Sign in. It’s quick, free and it’s up to you.
An account is an optional way to support the work we do. Find out more.
A MAN HAS died following a single vehicle fatal road traffic collision in Co Monaghan in the early hours of this morning.
The man, who was in his late 20s, was brought to Cavan General Hospital after the car he was driving hit a ditch at approximately 5.45am in Killacorn, Emyval, Co Monaghan. He was later pronounced dead.
Four other men were in the vehicle but only received minor injuries.
The road has been closed pending completion of an examination by Garda Forensic Collision Investigators.
Gardai wish to appeal for witnesses that may have been in the area at the time of the collision or to anyone that may be able to assist with the investigation to contact Emyvale Garda Station on 047 – 87222 , The Garda Confidential Line 1 800 666 111 or any Garda Station.
To embed this post, copy the code below on your site
Not totally responsible they had help from the bankers and developers. However they were meant to be running the country for the good of the Irish citizens. It is clear that they failed in that job and should never be allowed back into power.
the worldwide recession was going to happen anyway, but it wouldnt have been as bad here had we saved a few euro for a rainy day and stopped spening money left right and center…
Agreed. Many countries in Europe are doing reasonably well, we should have been one of them but thanks to the traitors and thieves of FF we have had the world’s greatest property bubble and bust. Last Year our banks were the worst performing in the world. We have had the greatest GDP drop of any recorded western country in peace time. FF under Jack Lynch set records for set records for the greatest growth of debt by any state in the OECD countries to date, though Brian Lenihan will probably break that record, upon reevaluation.
The editor of the Financial Times, described the last Govt. as the worst in Europe since WW2, that is some charge to make. Wall St. traders used to call Brian Lenihan the Minister for Fairies and Unicorns, due to his inability to tell the truth. It matters not a jot what this poll says, because the rest of the World views them as responsible for our mess, and reports that they have issues all state that Ireland’s woes are primarily as a result of the last Govt’s actions.
The funny thing is that FF did save for a rainy day in the National Pension fund, but they can be blamed (almost exclusively) for:
1. Not achieving any of its founding objectives.
2. Not stopping the Property Bubble.
3. Not regulating the banks.
4. Not introducing land reform.
5. Paying current spending with bubble revenue.
6. A long list of poor negotiations eg Woods’ deal with the CC, road overspends, benchmarking, Thornton Hall, Port Tunnel, P-Pars, e-voting etc.
7. Not introducing structural reform of the health and other public service or sheltered professions, when the funds were there.
8. Blowing the best chance this Nation has ever had of building a sustainable, modern and truly Republican state.
I can’t imagine that even the most diehard Fianna Fáiler could defend those.
Absolutely. They were in Govt & failed to do the right thing for our country. They ought to be stripped off all entitlements & given the standard state pensions & let them ***k off.
They are not to blame for everything. The summer weather may have been poor under any government.
Apart from that its the mother of all charge sheets.
eh where’s the “The opposition was as weak as the party in power and constantly called for more spending above the already excessive spending by FF”
Hear hear!
Very true.
The obvious group at fault in this whole thing is the Irish electorate themselves who voted in the FF/PDs for ten years. The Irish people gave the government the mandate to carry out the policies they brought in and it is not like we didnt see this all before – the exact same thing happen with Charlie Haughey. In 2007 FF got elected on the slogan “Trust me, I am a politican” – The old adage is true – “You get the government you deserve.”
It’s a bit unfair to blame all Irish people for this mess.
The following article goes someway to explain why we’re in this mess and how to get out (not intended to excuse fianna fail’s incompetence in anyway).
http://www.adamsmith.org/blog/tax-and-economy/mises-on-the-causes-of-the-crisis/
I do agree that not everybody voted for FF/PDs but I was using the term “Irish electorate” to refer to the majority of Irish people that did vote for them. Of course Ireland’s economy would have been damaged as a result of the global crises, but what a lot of people are failing to see is that Ireland’s economy would still have gone to the wall even if the global downturn did not happened. There were inherent weaknesses within the national economy, the obvious one being the housing bubble. The Irish economy would have gone bust just like the British one did in the 80′s and 90′s, and it went bust during periods of general prosperity in the global economy.
