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Dublin: 11 °C Saturday 18 May, 2013

Column: Suicide isn’t wanting to die. It’s not being able to bear living.

We have too many misconceptions about suicide. It’s not shameful – it’s the result of a fatal illness, writes Fine Gael TD Dan Neville.

Dan Neville

ONE IN FOUR of us will suffer a mental health problem at some stage of our lives. The demands, pressures and expectations of modern life can increase levels of anxiety and depression, and this is felt even more intensely at times of recession. Suicide has affected too many families and communities across the country, and yet a level of denial persists about this real and serious public health issue. The stigma and lack of understanding around mental health problems must be overcome.

There are many misconceptions surrounding incidents of suicide. One of the harshest realities for the bereaved family left behind is the admission that a loved one found life too painful and came to the conclusion that suicide was the only way out. But there should be no denying about the fact of the death. We need to call it what it is; a suicide.

It can be of great help to others if the bereaved speak candidly about the death of a loved one by suicide. I can fully understand the wish to protect a dearly departed family member. But we must educate society about issues surrounding mental, psychological and emotional ill-health. The longer misconceptions about suicide are allowed to persist, the longer we will all struggle to really address the problem.

People often say when someone dies of cancer or heart disease that they really wanted to live, but their disease got the better of them. And yet they wrongly say that someone who dies by suicide wanted to die. Nothing could be further from the truth. People who complete suicide want to live as much as anyone else, but living becomes too painful. Those who take their lives do not want to die, but they just can’t bear to live in the incredible pain that their illness is causing them. It is very important for people to hear that message. Suicide is not a cop out on life. People who complete suicide have reached the end of their tolerance.

Nothing shameful

There is nothing shameful about someone who dies of suicide. They have fought the valiant battle and they have lost the battle to their illness. Society’s attitude to suicide means it is easier to explain death from cancer or a road accident. Suicide is a different type of death, but it does result from an illness and that illness is mental, psychological and emotional.

The bereaved often ask; if there had been an intervention, could the suicide have been prevented? This is a very difficult question to answer. The intricacy of human chemistry means finding the right balance of medication can be very difficult to achieve. There is usually a lot of trial and error involved in getting the right combination to bring the mind and the psyche into balance.

Often, the sufferer lacks the patience to get this balance right, because they feel that their cause is a lost cause. These hurting souls find it next to impossible to take the time and effort to share their pain. There is no way of knowing if one more intervention may have been the successful one. Much of the world of suicide is cloaked in mystery; something the bereaved are forced to wrestle with. The only thing that the bereaved can know is that at the time of the suicide the pain had become too much to bear and their loved one could no longer continue the journey of life.

Those bereaved need to have a realistic outlook on what life will be like after suicide. The death of a loved one from suicide is a pivotal event; nothing is ever the same again. But this doesn’t mean there will be no happiness. Bereaved family members can be happy again, but happiness will not come about automatically. They must work hard on resolving their grief. But through a lot of time, pain and tears, they can return to happiness.

We must change our attitude to suicide. Mental illness is like any other illness. Professional help must be sought at an early stage and the State must provide the services required to help those with this illness to recover.

Dan Neville is the Fine Gael TD for Limerick and the president of the Irish Association for Suicidology. Byline photo James Horan/Photocall Ireland.

For information or support on mental health and suicide, contact the following organisations:

  • Samaritans 1850 60 90 900 or email jo@samaritans.org
  • Teen-Line Ireland 1800 833 634
  • Console 1800 201 890
  • Aware 1890 303 302
  • Pieta House 01 601 0000 or email mary@pieta.ie

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Comments (122 Comments)

  • Alot can be blamed on people not seeing a way out or things geting better. Iv delt with depression for meney years even had suicidal thoughts. All that realy keeps me going is my friends and family and what it would do to them.

    For years iv been told it’ll get better but I still can’t see things geting better,I’m just livening my life wateing to die

    Reply
    • @Damien James Murray,

      Hey, we all get depressed, some of us more than others. It’s trying to stay on top of it that is the challenge every day, isn’t it? I find when I feel shit, I’ll think of my sister with MS. I visit her, give her lunch, just sit with her …… I realize very quickly that my life isn’t all that bad. Sometimes I think of travelling, doing some work with the underprivileged. Hopefully I will some day.

      There’s a huge world out there Damien, make a plan, try it.

      Reply
    • Damien, I’ve written three replies to your brave post, and then cancelled them, due to the sensitivity of this subject. I’ll stick to just congratulating you on being brave, and let you know that now you, and me and countless others know, due to you, that they are not alone. The many thumbs up to your post proves this. All the best to you ,and I hope that you can see how valued you and your thoughts are.

      Reply
    • Stay brave Damien if not for yourself then for your family and friends. Brave post.

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    • Thank you,Im long past being ashamed/embarrised about it.It is a condition iv learned to live with.
      I lost 2 friends and a girlfriend to suicide so know to well the after affects it has.
      I lost my father to a drunk driver when i was young and im an only child so couldant leave my mother on her owen.
      I have traveld a bit,but as im single i dont have someone to share it with.

      Every one has suffered from depression and for some the slightist thing makes it worse,but coments like yours or even a smile from a stranger can help.

      Depression isant something that should be hiden but society has made it so !

