Does anyone know what the point of the tribunals was. As far as I can see, no criminal prosecutions or convictions were allowed to come from them. They only seemed to be a gravy train for the lawyers.

Help please.

Maybe but he is a fine gaeler and it happened at the time fine gael were in government, plus there are many around the cabinet table today who were in the same government as lowry

Would we be shocked if FG took a different approach to lowry than they have been to ming, so far they seem to think Ming’s action is more serious than lowry’s

Its ok, he’ll use Ming’s defense.

It’s everyone else fault!

It’s Friday of the Paddy’s day weekend.

Dáil don’t sit on a Friday, even if it did the “Great & Good” of FG (the ones who have not been caught yet), are all away with the birds on “Government” business at our expense.

They all hope this will blow over before they return, so they can keep up screwing us and not being accountable to us.

Bring back FF I say, at least we know them to be what they are.

In fairness to FG, at least he was never allowed back into the party. Unlike Beverly Cooper Flynn. Sure she was barely out of FF a wet week before she was back in. And at least they weren’t relying on his vote to stay in power like the last coalition. However, seeing FG people playing golf with Lowry doesn’t inspire confidence at all.

Is it Gardaí policy that any criminality by TD’s needs to be aired on national TV before it’s investigated?

Michael

What has the airing of the tape got to do with the Gardaí? A journalist got the tape and has publicised it, it has nothing to do with the Guards and they couldn’t stop it even if they wanted to.

@Bo11ocks_to_this I believe the tribunals investigate the issues and then hand over the findings to the relevant authorities who then proceed in trying to get convictions. Not sure why it’s done that way but there you go.

Here’s a little song for background music for you as you read political articles ……………

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlMtf-95-p4

Michael Lowry is Fianna Fails liability now. FG threw him out of the party a decade ago. FF were letting him order off the menu for his own constituency and thus ensuring his reelection just to keep the last catastrophic Government clinging to power that little bit longer. Micheal Martins FF Government, lest we forget.

@Bo11ocks_to_this
I thought it was obvious what the purpose of the tribunals was, to make sure none of the Galway test set ever went before the courts. How many people were charged over the beef tribunals? One, the journalist who broke the story, her crime, not revealing her sources.

Well said Carcu

FG and FF: two heads of the same cancer, or do I mean chancer.

“If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck then it must be a duck”

Why? All parties were raising funds in a similar fashion. It was the norm at the time.

Because, according to comments on the VinB show last night, some of the parties making donations to the FG party at this time were either directly or indirectly interested parties in the awarding of the licence, which was under the control of the then Minister Lowry on behalf of a FG led coalition.

That’s not the same context as ‘all other parties’ fundraising activities at this time. And it is well you know it too.

Brian it still is the norm .

Would be amazed if the tape was admissible as evidence. All sorts of data protection-type issues there Lowry could use to stop that I would have thought.

how many times has this man got to be caught before he is charged with something

Jail the fu€ker I say!

Michael

That ensures a fair trial cannot happen so not point in investigating let alone charge.

as happened before this buffoon would top the poll in his area will voters never learn in this country i dont think so

RTE should be sold . It’s a joke. They moved to Rome en masse this week. If that’s true about R. Doherty then she should pay up any arrears to Revenue , and find some humility!

RTE always the last to let the poulation know what is happening and only then if they have no choice but to broadcast.

well said jenny the goverment media machine RTE is an extension arm of the goverment the time has come to get rid of RTE it does not serve the people .

Yes, the relationship between them can be summed up in the phrase, “we’re not going to hurt each, now, are we?”

Its all Dublin’s fault and if Dublin wasnt so high and mighty then he’d be grand, I blame Dublin,feckin Dublin!

They’ll assume it is Mario Rosenstock and that Lowry is as innocent as ever.

