But can anything be done, people are stripped enough. The 1% aib have put on mortgage variable rates over last few months, is costing me roughly 2.5k a year!!! How much further are rates going to rise. Do they care about defaulters or bankrupts ???

they were only two words in that article that really needed to be written….”diseased country”

If everyone struggling defaulted, what would happen??

reading this has reinforced my decision to re-emmigrate. why dont we use more online banking here like ING for example.

Last one out turn off the lights.
The only people left in this mad country will be bankers, tax consultants, politicians, and sundry financial advisors, asset managers and insurance brokers.
Im no socialist but the nation is plainly being looted and the government is doing nothing to stop it.

Ensuring that the “pillar banks” would be in a position to screw the Irish customer was and is government policy. It was and is a fundamental part of the whole approach to rescuing the banks and was announced as such by the outgoing government and by the incoming coalition.

People voted for this to be done to them.

Bank in Northern Ireland and do all your transactions online. Sure, you’ll be giving your money to another country; but at least you’ll be kicking the a-holes in the teeth over here.

Giving more public money to bust banks is not very popular so it Is best done quietly.

We learned yesterday that our Government is going to give half a billion euro to the ESM Bank bailout scheme on 23 October. The decision to double the first payment from €250 million was made last month in Cyprus. It was kept quiet in Ireland.

Thomas Pringle blew the whistle on them yesterday – fb.me/2lbizhxPx

T

They are pulling funding for healthcare and the mental health sector.All these New charges are going to push some families to despair and possibly to a place where they will need help. when they look for these places they will be gone or closed. Welcome to Ireland … The banana republic

The banks will continue to screw us, simple arithmetic says that if the government want the €64bl returned to avoid the tax payer paying for the bailout then the banks must recover this from their customers. How many bank accounts is there in bailed out financial institutions, divide €64bl by that and you will understand how hard the bank has to screw it’s customers.

I’m in a full time job, I have a modest mortgage and I’m not in negative equity but every week I find I have less ans less. I spent a day last week checking drawers and jars for coins so that I could afford to get something for my dinner. I dread to think what people are doing with kids and big mortgages. It has left me with the abandon ship feeling and I have been researching for a way out to whatever country will take me. The fees my bank charges every quarter could pay half my esb!! I’m out!!! I can’t wait to go into my bank and withdraw my locked up savings (even if I’m penalised) and then hand them the keys to my house.

Years ago, I knew a rather eccentric girl who refused to have a bank account. She would cash her work cheque every month then transfer the cash to a biscuit tin under her bed. Oh how we laughed…:)

This infuriates me, I have 1 loan, I bought a house when on 3 times what I earn today, 5 years ago. Never missed a payment, always worked and they continue to stuff me. I am done with banks, never again will I borrow. Me and cash from here on in and if I was self employed I would pay little or nothing to the government that does nothing for me.

I just don’t know what to say.. destruction by the leaders! I tell ya what i’m going to do..it will be hard but I’m moving into a one bedroom apartment with a family of 5.. if the Indians,philapino’s can do it ,so can I.. this stigma of a big family in a small dwelling is becoming reality… Just turned down on a AIB morgage therefore I’ll take my 60k saved buy a one bedroom apartment for cash.. no morgage, minimal bills , start massive savings of 3000k/month and buy my house for my family outright in 5 years! No more morgage for 15 years…Own my apartment and small house at the end! Serious times calls for serious views! Substandard.. only in the eyes of the beholder! Fecking banks!

Aib is the photo used for this article and rightly so.
All the banks have added transaction charges but most of them you can get around by how you bank. But that’s not possible with the way Aib restructured.

I went in last week and closed my account, telling them why. I was a customer all my life with a good balance. They said nothing.

I think its high time for everyone in this country to withdraw all cash from these banks, and show the fcukers whose really boss, most bills can be paid in local po these days, the credit unions are still giving loans. so do we actually need the banks?

We need to protest, at least let them know that there are voters wanting change, it’s not going to happen by itself, we need a plan to have strength in numbers, any rallies or groups out there I should know about?

Is it just me or has anybody else noticed that some shops and cafes are not taking cards these days?

I set up a bank account with chase in 20mins when I was over in the states this Summer. I had a ‘personal banker’ who’s name, email and number I had. I also had a card in my hand and a personalised pin. Oh ye not to mention online banking. The standard of service over here by comparison is ridiculous

We are great at commenting, but who is actually going to do something constructive? Did Irish Tax payers not bail out Banks? Does that not give us some say?
What are going to do about it?

My opinion is the government has not investigated and pursued legal action against the banks as any investigation will lead back to many politicians who are or were in government, who had loans, shares or any dealings with the banks. Self preservation. We need a third party investigation to expose all involved.

