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Dublin: 9 °C Thursday 20 June, 2013

Column: Landlords who don’t accept rent allowance are lazy – and classist

There’s an unpleasant undercurrent in Ireland that distrusts people on state assistance, writes Lisa McInerney. But it’s short-sighted, unfair and snobbish.

Lisa McInerney

I recently relocated from Cork back to my home county of Galway, a move that was as inspired by my missing the tang of limestone in my drinking water as it was by the substantial disparity between the relevant rent averages. Hey, there aren’t many of us unwilling to displace ourselves for a bargain in this day and age, right? The nomadic lifestyle is an economic practicality. At least, that’s what I keep telling myself.

Moving house is a massive undertaking, just on the Crikey-is-that-alopecia? side of manageable. If, like me, you’ve got all your own gear and have arranged to move to an unfurnished property, the enormity of the task ahead is akin to that of launching a rocket into orbit. Hyperbolic? Maybe. Outside of the physical hauling, disassembling, and assembling again with fourteen extra screws and a mystery sprocket, the amount of admin work applicable is almost always underestimated and concluded only after hired goons from your building society track you to your new abode. At least NASA have their own vans.

And before you can even get started on such gut-churning delights, you’ve got to find and secure an appropriate property.With property websites and message boards only a couple of clicks away, it’s easier than ever to sift through what’s available until you find a right fit. This is a boon to landlords as well as to tenants; landlords can list their stipulations before entering into negotiations with prospective residents, which theoretically saves both parties time and potential embarrassment.

One of the things which kept coming up, on my recent search for a new home, was the term ‘Rent Allowance Not Accepted’.

It looked pretty dodgy to me, but it was on so many ads, by so many reputable letting and property agencies, that it was obviously a legitimate specification. I admit that the first thing I thought was that the landlords involved were saying no to paperwork that could end up in the hands of the taxman. Why else would they refuse to consider tenants who would need to give the Community Welfare Officer more particulars than they could shake their copy of Nineteen Eighty-Four at?

As a prospective tenant, it set alarm bells chiming. How could I trust a landlord who wanted to avoid paperwork? It might mean that they had similar aversions to accountability. Would they refuse to allow a tenant to apply for tax relief? Would they be registered with the PRTB? Perhaps ‘Rent Allowance Not Accepted’ would be the first symptom of an indifferent, unresponsive relationship with someone who had no interest in their responsibilities as a landlord, or in engaging with their tenant to ensure a professional and stress-free arrangement for both.

But it turns out that this is rarely the case. Contemporary Ireland, a society with sporadic but vengeful long-term memory, has little patience for tax dodging cowboys. It’s far more trouble than it’s worth to try a cash-in-hand lifestyle with assets as solid as a house; the potential penalties just aren’t worth the savings. No, it appears that the reasons for a landlord stating ‘Rent Allowance Not Accepted’ on their ads has less to do with Scrooge-like cunning than it has to do with plain and simple classism.

With Ireland’s unemployment rate currently hovering around the 14.3 per cent mark, more of our citizens than ever are applying for whatever state assistance is available to them. Outside of Jobseeker’s Benefit or Allowance, RA (officially, Rent Supplement) is the big one. It can ease the strain on the recipient’s pocket down to €24 a week. To those of us struggling – to the staggering, scary number of those of us now struggling – it can be a huge help. Impossible to underestimate it, really. There are plenty of families in Ireland for whom RA is the roof over their children’s heads.

There is a stigma attached, though, and not just tied into Ireland’s cumbersome sense of pride. There is a strong feeling that RA tenants, because the rent isn’t coming out of their own pockets, will mistreat the homes let to them. Because the supplement is paid directly to the tenant and not to the landlord, many landlords worry that there’s nothing stopping the tenant spending the money on something else, safe in the knowledge that eviction is a long-drawn-out and difficult process. That RA recipients will instantly fall into arrears, because taking their claim from initial application to awarded payment takes so long. That their insurance companies will refuse to cover the property, if its tenants are not currently in full-time employment.

There are plenty of landlords out there who have had problems with RA tenants, matching the issues listed above. There are plenty of landlords who’ve had problems with student tenants. There are plenty of landlords who’ve had problems with young professionals, with pet owners, with the recently retired, with young families. There are plenty of tenants out there who have had problems with nightmare landlords.

This is the problem I have with the ‘Rent Allowance Not Accepted’ mantra. It may have come from a natural desire to protect the property. It is still discrimination.

Of course landlords have the right to choose their tenants. It’s a business relationship, and the importance of having that opportunity to choose the right business “partner” cannot be underestimated. But a blanket ban on tenants who need – and, let’s not forget, are entitled to – rent supplement is a short-sighted and desperately unfair reaction. At best, it’s pretty lazy; one would hope that references, preliminary meetings with prospective tenants, and clear lease terms specific to the tenancy (as opposed to the generic contract I’ve seen floating about) would suffice. At worst, it’s outright snobbery. And it’s not an outlook exclusive to landed gentry types, either; there’s a nasty current running through Ireland at the moment, sweeping up the otherwise sane, which holds that state assistance claimants operate on the same moral plane as your typical 419 scammer. The presumption that people claiming state assistance are untrustworthy, untidy and unethical in every facet of their day-to-day existences, from paying their bills to choosing their party guests, is just not acceptable.

It’s certainly not acceptable in today’s Ireland, when hard work and general prudence don’t guarantee safe passage through this recession. How many of us can state that we have a recession-proof job? To take RA eligibility as a moral yardstick means that your ideal tenant today … could be your worst nightmare tomorrow.