They don’t care! Sure people have known what he’s been like for years, but as long as he gets the potholes fixed sure who cares!! People didn’t care about Bertie in the 2007 election either, or Haughey before that, so I don’t think it’s just a Tipp thing unfortunately. It’s very depressing.

It is the culchies who keep voting the crook in! :-)

It was the Dubs that voted Bertie and Haughey in!

Lol so true. We should all just elect dustin the turkey. Sure he’s your only man :-)

Northsiders!

And Ray Burke don’t forget and Liam Lawlor and the Mayo gang for Flynn after Flynn, Tipp no different to other places really but convenient to hammer the voters.
The powers that be know more than the ordinary person and they take no action except in Lowrys case they kicked him out of FG but he continues to be best pals with his old friends in that party in HQ and in Tipp.

They won’t give a shit as proven by the fact he got re-elected the last time. Can’t stand the man and never voted for him but he’s got his Thurles Mafia and the rest covered so he’ll always get re-elected until he opts not to run.

With regards to Liam Lawlor being voted in by Dubs, My dad was at one of the counts in either the early ’82 or ’87′ general election when miraculously out of nowhere, late in the night/morning, Lawlor pulled a few hundred votes from the sky outdoing Tomas MacGiolla!!Guess who was the chief voting returns officer in charge of events that night….George Redmond ….my dad and those who were there that night couldn’t believe what was happening…cant be proven nor disproven but these people are a different breed and would do anything to win power…so I wouldn’t have put it past Lawlor…

the fools would vote for him again

Seeing as he is on a sabbatical ….. this might amuse you in the meantime take the phrase “That’s Brilliant” and say it in a liverpudlian accent …think John Bishop ! ………… it’s very annoying and it won’t go away !

He did save FG from going Bankrupt in the mid 90′s,might explain the misplaced Enda and several other senior FG figures have for Lowery.

He’s allowed because the people voted him in. We’re the only ones who can stop them walking through the doors of the Dáil.

Cormác

Enda or Michael?

What is worse is that I’d almost believe that what I saw on TV3 last night was little more than a figment of my imagination. A quick google search throws up the journal.ie, and newswhip.com as the only news sources in the entire country that have bothered to cover this story in any way shape or form.

RTE appear not to have mentioned it on either radio or television (unless I missed something). So called Newstalk have given it a wide birth entirely, which I suppose is hardly a surprise when one considers who owns that particular organization.

One thing for sure, the silence is deafening.

@Dawg – And the Sindo, which broke the story in the first place.

I agree with you about RTE. They seem to be scared off anything mildly controversial since the bogus tweet and the Kevin Reynolds debacle. Current Affairs is lame populist whining these days. I have no idea what the point of it is supposed to be, and even less idea why licence payers are supposed to fund it.

Pat Kenny’s wages that’s why.

Yes @Emily, Elaine Byrne has a spine made entirely of tungsten steel. A picture in any dictionary next to the definintion of “journalist”.

Kudos to Paul Hyland and the Journal.ie for covering this story today.

I wonder is it legally permissible to conscientiously object to paying RTE a licence fee?

4500 of us will pay our tv licence or broadcasting charge should I say, to cover Pat Kennys wages. Money well spent?

Just a little point about the Broadcast Charge ; If Michael Lowry was in his old position of Minister for communications then he would be collecting it………..
Or to put it another way ; Pat Rabbitte is the successor to Michael Lowry’s Department ……… and another previous incumbent was Ray Burke ! ………………
Now I’m off to buy a few fish ………. I love the smell of fishy on a Friday !

What do you want them do? They can’t do much at all. There was a motion of censure passed against him after the Moriarity Tribunal, but sure that doesn’t do anything really at all. It’s a matter for the Gardaí now, so you don’t want the Government getting involved, tampering with the investigation and possibly allowing him off on a technicality.

On the big picture, it’s actually a good thing that the executive can’t sanction a member of the legislature, as this would be bad from a separation of powers and democratic point of view.

