humans to eat meat. That is just plain irrational.

I don’t dig up foxes from their dens, but if one came into my home and near my baby I would not think twice about killing it.

And no, I would never condone inhumane animal culling. Just because I believe in urban pest control, does not mean that I ever have time for cruelty to animals which I think is disgusting.

Well its the right thing to do kitty. I bet you don’t like those evil lions in attenborough docs eating the poor gazelles do you? I eat meat, quite a lot because its infront of me on a plate but i don’t then say its wrong for other animals to live by their natural survival instincts. Why not try and stop the fox before it has an opportunity to get at your child.

A dog would do the same to chickens to be fair…. If you have a chicken coup you run the risk of stuff like that happening. It’s in their nature.

We are not questioning your good deeds kitty, i applaud your kindness. I really do but i don’t agree with your idea of evil foxes killing for the fun of it. Like Martin said many dogs would instinctively do the same to chickens, they are only doing wrong in your eyes, not by nature.

I come from a farming background, always had dogs and chickens, dogs never harmed them even tho they roam free on farm. If you don’t want foxes to get them, close them in safely at night as this is when foxes hunt. We’ve had foxes in the vicinity of our farm for years and thankfully they didn’t get the chickens. They can be a threat to new born lambs but we have a beef herd so now issues for us. Humans have no one to blame but themselves if foxes are in an urban area as this was probably once their territory before urban sprawl and their only source of food now is what humans throw away.

Ok kitty. I’m just pointing out that humans are species bias according to social norms. It baffles me.

Chicken farmer close to my place recently had 300 chickens killed by a jack Russell… So yes, it’s in their nature.

yes Martin i agree was on my Aunts farm many years ago and they had a Jack Russel …i found newborn kittens in the hay loft and the dog was beside me saw them and jumped in and grabed two in its mouth and killed them there in then in front of me ! …hated those dogs ever since.. :(

It all depends on the dogs conditioning, obviously if they’ve been around them since they were pups they are going to be used to them.

agree, obviously this dog wasnt …

That’s not the same thing at all and you probably know that. I agree that the wanton waste and slaughter of you chickens is hard to stomach and it must have been heartbreaking for you. But talking about feeding babies to foxes doesn’t advance your argument or make me at any rate feel very sympathetic towards you.

ha ha …

Nail on the head. More should be done about idiot parents, not wild animals.

This baby must have been on the ground, either on a blanket or in a crib or something, unattended

Exactly!

thought of that too ,normally a new born is in the sittingroom in its crib in the courner so its NEW MOTHER’ can keep peeping at it for obvious reasons and a window/door would not be opened at this time of year too !..you would wonder …

Well I know myself, I don’t have kids but whenever I would be minding my niece when she was a baby I never left her alone and if I did I made sure the front, back door was looked and the windows too. That was just for leaving the room.

I think that’s a tad judgemental. You mustn’t have kids. The usual scenario is when your baby is asleep in the daytime (likely in a quiet, darkened room), that’s when you go into the kitchen (with your baby monitor), make bottles, sterlise all the equipment, get something to eat, have a shower, take a quick nap yourself, etc. When the baby turns six months, parents usually put them into their own rooms at night – there is nothing wrong with that. The only thing I would be aware of is to have the house secure in the first place – at least all doors and windows closed.

and I am A MUM …:)

The fox went up two storys also

what ? …you serious did she live in a flat complex or what ?

no she lives in a nice two story house … ..

It’s called a den

Most of the times it backfires.

Third attack in the middle of London in recent years, not second.

Interesting. An article in new scientist speculated we’re a blight on the earth, large bodied and long living. The earth was here before we arrived and will be here when we’re extinct

Glad someone agrees with me … I know we can’t tar the whole human race with the same brush .. Just like we can’t condem the whole fox population because one attacked a child … But all in all my sentiments about humans still stand .

Ruddy things legging it out in front a cars at night. But I’ve nothing against the fox. It’s just rooting through our garbage for food . Tis not their fault we ruin everything natural

Hard to make a full recovery after facial trauma and losing a finger.
But you’re right, far better that we lose a few four-week-old baby fingers. Small price to pay to keep such magnificent vermin in the heart of our cities where they fill such a vital role in society.
After all, spare the teeth, spoil the child, right?

Yes, this was actually a planted fox. A hunt snuck into the house, painted the baby’s finger with fox bait and released a fox into its crib, just for the negative PR for foxes.

No, perhaps they’re thinking its a wild animal and it didn’t occur to it that unattended human newborns were off limits for eating. I doubt any one ever sat it down and told it. It was hungry and opportunistic – as wild animals are. It is extremely unfortunate, but it’s also the way of the world once you take out human rationalisation.

Shanti, have you actually read some of the stupid comments on this page?
If this had been a rat attacking a baby, do you think they’d be calling the mother a bad mother for leaving her child sleep alone or do you think they’d be calling for more rat-traps?

It’s a mix of thinking that we should save all the cute animals and thinking that foxes are cute, neither of which are particularly bright things to think.

Actually Mark, I have had rats as pets and I don’t understand the great aversion to them. Rat migration patterns prove that they were not responsible for the plague and leptospirosis isn’t nearly as common as most would like to think.. They’re clean, intelligent, affectionate, capable of meta cognitive thought and empathy.
For this reason they go where the food is – is it their fault that humans are filthy and leave their waste strewn about the place – or are they just being opportunistic?
Best way to get rid of wild rats is to clean up. Funnily enough – this is also the best way to get rid of foxes. If we leave food around then what do we expect?