      Reply
  • Excellent article and every single word rings true. I recall a recent article in the rag that is the Sunday Independent about the late Gary Speed and the journalist in question stated Gary Speed had no thought for his wife and kids. . . Whilst main stream media continues to write drivel like this their is no hope of wider society understanding this issue.

    Reply
    • The media are often clueless in this regard and do more damage than good. For anyone in the depths of depression is often appears to be the only release from the suffering. Those with depression are often very skilled in hiding their condition. Thats why is so often said ho much a shock it is for friends and family when a loved one is gone.

      This condition is misunderstood. Many of us will face a mental condition ourselves or with a family member. Education is the key to help people recognise the signs and to approach them in a considered and caring manner.

      Reply
    • Fr Ed O’Toole I agree with you 100% especially when you call the Sunday Independent a ‘rag’. You are too kind and polite. Most of us would use adjectives (of the 4 letter variety) to describe the said publication that are not suitable for polite company.

      Reply
  • Well done Dan. A well written and thoughtful article. Your understanding does you justice.

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    • i agree… its time people stopped having this shameful attitude towards the issue, it makes it very difficult for families to talk about/remember loved ones who may of taken their own life.

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  • Too often this is an issue which is hidden from public discussion. More people die from suicide each year than at any time on the roads. Yet we continue to see millions spent to address that. More needs to be done to bring awareness and help to those that need it.

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  • Brilliant article. Education & removing the stigma for families, & talking about it as we would heart-disease or cancer, is definitely the way forward.

    Reply
    • I dont think there is more help than ever, let’s see ,neighbours ?have their own problems,the dr.?a pill,can’t see that helping much,the Samaritans ?perhaps but can’t do anything practical. Try getting to an acute unit take a ticket and wait .or go to ur clinic on monday. I don’t see this as a brilliant article as obviously people want to live, and b let live without extreme stresses.this should b a human right yet this country denies us that right .

      Reply
    • Ehhh… What…?!

      Reply
  • jaysus if praying worked I wouldn’t be still mental. I dont pray myself but lots of people over the years have prayed for me. each to there own.
    living everyday with bad thoughts is a horrible horrible way to live.

    Reply
  • How many will read this and recognise it’s importance. Too few. Not an issue we are comfortable with.

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  • This makes a lot of sens and the picture describes so well the unbarable feeling I was stuck in for five days when I was on the wrong medecine when suffering from depression. During these few days I felt I was going crazy (not being able to control my mind). I was physicaly and mentaly suffering. It is beyond pain. It is unbarable. You want it to stop. Luckily enough, I had just enough sens to realize I was on the same medecine but using a different brand for the last five days. I got a friend to drive me to the camist and insisted in changing my medecine to the original brand I was taking. And when I got out of that state, the first thing I thought was: I understand why people comit suicide. How can anyone live like that for more than a week… So in that case, suicide is not a choice. And I know very well that depression is not a choice and to get out of it you need to scream for help!

    Reply
  • I was diagnose with depression a few years ago. I was lucky enough to have a brilliant GP and a supportive network of family and friends. I also reacted really well to the medication I was given. I am fine now but spent some time in hell before my medication started to work. I honestly don’t know what would have happened without the tablets. It’s so easy to judge people who kill themselves as a result of depression if you are lucky enough never to have suffered from depression. The best way to describe the illness is through the painting “the scream”. That’ s how it feels, no words can describe it better than that painting. I have learned to be non-judgemental about suicide: as the author said: it’s not that you want to die, you just need the pain to stop. To people like waterford: I am a catholic too, so I want to ask you this: I was always taught that God is Love, but yet the God you talk about seems to be a harsh and unforgiving one. Before you judge people who kill themselves maybe you should have a close look at yourself .

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  • Dan,

    You have written a remarkably sensitive and insightful article, except for one major detail that nobody ever really wants to face:
    The unbearable pain that makes living unbearable and corners people into suicide is not always “illness”, sometimes it is just about very real circumstances for which there are no solutions.

    Life can sometimes be desperately unfair to people that way, and when it is, it is probably the unkindest cut of all to dismiss that as “illness” that can be aided by therapy and medications when what are really needed are more tangible solutions.

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  • brilliant article hits the nail exactly on the head.

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  • my brother committed suicide, I dont feel shame for what he did, just sadness for the crap he left behind for my parents my other brother and myself, they dont realise the pain, anger, shock, etc etc they leave for everyone.. doesnt get any easier, in some ways worse as time goes on.. I knw first hand, ask my brother what Its like to pick your baby brothers brains off the Wall of his room..affects the rest of your life unfortunately.

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  • re: The assignation of a “stigma”
    It is of course a moral failure for any institution in a democratic society to argue a “stigma.” It is the responsibility of such organizations to do precisely the opposite: To establish that all people are equal, regardless of who states or intimates they are not. It is imperative to a free society that education lead. Societies depend upon it.

    It is the responsibility of administration hierarchies of all educational facilities, institutions to assure that no group is diminished, on campus or off, in curricula, or through the voices of teachers, professors or students.

    It is further the responsibility of every journalist to do the same, to make clear to the public it will not tolerate the diminishment of any group, no matter who states or suggests it.

    Harold A. Maio, retired mental health editor

    Reply
  • Very good article.

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  • @waterford , it doesn’t state anywhere in the Bible that suicide is a mortal sin coz there’s no such thing. ALL sin is the same and God is all k owing so he knows before us what decisions we will ultimately mAje. This in no way encourages suicide. I don’t think the old view of suicide meaning you go to hell in anyway comforts families when they lose someone to this

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  • “The intricacy of human chemistry means finding the right balance of medication can be very difficult to achieve.”