Never forget the PD’s role in formulation of policies of both FG & FF ???
Liam Lawlor, Ray Burke, Charles Haughey, Des Traynor, Denis Foley, Beverley Cooper Flynn, Bertie Ahern, Padraic Flynn, Ivor Callelly, Willie O’Dee…
Salt of the earth.
U forgot to mention Jim McDaid & Martin Cullen – 2 elusive slippery weasels who were up to their necks in dodgyness of all kinds but for the most part got away with it. And remember John ‘line my pockets’ O’ Donoghue !!!!
John O’Donoghue – if there’s a shiftier individual in the Northern Hemisphere I’d like to meet him
@ gavin – there is… jackie healy rae
Could you imagine if we were french. How long would Bertie Ahern’s prison sentence have been?
they would have dusted off the guillotine for that f*cking c*nt……..excuse my langusge but I DESPISE THE MAN.I wish he would read sites like this and realise how much he is (dis)regarded by the REAL people of this country.A curse on his head.
Couldnt agree more. He is the scum of the earth. Maybe he does read this site, i got one thumbs down…has to have been him….couldnt have been a “normal” person.
I can’t stand the man’s sheepish grin with his little teeth…lol!
Lest we forget…
A Sample Period Of Years Under Fianna Fail – And What They Have Been Up To!
In October 2007, former Fianna Fail Government Press Secretary Frank Dunlop told the Mahon Tribunal that property developer Owen O’Callaghan paid off a debt of £10,700 for Fianna Fail councillor Colm McGrath when he was facing a court judgment.
In October 2007, a book was published that included a claim that a serving Government Minister has admitted taking cocaine, and that he wasn’t the only one doing it. Taoiseach Bertie Ahern made no effort to investigate it.
In September 2007, Fianna Fail TD Michael Collins was found guilty in court of obtaining a tax clearance certificate under false pretences. He had previously made a €130,000 tax settlement arising from a bogus non-resident bank account.
In September 2007, jailed Fianna Fail councillor Michael ‘Stroke’ Fahey had missed six months of council meetings, and by law he should have been deemed to have resigned. He escaped this by asking the council to deem his absence to be ‘due to illness and attendance in Dublin’.
In September 2007, Taoiseach Bertie Ahern, while being questioned at the Mahon Tribunal, accepted that his earlier story that Celia Larkin had made a £30,000 sterling transaction on his behalf could not be correct, unless the bank records were inaccurate.
In September 2007, Taoiseach Bertie Ahern, while being questioned at the Mahon Tribunal, said that he must have given £30,000 to somebody else (to make a transaction that the bank had no record for), but he didn’t know who he gave the money to.
In August 2007, Bertie Ahern appointed as a Senator former Fianna Fail TD Ivor Callely, who had just lost his Dail seat in a general election, and who had resigned as a Junior Minister after a scandal in 2005.
In August 2007, Bertie Ahern appointed as a Senator former Fianna Fail TD John Ellis, who had just lost his Dail seat in a general election, and who had resigned as chair of an Oireachtas committee after a scandal in 1999.
In July 2007 the Standards in Public Office Commission said that Fianna Fail had failed to report a donation in the party’s statutory declarations for 2005.
In June 2007, Taoiseach Bertie Ahern made secret deals, using taxpayers money, with independent TDs to secure their support as Taoiseach. Two of these independent TDs, Beverly Flynn and Michael Lowry, had previously been forced to resign from their parties after scandals.
