Next week we will be paying over 700m to senior unsecured bond holders in Anglo. This week the Greeks get their borrowings cut by 50%. Just who are the fools in all this?

we are paying our way and we aren’t getting anything cut. would of been better off not paying anything back

Debt forgiveness should be universal…or not at all. Isn’t the whole purpose of the EU to create a general set of rules that ALL member states must adhere too for the creation of an EU state?.I mean surely they cannot be creating one set of rules for one state and another set of rules for another state? This would be open to a legal challenge

Why is it not so easy to wipe out third world debt?

No. The Greek people were never going to stand for the austerity that Ireland so pathetically puts up with. They took took to streets. They shouted from the tops of their voices. “Go to He’ll”
They knew they had Europe by the balls and they never let go. Despite a European subservant government The Greek people fought it and they won.
What’s happening here. We sit behind just bitching the politicians that we voted for who are just little pawns of Brussells. Time to rise up people.Time to say no. Can’t Pay. Won’t Pay

Irish: comply with bailout conditions- get absolutely shafted.
Greeks: ignore bailout conditions, throw hissy fits in the streets- get a massive discount.

The world is not fair.

Reducing Greek debt is not letting anyone off the hook, what we here is a pain sharing exercise. The debbt being written off represents past borrowings. Greece must still deal with a massive ongoing fiscal deficit. They will still have to sack 30,000 state employees, reduce pensions and other social benefits, increase VAT and, if they can collect them, income tax. They will also have to sell off virtually all state industries. Some let off!

And were will growth come from. Their economy relies on tourism, shipping and agriculture. Not exactly strong cards in a glbal recession. Envy the Greeks? I don’t think so.

I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies-Thomas Jefferson 3rd President of the Unite States.
We have been sucked into the debt trap to bail out the banks that are shafting our economy and its citizens to protect their bottom line. Greece were in up to their eyes but decided enough is enough and they have reaped the benefit. From what i understand very little tax reachs the exchequer over there,shops outside urban areas have 2 prices -with tax or without !!!,they retire at 55 etc.
Watch – the next step will be a revisiting of existing Treaties or new ones which will meddle in our internal finances (to protect the euro of course!! but should be translated as to finance the banks). And they now have a big stick to beat us and vote the correct way with our large bank saving debt!

The Greeks were not left off the hook, the banks were left off the hook.

It’s like everything in life if you toe the line you get the shitty end of the stick, but if your a complete arsehole you get taken care of. Only difference is were the arsehole with a shitty stick!

Again we as a country even though we do not agree just sit back and let it happen. What about us hard working citizens who are working our guts off just to bay the bills and debts owed by the bank, where is our bailout?, our help, our support……………….we get nothing except red letters and threats that we will lose everything if we cannot keep up with repayments……………..makes my blood boil!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :(

However you differentiate the Greek situation to Ireland’s the fact is that it not their younger generation leaving to search for a normal chance of life. All Greek citizens will take pain but so will the gambling bond holders and bankers now. They have achieved a bit more fairness at least and a better deal for the the futures of their sons and daughters. The cockerel strutting haves of Ireland care nothing about the have-nots and their generations to come. Irelands Rebels of yesteryear are turning in their graves.

I think ok it was maybe necessary for the Eurozone.But if you know the greek system, there is NONE, then you know it is soooo wrong! That is like a child who behaved badly for a long time and all the sanctions did not work was in the end left of the hook, taken off the time out and get what they want.
I have been living in Greece for 4 years and now looking back I KNOW how it works there. The government and uncles, sisters, aunties, neighbours etc are immensly rich and the public HAS to cheat and lie and pretend otherwise you get f****ed and go nowhere. The situation is horrendous! And the worst is that they are not WILLING go change because the crisis requires a different way, a change of thinking and Greece is not WILLING to do so. As I said several times Ireland is very well able to do that – but still then Ireland should also get at least a better deal!!! <3!IRL

” The Greek people were never going to stand for the austerity that Ireland so pathetically puts up with. They took took to streets. They shouted from the tops of their voices. “Go to He’ll”
They knew they had Europe by the balls and they never let go. Despite a European subservant government The Greek people fought it and they won.
What’s happening here. We sit behind just bitching the politicians that we voted for who are just little pawns of Brussells. Time to rise up people.Time to say no. Can’t Pay. Won’t Pay ” BURN THE BOND HOLDERS

Strange poll – why 3 options to say yes but only one to say no?
Early days yet in this poll, but already people seem opposed to a Greek write-down, despite this being the only way to really get out of a debt spiral for many countries including Ireland.