    (sigh) Yet another person touting the “brain chemistry” paradigm for which there is **only** circumstantial evidence.
    The next sentence will mean that most people will completely disregard everything I say, despite any objective truth it may contain. As someone who was diagnosed as “paranoid schizophrenic” and who has suffered at the hands of the so-called mental health services, I find it very difficult to recommend people to seek help.
    I except that I was out of control and needed to be detained without trail, however I do not accept that I had to be force-fed medication under threat of forced injection. I do not accept that in order to get time alone I **had** to act up and cause trouble to be put in solitary. I do not accept that I had to wait until I was well enough to go to college to receive counseling.
    How can we talk about the states of “elation” and “depression” without talking about the existential crisis that mental health problems reflect – that “to be or not to be” question, that has been asked down through human existence?
    Thankfully, my answer was to fight, and is to exist. The National Learning Network helped my with it’s Wellness approach and caught me at a very low ebb.
    I feel that life has rewarded me and I now live medication free (which I did carefully, by persisting with psychiatrists), and more importantly I am happy…. but as far as psychiatrists are concerned, no matter what I do, I can never ever recover.
    Terry Lynch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31PhV2JeUwI&feature=relmfu

    Reply
    • A very interesting post. All the best for the future.

      Reply
    • Glad to hear that you’re doing better, I’m a survivor of the “chemical imbalance / seratonin theory (disproven in 1983)” to depression myself.

      I had a lot of nasty things happen to me growing up and I needed counselling, instead I got SSRI drugs. The same type of drugs that caused Shane Clancy to go out and stab his ex’s new boyfriend and then himself in Bray, and countless other murder suicides worldwide (see http://www.ssristories.com). I nearly killed myself funnily enough, the drugs made me start hallucinating and thinking really odd thoughts – so when I hear people pushing these drugs for depression I hear alarm bells ringing.. They’ve done more harm than good to every person I know who has taken them (and unfortunately, that’s a large number).

      I know that this may be an unpalatable idea to many, when I went to the shrink and they prescribed anti depressants I thought that they would help, I figured the doctor wouldn’t give them to me otherwise. But after my first suicide attempt they told me to keep taking them! After the second attempt I said I refused to take them anymore. They gave me different drugs and I had a 4 month hypomanic episode – which they failed to recognise. I then crashed and suffered a 6 year dysphoric episode.

      I lost 7 years of my life to those drugs. All I needed was counselling (and it might have helped if they’d run some tests, as it turns out I had temporal lobe epilepsy). Instead I got told to take drugs that list an increased risk of violence or suicide in their side effects.
      This side of the “happy pills” needs to be made common knowledge. Dr Ivor Browne is right, drugs should only ever be used as an absolute last resort – and sparingly. They cause too much harm to be prescribed so freely.. If I had known what those drugs were going to do to me, I never would have taken them.

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    • @ Cr Mal, as a retired counselling psychotherapist, I can say that yours is one of the few posts in this thread which makes any sense, while I know that everybody has a right to their opinion, most are widely off the mark, un-informed , selfish, and ladened with religion ridden crap. let them spend as much time as I have in a clinic setting trying hard to help those suffering from depression and with suicidal thoughts and then see how they view the subject of the taking of ones own life.
      this is not a subject that the lay-man can discuss with anything but his own opinion, which has absolutely no relevance here.
      I know the score, I’ve been dealing with it for years.

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    • Dave 14/07/12 #

      Time for some balance hear. I’ve suffered for years, only to finally seek help 5 years ago. SSRI’s have been my saviour. My quality of life has never been so good. I’m happy. I can live. I want to live the best I can. Medication is not for everyone – but it is for some. Encourage people to find what works for them. Dont scare them into avoiding a choice that might work for them.

      Reply
    • @ Dave,
      I don’t doubt that some people are helped by them – if you notice I said that they should be the last resort and the medical guidelines and professor emeritus of UCD back that up.
      In too many cases they’re the first and often only port of call – and this can have devastating consequences – as the listed side effects prove.

      Reply
    • SSRI’s are peculiar things…different people react to them in different ways.

      Less surprising when you realise that the affect is intended to correct a chemical imbalance, similar in nature (though not affect) to diabetes, but with none of the careful testing to establish need and doseage associated with insulin treatment, which is odd really, considering they are using them on exactly the same type of body.

      It is not rocket science to figure out that the people who do suffer the relevant chemical imbalance will probably benefit significantly from SSRIs, take in a dosage tailored to their needs.

      However, in those who do not have a relevant chamical imbalance, they will artificially create one, with unpredictable results (to say the least).

      A seratonin imbalance is *not* a mental illness, it is a metabolic insufficiency, that probably has as many physical indicators as, apparently, *mental* ones if we knew where to look, and it needs to be treated as a metabolic insufficiency…

      You don’t just prescribe a patient 3 months of a standard dose of insulin to “see how that works out for you”, so why do it with SSRIs?

      In case you are interested I have an atypical reaction to SSRIs myself in that they tend to amplify whatever mood or state of mind I am in, good or bad…which, of course serves no useful purpose at all.