In June 2007, Fianna Fail changed the law to create three new Junior Ministers with salaries of €150,000 a year. They had previously done this in 1977 and 1980. When Fine Gael did the same in 1995, Fianna Fail called it an abuse of the taxpayer and an act of hypocrisy, and Bertie Ahern vowed to abolish the new posts.
In March 2007, Fianna Fail councillor Michael ‘Stroke’ Fahey was jailed for twelve months after being found guilty of defrauding his own council of €15,000 and falsely implicating an innocent contractor in the crime. The jailed councillor was also chairman of the Limerick Prison visiting committee.
In May 2007, stockbroker Padraic O’Connor said that Bertie Ahern was wrong to say that he had given Ahern £5,000 as a loan from a friend in 1993. O’Connor said he was not a friend of Ahern’s, that he had been asked for a political donation of £5,000, that he had given that on a company cheque, and that he had been given in return a false invoice for consultancy work that had not been done.
In February 2007, Taoiseach Bertie Ahern praised the Moriarty Tribunal for its ‘outstanding work in painstakingly stripping away the layers of secrecy and obscurity surrounding Mr Haughey’s financial affairs and exposing them to public scrutiny.’
(He was quick to reverse those words later when his own antics began to be exposed!)
In December 2006, the Moriarty Tribunal found that former Taoiseach Charles Haughey took payments of €11.56 million, or €45 million in today’s money, between 1979 and 1996, and granted favours in return.
In October 2006, it emerged that Taoiseach Bertie Ahern had bought his house from businessman Michael Wall, who had been at a dinner in Manchester at which Ahern was given £8,000 sterling. When asked why he had not previously said that Wall was at the dinner, Ahern replied that Wall had not eaten the dinner.
In September 2006, Taoiseach Bertie Ahern said that, when he was Minister for Finance, he had unexpectedly received a donation of £8,000 sterling from some millionaires who he had a meal with in Manchester on the night before a Manchester United football match.
In September 2006, Taoiseach Bertie Ahern accepted that he had appointed people who gave him money to State boards, but he insisted that he did not appoint them because they gave him money. He said he had appointed them because they were his friends.
In September 2006, Taoiseach Bertie Ahern said that he had accepted £39,000 from friends, including the brilliantly-named Paddy the Plasterer, in 1993 and 1994. He said it was loans, and that he had tried to pay them back but they had all refused.
In September 2006, when Taoiseach Bertie Ahern was first asked about allegations of receiving from €50,000 and €100,000 from businessmen, he told journalists that a lot of the report was correct but that ‘the figures are off the wall.’ This, of course, was true, because he got some of the money ‘off Michael Wall’.
In December 2005, Fianna Fail Junior Minister Ivor Callely resigned when it emerged that a top construction company had painted his house free of charge, while the company was also doing work for the Eastern Health Board of which Callely was chairperson.
In April 2005, former Fianna Fail Junior Minister for Transport, Jim McDaid, who had led an anti-drink-driving campaign, was arrested after drunkenly driving his car the wrong way up a busy dual carriageway.
In January 2005, former Fianna Fail Justice Minister Ray Burke was jailed for six months for making false tax declarations, breaking a law that he himself had helped to pass. He served four and a half months in Arbour Hill prison.
In May 2004, Fianna Fail expelled Mayo TD Beverly Flynn from the Party. Bertie Ahern said the integrity of the party depended on her expulsion, that Fianna Fail was at a crossroads, and that the party would also have to deal with any other members who transgressed ethics and standards in public life.
In September 2003, Fianna Fail TD Michael Collins resigned from the Parliamentary Party after making a €130,000 tax settlement arising from a bogus non-resident bank account.
In September 2003, Fianna Fail TD GV Wright knocked down a nurse while driving under the influence of alcohol. The nurse’s leg was broken in four places.
In December 2002, former Fianna Fail Government Press Secretary Frank Dunlop told the Flood Tribunal that former Fianna Fail TD Liam Lawlor (who he also knew as ‘Mr Big’) was the first person to tell him that money would have to be paid to councillors in return for their votes.