I’m pretty sure other polls asking if Ireland should have a write down of debt the results would us to be in favour of that option for ourselves – but seemingly not for others. What’s up with that?

they will be screewwwed when the recession is over. Their loans will be sky high…… i’d rather be here where at least we can have some chance of getting liquidity back to the economy after this nightmare is over.

I wonder to myself if 100% of Greek debt was written off, could it still make a go of things or would it land back in the mire in a few years due to low growth, ballooning public deficit and poor tax compliance?

There’d be war here if 30,000 public sector workers had compulsary redundancies and pensions were slashed as in Greece.

The unions would never accept that ‘deal’ here.

The simple reason is as the Troike have said is that the greek people will no longer accept any austerity measures. This is why we are not being offered a write down.

On the other hand it does mean that we still have a business presence on an international stage. If we had revolted then there would not have been another announcement of 3 companies setting up Eurpoean/International headquarters in Ireland.

We cant have our cake and eat it too.

It’s great the eu can sweet talk china into buying some debt off us. But all this debt swapping is going to have to stop sometime soon. I mean it’s is all non existent bonds that a government will pay out in the future so I think Ireland should bring out a hundred year bond and try to sell that. I am sure the cokeheads on wall street will buy into it and if they do, so will everyone else. Or maybe Ireland should come up with a new variation of a credit default swap and try to make money out of that seen as we are going to continue with the same bullshit that got us into this mess

Greece can’t pay back that money. It really is that simple, it matters not a jot whether it is right or wrong, it just cannot be done. If they keep on the austerity course and the ECB/EU keep pretending that they can pay it back then there will be an all mighty default that destroy the Euro. It will make the last few years here look like the good times. This is what should have been done years ago before the loohlah’s kept kicking the can down the road.

Have no doubt that Europe will get up to pay back all of the banks debt, even though it is not our responsibility. We have an elected Govt. that while not as treacherous as the FF/PD one will not push our side. We’ll be good little boys and girls and keep our mouths shut and our economy will pay for it for years to come.

Brave Greeks. Pity the other countries are too weak to stand up.

I have to laugh when I hear the Greeks complaining about VAT hikes, we’ve had them for years.Who remembers that VAT was introduced as a temporary measure supposedly for ONE year only back in the late sixties.If their Bondholders can take a cut, why can’t ours ?They are mostly the same people institutions we are all dealing with.
Or could it be that the Greek people took to the streets and said no,enough is enough.
All the Irish can say is Baaaa, like the sheep we are.

This is partly because the Greek people said fu*k off we are not paying!!!
Well, we should do the same.

There is an alternative!

Greece are not being let of the hook.a lot of people who made comments need to read what has taken place.Greece will be paying back the e.c.b. i.m.f.for the next 10 to 15 years.The I.M.F. & E.C.B. are opening an office in Greece for these years to keep check on how money is spent.a lot of hardship to come in GREECE in the coming years.We irish only have 3 years of hard times ahead.so we are lucky,

@Lou: If everybody would see the future so black and hopeless like you we could then right now and shovel our grave. It is not about seeing all negative but CHANGING view which life we ALL live. Everybody even the “small ones” are dictated by HAVING, OWNING, GREED etc. This is what the recession forces us to do now….. You will see what will happen to the rich ones, the home owners etc. The Euro will be gone soon and then if everybody will be forced to live a humble and simple life – who will have the problem. Not us the now “small ones” (how I hate this expression) as we learned to live in peace with ourselves – but then look at the “big ones” – they will be soo overwhelmed. No Euro anymore, all materialism gone – what now? The recession is scary, no doubt but is the best thing ever happening! It teaches us a lesson, THE lesson!

it wont make a tiny bit of difference in the long run, this is an internationally unsustainable debt and the euro is still about to collapse, this is like that kid sticking his finger in the dam to hold back the sea

Greeks will pay dearly for this…if for no other reason than to make an example of them. VAT rates raised, income tax thresholds lowered…they as a nation are in for a brutal few years. Greece has a very lax attitude to tax collection hence their probems..but they couldn’t pay so what other option had Europe. I’d agree though…they shouted long enough and loudly enough that even they were heard in the loft ivory French and German towers.