      Reply
    • Thanks for the responses.
      Mental health is a very emotive issue and people get agitated by discussing it. At least that has been my experience, so much so that I seldom bother sharing my experience any more. I have found that the pro-drug people don’t want to hear the facts. Facts such as there being no scientific evidence for the medical model; drug trails are often ghost-written; drug trials often have pre-trails to screen out placebo effects; there is no known mechanism for how SSRIs are **meant** to work (the level of serotonin initially goes up and then goes back to were it was in about a week!)

      But then why would anyone listen to me?
      I have a dis-empowering label and obviously “lack insight into my illness” and would, if hospitalized, be “non-complaint” and cause a severe “management problem” because I’m not subjecting myself to that type of “mental health” treatment again.

      The Mental Health system is such an irony. You need to be mentally strong to recover from it! It’s so bad that people who recover refer to it as “surviving”. It steals the voice from people who’s problem was they had no voice in the first place. It perpetuates a no-recovery model. Thankfully this is changing – albeit slowly.

      However, there is help out there, even within the system. There are nurses and psych ward staff that are true unsung heroes of it. Listen to the ones that tell you there is nothing wrong with you. You definitely have a problem, but that is different to being chemically deficient.
      You can solve a problem. It takes persistence, work and a certain amount of faith that you can get better. It takes a commitment to change. Look for wellness based approaches, and if necessary use medication to dull you mind and your powerful emotions until you can solve the problem.

      BTW: I wouldn’t even advise anyone come off their meds on their own. It needs to be a process because it can be damaging to stop abruptly.

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    • +100,000,000,000,000 Creatively Maladjusted..

      I couldn’t put it better myself (honestly, I couldn’t, you said it perfectly)

      Reply
  • I totally agree that suicide is an answer to enormous, unbearable pain. No one would wish to end their life unless they felt there was no way out of their pain. I have some experience of losing friends to suicide. Society in general is responsible for the stigma &misunderstanding around mental illness. Its those of us who have direct experience with suicide can help educate others about its causes & v complex issues. I take heart from reading many of these posts. Thank you. : ) R.

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  • Great article,well done for posting this.

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  • A remarkably dogmatic piece- full of ‘this is what society must do’ and ‘this is how the bereaved must behave’ and ‘this is why someone dies by suicide’.
    Our commitment to living is precarious for us alI I would suggest and the reasons leading up to someone taking this irreversible step are as varied and as many as there are people. It may not be that helpful to sweep them all under the one cause. How can any of us know for sure?
    As for those left behind…. Again reactions can be very complex. The road of grief is a rocky one and all the rest of us can do is walk with them, with compassion, patience and hope. While I accept there can often be a particular intensity grieving the loss of someone who apparently deliberately took their own life, the journey of grief is essentially the same.
    And are all people who die by suicide sufferers of mental illness? I am not sure. The harshness and cruelty of life can make getting out of it a sane choice.
    In all the intent of this piece seems honourable… challenging the enduring stigma attached to suicide but in my view, its way too black and white for an phenomenon that is as mysterious and challenging as life itself.

    Reply
    • I think you are seeing much the same thing as I am here Shane, although putting it far more eloquently.

      If there is one thing life has taught me it is that people are very efficient at self protection on all levels, conscious or unconscious, and usually become addicts or take their own lives simply because, for whatever reason, all the alternatives were worse, and not just on the spur of some kind of moment, but in an established pattern.

      The only way to prevent suicide is to find a way to offer a new, better alternative. I do not mean *our* idea of what should be a better alternative. That is meaningless and often useless. I mean one that really is better for the person in question, whether it be stronger painkillers, or better controlled psych medications, or a home to live in, or companionship and support, or even privacy.

      …and if, as sometimes happens, we cannot offer a better alternative in time, then we should sadly let the that person “go gently into that good night” relieved that they found the courage (because suicide is terrifying to face) and their pain is over, and respecting them enough to recognise that, however much it hurts us, it is unlikely they made a decision so final carelessly, or without knowing exactly what they were doing.

      Of course nobody wants to stare that long at the fact that life can be that harsh, but we should also spare compassion for those who no longer had an option on averting their eyes.

      Reply
  • Funny how the last government put St.Johns Wart as a prescription only medication when it was a relatively cheap herbal remedy for people suffering from depression look at the price now it is over triple what it used to be.

    Reply
    • this was done because they saw the opportunity to make money through making it a “prescription only” treatment,. FACT.

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    • Used to take them years ago. Then since they became unavailable over the counter I’ve taking/taken to many different medications to remember. seroxat and xanax at the moment. The weird thing I find about medication is, I have my good days and bad days while taking them but I have extremely bad days if I miss taking one. I think its more of a mental thing though that when I don’t take them I panic and just go downhill rapidly until I get back home and take one, even then it can take me a while to calm down and stop shaking. I’ve been on them so long now that anytime I have to go to outpatients to meet my doctor ,I get all worked up that he will change my tablets.

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    • P Wurple 14/07/12 #

      Not FACT Richard… OPINION.

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  • Excellent article.considering roughly the same number of people die in this country by suicide ,as are killed on our roads,the resources put into preventing both from happening are shamefully imbalanced,as a society we need ti address this,and quickly

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  • It’s a permanent solution to a temporary problem…there is always help available!!!!!

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  • The Republic of Ireland has historically been a macho, sexually repressed and religious society (religious, in the god fearing sense). We still are, to a large extent. This, in my opinion, is the main cause of depression, mental illness and suicide for the vast majority of people. Perhaps, for a very small number of people, a chemical imbalance is also a cause, as Dan Neville points out.