In November 2002, former Fianna Fail Government press Secretary Frank Dunlop named six Fianna Fail councilors who he bribed to secure the rezoning of land at Carrickmines in south Dublin.
In September 2002, the Flood Tribunal found that former Fianna Fail Justice Minister Ray Burke received corrupt payments, including £125,000 from property developers and £30,000 from the owners of Century Radio.
In September 2002, the Flood Tribunal found that former Fianna Fail Government Press Secretary PJ Mara had failed to co-operate with the Tribunal, by failing to provide details of an overseas account. In the 1980s, in a Hot Press interview, Mara said that his greatest ambition was ‘never to be found out’.
In May 2002, former Fianna Fail Government press Secretary Frank Dunlop said that he paid at least £160,000 to 25 councillors in relation to the redrafting of the Dublin County Council development plan from 1991 to 1993.
In February 2002, former Fianna Fail TD Liam Lawlor was jailed for a third time for contempt of court when he refused to comply with orders of the Flood Tribunal. When the Dail called for his resignation, he was brought to Leinster House in a prison van to speak against the motion. Lawlor had previously chaired the Dail Ethics Committee.
In January 2002, former Fianna Fail TD Liam Lawlor was jailed for a second time for contempt of court when he refused to comply with orders of the Flood Tribunal.
In December 2001, Fianna Fail TD Ned O’Keefe resigned as a Junior Minister. He had voted on a bill about feeding bonemeal to animals, forgetting to inform the Dail that his family was involved in manufacturing the substance.
In April 2001, Fianna Fail TD Beverly Flynn resigned from the Oireachtas Public Accounts Committee. She had lost a libel case that she had taken against RTE, who had correctly reported that she had sold banking products designed to assist tax evaders. After losing the case, she faced a €2million legal bill.
In January 2001, former Fianna Fail TD Liam Lawlor was jailed for contempt of court when he refused to comply with orders of the Flood Tribunal.
In June 2000, Fianna Fail TD Liam Lawlor resigned from the Parliamentary Party after he misled an internal party investigation about a donation that he had got. Lawlor was also chair of the Oireachtas Joint Ethics committee.
In May 2000, Fianna Fail Finance Minister Charlie McCreevy nominated Hugh O’Flaherty to a £147,000 job as Vice President of the European Investment Bank. O’Flaherty was a former High Court judge who had been forced to resign after a scandal the previous year.
In February 2000, Fianna Fail TD Denis Foley resigned from the Parliamentary Party. He had £100,000 in an illegal offshore account. He said that he knew that his account might have been an Ansbacher one, but he had been ‘hoping against hope’ that it was not.
In November 1999, Fianna Fail TD John Ellis resigned as chairperson of the Oireachtas Agriculture Committee. He owed money to farmers, he had £250,000 in debts written off by NIB, and Charles Haughey had given him £26,000 of taxpayers cash to settle other debts.
I think this is just funny so I left it included! – In January 1999, former Fianna Fail Minister Padraig Flynn appeared on the Late Late Show on RTE. Now a European Commissioner, Flynn complained about the difficulties of living on ‘just £100,000 a year’ when he had three houses, housekeepers and various cars to maintain. ‘You should try it,’ he added.
In June 1995, Celia Larkin lodged £11,743.34 into Fianna Fail leader Bertie Ahern’s bank account. Ahern says that £10,000 sterling of this was actually his own money, part of £50,000 that he had earlier withdrawn from his own account and used to buy £30,000 sterling. However, the bank has no record of selling £30,000 sterling to anybody during that period.
In December 1994, Celia Larkin lodged IR£28,772.90 into Fianna Fail leader Bertie Ahern’s bank account. Ahern says that this was £30,000 sterling cash given to him in a briefcase by his soon-to-be landlord, just after he had become Fianna Fail leader and was expected to become Taoiseach However, the amount equates exactly to $45,000 based on bank exchange rates on that date.