I just can’t understand this at all, if you are lucky enough to be employed your wages are drastically down compared to the time when you took out your home mortgage.
If you are self employed I’m sure you have had to cut back on your charge out rates to compete for business and again your income is drastically down.

Then you are down further in your pocket with various cuts to Social Welfare that some people depend on such as Children’s allowance.
Stealth Taxes are on the increase, (VAT, Property Taxes) again hitting your pocket.
With next month’s budget I’m sure the Government will cut tax credits and our cut off points, increasing the amount of PAYE and Income Tax we all pay and as for the USC, it is a joke.

However all living expenses are increasing, (Gas, Electricity, Diesel/Petrol, Motor Insurance, Road Tax, Health Insurance, Mortgage Interest….The list goes on)

Guys the figures just don’t add up, can’t anyone not see this.
Eventually no one will have enough money to survive on.

Would anyone agree that by REDUCING all taxes such as VAT, Vehicle Registration Tax, Income Tax, PRSI and Universal Social Charge, Import duty, Excise Duty and giving people more money in their pockets will actually stimulate this economy.
People will have more cash in their pockets, will eventually spend more and in turn this will generate more VAT for the Revenue, stimulate more jobs therefore paying out less Social Welfare whilst bringing in more PAYE, PRSI and USC.
Reducing VRT will reduce the price of cars and maybe even stimulate this industry again creating jobs and bringing in more Tax Revenues with greater sales numbers.

You can’t tax the people out of this situation, eventually everything will crash. (even more than it has done already)

Germany kicks US when we are down yet we buy their cars and spend money in their shops. We shop in Lidl and Aldi to save a few pennies, they only have a handful off staff in their stores and usually aren’t helpful. The more trade switches to these guys, the more jobs will be lost in Dunnes, Supervalu etc. as they employ fewer staff. Some of their fresh stuff is Irish but most of it comes from countries who want to support austerity in Ireland. And where do their profits go? The same place as the interest on the bailout loans, that’s where

There is no profitable well run bank going to set up for small business or general retail in Ireland. Potential is too limited given the risk factors. They may come in to cherry pick corporate and large exporter business. Someone some day may take a look at mortgages but only after a period of stability.

What Id love to know is , if a profitable well structured bank wanted to setup in Ireland next week , where they would be in a position to behave competitively, would the Government grant them a license ?

I somehow believe , the Government would rather then didn’t apply for a banking license in the Rep.

I once came into a small few quid – having met with 2 bank officials ( they were to advise me ) but all they wanted to do is sell various products which invariably would only help reduce my balance and obviously get as much out of me as is humanly possible…….They were stunned when I simply said ” if I can’t just leave my dough resting in an account and NOT have it working for me ..I’ll simply withdraw it all and throw it into a biscuit tin !!..as you wish sir.

So much rhetoric, and too much precious time…wasted…

What is desperately needed for personal banking customers i Ireland is some arrangement for ethical, free banking. Like the Co-Op Bank in the UK. The Credit Unions might be in a position to put something similar in place. Ordinary folks are fed up with the big banks, who have failed us utterly.

In a comment yesterday in the papers, a spokesman for the Dept. of finance when questioned regarding the morgtage increases,replied mortgage rates were “commercial decisions”for banks….and here comes the killer..
since the bail out, he continued a “relationship framework”had been SIGNED with the domestic banks,and the government.The spokesman ends the statement by saying,”We now dont get involved in “Day to Day” banking”..
Talk about been thrown to the wolves…..

My mortgage has gone up nearly €700 per annum since July. Bank of Ireland/ICS and I do not have a job. And their variable rate is now 4.55%. Plus I see that the fixed rate that they gave me is 0.5% higher than the rate they give new business! Where are the Government in all this?

Ryanair should open a bank. Plenty of empty shops in prime locations and most people would transfer straight away.

Pulled out of my local bank altogether. I now save in Silver coins. Gold is good too but a bit expensive. I feel great that the banking system cant gain on my hard earned wealth and I get extra leverage with the surge in asset prices as a result of US dollar or future ECB printing. Only issue will be 50% or more capital gains tax that desperate governments will introduce in the future.
Silver is fairly liquid. If you need cash in a hurry any local jewelry store or cash for metal shop will take it from you. better than an ATM.

” just BEGUN picking our pockets” ? What planet have you been on for the last 30 years?

@ coddler, I hope you didn’t type all that on a phone or else you will need a finger transplant ? :-)

I wonder if I could survive without a bank account.
Didn’t Bertie claim not to have a bank account when he was a minister.
If it’s good enough for that clown it’s good enough for me…..