Has Enda accepted the findings of Moriarity yet?

Why did Lowery still up till very recently have such favourably access to senior FG ministers Hogan&Reilly to name but two.

@Jenny No I don’t think enda has actually stood up in the dail and accepted the findings of the tribunal, makes you wonder

But as long as mainstream media don’t make an issue of it, it doesn’t make its way into the pulic

That’s incorrect. If you would just take 5 minutes of your time and actually look up Oireachtas.ie you would clearly see that Enda Kenny has accepted the findings of the Moriarity Tribunal. He called it: “A devastating critique of a powerful elite exposing a gross abuse of privilege; a rank abuse of public office and a devastating abuse of public trust is”. It’s all here: http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2011032900019?opendocument

Can people please get their facts right and stop speculating.

@ Ignoreireland ……………… Talk is cheap ….what has he done about it ? ………….. unleashed C.A.B. ? ………………

@Dermot Ryan, again, if you look at another comment of mine, what can he do? And I for one am certainly glad that the Government doesn’t have the power to direct the Gardaí or CAB to prosecute anybody. Imagine if they did? I’m not attacking this government particularly, but any Government could potentially use such a power to silence political opposition. It’s the mark of a democracy that Government power is limited, and on issues like this, when we’re talking about due process and allowing a plurality of political views to be held, it’s of vital importance that the Government can’t force him to resign or direct the Gardaí or CAB to prosecute him. It’s up to us the people to eject him from his seat. I know it sucks to see him in the Dáil, collecting his salary and earning his pension, but that’s the people of Tipperary’s fault, not the Government’s.

but isn’t the fundamental problem …the Taoiseach IS supposed to be in charge ! ….what if the Director of Public Prosecutions is in the pocket of someone …..I’m not saying they are but the taoiseach should be able to sack corrupt officials or incompetent ones ….that’s why the taoiseach’s term should be restricted to one term …it would remove the fear that all politicians have of not being re-elected and it would let them concentrate on the job of getting rid of corruption ……. We need to change the system or we are just on a spiral to nowhere !
By the way I wanted Enda Kenny to be the greatest Taoiseach this Country has ever seen based on the words spoken at the last election , admittedly he is restricted but we the people gave him the largest majority in the State to do what had to be done , to do what he said he would in the safe knowledge that the people were behind him 100% ….I’m genuinely sorry to say that from where I’m sitting that has not and will not be done by this or any government that exists under the current system ! ………The Central bank now decides whether you are evicted or not …… Anglo, the most corrupt bank swept under the carpet , I could go on but hopefully you see my point !
And by the way the key to sorting Ireland out is a strict adherence to the Irish Constitution …that is what gives the Taoiseach Power not legislation !

@Ignoreland

Enda did not utter the words that he accepted the findings of the moriarty tribunal, you should actually read what he said

This from micheal marting after enda spoke

Deputy Micheál Martin: I welcome the publication of the final report of the Tribunal of Inquiry into Payments to Politicians and Related Matters. I accept fully the conclusions of the Moriarty tribunal, and I note that sentence is missing from the Taoiseach’s address. The Taoiseach needs to clarify prior to the conclusion of this debate that he accepts the conclusions and findings of the Moriarty report

So you’re trying to argue that he rejects the findings or the Moriarity Tribunal? Or that he doesn’t accept them because he hasn’t expressly said that he does in the extremely narrow and formalistic way that you’ve defined ‘accepting’ to be? So basically you’re going to completely ignore everything else that he said and the substantive content of what he said? Are you serious? Are you that pedantic??

He’ll keep his pension though, is he being paid his ministerial pension and his TD wage at the same time!

Lowery made reference to K Phelan’s family to a Senator,Phelan became aware of this and released the tape.Check out VB on the 3 player,tape is shocking.

Truth warts n all would put the majority of the FG party in the same standing as lowery, greedy, corrupt, stroke pulling, brown envelope taking fcukers!!