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Comments (65 Comments)

  • R.a can be paid to the landlord.Also there is a scheme from dcc called Ras where a contract between dcc and the landlord is drawn up and payment is made directly to the landlord with a long term lease.Majority of the properties in Dublin that accept rent allowance are horrible little hovels that desperate people find themselves accepting because of the lack of suitable and acceptable accommodation. However I do have to say that in many cases, the approval of rent allowance can take anything up to 3 months. I’m currently in my 4th month of waiting for rent allowance to be approved,after repeatedly sending in the required information.On more than one occasion,both the hse & dcc have given me the wrong decision of denying my claim,and have admitted they were wrong.However,my landlord does not receive any contact from either party explaining that.”we don’t really do that” they say.So now I’ve been asked to leave,and will not be getting any deposit back.To make matters worse,I’ll now be placed back at the start of the que when looking for another place to live.I can safely say that my landlord will never accept rent allowance again,but can you blame him?

    Reply
  • What about No Pets, No Children, No Smokers?

    If landlords want to set their own preconditions on who they rent to then its up to them, the market will decide if they can rent their property or not.

    One of the problems in Ireland is the accidental landlord, the guy/gal who bought an apartment before they met their spouse and bought a house with them, or people who brought second properties thinking the price would never drop and they could flip them. Now they are left with a property they cannot sell and a rental business they really dont want to be in. It is this emotional attachment to the property that causes problems like No RA, No Pets etc

    Professional landlords look at the properties as a long term investment and they dont have the same emotional attachment to the properties

    Reply
  • The article and the comments so far completely ignore the practical downsides of RA tenants, regardless of why they’re on RA.

    RA is paid in arrears, which generally results in the landlord waiting for rent. RA also has to be topped up by the tenant, in many cases this top up doesn’t happen. RA can also be reduced unilaterally at any time as is likely to happen in this budget. This reduces the rent the landlord gets, without any consultation with the landlord.

    While there may be landlords who don’t accept RA tenants out of laziness, classism, or even with a view to avoiding tax – most won’t accept them for the plain and simple financial reasons. The author completely neglects to mention these and therefore gives a misleading representation of the actuality.

    Reply
    • Oddly enough, the cheaper places in my locality on Daft.ie are often cheaper than the rent allowance places..
      As for the rent allowance being paid in arrears, I don’t have that problem.. It took a couple of months to come through I admit, but my deposit covered it until the rent allowance came through, which was back dated to the date of application, at which point the rent was paid in full, restoring our deposit to the status of deposit and no longer covering rent.

      I’m not saying all those claiming RA are great – that’s just as much a fallacy as refusing all RA recipients because SOME are scumbags. But there are plenty who have much respect for their landlords for being amongst the few who didn’t discriminate against their situation.

      Reply
  • I’m also kind of baffled by the assumption that bad tenancy behaviour is the sole prerogative of rent allowance tenants. I have friends and relatives who’ve let properties, and some of the “highlights” they’ve encountered from “respectable professional people” have included refusal to pay rent for months (and months), destroying the bath, and running a full-scale brothel from the premises. It’s not like you suddenly turn into “not an asshole” when you get a job.

    Reply
    • Yup, just think, white collar criminals and drug dealers would never be short on a few bob and in need of rent allowance, but that doesn’t mean that all those who can afford to pay their rent in the recession are criminals!
      Most are just hard working people, fortunate enough to still have jobs!

      I don’t see why it’s an outright “no rent allowance” on the ad, I’m surprised it’s allowed if I’m honest.. By having that statement in the ad, the landlord is basically saying; “no disabled, chronically ill, unemployed or redundant workers, single mothers or low income families”..
      I totally appreciate that there are some kinda dodgy people getting this allowance (I’ve had to sit in the waiting room with some of them up at the CWOs office) but to have it on the ad that they haven’t even got a hope (especially if the rent is cheaper than the rent allowance accepted places!!) just because they’re reliant on the State is akin to “No Blacks, No Jews, No Irish”

      Reply
    • user 15/07/12 #

      Thank you Lisa.
      Does working mean you have morals suddenly? or always do right or become responsible?
      No it does not, and being on R/a isn’t always by choice seriously.

      Now it seems as if everyone on rent allowance, drink, smoke, wrecks the place, and not pay rent???Shameful seriously…How about renting it to a family? needless top say, nowadays they ask ( Where are you from? seriously??

      The comments here simply make people on R/A seem as if they are of a certain category.
      R/A isn’t always a choice, it could be involuntary, given the current times.

      It seems like every professional, does not go out on week-ends, drink/smoke or even bothers cleaning the house.
      Seriously, it depends on who you choose to rent your house to, as it has been said, you could screen the prospective tenants when viewing, I find it discriminating, saying that working people, pay rent on time, and R/A people don’t, I have a friend who works, and always used to borrow money from me or my other colleague, no kids, no responsibility, but he always owed rent.

      I myself, was in full time employment, a single mother of two, and my house was always spotless as the kids eventually stayed there, so the place had to be neat, if the childcare in Dublin, costs 950 p/m for a 2 year old, and I had to pay after school for my 7 year old, on top of that, paying for my degree in the institute of Technology taking an evening part time course, and on top of it, paying € 1000 rent p/m, add the transport, and on top of that not seeing my kids, the bills/food, etc..So there was no way, even with 2000 p/m after tax, it was just impossible.
      I had no choice but to stop working and carry on with college as this was my only choice, but the poor keeps getting poorer, and the rich keeps getting richer, and that;s it.
      So, I struggled to find a house, because I was on R/A, although I worked for years, had good references, this did not matter, they ruled me out, me and the kids had to stay in a 1 bed’s apartment sharing a room for a while before eventually finding a place, who was costing way more than what the rent/a was, I had to top up by so much,( €80 ) weekly, when I got 247 , with 2 kids, I didn’t complain because it was better than nothing and it was either that or living in Jobstown, where R/A is always welcome, but of course not safe at all..
      Seriously, the landlord can get his rent paid straight into his bank account, and there will be no problem, I never saw my landlord, because he always got his money in his account, and then he only came over every 6-10 weeks to get his top up, but I can tell you this much, He never fixed anything in the house, I always got it done myself, because every time something had to be fixed, he threatened me, next month rent will go up, shower broke, he’d send one for delivery, and will never install it, till I’d get someone do it…

      So really, Stop this discrimination and stop renting your house to irresponsible individuals, if not to say the word!…..