Time to do what we’ve always done, bury our heads in the sand! The whole country needs to come together and stop what’s happening but that’ll never happen!

I was with AIB until they inroduced personal charges, then switched to National Irish Bank. NIB are now to be known as “Danske Bank” and they have closed my local branch, are about to close the regional branch my account transferred to and have taken the “Irish” from the name. The service is crap, phone queues are from Achill to Wicklow and they charge plenty for it.
Bugger ‘em!

The Banks here will be in trouble for a long time. Banks are only as strong as the economy they are in. Multi Nationals and our own Corporates such as Glanbia cannot bank with our Banks becuase their credit ratings are too low, The Small Business community is in disarray and probably most could not replay new credit if they got it. There are 15% arrears and rising on mortgages when 1% traditionally would be counted as high. They have closed or are closing their overseas businesses. So they are now trying the only tactic they have left increase rates on existing customers and increase charges on their small customer bases. The government cannot object as they have told the Banks to get themselves back into the Black at all costs to justify the 65 million they have being given.

You would have set up new banks for a tiny fraction of the money.

You cannot be serious, coddler??
Although the idea of potential discomfort inflicted on the banks will please their detractors, of who there are many, it would result in innocent mortgage holders gaining bad credit records and losing their homes. It couldn’t be organised, not with the best will in the world. You see, that’s the BEAUTY of capitalism, the rich and therefore powerful hold ALL the aces and top cards. You cannot beat them. Even the government cannot win.this game.

Its very easy to be populist when writing about the Irish Banks. They made huge mistakes and the country is bailing them out, leaving the tax payer to take the pain. They reward the taxpayer for this generousity by increasing rates and fees. Simple.

Or is it that easy ? Irish banks made huge profits in the boom years by borrowing money cheaply on the markets and lending it cheaply, mainly to the Irish public. In order to keep up capital ratios they took deposits from the Irish public in some cases paying morein interest than they were charging on loans. In the boom years banks tripped over each other to offer discounts on fees. Fees were dramaticly cheaper than anywhere else in Europe. As an example in one bank the fee for an unpaid cheque being returned to your account was €5 in its sister bank in NI the equivilent was £25.

Naturally it was an unsustainable business model, the profits that they generated were really no more than sleight of hand. Now that the crash has happened and the proverbial has hit the fan we need to decide do we want profitable banks or do we want to bale them out on an ongoing basis. The world of banking is changing we need to change with it. No longer is it sustainable to maintain a branch on every street corner, to have a teller available for every customer in the queue, to use a paper based money transmission system. The world of branch banking, with its cheques and large cash transactions is over. In European terms Ireland is still the largest per capita user of cheques and in absolute terms only surpassed by the UK and France. If Ireland is going to have profitable banks then we have to allow them charge higher rates of interest on loans and bigger fees. If we don’t want that let’s stop talking and keep bailing

My god the amount of negativity….it’s like a giant leech on this site. Get some perspective. Even on the dole in this country you are still in the top 10% on the planet. Would you swap all your money woes for the health of a loved one?

If you have a Sky TV subscription and a mobile phone you cannot complain about not having enough money as you choose to spend it on non essential items. If you don’t have these items and you don’t ever eat out and you don’t by new clothes every couple of months and you still have nothing left over you’re responsible for doing something about it – even if that means emigrating. just stop whinging about it. Your life is running out and when your dead, your dead.

PS – if your only response is to ‘red thumb’ me because you don’t like what I’m saying then you’re not taking responsibility for your own life.

My proposal for a peaceful revolt would be a National Mortgage strike with two demands:

1. No more funding of the banks from the Peoples’ pockets for any reason.
2. The People be reimbursed for the money already stolen from us.

Demand 1. Unfortunately a significant proportion of the bondholders have already been paid off at this stage thanks to the abject surrender of the last and present governments in the face of ECB demands and threats. There are however enormous sums still being being paid to bondholders on a daily basis and this haemorrhage needs to stop. Have a look at Bondwatch Blog from Diarmuid O Flynn (Irish Examiner journalist) so see the huge losses we are suffering every day. On top of this there is still the €31billion of promissory notes to be paid and the interest which amounts to €47 billion approximately. We can’t allow any of this money to be paid. Heaped on this again are the billions we have pumped into NAMA which is just another bank bailout under a different mask. All this looting of the nation needs to stop immediately.