…And thats ONLY a sample – that we know of!
It’s also directly lifted from: http://www.druidschool.com/site/1030100/page/928971
You could have just posted that instead of trebling the size of the page with something that wasn’t your own work.
All fair points (well, not reading that entire thing, So I’m just taking that your point is in earnest for granted).
When a Party, any Party, is in power for effectively 20 yrs (with a 2 yr gap in the middle), a long list of mistakes & errors of judgement is bound to be easily compiled.
Wonder would you also go to the effort of compiling a list of Governmental successes…?
Would seem fair.
(Also signing your own name, rather than a pseudonym would be nice)
Actually Ryan – they copied a lot of it from me and my site at unitedpeople.ie – and if you bother to read it, they left stuff out!
Here is the link: http://www.unitedpeople.ie/fail.html
Paul, mendacity, gombeen politics and self-serving fraud are not mistakes.
An excellent post congrats
If you originated the epistle, then why do you give druidschool.com a credit on the link you just provided?
Not that I disagree with any of it, by the way.
Dear Paul Anthony Ward, your FF party just didn’t fall across and into corruption (massively repeatedly) just by ‘mistake’ as you spin it as.
They jumped in one after another willingly, again and again – mistake my backside!
…And for the record. I WAS a FF member for some time in my own country, I was the head of a local branch, and financial treasurer for a short period in my county.
I say SHORT period because the higher I rose in the org, my eyes awakened to the utter levels of misdeeds of members and corruption that was in the party – not to mention the utter backstabbing and behind closed door deals on the quiet!
I got out rapid, very rapid and will NEVER support FF as an org or anyone they put up for election. They are an utter disgrace and if they weren’t a political org – they might be classified in another country as more close to an organised criminal one!
I once had faith as FF low member – an on the ground worker, the very same that Mr Ahern is now backstabbing in his twisted version of history where he paints himself as near saint – but once I saw just how two faced things were and the REAL methods of operations were at higher levels, I was in total shock and disgust.
This country needs a decent, honest TOTALLY transparent party – and so far I have yet to see even one step up and be just even that!
…As for Fianna Fail, they are – or should be – history!
Dear Ryan Murphy, I am agreement with your sentiment 100% and anyone that help expose/remind others of just how bad FF got – also deserves credit.
We should not let the new generations forget – or lessons will not be learned!
In case there is confusion Ryan, I moved briefly to another LAN system where I do be signed into Journal.ie with a more personal name. Best wishes and keep up the good job of telling it as it is.
Some things are their fault, but not by any means the whole situation.
It’s not their fault, for example, that the Euro was disastrously set up, in a way that benefited France and Germany but put the other member states at a disadvantage. The European Central Bank has a lot more to answer for than it’s actually been taken to task for. It’s far too simplistic to say ‘it’s all Fianna Fáil’s fault’ – what people fail to see is that during the key years, the opposition parties were, in some cases, actually criticising the FF-led government for their stinginess!
Yeah, FF made some bad decisions, and some of these were disastrous – but they’re by no means wholly responsible. Ultimately, Europe has to shoulder some of the blame too.
While I agree with the statement that the Euro was flawed, is flawed and fatally so. I have to disagree that it is the cause of our woes, your statement is just typical FF West Brittery, blame the opposition, (the natives can’t be trusted etc).
It has to be the mark of a lunatic, to blame the opposition for FF’s actions. Did Enda drive Brian Cowen to meet Sean Fitzpatrick for a “chat” in Druids Glen. Were the opposition selling favours and appointments to Govt. boards, were they fixing contracts at inflated rates to friends and donors of the party. You might as well blame the Dáil porters as the opposition.
The problem is that until people like Tom have a bit of pride in being Irish, respect for the country and start believing that all people should be equal before the law, then we are going to have the FF problem rearing its head again. It may come under a different guise, probably most of them will move to FG, their more honest but still desperate brother.
