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Dublin: 9 °C Sunday 19 May, 2013

Noonan insists: No, the Troika DID demand that we repay the bank bondholders

After Stephen Donnelly reports the Troika shifted blame from themselves, Michael Noonan says: it’s Trichet’s fault.

Michael Noonan speaks with Jean-Claude Trichet, the then-ECB president, at Noonan's meeting of European finance ministers in March 2011.
Michael Noonan speaks with Jean-Claude Trichet, the then-ECB president, at Noonan's meeting of European finance ministers in March 2011.
Image: Geert Vanden Wijngaert/AP

FINANCE MINISTER Michael Noonan has again insisted that policies adopted by the Troika mean Ireland’s state-supported banks are forced to repay the unsecured and unguaranteed bonds.

Noonan’s denial contradicts statements from independent TD Stephen Donnelly who was this week told by the Troika itself – during its ongoing quarterly inspection of Ireland’s progress under the bailout deal – that the policy was one adopted by the previous government.

In a blog post published on his website, Donnelly said he had met the Troika as part of a delegation from the technical group, and had been told that “it was the previous government and not the Troika that insisted on payments to unseen unguaranteed bondholders of the pillar banks.”

This meeting took place on Wednesday of last week – the same day that Noonan went on the Dáil record to insist that the policy was, in fact, determined by the European Central Bank.

“When this Government took office it attempted to implement burden sharing with senior unguaranteed bondholders, in particular institutions that were no longer core elements of the Irish financial system,” Noonan said in response to a written Dáil question from Donnelly himself.

Noonan said these policies had been discussed at length, particularly with the then-ECB president Jean-Claude Trichet in the run-up to the results of the last round of stress tests which were announced on March 31 of last year, just weeks after the government came into office.

Noonan said:

At that time the President believed that such action was not in the interests of Ireland or the Euro Area.

This matter was discussed again with President Trichet on a number of occasions including the Ecofin meeting in Poland in September 2011.

That Ecofin meeting was the last attended by Trichet in his role as ECB president; he was succeeded by Mario Draghi in November of that year. Noonan’s response does not explicitly discuss any individual discussions on the subject with Draghi, though the two have met on several occasions.

The minister added arguments of his own, however – saying that State-owned AIB had a mandate to ensure the proper supply of banking services and that its business model remained intact.

This, he argued, required it to keep its business model intact so that it would eventually be able to access funding in the usual way from the world’s money markets, and wean itself off State support.

“Nevertheless, I would like to again reiterate that this Government is currently in discussions with our European colleagues in relation to securing a deal on the Irish bank debt”, he said.

“Further detailed work will continue to ensure that the positive moves in Europe are harnessed to maximise the benefit to the Irish taxpayer.”

Read: Troika forced Ireland into repaying €1bn AIB bond – Quinn

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Comments (63 Comments)

  • These were official meetings. Surely minutes were taken? Why can’t this “he said, she said” nonsense be solved by releasing those minutes? No more ambiguity.

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  • Donnolly is the lone sane voice from the asylum that is called the Dail .

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  • Cara 21/10/12 #

    Well we have to believe Micheal Noonan don’t we?? It’s not as if he has lied to the Irish people previously…..

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    • Haaa haaaa … seriously , hee hee, whooo haaa haaa ….. Noonan … haaa haaa …

      I have to laugh, otherwise …….

      We have been sold a pup … the emperor has no clothes, and FFG/Labour/FF have been found out !!!!

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    • Noonan said plenty of times that we should pay the bondhoders. He never said the troika were leaning on him. Whether its true or not though doesn’t matter now – it was the right thing to do, it’s over now and we’re more stable because of it.

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    • Right thing to do? Could you provide some facts to back up that claim?

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    • Irish 10 year bond yields were around 22% this time last year – too high by far for any country to sustain itself on the market. Since paying off bondholders this rate has fallen to below 6% – a rate we can afford. The reason for this is that the State paid its debt. Simply put: we paid back what we owe and investors are more willing to lend now. Hence, we’re back on the market. If Noonan hadn’t taken the decision to pay back the bondholders we’d be looking at a second bailout because we wouldn’t be able to siurce funding from anywhere else.