    There is a taboo and stigma surrounding mental illness, depression and suicide in the Republic of Ireland and this silence and fear of speaking out serves to make these problems much worse. I am pretty sure that some of our 166 TDs are suffering from depression and mental illness and it would be great in combating the taboo and stigma of mental illness, depression and suicide if they would come clean about the depression and mental illness they suffer from.

    The Norwegian prime minister, Kjell Magne Bondevik came clean about the depression he suffered from in 1998 whilst he was still serving as Prime Minister.

    http://www.who.int/bulletin/volumes/89/12/11-041211/en/index.html

    He told his people he had to take a break because he had depression and left his office for nearly 4 weeks. His admission to his people was inspiring both to his people in Norway and beyond.

    I understand that 4 times more men than women commit suicide in the Republic of Ireland. That suggests to me that the main cause of suicide in people is that people (most often men) are bottling up their feelings and not sharing their pain with others. I also think this is the main cause of depression and mental illness in both men and women. A problem shared is a problem halved. Like has been done in Norway, we need to invest much more in mental health services in order to create a more compassionate, non-judgmental and non-coercive service, a service that efficiently matches up sufferers with helpers, those who want to speak out with those who want to listen. The present economic recession should not be an excuse not to move on this top-priority issue immediately in terms of both funding and organization.

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    • Are you comparing the republic of Ireland to the macho god fearing sexually repressed people of Northern Ireland? Perhaps you are comparing it to the religious society of Great Britain which has a religious leader as head of state, or the 26 Bishops automatically appointed to the house of lords and its religious flag. Maybe your comparison was meant to be before 1922 when the nation suffered great religious (& sexual) repression.

      Your opening comment is an indicator of a bias against yourself and your own people. Would you think that such a bias robs people of hope and is therefore a contributory factor in suicide ?

      If your first statement is incorrect and an indicator of prejudice, it damages the credibility of the rest of your argument no matter how reasonable it may be.

      Reply
  • In my earlier comment I referred to a piece of ‘journalism’ in the Sunday Independent. Here it is, in all its astonishing ignorance: http://www.independent.ie/opinion/analysis/eilis-ohanlon-refusal-to-condemn-suicide-is-no-help-to-anyone-at-all-3010251.html

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    • Wow.. That’s the most cold hearted almost sociopathic opinion piece I’ve read about this topic that was printed in the mainstream media.. That’s actually quite sickening..

      Don’t suppose she fancied factoring in the circumstances involved? Just felt like peddling a fallacious load of bile..
      I think the biggest problem we have is that we are losing touch with one another.. We have become more insular, more self serving – we are in a sense being closed off. The longer we spend in these little bubbles, never reaching out, never connecting with others the worse our mental health becomes – between that and the financial woes placed upon the demographic she points to (young males) these are far more likely the cause of suicide than the fact people are not so quick to condemn..

      People call it a selfish act – blissfully unaware of the fact that it is their own selfishness causing them to say that. You can guarantee that the pain they feel due to grief was nowhere near the level of pain or despair that the person who took their own life did.
      The people left behind are entitled to their grief, even the anger phase, but maybe what they’re really angry about is that now their loved one has left, each of them gets to share a tiny piece of the pain the deceased left behind – and they really would have preferred to let them carry on with all that pain than have to experience some themselves.

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  • I lament the loss of my friend Martin. :(
    I wish you had stuck in there man, we need more kind-hearted souls like you.
    May you rest in sublime peace.

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  • All human activity including suicide is a consequence of the complex relationship between the individual and the systems, of which they are part. Therefore the rates of suicide in a society may be an indicator of the health of that society.
    It strikes me that perhaps a contributing factor to an individual dying by suicide is the unspoken but very real pressures society puts on them and perhaps the most destructive pressure of all is the one to be ‘happy’. In previous generations and in other societies where the expectation is for life to be hard and where pple are prepared for setbacks.. Suicide is not so prevalent.
    It is a paradox the expectation we put on ourselves to be happy leads to real unhappiness, expressed most tragically in deaths by suicide. If we as a society had more realistic expectations it could relieve many of unrealisable goals and so help those who feel their unhappiness is unbearable that they aren’t alone and maybe it isn’t their fault they aren’t happy….it’s just life.

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  • When disappointment arrives at your door daily and you have difficulty in reacting to it or have a limited set of coping skills to deal with it then you need help and support. It is there if people ask yet for some it is difficult to ask. In the past the places they would have gone for help was the church, the government services, family and friends. Now it seems more difficult to ask these people for help for some people. I think we all know people who are vulnerable to breakdowns and crisis in their lives and help is needed more now than ever to bring hope and practical help to get these people back into the mainstream of life and out of their isolation.

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  • Great article Dan, you hit the nail on the head. It is tragic for the individual and the bereaved. Of course it’s an illness and everyone wants to live.

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  • Suicide is not just an illness of an individual it is a sickness in the society that failed to provide the handholds necessary to sustain the individuals sense of belonging in the society. Hence the incidence in young males.