Roll on the next bankruptcy – it is what FF excel at and FG are competent at.
Ah, Tony, I’ve been wondering for a while why you throw so much abuse at Fianna Fáil in every single post.
The phrase “FF West Brittery” has just given you away!
You’re a stooge for the Shinners! Make sense now!
How dare you question my national pride. I’m about as proud as any man of my country. Not only do you impose supposed west-brit motives upon my statement as a personal insult, but you fail to understand correctly the meaning of my statement.
The crucial word in my previous comment was ‘some’. Did I not say that ‘some things are their [FF's] fault’? Did I not also say that FF made disastrously bad decisions? Not only that, but my point about the opposition was a counter to the media-led impression of FG as the salvation of the country. They were pressing for situations that, had they been in charge rather than FF, would have left the country even worse off.
I suggest, sir, that you read a person’s comment next time you get the urge to question their national pride.
Sorry Paul, that comment was directed at Tony!
The general public were complicit to an extent. Too may of an educated general public allowed their own wages to get out of control and didn’t sufficiently question the value of their houses. Too many were gullible, wrapped up in their own little “Loreal” moment believing their salaries and houses were worth more than the European averages we were competing against. What really sickens me is that collectively we allowed ourselves to be duped by empty promises that enough people such as David McWilliams were warning us about. FF got it hideously wrong and I agree they should never be allowed back into power … but collectively we bought their crap and assumed it was gold in the bank.. We got it wrong too.
Who’s this “we”, paleface?
I know that not EVERYBODY made these mistakes, but too many of the Irish general public did make these mistakes. There are of course those young families that just fell in love, wanted to start a family, and who were forced into borrowing too much money for over-priced houses. But there was quite an amount of the Irish general public working in the banks accepting bonus payments based on the loans they issues. Too many of the Irish general public getting €2 for every block they laid to build those houses. Too many accepting advertising revenue that fueled the property boom. Too many people being greedy and assuming they were entitled to living standards that a few years previously would be seen as ludicrous and unsustainable. Fact was it remained ludicrous and unsustainable, but too many people closed their eyes and believed the fairytale anyway. Remember what Bertie said …… “If only someone had told me about what was really going on in the banks ….” Too many people from the very top down had their eyes closed. What I find annoying is that all this happened to us, an educated adult population …. because too many had their eyes closed. It also happened in other countries such as Iceland so we are not alone. But that doesn’t mean we are completely blameless. We voted in those people who allowed it to happen on our democratic watch … not to mention the huge amount of young adults at the time who traditionally didn’t vote. Thankfully that has changed now and many more people are voting.
16% of those polled say that the party is not to blame. Is it a coincidence that this is almost the same percentage vote-share FF achieved in the General Election?
It is pretty interesting alright.
Although, nobody’s saying the Party doesn’t have some fault, just that anyone else would’ve made the same decisions; everybody’s a visionary with perfect hindsight!
"anyone else would’ve made the same decisions"
Yeh that’s right Paul whatever helps you justify your unconditional support for Fianna Fail
@Darren. There is nothing as unconditional support for FF, the person giving them “support” always has something in mind for themselves.
P Ward just comes across as someone who there is absolutely NO talking to. Much like Charlie, or Bertie, or Meehall, or Harney etc etc. . .
May FF rise from the sewers and produce another catastrophe some time in the future. Just wait til the country gets sorted first. Cheers.
Now hang on there lads, ad hominem attacks much??
It’s a perfectly valid point to make that any Party would’ve made the same decisions.
This is evidenced by the fact that Lab & FG were playing the exact same auction politics in ’07 as FF.
Further evidenced by FG & Lab following FF policies, to the letter, when they got into power.
Now, if you wanna engage in that debate, engage in that debate; strangers telling me I’m like Harney from a 25 word post, a bit much like…!