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    • Noonan is WRONG. He himself opted to continue repaying bondholders last November after he unilaterally backed down from imposing losses on BOI bondholders.

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    • Every effort by this Government to reduce the debt has been rebuked or rejected outright. Certain issues,not so easily dismissed off hand are being strung out for as long as possible.Retrospective recapitalisation as an example.If it goes the way it looks as if it may go,well then there will be absolutely no decision made until after the next German election.That is next September I think.Expect more delaying tactics.Its like they want to get this Government here out of office.That puts FF back in the running for Government,Coalison ..whatever. Its like they are trying to do everything possible to get there old FF buddies back. You would never think it was deliberate.That could never happen….could it?

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  • “The myth of Irish pluck continues today, even amid the financial crisis. Prime Minister Enda Kenny recently graced the cover of Time magazine. But according to data from the International Monetary Fund, Ireland has displaced Japan as the world’s most indebted economy. Government, household and nonfinancial company debt add up to 524% of Irish GDP. (The Central Bank of Ireland uses a different basis for calculating the debt of nonfinancial firms; its estimate for total debt would be lower than the IMF’s.) Funding this gargantuan load at an average cost of 4.5% would swallow nearly 24% of GDP—in other words, Ireland’s entire industrial output.”
    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390443675404578060282188578350.html

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  • The kop 21/10/12 #

    you just just smell the BULL Stuff every time they talk…. being lying all through the pre-election and since the first day they took office..the funny thing being they didn’t need to try sell us so much shite in pre-election sure they were a shoe-in…..nobody was going to vote FF back in to power…..
    way more inclined to believe Stephen Donnelly on this one… always well prepared whenever i see him on doing stuff on tv..and talks fact not fiction

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  • Ha ha ha BULLSHIT!!

    They wanted us to pay back the banks at any cost to the taxpayer, and now the people are turning because they know that this debt is not our responsibility, yet, money is being taken from every single man, woman and child in this country.

    They knew it was wrong but have vested interests in these banks. Just look up the bilderberg meetings where Michael Noonan is actually a member.

    It’s an utter disgrace!!!!!

    All we are hearing from ye is lies lies and more lies and people are getting pretty tired of the same bs year in, year out.

    http://www.change.org/petitions/supporting-the-irish-nation-step-down-from-government

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  • Noonan also told us all summer that we will wait and see what deal Spain gets as we will have to get the same as we are in a union but after Merkel ruled out any retrospective bank debt deal he insisted it was only in reference to Spain.
    I wish Rte could play back the many clips as its a complete joke.

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  • This shower are turning out to be bigger clowns than the last bunch of gombeens.

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    • They are worse , The last shower were parochial in comparisson in the mistakes they made compared to fg/lab. This shower are deliberate in the cruelty they are foisting on us.

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    • Eileen
      You clearly don’t know what your talking about as the meetings Minister Noonan is talking about are a matter of public record.
      The accusations by our two Sinn Fein contributors that Minister Noonan is a liar is tawdry and not unexpected when one considers that these gentle guys belong to a Party whose Leader is accused of instructing Volunteers to drive a young woman across the border to her execution/murder.
      How dare they suggest that honourable people like Michael Noonan would lie about fiscal matters because this is the one area where integrity is vital to our National interest.
      When we read of the hypocrisy of Sinn Fein in terms of their participation in the Administration of that piece of the island that is Ruled by Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth, Peter Robinson accuses them of gross dishonesty in their dealings. What else would you expect from people who still have massive caches of cartridges.

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    • Since you like to drag up history Paddy, lets not forget Noonan threatened to drag a dying mother through the courts.I’m sure the stress he caused her took no affect on her or her family.