FG the same corrupt party as FF.

Ryan- and every time you repeat that lie…the FF spiel “sure they’re all the same”…you sow the seeds of the next FF Government.

How’d you work that one out kev? I’m putting both corrupt parties into the same pot. Same game different name, here’s hoping sensible people can see that and vote out FG just as quick as they voted FF out.

Ryan- do I really need to trot out the dozen senior FF politicians caught out over the last number of years? Not county councillors- ministers, senators, TD’s and Taoiseach’s, no less? On doing so, you’ll trot out the dozen comparable FG politicians who were similarly tainted, thus proving that “they’re all the same”? No? Of course not. Because they’re not. And you can’t back up what you’re spouting. As usual.

Is boon not a member if the bilderberg grouping? Did he not attend said group on public funds and what was said at said meeting?
I don’t need to back anything up FG are the sane as FF…..warts n all and in years to come we will see the true extent if their own backhanders (primary care centre anyone, nursing home conflict of interest anyone)

Save your breath you won’t convince me that FG are any different.

Hahahaa *boon=Noonan*

Though the typo might be right this time.

Thought so, Ryan. Embarrassed for you.

You must confuse me with some one who gives a sh1t what you think.

Where do we go from here you say? Nowhere, that’s where. This is IReland INc. He is part of the establishment and him and his ilk are untouchable. All these conversations are complete wastes of time.

I love the smell of Napalm in the morning, smells like LO-w-Ry. ( do this in you best Colonel Kilgore voice).

One of these days this war is gonna end son, one of these days this war is going to end

The Director of Public Prosecutions has had the tape since then ! ……………The D.P.P. is now going to come under the spotlight ! …and rightly so ! ….one of the most powerful anti-corruption devices in the State …………..
Well done Sunday Independent and here and Vincent Browne …… This is, I feel, is the Annie Murphy moment for the corruption in this State ……expect alot of your heroes to fall folks !

Capital “H” for here ..in the interests of fairness !…apologies Mr. Journal !

No! …and please don’t be insulted the constitution is fine as it is …it just requires an article that hands the people a mechanism to remove a corrupt politiician/government from office…………Every single problem with Ireland can be fixed with our constitution having this addition! ……….. and the right judges, politicians and civil servants ! ……..

I believe CAB is now involved,they have “teeth” unlike the tribunel.

You and people like you are the core root of the problem, not politicians. It’s that attitude from the electorate that breeds the corruption we see today.

Well said Jason.

You need to justify you’re statement, as I believe you failed to do this. What exactly is your point.

Gaz, I genuinely thought it was so self explanatory that anyone could understand it. But if you really want me to spell it out I will.

If we look to the Netherlands, a sitting member of parliament caused national outrage when he was found out to have over-claimed on his allowed expenses. How much did it take to have the Dutch up in arms? One thousand euro. The electorate don’t tolerate corruption to any extent over here and, as a result, Dutch politics is quite clean of corruption. Ireland on the other hand has a low corruption level because it has been legalised and the Irish electorate (using your very logic) accept it. So who is worse? The person who takes the system for everything he or she is “entitled” to or people like you who allow them to take everything they can because “they’re all doing it”? In my opinion the people who facilitate it using your logic are worse than those who do it.

I sincerely hope that anyone who is found to be corrupt is treated accordingly. I just have little faith that this happens in Ireland.

F**k you, Deputy Stagg! F**k you!! That is most unparliamentary language!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YD-xxoQwOo4

“You’re a shower of knackers”Phil Hogan to a memeber of the Press.

Fair point Ignoreireland but where is Gogarty now?
and an addendum …….Emmet Stagg’s history is not exactly snow-white ………. which brings me back to Ming …I would love to know who the arresting Gardai were on the night in the Phoenix Park and where they are now ….

They have put up.

Oh yeah, that makes a lot sense. Lowry must be innocent after all.