      Reply
  • Rent can be paid by a direct debit, and it can be arranged that the tenants rent allowance is paid to them the same day its paid to the landlord, also the tenant can request the rent allowance to go directly to the landlord , the balance can also be direct debited so in fact a tenant receiving rent allowance can be more reliable that one with a wage.
    When I separated from my husband ,i wished to remain in the property i had been renting, but my landlord evicted me and my 2 year old child because he didnt want to sign the forms, he was not only avoiding tax but was breaking the law i believe, in doing so, he also withheld my deposit when i left .
    Some landlords are real pieces of work.

    Reply
  • Great article and a subject close to my heart having been both a tenant and landlord. As a tenant I could never understand why landlords wouldn’t accept rent allowance. It seemed to me that their would be more chance of getting rent paid if it wasn’t coming out of the tenants own pocket!

    Then I became a landlord and realised that INCREDIBLY the payment is made to the tenant and they can do what they want with it. I had about 3 or 4 different tenants in my house and they all abused this fact, one even went on holiday to Spain with the money!

    Every single rent allowance tenant I had missed a lot of rent payments and wrecked the house. Coincidence?

    Leon

    Reply
    • I think,u choosed bad tenants,its the common problem as many landlords want to save money and never register tenants with PRTB,if u do that u always can sort any kind of problems related with your rented accomodation.
      As for me,im about 3 years living in the house,landlord agrees with RA,i do not have any arrears,house is always clean and landlord is happy :) All depends what kind of people u find to live in your house and how u protect yourself from any arrears,demage etc.

      Reply
  • To echo Donna – as you may have seen the attitudes on here have made me really angry.

    I have been a rent allowance tenant. My partner still is. He receives a cheque each week which we only cash when rent is due. It’s NEVER been spent on anything besides rent.

    In 4 years the ONLY time the rent has been late was when we we moved in first and were waiting on approval from the CWO, and our deposit covered that until the rent supplement was backdated and the rent was paid.

    I should point out – the CWO was horrid. He suggested I get pregnant in order to qualify for the level of rent in my local area. He reduced me to tears and was generally an asshole. I had to get help from a TD to be treated fairly. So basically if you rely on state aid, you can expect to be treated like shit by everyone from the social to landlords to judgemental compassionless idiots like the majority of posters here, yay.. I’m sure everyone would love to experience that..

    With regards the author of the piece (this is a mistake I see being made in every discussion about RA) it’s not that they cover your rent but you need to pay €24 per week, it’s that you must contribute AT LEAST €24 per week. My partner pays the lions share of his rent and always has. At present he pays €45 (out of €188p/w) per week toward his rent, the rent allowance is €40. So to give the impression that rent allowance is some massive payment is very misleading.

    The majority of landlords who accept rent allowance rent sub standard property (the horror stories my partner has told me- and I have seen from viewing them), cold, damp, mouldy, with infestations and I even saw mushrooms growing in one..

    As I said above, when we moved in here the people downstairs were rent allowance tenants – because they were both in wheelchairs. In people making their assumptions about those claiming rent allowance they are conveniently ignoring that people claiming rent allowances include disabled people too.
    By advertising as “rent allowance not accepted” these landlords are in fact committing discrimination on the grounds of disability. They certainly have on my partner, and my former neighbours..

    Thank goodness for our landlord, a decent man with whom we have a great relationship. A diamond in the rough. He’s had his share of bad experiences, (he has several properties), but the majority of his tenants are decent people. He realises that you can’t judge a person by their situation – only by their actions. There’s some people here who could obviously do with learning that lesson..

    Reply
    • I have live in 5 houses with the people, Irish people, who receive this free rent. they really destroy house and never pay rent, never! because of this I got problems also. They drink every night, always breaking everything and destroying house. I had to move because of them, I never receive anything free, I always work, even cleaning hotel toilets because I never ask for anything for nothing like these people. 5 times!!!! That is a lot of times if its only small number of people. I am saving now to buy a house and if i ever have to rent it to others I never rent to free allowance people, sure not.

      Reply
    • Well then Kasia, you would have missed out on the two people who lived here when we moved in. Really nice people, only claiming because their health had deteriorated. They were the nicest most genuine people I have ever known, and I am thankful to have had my life touched by them.

      What happens if an existing tenant gets made redundant and is forced to make a claim – do you turf them out?
      If someone has a nervous breakdown and is put on disability benefit for mental health reasons they would be forced to apply for rent allowance – would you chuck them out too? Or refuse to let someone who is depressed or chronically ill to rent your property?

      I appreciate that there are SOME in receipt of this allowance who are perhaps not the most desirable tenants. Of course there are. People are people after all. But to make such a sweeping generalisation about EVERY recipient and block them off from renting is really discrimination, and some could say snobbery.

      There are plenty out there claiming this supplement because they need it and not because they are scroungers. Because they have good reason to, not because they are disrespectful, alcoholic wasters.. Just because some are like you describe does not make it right to tar everyone with the same brush.

      Reply
    • user 15/07/12 #

      The comments here simply make people on R/A seem as if they are of a certain category.
      R/A isn’t always a choice, it could be involuntary, given the current times.