    Reply
  • All human activity including suicide is a consequence of the complex relationship between the individual and the systems, of which they are part. Therefore the rates of suicide in a society may be an indicator of the health of that society.
    It strikes me that perhaps a contributing factor to an individual dying by suicide is the unspoken but very real pressures society puts on them and perhaps the most destructive pressure of all is the one to be ‘happy’. In previous generations and in other societies where the expectation is for life to be hard and where pple are prepared for setbacks.. Suicide is not so prevalent.
    It is a paradox the expectation we put on ourselves to be happy leads to real unhappiness, expressed most tragically in deaths by suicide. If we as a society had more realistic expectations it could relieve many of unrealisable goals and so help those dwho feel their unhappiness is unbearable that they aren’t alone and maybe it isn’t their fault they aren’t happy….it’s just life.

    Reply
  • reds 14/07/12 #

    I just can’t take anyone who believes in a “god” or takes advice from a priest seriously!

    Facts are facts and these people do not go to hell and anyone who says that should be ashamed of themselves. Suicide is increasing in this country and there needs to be a lot more help out there to stop this continuing. To achieve this we need to be more open about the subject and not sweep it under the carpet because the man in the sky says its wrong.

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  • and , by the way, the help given by ethical counselling psychotherapists is DRUG FREE.
    comments???

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  • @ ann reddin you might want to get of your high horse and read your bible ,your interpretation is incorrect it states
    Though shalt not kill …. And then states those who do it in “anger” are liable for judgement …. If you have any experience you’d no those who commit suicide don’t do it in anger it’s a
    Crippling emotional sadness and depression that they feel unable to bear. I suggest you pray and ask God for revelation on this matter or for the gift of dicernment (also In your bible)

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  • May God bless you, Dan, for your continued great work on this issue.

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  • This article has got it spot on. Well done for printing it and giving us a new insight into Suicide. The title sums up the reality of what suicide is ‘ not being able to bear living,. As someone whose life has been touched by suicide it makes my heart ache just reading it but it relieves some of my guilt.

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  • Suzy Coe 02/11/12 #

    Amen brother…. Well Said !!

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  • No one should ever have to feel this way. The feeling of living by a rope and watching as the fibers falling off while being anchored by this shell. It is sad and pitiful. I would know because I am living it…and I am disgusted with how people can be so disrespectful towards each other. Not everyone’s choices are the same reasons…this article is the best I have found by far. Anything can trigger the desire to commit suicide…to some…it takes time and planning…after exhausting all the choices that they can think of. Be it bursts of anger, comments of suicide jokingly or bitterly, writing, talking to someone…It takes patience…and a hell of a lot of understanding to get someone to get out of that mentality…the pain is beyond what anyone can comprehend. Yes, there could be there is an imbalance…regardless…I feel compelled to want to reach out and help those who is near giving up and so I have desired to comment…I doubt I’ll visit this page again…seeing that I already said what I could at this moment. Everyone suffers…some more than other…and we all have a level. The choice of a fox biting off his/her leg to be free from a trap…a mother dolphin bringing poison to her captured baby…In the end it is called choice. To the ones that understands…LIVE…because I understand…I truly do.

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  • http://www.optimox.com/pics/Aurasol/nanoSilver/SilverGoldPlat.htm

    I hope some who really need help will check this out.

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    • Has anyone considered that people suffering immediately from depression rarely do it as they dont have the energy or will ,it is generally people coming out of depression that do it ,or people that never presented with depression at all.a lot of people just make a decision that they cannot go on with the life they have,and it’s especially previlant now as people have been landed (by the governments) with huge debts they cannot see a way of repaying .so if mr Neville (fine Gael) could speak to his leader it might b more helpful. People are at their wits end with worry and asking people to simply go bankrupt is putting nails in their coffins ,as bankruptcy is as big a taboo as suicide ,if u want to save a lot of lives mr Neville the simple solution is to do what the Norwegians did .

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    • Eilish, you are very insightful. There is a state of mind I am familiar with where the only thing keeping some people alive seems to be the fact that they are too clinically depressed to be capable of decisive action.

      It is true, it is ridiculous to define suicide as related entirely to mental illness, in circumstances where some people are living without any source of income at all (social welfare payments are now often subject to weeks or months of delay, and many, formerly, self employed people are not entitled to anyrthing at all), waiting to lose the roof over their heads…which is not just bricks abd mortar, it is the place where you store and protect everything that is precious to you, a move into emergency transition accomodation can mean losing everything, for good, including custody of children.

      …and all with no hope at all of a brighter future for decades, in fact, in real terms it most certainly will get worse.

      The UK has opted for slowly and formally pushing their most vulnerable off a cliff, this is Ireland, where we let the mot invisible and isolated slip quietly off a cliff while we collectively avert our eyes and pretend it isn’t happening.

      The UK seems to have stopped collating formal data on suicide. I wonder, have we? Or do we just pass even more of them off as “misadventure”?

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  • I’m not too sure about the characterization of suicide as what people do when they “can’t bear to live”.

    Nor was Wittgenstein, who was rather well-acquainted with suicide as three of his brothers killed themselves. Ludwig W said that suicide required “a rushing of one’s own defences” — rather important, because it requires strength rather than weakness to do it.

    Terrorist suicide bombers, Kamikaze pilots, hunger strikers etc, commit suicide. Their self-inflicted deaths are acts of hostility and strength rather than despair and weakness. Time for a bit of a re-think, don’t you think?

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    • Jeremy I think you can see quite easily there is a difference between those who die by suicide because of emotional turmoil and those who die for a cause, such as those you mentioned. Yes, they both die by their own hands but it’s comparing apples and oranges in lots of ways to compare their motivations.