@Tony, I’d prefer if a stranger didn’t question my personal integrity based on what Party I canvass for…
It’s so beyond cynical & pathetic that it wouldn’t be acceptable in any journalist circles (except maybe “An Poblacht”)
“nobody’s saying the Party doesn’t have SOME fault” – well, that’s generous.
“anyone else would’ve made the same decisions” – that’s a staggering rationale.
With apologias like this it’s crystal clear that you’ve been indoctrinated fully. Imagine all that education and a total inability to think one’s self. It’s depressing.
And if you want to rail against ad hominem attacks with any credibility you probably shouldn’t immediately follow up with an ad hominem attack.
Just a thought, Paul.
“It’s a perfectly valid point to make that any Party would’ve made the same decisions.
This is evidenced by the fact that Lab & FG were playing the exact same auction politics in ’07 as FF.
Further evidenced by FG & Lab following FF policies, to the letter, when they got into power.”
Bu!!sh!t.
Nice try. Don’t think there’ll be any biters on this nonsense.
Paul, you seem a reasonable guy, even if I fundamentally disagree with you on most matters political.
You should therefore realise that the history of the world according to Weebl and Bert didn’t start in 2007. They did most of their damage before that. I haven’t even mentioned DeV yet.
Hey Gavin, we should really stop meeting like this, people will begin to talk(!)
I attacked a point, not a person. So, not an ad hominem attack.
You can’t just call something bullshit & move on. It’s a perfectly valid point & you know it (hence why you didn’t engage with it!).
And indoctrinated? It’s funny. I was gonna say the same to you!
You seem completely incapable of changing the record or even engage in a debate on the issue.
And Ryan. That’s a long debate. One, ultimately, in which I obviously come down on the opposite side, so let’s leave it at that. Too much for one post!
Hi Paul.
Firstly, your Poblacht pop was an extension of you”stooge for the Shinners!” ad hominem. Saying that you were attacking a point is merely semantics and it was clear you were playing the man, not the ball.
Secondly, “anyone else would’ve made the same decisions” – why do we bother having elections if ultimately any will do make the same decision? Why did the Greeks bother at all coming up with the concept of democracy if it turns out it’s completely redundant? It’s frankly one of the stupidest things I’ve read. When a rationale is so overarchingly dumb and obviously a blind alley then it’s perfectly acceptable to disregard it entirely (Bu!!sh!t!), do you see?
Thirdly, yes “indoctrinated” – how else can you explain why you’re toeing the party line when anyone with an uncoloured viewpoint can see that FF have led this country to emasculation and loss of sovereignty (17 out of the last 20 years – who else’s fault can it be?).
Read into the “An Poblacht pop” what you will. I just think it’s a dreadful paper that’s an (open) Party fluff piece.
And I never called his personal integrity into account. Not once.
Secondly, what a ridiculous piece of sophistry that is! You brought in the Greeks & all!
Sure, why not ignore the question of what others would have done in a a question of REASONABLE culpability; the point is to examine how much Fianna Fáil knew. And considering no other Party was calling for regulation at the time (these are the Parties that are now governing btw!), how can they legitimately attack Fianna Fáil for decisions they made when they would’ve made the same themselves. Indeed, how can you?
Like every other “pub economist”, you’re a visionary with perfect hindsight.
Thirdly, yes “indoctrinated” – how else can you explain why you’re toeing the party line when anyone with an uncoloured viewpoint can see that FF have led this country to emasculation and loss of sovereignty (17 out of the last 20 years – who else’s fault can it be?).
Thirdly, I’m not sure I buy that “loss of Sovereignty” rhetorical bull… We’re proud members of Europe, why not accept their help?
And I find it betrays a bizzare arrogance & cynicism (if you’ll excuse me for saying so) that anyone who disagrees with your particular point of view must be “indoctrinated”; unbelievable really…
One day I’ll be as enlightened as you & attempt to mow down all opposing viewpoints by calling them indoctrinated rather than actually engage in a debate… One day…
Moreover, I agree that a Recession happened on Fianna Fáil’s watch, yes, but we got a drubbing at the election. THAT is how democracy works! Party does bad. People punish it at the election. New Govt moves in & people allow a new generation to move up in Fianna Fáil.