      It seems like every professional, does not go out on week-ends, drink/smoke or even bothers cleaning the house.
      Seriously, it depends on who you choose to rent your house to, as it has been said, you could screen the prospective tenants when viewing, I find it discriminating, saying that working people, pay rent on time, and R/A people don’t, I have a friend who works, and always used to borrow money from me or my other colleague, no kids, no responsibility, but he always owed rent.

      I myself, was in full time employment, a single mother of two, and my house was always spotless as the kids eventually stayed there, so the place had to be neat, if the childcare in Dublin, costs 950 p/m for a 2 year old, and I had to pay after school for my 7 year old, on top of that, paying for my degree in the institute of Technology taking an evening part time course, and on top of it, paying € 1000 rent p/m, add the transport, and on top of that not seeing my kids, the bills/food, etc..So there was no way, even with 2000 p/m after tax, it was just impossible.
      I had no choice but to stop working and carry on with college as this was my only choice, but the poor keeps getting poorer, and the rich keeps getting richer, and that;s it.
      So, I struggled to find a house, because I was on R/A, although I worked for years, had good references, this did not matter, they ruled me out, me and the kids had to stay in a 1 bed’s apartment sharing a room for a while before eventually finding a place, who was costing way more than what the rent/a was, I had to top up by so much,( €80 ) weekly, when I got 247 , with 2 kids, I didn’t complain because it was better than nothing and it was either that or living in Jobstown, where R/A is always welcome, but of course not safe at all..
      Seriously, the landlord can get his rent paid straight into his bank account, and there will be no problem, I never saw my landlord, because he always got his money in his account, and then he only came over every 6-10 weeks to get his top up, but I can tell you this much, He never fixed anything in the house, I always got it done myself, because every time something had to be fixed, he threatened me, next month rent will go up, shower broke, he’d send one for delivery, and will never install it, till I’d get someone do it…

      So really, Stop this discrimination and stop renting your house to irresponsible individuals, if not to say the word!…..

      Reply
    • Kasia,sometimes you can get bad tenants and they will be professionals,so u never know what option is better-as all of us are just people and does not matter are we getting RA or working.

      Reply
  • Just out of curiosity, given the above comments about rent allowance tenants all wrecking the house, not paying their rent, drinking their rent (but of course! they’re all alcoholics!), etc., how many commenters here are/were rent allowance tenants?

    I was, back in the 90s, and I was a really good tenant (though I say so myself). This prevailing “wisdom” that *all* (or even most) unemployed/low paid people are also irresponsible layabouts/vandals/thieves/”scroungers” is really quite disturbing.

    Reply
    • Rent allowance can be paid directly to the Landords account on the Tenants request. This would probably be the best way to go in my opinion.

      Reply
    • I have been both a tenant and a landlord. I rented out my old place after I got married, same as a lot of people I suppose. I ALWAYS pay my taxes, on time as well I might add. Even though I make a loss on rent vs mortgage, and it is in neg equity so I can’t sell it. In 30 years it might be sellable. The one and only RA tenant was a disaster. I thought an RA tenant would be more secure, having a stable income. Nope. Rent was always late. I got them out luckily without much hassle in the end, as I refused to repair the front and internal doors they had smashed to smithereens in a drunken fight after 3 months in the place. With no front door the place was not really livable. I was out a months rent, and the place was very badly damaged. Also had hassle of finding new tenants etc. while I was 38 weeks pregnant at the time…. Count myself very lucky that I didnt have the eviction nightmare as well.

      Anyway, lesson learnt for me, I never rented to RA again, and won’t either. Calling us lazy is a bit much, prudent more like. Why would I take that rubbish on again when I can get a tenant who pays rent on time and doesnt damage the place?

      Reply
    • Totally agree with you P. I have literally lost thousands upon thousands because of RA tenants, you would not believe the damage…in one instance they actually smeared their excrement all over the walls before leaving, that after not paying rent for months. I wouldn’t mind if I was a bad landlord or the place was a kip, but the complete opposite. Rent was always late, if it was paid at all and I can tell you that for almost ten years every single RA tenant was a nightmare. Trying to evict them is a joke, a nightmare! Funnily enough since I stopped accepting RA I haven’t had any problems, rent always on time and properties respected. It is a pity that the bad tar the decent good tenants on RA but I cant take any more chances.

      Reply
    • p wurple, sorry thats hilarious, im sure you were mighty stressed at the time with your tenants especially when you were so heavily pregnant but what a laugh them smashing the doors and then expecting you to fix them, fair play for making a stand and glad you got those twats out!!!

      Reply
    • I’m on rent allowance – was about a month in a house share when I lost my job. Thankfully the landlord was brilliant at the time and had no problem accepting rent allowance. I got a few weeks work here and there and eventually decided to go back to college. Over time people moved in and out of the house – had so many inconsiderate house sharers, not cleaning up after themselves, being loud, drunk and most importantly not paying their share of bills on time. All of these people worked. I’ve NEVER been late paying a bill or rent. It’s in my upbringing be on time with bills, be responsible for yourself, respect others etc etc.

      Eventually I decided this just wasn’t working and I needed my own space. When looking for a place I was amazed at the amount of landlords who wouldn’t accept rent allowance. The ones that would were mostly depressing kips. It seemed they chose others above me just because I was on rent allowance. I had a reference from the landlord, was armed with bank statements to prove there was enough in the bank to pay a number of months rent but kept hearing back that it was given to the person working. It really looked like the only place was going to be a depressing bedsit. Eventually after months of searching I found a flat which is actually quite nice!

      There’s no excuse for anyone on rent allowance who isn’t paying rent to landlords. The Back To Education Allowance (equivalent to dole) goes into my bank account (used for rent and bills) and I live off the rent allowance which I get in the post office. People who wreck properties must be scumbags in the first place and surely a landlord can detect this when they screen them. It is very frustrating to be tarred with the same brush as these people.