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  • great article

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  • I would like to give my opinion on this subject but I wont because it is such a delicate topic to talk about.

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  • Is it a legitimate option? In any circumstance, or just particular instances, such as those put forward by euthanasia supporters?

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  • Jack. 14/07/12 #

    Listen to “Magicians Assistant” by Scroobius Pip. It is an excellent r
    poem. There is a song. Just search Scroobius Pip vs dan le sac. I love this song, even though I find it difficult to listen to.

    It is, in short, Pip talking to a person who committed suicide and talks about friends, family etc. It’s really worth a listen.

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  • A Fine Gael TD for Limerick is the president of the Irish Association for Suicidology? The universe has an odd sense of humour.

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  • Drink colloidal gold and silver to alleviate depression. It has worked for thousands of years and it’s working now. There is plenty scientific research on it on the net. I felt like being reborn after taking my first sip. It is scientifically proven to increase IQ by at least 20%.

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  • The question people need to ask themselves is what happens after? Is suicide really the end or just the beginning of the end. For years people rarely turned to suicide as they knew it was a mortal sin and what happens on the other side is much worse than what happens here. It’s still a mortal sin. Ask God for forgiveness and pray for strength.

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    • @ Waterford. Give yer awl superstitions a rest, will ya!

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    • Careful, or I’ll repaint that concrete slab above the Waterford train station in Kilkenny colours.

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    • Conor-you are mistaken. This is why the country is in the state it is, but that’s a conversation for another day. I sense your anger and I forgive you. It’s ok my friend.

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    • Oh please! Anger? Actually I feel pity for you that you cling to your misguided and un christian catholicism. How about I forgive you your lack of empathy and understanding?

      Oh and seriously go and read canon law. Suicide as a mortal sin like the existence of limbo no longer exist within catholic dogma.

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    • Conor, it’s attitudes like yours that make the new generation feel that suicide is an acceptable option. This is not a forum for your personal vendetta against the church and this certainly isn’t the story for it. It’s sad to see your fear manifested like this.

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    • @Waterford

      A total misjudgment of what it is like to have depression and take the ultimate step to remove that suffering. It is an illness plain and simple. The reason for the illness is complex be it a chemical imbalance or arising from circumstances of life. You wouldnt turn to god to fix your cancer or flu. The message should always be there is help out there. There is always someone to talk to. Suffering alone only leads to very dark places.

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    • It is precisely the mindset of Waterford that ironically makes suicide such a shaming concept in Ireland. And that helps nothing.

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    • Michael, I disagree that people don’t pray to God to cure cancer or the flu. On the contrary, I believe that prayers are offered up every day all over the world for these causes. I do agree that talking about problems helps. And your local priest will only be too happy to speak to you. Psychology is part of their training and they are more qualified than most to discuss suicide.

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    • Waterford is the new troll on the block.

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    • Sluazcanal, if you feel that having a religious belief is trolling then I fear you lead a very sheltered life.

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    • Amazing! You just haven’t the faintest idea about real depression do you? If you did you would realise how absolutely ridiculous your comment is. It’s actually upsetting to see the bullshit you have come out with,belittling those who are struggling mentally. Just pray and it’ll all be ok???? If that was the case then no bad would ever happen!!

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    • Darren, You are right everyone is entitled to an op

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    • Darren, you are right everyone is entitled to an opinion. Don’t see how that makes me a clown for having an opinion too.

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    • Sara 13/07/12 #

      @Waterford as someone who has experienced and lives with the trauma of losing a loved one to suicide, I’d have to say you’re talking absolute shite. The last thing a severely depressed person (and god knows how many could be reading your hateful comments) needs is to be told to shut up and deal with their illness by praying to some fictional deity. Granted, some people may find that helpful but as someone who has also experienced depression I’ll tell

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    • Waterford, go away, you r a troll.

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    • Sara 13/07/12 #

      Cut myself off by accident – to surmise myself praying and being told to stay quiet when you’ve been brave enough to speak up about the agony you have been going through is heaping yet more pain on top of an already overloaded burden. Suicide is not a mortal sin – it is a tragic event and those people (and their families) who feel that they have no other option but to take their own life should not be viewed with such callous opinions. Losing a loved one is hard enough without being told that they’re in hell. I’d advise you to do your research a little more carefully and employ a little more of the empathy your Jesus spoke about before offering such cruel words.

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    • What is wrong with all you people who refuse to admit that faith in God (or the lack thereof) is a critical component in one’s state of mental health and therefore has a tremendous effect on one’s suicidal tendencies. Even physicians agree with this! Fair play to you Waterford for not allowing these non-believers to speak nonsense. God Bless!

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    • On the contrary Waterford I have no vendetta against the church. I ignore it mainly. I believe in the teachings of Jesus and the morals and empathetic existence he espoused. I do not listen to any of the twisted teachings that the church has created based on His. I have known many people with a strong faith that still suffered from depression and it is a truly awful thing for them to be burdened with.

      Your troll like ramblings are an affront to all good christians or indeed anyone who has empathy and understanding at the core of their beliefs.

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    • Can’t you just feel God’s love in these believers ramblings…

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    • Fagan's 13/07/12 #

      Traditionally Catholics had a lower suicide rate that Protestants. The Catholics hand confession, the saints ets, the very strict forbidding of Suicide, all were a way of channeling the pressure, maybe it drove the mad in other ways. The Protestant was as the book in question said,faced directly with the power of God, it often overwhelmed or felt too distant.