Demand 2. The money we paid to date to honour the bank bonds had disappeared back into the global financial casino and is gone for good. But there are ways to recover our losses if the government was brave and radical enough. The figures are not entirely clear but since the banks extorted the blanket bank guarantee from Brian Lenihan in Sept 2008 there has been at least €67 billion stolen from the Irish people and pumped into the banks. On top of this is NAMA which has taken €72 billion worth of bad loans off the banks balance sheets. We will be very lucky if we recoup 50% of this, so let’s say another loss of €35 billion. That leaves a conservative estimate of €100 billion which has been extorted from the Irish people so far.

Even the right wind commentators now agree that the ECB exceeded its authority when it demanded that Ireland repay the bank bondholder in full. Ireland may have a legal case it can take to the European Court of Justice in relation to this. Therefore the first port of call for the government should be Europe with a demand for repayment for the banking debt that was illegitimately imposed on us.

Another way to recover the money robbed from us would be to take ownership of the bank’s Mortgage Book in return for the state aid which the banks extorted from the country. I don’t have the exact numbers but let’s say we have pumped €20billion into AIB/EBS at this point. The government could immediately take ownership of that €20billion figure in performing mortgages and direct the monthly income stream to finance the country and help reduce our deficit. The bond money has disappeared but there is still real wealth in the banks in the form of bricks and mortar which can be leveraged to help the people.

If the loss of some or all of the mortgage book results in the collapse of AIB/EBS then so be it. We will step in and take control of the retail banking network to keep the branches and ATMs open etc. We own the bank almost entirely now so we can take as much of the retail banking system as we need to serve the country.
After the deposits have been moved to the new state retail bank he remainder of the bank can be liquidated and divided up among the creditors or sold to an interested party.

Essentially we would extract our national stake from the bank through the housing/property stock , take the banking infrastructure that we need to support the people and dump the rest.
We need to stop the charade that the Irish banks are functioning financial institutions providing the normal banking services such as credit to the economy. They are not and they may never be again. This is an unprecedented crisis and we need to take complete control of the banks and exploit them to ensure the survival of the nation. What the government have done so far is to nationalise/socialise the debts of the banking system while allowing the banks to retain control of their assets. We need to reverse this position and nationalise the assets of the banks to save our republic.

The beauty of a Mortgage Strike is that it would directly target the Banks who bear the bulk of the responsibility for breaking the country.
The recent property bubble amounted to a enormous theft from Irish people where hundreds of thousands of people have been saddled with huge debt just to put a modest roof over their heads (in most cases) An insider elite of landholders, developers and bankers became obscenely wealthy on the back of this bubble while the political class encouraged the stampede.
This debt is now a millstone around our necks but it could be used as our most effective weapon to drive real change for the better in how this country is governed.

A Mortgage Boycott would force this government to finally begin to meet their responsibility to the Irish people instead of pandering to the infinitely greedy banks. This would involve a large number of people withholding their mortgage repayments until the government meets the 2 demands outlined above. As the Irish state now owns most of the Irish banking system, the impact on the government would be immediate and substantial.

The protest should insist on a mortgage freeze for the duration of the Strike so that people are relieved of the burden of paying their mortgages without any penalty until a satisfactory conclusion is reached.
So for example if a person’s outstanding mortgage total is €200,000 to be paid over a 20 year period then this is the amount and timeframe which will apply when the boycott is over. The withheld monthly payments would not be transferred over to the banks at the end of the strike but would instead be paid at the back end of the mortgage term when people’s finances should hopefully have improved.
The freeze would have the advantage of easing the financial pressure on the people striking while increasing the impact on the financial institutions and the government by depriving them of income for the duration of the strike and with no prospect of receiving the outstanding money until people reach the end of their mortgage terms.
No penalties, additional interest or any financial sanction would be accepted from the Banks or the strike would continue.

Obviously, it would take a significant number of people to commit to the action for this to be effective but it might be possible to kick start the protest through the media, Facebook etc and sign up the necessary number of people for the movement. Momentum for the civil disobedience should be achievable with so many people already under serious financial pressure thanks to the greed and stupidity of our banking and political elite and other vested interests.

A reasonable target might be in the region of 250,000 mortgage holders who are prepared to sign up and commit. When the target figure has been reached the protest would begin the following month and continue until the government undertakes to stop rewarding the failed bondholder gamblers with our money and future.
Our past and present governments have signed up the Irish people to foot the bill for the banking collapse to the tune of €100 Billion and counting. FG and Labour will tear the heart out of this country with vicious cutbacks and tax increases to pay for this robbery while our young people look at an empty future and emigrate in their tens of thousands. This is wrong and has to stop.
It’s time the government realised that they rule the Irish people only through our consent and they do not have our permission to bleed the country dry to provide a transfusion to the parasite financial elite.

Makes you wonder if your in negative equity why bother paying your mortgage