      I’m sorry that landlords have been stung in the past but please do not tar everyone with the one brush. I’ve been a great tenant (even if I say so myself!!), look after where I live, keep the place spotless & well maintained, keep the garden tidy of my own accord because I like to and at this point resent these attitudes as they’re unjust!!

      Reply
  • Donna 05/12/11 #

    My jaw is on the floor. I am shocked at the closed minded attitudes shown in the comments here. I was going to say that sometimes it’s the letting agent who put it on the adverts as standard, I know of one infamously snobby letting agent who adds it on to the ad whether the landlord cares or not because she doesn’t want to deal with what she considers as spongers. I thought she was a lone moron in a civilised, informed society but apparently I’m wrong.

    I am on rent allowance and it is paid in advance and directly to my landlord’s bank account. It never comes near, what you must perceive as my greedy little hands so you’d needn’t be so concerned about me accidentally drinking or spending it. Oh and in case I am ‘one of the few’ who isn’t scum, I’m not, there isn’t just a few, most of us are like you, just regular people, trying their best to get along in life.

    With the budget on in the background and the threat of more people falling into poverty, people who 3 or 4 years back were secure in their jobs, homes and futures, you still consider people in receipt of rent allowance as ‘undesirables’ just because they need rent relief. We are a nation in economic crisis. You can’t assume everyone entitled to aid is going to be scum. Landlords need to be obliged to register so that their income can be correctly assessed and they like everyone else can contribute to rebooting our economy.

    Maybe if the tenants you got were crap it reflects upon you as a landlord, maybe you got the caliber of people you expected and you deserved it. There are innumerable families in receipt of aid but they rent successfully off landlords who aren’t bigots and are normal contributing members of the community.

    You don’t have to accept someone who can’t prove a history of good tenancy, that’s your prerogative as what I assume is someone who thought they’d make a few quid on the side as a landlord during the boom and is now a bit tetchy because the housing market collapsed and now you can’t retire at 40 like you’d hoped but don’t assume that you are in some sort of different class, class has rarely been more level.

    I can only suggest that you people snap out of it and be thankful that you and your families are lucky to be in a position where you are not the ones in need of understanding and help. Honest to God, you make me so sad sometimes.

    Reply
    • Fair play to you donna, its this mé féin attitude that got this economy into trouble in the first place and there are still idiots out there that think the Celtic tiger is coming back. If landlords applied the Tenancy Act effectively, they would not have problems with tenants paying the rent.

      Reply
  • Richard, that’s probably an option I would have chosen myself if it had been available back then, simply for the convenience of it. I don’t like the idea of it becoming, say, a condition of tenancy because “otherwise we can’t trust the sort of people who get rent allowance to give it to the landlord”, though.

    Also I love that this article shows up on the main page just above an article about child poverty with the pull-out quote “The first thing that I pay is the rent”. Because, yes, some poor people actually care about paying their rent and having a roof over their heads, rather than spending it on fripperies or magic beans or whatever else rent allowance tenants “all do” before setting fire to their rented accommodation and driving off in their luxury cars.

    Reply
    • In response to magic kelly, I am not entitled to Rent allowance as I can no find decent livable accommodation for 255e per month in Galway city; that is the standard rate for a single person and its paid into the post office where you collect it each week. The taught that a landlord would get his rent paid into his account is crazy as some landlords don’t adhere to their duties and the last line of defense for the tenant is to withhold rent to force that landlords to adhere to their duties In addition rents would be not fall if rent allowance was paid into their accounts.
      Finally, all landlords have various methods of writing off any rents not paid and maintenance of the house (s) when completing their tax returns, if they are even paying tax.

      Reply
  • I’ve never understood the blanket ban on Rent Allowance either. I have a relative who was involved in letting property and people on rent allowance were considered just the same as someone renting from their own pocket. As you said in the piece, there were references, meetings, a detailed contract. If someone on rent allowance met all the criteria, they got the apartment. Similarly if someone who wasn’t on rent allowance met the criteria and had the deposit and the references, then they got the flat. My relative regularly passed over prospective tenants with no referenances, for a tenant on rent allowance, with excellent references.

    Surely rent allowance means the money is guaranteed, no? I’m not sure how it works so maybe I’m wrong there but I’d think knowing that a certain amount is guaranteed form the social each month is a pretty good thing!

    I rented privately for a while as a student/start of my career. If I had lost my job and needed rent allowance, then that was only a change in my financial circumstances. It didn’t change my character!

    Reply
  • Great piece Lisa. A lot of landlords are still in the ‘cute hooer’ category and are simply not registered, do not want to pay tax and baulk at the idea that you could be ‘supplemented’ at their property. It’s a bit like rabid racists assuming ‘foreigners’ are somehow allocated funds that should be for them. Current landlord is no exception. I simply cough up out of my reduced job seekers’ payment for the time being.

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    • A lot of landlords want their rent paid, on time. Unfortunately some on Rent Allowance drink or spend the allowance before it gets anywhere near the landlords pocket. Trying to get them out then for not paying rent can take years. Totally support landlords not accepting rent allowance.

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    • Jesus wept pat, they simply don’t want to pay tax, or are registered, they are basically black marketeers simple as

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    • @Martina I am landlord Martina. I pay my taxes, as do all of the landlords I know. Its too much hassle not to pay taxes on property, not worth risking fines and perhaps even the property itself…those days are well gone Martina. I refuse to accept Social Welfare Rent Allowance because its paid to the recipient of the allowance and not paid directly to the landlord. I used to accept rent allowance but in every case I never received rent on time, most of the time I received nothing for months, not only that but I ended up having to pay thousands to get them out. I would prefer to leave the property idle rather than accept Rent Allowance, indeed I have done so

      Why “Jesus Wept” ?