      I don’t think people need to ask for forgiveness, they do need to talk to though, whether that be a priest, a counsellor, a friend or getting things off your chest via prayer, then fine. We’re a terror as a people for bottling things up, a nation of steam cookers, its good to keep letting the pressure out folks.

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    • @Waterford,

      Suicide is never acceptable. Suicide, which I prefer to call, ‘taking your own life’ is the last resort that people take because they are so deep in their depression and so far down that damn dark tunnel, that they just can’t see a way out. It’s up to me, you and everyone else to help them and show them that life isn’t all that bad, just take another path and try it out.

      Your beliefs and religion like all religions are manmade. Don’t always believe in what you read. Don’t be so bloody judgmental of others. Do you honestly think they’d prefer to be six foot under? I don’t think so.

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    • Where does it say in the Bi or that it’s s mortal sin ?! Ask any priest it’s not in the Bible, I’ve asked and checked !

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    • @Waterford While some priests may have training in psychology they are not qualified psychologists. If you have some private beliefs which comfort you thats fine, but this is not the place and this is certainly not the topic in which to dispense religious dogmatic advice. Not everyone these days has religious beliefs and feels the need to ask a mythical being, or anyone else, for forgiveness.
      @Patrick Moon, exactly what physicians agree that a belief in god is a critical component in one’s state of mental health, I suspect any that do believe this sh**e are believers themselve? Are we to believe then that all atheists are somehow mentally deficient, some of the greatest minds the world has ever seen have been atheists, from Democritus to Zuckerberg. Belief in a supernatural being is not a requirement to good mental health, nor is lack of it an indication of poor mental health. Superstitious beliefs like this should be left where they belong, in the Dark Ages.

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    • Piss off ‘Waterford’ you haven’t a clue what you’re talking about!

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    • Waterford said “The question people need to ask themselves is what happens after? Is suicide really the end or just the beginning of the end. For years people rarely turned to suicide as they knew it was a mortal sin and what happens on the other side is much worse than what happens here. It’s still a mortal sin. Ask God for forgiveness and pray for strength.”

      Waterford people have being committing suicide for many years in Ireland difference is now we are acknowleding that fact. Personally if I was you having your beliefs after reading what you posted I’d suggest you should turn to your God and ask for forgiveness and ask him to give you some compassion.

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    • Lynda I think commandment number 5 has that one covered.

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    • How are u so convinced about this? R.

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    • DaveC 14/07/12 #

      That is one insensitive stupid comment Waterford.

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    • guilt even beyond the grave, thats the christian way is it? ‘Thank chrisht’ that so few fools like urself remain in existence

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    • Waterford, as somebody who had their opinion on suicide beaten into them by priests, nuns and christian brothers, only to later bury friends who took their own lives, may I just say that your comment represents perfectly the incompassionate cancer of catholicism that has caused absolute devastation on our country and makes a mockery of the message of christianity.

      Anything to say about the people who took their own lives as a result of a life of mental torment as a result of being raped and buggered by catholic priests?

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    • Waterford, all I can say is:
      Thank heavens you were not born in Japan, because if you had been, heaven knows what kind of blind belief system you would be trying to impose upon us:
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forty-seven_Ronin

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    • You would want to go have a chat to Richard Dawkins ya troll

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  • The more I think about suicide (by people who are not terminally ill), the more it looks to me like an out-and-out act of aggression tarted up to look like “victimhood”. As Robbie Coltrane’s “Cracker” character put it, suicide is a “bomb going off under the kitchen table”, and families who have to deal with it are damaged irrevocably. People who kill themselves are like abusers from beyond the grave. Their victims are children, parents, spouses, anyone who is made to “carry the can” by having everyone else ask “why did he do it?”

    We are all accustomed to wringing our hands and expressing regret and sorrow when people kill themselves. I think it’s about time we woke up and saw the political power of “victim-stancing”. A crummy and dishonest political trick.

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    • People don’t commit suicide just to hurt other people.

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    • Ok, I’ll see your “victim stancing” and raise you guilt.

      People don’t just suddenly decide “oh, I’m having a bad day, I think I’ll end it all”. They will have been struggling for some time. If they’ve been prescribed psych meds they are supposed to be on suicide watch.

      So damn right the family and friends should wonder was there anything else they could have done, they should have noticed that this person that they are so devastated to have lost, wasn’t ok.

      They might not have been able to help, that’s fair enough – and feeling helpless in someone else’s mental health is frustrating and upsetting, but too many people just walk away, tell them to “pull themselves together”, to “grow up and get over it”.. It’s not very helpful, it can trigger suicidal feelings.. You would not believe how many people are ignorant enough to actually suggest suicide to people when they’re depressed.

      Sometimes when people commit suicide they have convinced themselves that no one is going to care anyway, they may have convinced themselves that by killing themselves they are relieving the burden of their mental health issues from those who love them, some do it because they feel trapped.. There are myriad reasons for suicide, your statement makes a sweeping generalisation which attempts to maintain the “suicide is a selfish act” stigma.

      You want to paint an ignorant and frankly compassionless idea about suicide (based on a fictional character) then that’s fine – but I certainly hope that none of your friends ever needs you when they feel they’ve reached breaking point.

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