I see my first reply at the top was taken down. Typical of this po-faced society just interested in sitting down and having a nice chat about everything with a cup of tea and a piece of cake. Pathetic

I presume we’ll get 50 per cent off now….. Oops, sorry, I forgot, we’re a supine, spineless people who will let our ‘betters’ trample all over us. Don’t ever let me hear any talk of ‘the fighting Irish’ again….. Oh, and did you see where their deal is that the banks’ owners and shareholders will be asked to pay up first and then the State is called in to make up the shortfall. We’re different. Our stupid Government takes over the banks when the banks are making losses (not in all the generations when the banks were making profits) and says: “It’s okay, lads, we’ll get that”. And the Irish people are sent out to pay the lot. Oh, ’tis the most distressful country that ever yet was seen. Lie down, Croppies, lie down….

The write down of debt for Greece is for the banks .i will say no more.you will understand when the details are published .we will be 100% better off then Greece.Happy Day”s ahead John.

Unfortunately, for all their gusto and noise, the protests in Greece had little in terms of tangible results. They may have been encouraging, and occasionally entertaining, to watch but hardly any of the austerity measures were softened – and none scrapped – because of them.

Similarly, the decision to write off 50% of Greece’s debt is pure realpolitik. The remainder is still mostly unsustainable (as opposed to the completely unsustainable 100%) by an economy that still, after all the austerity measures, is expected to produce net losses. At the end of the day, the possibility of a 50% recoup of bondholders’ investements is better than the certainty of 100% write-off, which is what would happen if Greece went bankrupt. The whole “saving the Eurozone from implosion” is merely a side-benefit to the deal.

I think they are getting away with murder, but the flip side is their tax systems are a cpmplete sham and i dont think they’ll ever sort themselves out. But in the long term they have no industry and no hope of attracting any type of foreign investment. Would you invest! However look at us, new companies are investing here weekly because one, or tax rate and two, we have held our reputation very much intact internationally.

Ireland will never get a better deal because we have a government who doesn’t give a shit about the people on the street it’s only interest is in looking good to Europe.

I don’t like the questions in this poll. It would have been fairer and better to ask if we agree with the 50% cut that Greece got,y answer would have been yes, the Greeks have suffered more than enough now.

And it is time to stand up and say no more but where do you start?

Bailout shmailout!!

Greece lied about their cash in order to get into eu, ot all about the banks

Yes Elisabeth. Let’s sit here and wait like donuts. Wait for the next 4 or 5 lovely budgets that will strip you bare. And by the time your waiting has ended your Sons and daughters will be gone. Your younger children will be dunces because there will be minimal education facilities. Your job will be gone or poorly paid, your house will be gone and if any more A&E, hospital services shut down because of the situation that bankers ,useless politicians and their millionaire cronies have caused you’re life may well be gone. Now..Would you like a cup o tea pet

Of course this is not a let off for Greece but it is a lessening of pain brought about a direct result of people power. Losing 30,000 state jobs is still a terrible price. Yesterday they were looking at losing a lot more.

Less emotional argument here
http://ftalphaville.ft.com/blog/2011/10/27/714061/greek-lessons-from-john-major-latvia-and-ireland/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Referring back to Benvolio’s comment earlier, if you’re going to compare the extent of Greek debt vs Irish, you must factor in the population difference – Greek’s population is almost 3 times that of Ireland so, of course, regrettably, in this dire situation, you would expect their debt to be 3 times greater. If I’m right, wait until the Italian debt (population 60m) surfaces and hits the fan! Hang on to your life jackets!
In terms of protest, Ireland must try NOT to shoot itself in the foot. The electorate chooses politicians to speak and negotiate for the people – choose wisely. Rather than complaining about the politicians YOU choose to speak FOR you on the world stage, get ACTIVE in politics. Potentially opportunistic street protests and work stoppages will damage Ireland’s economy future and ultimately serve no useful purpose. Look what violence has done for Northern Ireland over the years!

The argument that because we are toeing the line we will get our economic sovereignty back quicker, holds no water for me. The EU is/will push for more centralised taxation and economic decisions. Whether we like it or not we will never have economic sovereignty again. We will be the United States of Europe.

if greece lose half their debt then they will be out of debt in half the time even with our next three harsh budgets we will still owe vast sums of money and how will that be paided back further austerity measures public servants laided off after the end of the croke park agreement or sooner if this budget flatlines the economy grow up gerry and see the ligh tthis goverment knows the people of Ireland will take it all and more