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    • Because any so called land lord that does not accept are in all honesty not paying tax I know a few landlords they let out their apartments for cash and they have openly said that they can’t afford to pay the tax because they are just about paying mortgage on said apartments, it’s black market once it’s cash in hand

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    • Also in reference the cheque can be made out and addressed to landlord so that excuse is out the window it’s more like lazy land lording

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    • Eighteen years as a landlord, numerous requests for the rent allowance to be paid directly to me….never accepted. I even remember tenants asking for same at my request, never accepted. Tenants get the Rent Allowance, the onus is on them to pay the landlord…in my experience, they never do.

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    • I think a lot of landlords need to wise up, you can insist on the cheque to be in your name and addressed to you, I know a few who are pretty good but a few I know are tax dodgers

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    • GGGRRRRR!! To the “landlord” contributing here..

      Me and my partner moved in where we are 4 years ago. It was the ONLY place that would accept rent allowance in our area at the time. My partner is on disability, as was I before I became self employed.

      There was a delay in the first payment (waiting for the social to get their fingers out), since then our rent has NEVER been late, EVER. The rent gets paid first, then the electricity, then food.

      Perhaps you have had bad experiences, but I can tell you now – my partners had bad experiences with the majority of landlords who accept rent allowance – they’re usually greedy feckers who don’t care that there’s black mould growing in the bedroom or that the washing machine leaks – they just want their cash..

      It cuts both ways. As this column pointed out – refusal to accept rent supplement is DISCRIMINATION. As those on disability allowance must apply for it too.

      Thankfully – our current landlord is a decent man, who realises that just because someone is claiming rent supplement doesn’t mean that they are going to screw him. Perhaps you should learn to judge people on their own merits rather than the situations they find themselves in.

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    • I am sharing my experience’s and personal opinion. I would consider myself a very good landlord, anything that needs repairing is done within 24 hrs and replaced as new. I can be contacted 24 hrs a day should need be and I have reduced the rent unlike other landlords in the same area. However, in my experience being ‘decent’ is considered a weakness by many and an excuse to get one over. You can be angry at me all you want, it doesn’t change the fact that the majority are giving the minority such as you and your partner a bad name. Perhaps when your landlord has been screwed as much as I have by those in receipt of Rent Allowance he will change his outlook also. I do not accept rent allowance, it cost me thousands in rent and damage done to the property by over 6 sets of tenants all in receipt of rent allowance.

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    • Well then Magic, perhaps you should have checked their references before renting to them.
      And while you are at it, learn about the fallacy of your discrimination.. Y’know, tarring all with the same brush? Hasty Generalisation etc..

      Like I said, by refusing rent allowance you are discriminating against anyone who claims rent allowance due to disability (or redundancy). Why not arrange the viewing and get a sense for the prospective tenants rather than ruling them out at the stage of advertising??

      But I guess it is much easier to just tar everyone with the same brush.. And if that’s the case, you shouldn’t mind being considered an elitist bigot because that’s what the majority of “rent allowance not accepted” landlords are, even if you may be in the minority :)

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    • Ps.. In my local area there are two or three landlords with a substantial property portfolio – my landlord being one.
      He owns many properties, has been a landlord for decades, and still accepts rent allowance.

      By comparison, the other big rent allowance landlord is a money grabbing a*hole, it’s his places that have mushrooms and black mould.. He rented a portakabin with a calor gas heater on a building site to someone during the boom for €800 a month..

      Something tells me my landlord may just have a tad more experience than you, it hasn’t put him off.

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    • I own more than one property, I assure you I have a lot of experience.

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    • Have to agree with Mr Magic, he seems like a good landlord to have. Not many have landlord who fix everything in 24 hrs and reduce rent. I have share in past with rent allowance people, more than one time. They destroy house every time and because I live with them I have problems also. They never paid my landlords the rent but could drink and smoke every nigh, always drunk. I work hard always and never get money from Irish for anything free but maybe Irish get everything free so dont care because its not their money so they dont feel they should care. I pay rent now to also a good landlord who owns property everywhere and he also doesnt accept this free rent. I share with three others who pay rent also and dont get free money, the house is always lovely because we respect his house and we pay rent always.

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    • Ok, so they’re not showing up here on my app, but I got the email responses and I am so glad that you chose to make assumptions on my personality and call me a “dickhead”.
      I also said you may be in a minority yourself – implying that you may be a decent landlord in a sea of those less decent, but apparently you missed that.

      Glad not to have you as a landlord.. Our landlord sorts everything out for us, goes above and beyond in many ways.. He’s a really decent guy. And he likes us, because we cause him no aggro at all.

      Your judgement of me – I assume caused by your misinterpretation of what I said, shows me that you had made your judgement already. Many landlords would be glad to have me, they just won’t accept my partner because he’s on disability..

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    • Given that it is government policy to move the 96 000 households currently in receipt of Rent Supplement to Local Authority (RAS) standard housing (including NAMA properties), on a phased basis over the next two years; and that these RS households make up 46% of private rental stock; it is reasonable to assume that, come 2013, private landlords will be much more welcoming towards low-income tenants.
      It is possible that a greater consideration for tenants may encourage landlords to upgrade the BER on their properties, thereby reducing onerous energy bills on said tenants and helping ensure that rents can be paid on time.
      @ Shanti Om: respects for you holding your corner in a complex debate……

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    • Thank you Micí
      I can appreciate that people have had bad experiences.. My main issue is with it being included on the ad, this, in effect, pure discrimination as those who are forced to claim rent allowance get lumped in with all those bad experiences through no fault of their own. And are prevented from even viewing the property or meeting the landlord to see if they are a good fit..

      I’ve tried calling anyway, and asking is the no rent allowance applicable when one of the tenants has a chronic illness for which they receive disability and was still told no.
      It’s really disheartening looking for somewhere to live when your options are so limited..