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    • Paddy Rodgers
      I do not know who you think you are coming on here assuming things about me.
      You have no clue .
      Michael Noonan has insulted and lied to the people of Ireland as has Kenny ,Rabbitte, Howlin , Veradkar et al. There is NOTHING honourable about Michael Noonan . Anyway you believe whatever you want to believe ‘Paddy Mark Rodgers’ I am sure Michael Collins would be spinning in his grave at your lack of loyalty to HIS beliefs and would be so ashamed of where the likes of Noonan , Kenny and the rest have brought this island. Don’t look now but we have been taken over fiscally . Deny that!

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    • Hey paddy….noonan is a liar, a despicable liar.

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    • Which Sinn Fein contributors are you speaking of Paddy? The commenters or Stephen Donnelly? Because Stephens Independent don’tcha know?

      Your bringing SFs past into the discussion is a massive red herring, as you could only be referring to the commenters and by bringing that up you are going way off course, as they would be supporters at most.. Not actual party representatives..

      Can’t seem to understand where you got your point from, you sound just like a guy we had here before called Mark Rodgers, his logic was just as zany..

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    • Shanti ,
      He does sound very like Mark Rodgers .

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    • Shanti ,
      He does sound very like Mark Rodgers .

      Kids , can’t turn my back !!! :) :)

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    • Ironic really, because I have had the “your contribution is worth less because you use a pseudonym” argument with both of them, and a Paddy Mark Rodgers too.. All of whom argued with the same sort of warped logic.. And funnily enough I pointed out to each of them that you can use an all out pseudonym as I have, or you can be extra sneaky and use a real sounding name..

      I wonder if they’re all the same person?

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    • Well
      I think Paddy Rodgers is Mark Rodgers , He has never corrected me when I have called him Mark . But do you know what , I do not care what he calls himself … I still can not agree with his logic as you say it is warped ….

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    • I don’t care what he calls himself either. That’s exactly the point I made to all three / him (delete as appropriate!) it’s the contribution that is there on the page that counts, not who said it or whether they use a pseudonym!!

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    • Eileen, you are obviously a Fianna Fail supporter or member. so let’s just have a neutral perspective here. 1st we had charley haughey, then Bertie, then Brian cowen, all part of the same group of people, what I wouldcall “un-convicted” white collar criminals. while under Bertie the country did have some success, his unexplained personal bank accounts over-shadowed this.
      you also state that the current crop, (Kenny and co.) are to blame for having the country where it is now. are you for real?????
      where have you been for the last few years?
      1. Fianna Fail signed the bank guarantee scheme.
      2. Fianna Fail were in power when the country went into recession
      3. Fianna Fail were in power when this state signed on with the Troika.
      These 3 issues are what have the country where it is today and Fianna Fail were at the helm for each and every one of these atrocities.
      Before you come on here making ridiculous and obviously biased comments, please go and do your homework and maybe then come back with a more thoughtful and intelligent comment that is un-biased. While I am not a fan of politicians in general, I do feel that the current crop are doing their best to clean up the legacy of the previous 2 governments. Is it Michael Noonans fault that a deal was struck with the Troika prior to Fine Gael getting power? I think not.

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    • ”Eileen, you are obviously a Fianna Fail supporter or member. so let’s just have a neutral perspective here.”
      Brian Doran
      I started to read your post , got to read the first sentence and did not read any more . Lol ! Lol !
      First of all Why is it obvious that I am a member of any political party ? or even a supporter of FF in particular ?
      I am neither but if that is what you want to accuse me of, go ahead . I will tell you that I have never supported FF, ever. I gave FG and Lab my first and second votes last year in the gen election , but I have become increasingly disillusioned by this administration by all of the lies they have told and have been caught out on . But as you do not know me and I certainly do not know you ,think what you like . I am tired of the lies and liars who are in government . I am tired of trying to make ends meet and of seeing young people in particular struggling to hold things together.

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    • I thought Mark Rogers was calling himself Mcbab since he was barred. I think this new fella is the serious chap used to call himself Neil and used to call any anti Government commentator a Shinner. it’s funny how they all sound the same. :-)

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  • We can’t believe any thing that’s pushed out now by ministers we are being lied to by our own by Europe or both.
    Either way it looks desperate times ahead and no mistake !!!