Would a rat attack a baby? No way. The rat is more likely to run away the second the baby twitches, they know humans are predators. Also – a rat will only bite when cornered, so that point is moot, my rats trimmed my hangnails and they never once hurt me (whereas when I do it I always end up making myself bleed).
Most people who scream “vermin” are merely trying to shift blame from themselves onto a creature who is merely trying to survive when we have destroyed its habitat.

Would a rat attack a baby? No way.

Really?
Google it.

I just did. The Mirror, The Sun and the Daily Mail.. Such reputable newspapers.

I’ve been keeping rats for years. Have several friends who breed and run rescue centres for rats and have a few friends working in the veterinary profession – I’d be more inclined to trust that.

Go beyond page one Shanti, to the reports of attacks in UK, Indian and US hospitals, to the videotaped attacks in NYC, to the myriad of reported attacks over the last fifty years and more. If it has already happened and been documented and videotaped, it’s a bit stupid to claim it never happens.

Right.. Looking at those results again, the further on pages, these are reports about giant rats. It may interest you to know that technically these aren’t actually rats..
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gambian_pouched_rat
(Please note – thanks to these rats, land mines are far easier to remove, thus saving countless lives and limbs).

Rats, as in rattus rattus (the black rat – quite rare) and rattus noverigius (the common brown rat) are what is found in the wild around here. They’re substantially smaller, far more skittish and do not attack humans.
By contrast, one of my mates In the UK has a pair of Gambians – and they are inclined to bite first think later, until trained. They’re a different species and their behaviours are worlds apart.

No, wrong again, the reports I’m talking about refer to the norway rat and the roof rat, the most common rats in the world.

Please link – they aren’t showing up on my search, and I searched for “rat attacks baby”. All attacks mention giant rats.. These have gotten loose in some areas due to irresponsible pet owners.

I tried searching “Norway rat attacks baby” https://www.google.ie/search?q=norway+rat+attacks+baby&btnG=&hl=en&client=safari&tbo=d&biw=320&bih=307&sa=2
Note the second link down and it’s response to the urban myth that rats attack babies..

They are lovely creatures

Are you serious Gary? They are vermin. They are in no way related to domestic dogs. They carry mange and attacks like this are only increasing. They are not pets!

I’d rather Mangey foxes roaming Dublin City at night rather than thugs attacking and robbing law abiding people out for a good night. Prefer the foxes any night of the week!

Haha. They share DNA homologous mr smarty pant. How stupid are you? Go onto the NCBI database and found out.

Homogeny

Foxes are wonderful animals. The reason why there is an increase in fox populations in cities like London and Dublin, is because of us disgusting humans leaving our half eaten food waste everywhere.

Foxes are starving and hungry and will appear to do anything for food. It’s humans fault this has happened.

Better waste control, less foxes.

“Foxes” as in junkies ?

where did i say they are pets? it is peoples problems they are running around the streets as anywhere they lived was torn down to build shitty apartment blocks most of which are left unused

An awful lot more attacks on children by dogs than foxes. Don’t see any calls for dogs to be culled or whatever.

Have a look at some of the likes dislikes. While not a great indicator of all Irish demographic populations it is an small indicator that if a ban came into place to ban fox hunting the fox would win.

You snare all you want. I used to do myself (rabbits) but thankfully i saw i didnt need to hunt to survive.

First a law. Them enforcement whether you comply or not and them a gradual dying out of your type of person. This will take about 2 generations If the ban was enacted now.

It’s coming. :)

Ollie the likes/dislikes are representative of the ideology of the journal (a pretty out there left wing bunch) it can’t even come close to a representation of the entire electorate. Cop On Mr Know It All.

Have a look at my response. It says while not a rep. of demographic populations.

I think you have selective short term memory. Maybe long term aswell judging by those comments.

Mate you got a few green thumbs and you think you could win a referendum, Wise Up.

*abortions

Your stereotyping there. You don’t know my thoughts on abortion. Reading thoughts – you are a marvel.

Shanti. A rat who imagines its being threatened will attack a human. I lived in the country as a child and more than once saw this happen

Like I said – self defence. They don’t go out seeking to attack humans..

Hmmm, slightly different type of fox culling, to be fair ;)

colm …we the humans have done this by cutting down forests.taking away any kind of food that the fox lives on because all creatures have moved out they have no place to go except the cities …i do agree hunting does keep the figures down but all said in done these animals belong in the woods and forest but what chances have they got, when man destroys it….

They didn’t ban hunting them. Just banned hunting them with dogs, that is flouted all the time.

Hounds have also attacked babies.

Agree

Some post here I would not agree with but two post stand out to me Mock Murphy and Old Holborn the other thing I notice was both do not have a id on their account nothing wrong with that at the moment just to say that some posters and they are very few can come out much stronger in their posts than if they might id but very soon I hope everyone will be required to have a id such as a photo with their real name and a up to date contact email address. Again I am not suggesting that at the moment anyone without a id are not doing wrong I hope this will change very soon

Alan, allow me to point out the folly of your wish.

As a public website all sorts of people visit the journal each day. Some comment and some don’t. There is no vetting procedure, it’s a free for all (unless you get yourself banned for breaking the comments policy rules).

It would be lovely to think that every person viewing here is of sound mind, but there is no guarantee. If you post a comment that stokes the ire of a slightly unhinged person, having your name, photo and contact email available for them to see would be a very stupid thing to do.

Some people use pseudonyms for a reason. Some can’t use their real name as a result of their occupation, some because they have suffered harassment, but asking that every person leaves themselves open to Internet stalking is quite myopic.

I don’t call out my home address if I am giving a public talk, same reason I don’t give my face and name on the journal.

Give up whinging Alan you dose.

10 fold increase in other pests that they usually prey on, like Rats. Which would you prefer to have in your back garden?