      Like I said, I got lucky.. My landlord is fantastic. A proper gent, always as helpful as ever if a problem arises.

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    • Mici…In my experience in the last few years the low income tenants are those not on rent allowance. I rented my place at a cheaper rate so I wouldn’t have rent allowance tenants coming to view. I don’t care to lease my property to anyone who has it paid for them, because they very rarely show the same respect as those who have earned it.

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    • @ Derek, if you have a two/three bedroom house (with garden) in Dublin centre, with BER efficiency D or better (and willingness to improve further); and rent at circa E500 per calendar month (fair value vis-a-vis minimum wage), I would be delighted to rent from you, without involving Rent Supplement.
      If you are unable to match these requirements, no worries NAMA can, once they get their procedures in place. However, it must be noted that by charging more than fair value from people earning minimum wage, forces same people to resort to working cash-in-hand and other black market activities; I do hope that your property is not amongst those properties paid for by illegal activity.

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    • Magik Kelly
      I cant understand,u said ”I refuse to accept Social Welfare Rent Allowance because its paid to the recipient of the allowance and not paid directly to the landlord. ”’
      If u are taking professional tenants-are they wages getting paid in to your account,not in to their hands? Both tipes of tenants(i mean those with RA and without) getting money in to their hands- what the difference then?

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    • Anna Kenny Yesterday, 8:59 PM #

      Not true. Where is this issue now in 2013…? I rented one app from a previous mayor in a city with black mould from floor to ceiling – promised to sort it out , would not , when challenged – evicted, deposit kept. Rented again from another prominent respectable citizen of same city , arrived on day to move in with van of belongings – no one to meet me , left on street for a day. had to cart all to friends and back next day. got keys. no kitchen installed , no electrics and no plumbing – it was still being built. The 2nd bedroom was being used as carpenters mess to build the presses for kitchen – he apologised and gave me owners no and when I called , estate agent came and shouldered me into the wall , threatened me and evicted myself and my work colleague after we refused to pay two weeks rent for two weeks without one bedroom, kitchen or electrics. Told I would be blacklisted on the rental market with all auctioneers. He is v successful estate agent – again ‘respectable’. Thrown out on the street – deposit kept. Rented again same city – painted the whole place. Did up the back yard into a lovely garden – cut back overgrowth , planted flowers herbs at own expense. Built a small wooden deck onto back bedroom. Paid for wood. Deposit kept when moving out for painting it a different color – only cream and pale lilac in a dark understairs galley kitchen – and for cost of removing the little deck . Had rent raised three times in next place until I refused to pay as no improvement s made and neighbour was dysfunctional disruptive , never told when moving in with child- next place : storage heating broken over coldest winter two back, cooker broken from moving in. holes in wall where phones pulled out . plaster and wall falling out on fireplace , carpets so worn i tripped on them , windows needed replacing , sink cracked badly , wash machine leaked . etc . criticised for calling electrician to fix storage heater after buying plug in electric heaters to keep the place from mould and damp due to window issue. no thank you . deposit would have been kept had i not refused to pay rent for last 6 weeks while at a stand off to get repairs done , rent supplement stopped as it declared uninhabitable. I had bought new doors and had them installed , rugs , door stops , painted the whole place , plastered the dodgy walls , and put up with everything blowing up and a myriad of excuses on ly to have it declared uninhabitable . I had hoped to get it approved for RAS. Not to be. Now homeless for 6 months and not a place willing to accept a student parent on RA or for RAS. Paperwork and lack of confidence I can pay bills and rent . The solution locally is – put your child in foster care if you want to go to Uni , and go rent as a single person in a house share somewhere. Or get teen child to work and pay . I was in receipt of disability allowance , and returning to Uni after break to have treatment. I think there are some agencies who are very amenable but there are a lot of nasty people who just dont think it through – little changes , repairs to keep up with regs . There are very few RAS – it is dead project. The number of differing views I received from surveyors on the survey done on the flat leave me quaking at the thought of going through with it again. But I cant get a mortgage and it is actually cheaper to buy than to rent :(

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  • Classism? What “ism” will they come up with next? Is the author trying to make out that everyone in receipt of RA comes from a certain, dare I say it, class?

    I speak to landlords every day, and I’d be lying if there aren’t a fair chunk of them who are either regretting accepting RA tenants, or have done so in the past with an open mind, but would never do so again. People need to ask themselves why that is the case. It would be a foolish landlord indeed, and there are some out there of course, who would try to rent a premises for cash in hand, these days. The Revenue are watching, and all it takes is one asshole tenant, or one overzealous neighbour, and he or she is hung out to dry.

    By the same token, I see some landlords with long term RA people living in their properties, and they’re happy out.

    The biggest issues here are the landlords who don’t do their homework on their tenants first, and the bonkers situation where the RA itself isn’t paid directly into a nominated rental account, by consent of both parties.

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  • From my experience of rent allowance the majority of people you get, or used to get anyway, were not people you would want living in a house you own.

    I would be extremely wary of renting a house to someone on rent allowance. In many cases it would work out better financially to let the house lay idle than be landed with a huge repair job when these people have made such a mess of the house that even they can no longer stand being there and decide to move on.

    It’s often the case also where the person receives the rent allowance from the government and does not pass it on to the landlord.

    I’m sure there are many decent people receiving rent allowance but from my own experience it is definitely something I would stay well away from.

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  • There are obviously some people claiming Rent Allowance who are giving the rest a bad name. In the current climate more and more people are looking for help as they are losing their jobs or being forced to take reduced working hours and wages. I can understand that some landlords have had bad experiences so are wary of renting to RA tenants, but surely the criteria for renting your property comes down to doing full reference checks, as this way you will weed out the good tenants from the bad, irrespective if they are claiming RA or are in employment.