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  • They based their pre election on lies and deciept.
    They have lied since and continue to do so.
    No credibility in their own country and the laughing stock of europe.

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  • The simple fact is we now “owe” Euro 64 billion as a result of original decision taken by FF and subsequent decisions by FG/Lab . The “real” Government – the “Mandarins in the Civil Service on Euro 200k and unelected , unaccountable , invisible etc promote this policy because they look to gettiing some of the big jobs in Brussels and love the lifestyle of jetting off to various Cities around Europe with Ministers for the latest “crisis” summit. It would be a farce if it was not so serious.We need a new Government to take control and to confront the EU and Germany with the truth about what the bail out was really about – to avoid contagion to German/Banks who lent foolishly to Irish Banks.We can pull the Euro down and we are in the last chance saloon to do this and get the result we want by playing “hard-ball” and look the Germans in the eye and be prepared to go over the edge if necessary !

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  • Let Noonan proof this! He surely has documented evidence of this?!!
    If not, he should be criminally charged for aiding the embezzlement of billions!

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  • Oh,and lest we forget,Noonan is one of the Bondholders,so why would he burn his own money

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  • when you send a monkey to an Ape convention,they will always send it back with peanuts.

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  • Noonan is a liar full stop! I wouldnt believe him if he was set on fire we petrol and i had the fire extinguisher

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  • Pravda / RTE have just released a new communique, Angela has told Enda that We are special.

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  • They caught us out with their trickery and false information and glad handed us in the photo oops

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  • MrKnow 21/10/12 #

    Noonans days of a politician are coming to a speedy end.

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  • do any of ye ever get tired of reading the same ol shite?? irelands political system has been corrupt for decades,
    either support it and vote for the right wing gombeens, emigrate and have nothing to do with the place anymore or vote left wing give them a chance and see what happens

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  • But the Pat on the top of the head from Angela’s sidekick Sarky told us all we need to know.

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  • MrKnow 21/10/12 #

    I heard a French newspaper published a article with the heading ‘Europe’s pet poddle (Ireland) doesn’t get treat from there masters Germany’. If that article is true we really are the laughing stock of Europe.

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  • M Bowe 21/10/12 #

    Kenny says the possibility of the bank debt problem was “not discussed”at summit last wk. Noonan has not “discussed” the unsecured unguaranteed bonds with Draghi since he took over last nov. Can their incompetence run this deep or wwhat are they hiding???

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  • We are gone from Basket case to special case

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  • We are already repaying the bondholders with OUR WAGES x-(

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  • Troika: Ooooooh no we didn’t!
    Noonan: ooooooh yes they did!
    Pantomime season starting early this year

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  • its about anglo

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  • Tús Nua 22/10/12 #

    ungaurenteed debt was ungaurenteed for a reason and Noonan is apparently a clown

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  • Attention Irish politicians!!!!!! Please don’t tell us the truth anymore as you know we can’t handle it. We cast our votes based on a sliding scale of lying the best liers for years were FF and now we have Labour and FG who only got elected because they told less lies. It turns out they lied about that too.

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  • Yes Kerry: If Michael Noonan hadn’t taken the decision to pay back bondholders investors would be much less inclined to buy up new bond offerings. A year ago Ireland’s benchmark 10-year bond yield was at around 22% – far too high for any economy to sustain itself. Because the State paid its debt this has since fallen to below 6% – a sustainable level and hence the recent offerings.
    If the bondholders hadn’t been paid back in full we’d be looking at a second bailout because nobody else would be willing to lend to us.

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  • padraig 22/10/12 #

    David McWilliams advised default yet had counsel Brian Lenihan to save the banks. That is one reason I doubt people calling
    for default – possible hypocrisy or a failure to be practical minded. The Coalition now labours to save the banks. Hypocrites? All pols are. It matters not. Fulfilment might fail with the Euro but this FDI reliant state cannot lock itself out of international money markets or has to make its return swift. Therefore Noonan is doing okay.

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