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  • for those saying that it goes to directly to tenant then you need to get your facts right, it goes directly to the landlords bank if you choose it to. also its unfair to be put in the same class as scumbags who have no respect for other peoples property. i suffer from bipolar among other things and my wife looks after me and my 1 year old daughter. and we are living in a place where the youth have no respect and always fights at night, my nerves are gone. now we are looking for a new place and every where i look says “RENT ALLOWANCE NOT ACCEPTED” this is actually discrimination in the eyes of the law, we only claim rent allowance and disability allowance. we can claim 100s more but it wouldn’t feel right, in the house we are in at the moment, we have put a new bathroom in, flooring on hall stairs and landing, also repainted and fixed the places that needed to be fixed. all this cost us money (not alot but it was our money as the landlord offered money but we refused to take. we are a quiet family with a lazy Labrador, we don’t drink or do drugs or even go pub, our idea of a party is family over for a nice homecooked meal, i wish i could work but at the moment crowds of people set me of. our neighbors love us also. we don’t deserve to be told no when we need help. all we want is a nice house in a quiet area but because the snobby landlords don’t know a good thing it means we are stuck here because we cant move to a place that’s like where we are now. the life i have had im entitled to be in a nice quiet area without feeling awkward. learn your facts people and i hope the snobby landlords who refuse rent allowance change their ways as we are not all like the thugs you hear about.

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  • I have a lot if dealings with people who are in receipt of rent allowance and the whole system is a joke.the majority have no respect for the property and then they don’t pay the rent on time .it is very difficult to get rid of a tenant even if they don’t pay their rent for months.no matter what state they leave a premises in or how much rent they owe they can just move on to the next property courtesy of a deposit cheque from the community welfare officer,those of us who go out to work and actually pay for our houses are only fools.the rest are laughing at us

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    • Er.. You don’t get your deposit from the CWO.. You can’t claim the rent allowance from the CWO until after you move in – as you need the landlords signature on the forms, and if your deposit was being retained I would imagine they would question why (no experience of that first hand, have never had a deposit retained by a landlord).

      Deposits are not provided by the HSE or the Social. This is stated on the Citizens Info website and the Welfare.ie website. I don’t know where these people were getting the extra cash for a deposit that they felt happy to damage your property or skip away and leave theirs with you.. I know I wouldn’t be stupid enough to destroy the property of my landlord as they have been nice enough to let me live there, be reasonable with the rent and very helpful. It’s the very basic of respect to leave their property the way it was when I moved in.

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    • Why would you rent to these tenants in particular then, all it takes is a phone call to their previous landlord to show that they are not suitable tenants. The criteria for tenants should be good references, not whether or not they are claiming rent allowance.

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  • It seems, NOT the social protecting law decides if someone is poor enough to be entitled for social protection like RA, but the landlord is it.
    I am seriously in doubt whether that corresponds to the spirit of the law, in particular it does not seem to me to correspond to the European legislation.
    Ultimately, I will not accept any control functions of the state over the landlord.

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  • I totally agree with the author. The rent allowance system is also ridiculously restrictive. As well as finding landlord that will accept rent allowance, you need find a property where the rent is below €300 if sharing or below if €450 for a single person apartment. That makes it pretty hard to find an apartment in Dublin that is cheap enough, AND they accept rent allowance.

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  • It’s not only about being a model tenant but also about the financial risk of the landlord. Someone who is unemployed is definitely riskier than someone in employment.

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    • Really? In the current economic climate? I wouldn’t be so sure..

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    • Donna 06/12/11 #

      I’m confused about why you assume you have to be unemployed to be in receipt of rent supplement. Maybe this is just another example of why blanket statements are wrong. Most entitlements are to help people get back on their feet, not support them forever. The idea is that you go and find work and eventually don’t need the payment at all and shockingly that is what most people try to do because believe it or not, it is not preferable to have to answer to grouchy, overworked CWO’s who can also assume you’re some sort of scum, to have spot checks where someone can turn up on your doorstep and demand to check out your home as well as regular rent supplement reviews where you fill out the same bits of paper over and over every few months, constantly reminding yourself of just how little you have. I’d much rather just have a job that supports me right away but unfortunately the world doesn’t work like that.

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    • That’s a very good point..
      If your wages fall below a certain level (eg, if your hours were dropped drastically) you may qualify for rent allowance.. So you would be working but still claiming rent allowance (as it falls under the heading “supplementary welfare allowance”)
      And you would get lumped in with the assumption of the majority here of being an alcoholic, disrespectful, destructive undesirable.. Even though you were working..

      But they’re happy to discriminate against the disabled so I guess anything is fair game.

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  • So what you’re essentially saying is that it is lazy and classist to do risk assessment and check creditworthiness of the counter-party with whom you’re about to enter in a financial transaction? So tell me something, MBNA are ok to check if you’re in employment before granting you a credit card with a limit determined by how much you’re earning but it is not ok for the landlord to check creditworthiness of the prospective tenant. That is liberal nonsense, emotional position rid of logic and substance.

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    • I don’t think that was the point. Any landlord should check the references and how their last landlord felt about them as tenants, it’s common sense. Otherwise you could wind up with anyone!
      The point is that when you search for properties to let on websites such as daft.ie etc the majority of properties (especially at the nicer or cheaper end of the scale) have “rent allowance not accepted”, before any reference checks or credit worthiness is even established.

      If you find yourself redundant, disabled or left alone with a child you never even get a look in. You may be a model tenant, pay your rent on time, clean and honest, but if you’re on rent allowance it doesn’t matter. You won’t be accepted, so don’t bother.

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  • If someone is lucky enough to have a proprety to rent, he/she should not make any difference between good tenants—-employed or not.

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