I mean, FFS, Bertie Ahern is gone. Brian Cowen is gone. Who the f*#k are you still mad at?!
It’s about time you realised that democracy has done its job. Fianna Fáil has 20 seats. Well done.
Move the f*#k on!
Who are we still mad at Paul?
Would you like a list, with citations?
So Fianna Fail’s support is running at approx 16% in this poll…?
Happened on their watch = their responsibility.
Not the question asked
that party stays dead.
come next election, we stamp on their testicles again. harder. they stay dead for a decade minimum, let labour grow, sinn féin get over twenty, and keep bertie’s bent morons in the low teens. Fianna Fáil stays dead.
never again.
The hiding of the bank debt the lies they fed people and the we know best attitude when being warned that this would happen. Arrogant attitude to what the people wanted/needed as well as the Cronyism all made our fall alot harder then it needed to be.Riddled with corruption and got the kicking they deserved in the election but over all they arent to blame for everything but for 95% of it.
Mr Stamper is correct in his appraisal. If we go back pre building boom our economy was moving nicely. Its almost amazing that so few can have such a ruinous affect on our country. Politicians Bankers and Developers gorging themselves on greed and gluttony. Many smelt a rat in the room but these people were also benefitting from the spin offs, general business etc, basically the country was awash with borrowed money, not a rainy day in sight.
One evening an old Cherokee told his grandson about a battle that goes on inside people.
He said, “My son, the battle is between two “wolves” inside us all.
One wolf is Evil. It is anger, envy, jealousy, sorrow, regret, greed, arrogance, self-pity, guilt, resentment, inferiority, lies, false pride, superiority,and ego. The other wolf is Good. It is joy, peace, love, hope, serenity, humility, kindness, benevolence, empathy, generosity, truth, compassion and faith.
The grandson thought about it for a minute and then asked his grandfather: “Which wolf wins?”
The old Cherokee simply replied, “The one you feed.”
It sems we fed the Bad Wolf!
Fine Fail didn’t get into power by themselves. They got big hefty votes every time.
The madness of the property boom was not confined solely to the upper echelons of NAMA developers.
In saying all that, they are largely to blame, through their magical and unique mix of corruption, greed and incompetence.
FFekin right they’re to blame! Couldnt organise a game of SCRABBLE! As for them trying to spin us dizzy with their bullshit -up to the week BIFFO the GOON sacked himself, they almost convinced their tiny brains that they could pull it off once again. No chance! The icing on the cake for me was Brian Lenihan’s speech “WE’VE TURNED THE CORNER” …FFsake! Europe and the IMF were pissin themselves laughing at our Government and rubbing themselves with joy at the prospect of what they could make out of us and here’s the FF Circus flying into town to negotiate a “Better deal for us” ..Their nothing but a joke, a shambles and an embarrassment to our good country! They should bow their heads in shame – the lot of em! Hopefully the only corner the FF circus clowns turn, is the one outta here!!!
FF RIP.
Fek Off FF with your thumbs down! We know what stool your ass sits upon!!! …smack of thy Herald coming to a head near you. . . . .
FF were in government and cannot avoid responsibility and therefore blame. When in government you have power and responsibility.
However, while politicians of all parties share blame, so does the electorate. Who voted for FF all those times? Who pushed FG to promise even more spending? Voters did. Until voters appreciate that government does not have a magic sock with an endless supply of gold in the toe, voters will keep voting for parties that promise more spending.
It’s still happening. We’re borrowing HUGE sums of money to spend on public sector pay and welfare that are way above international benchmarks. I’m neither anti public sector nor unfeeling to the unemployed, but the borrowing has to stop quickly and the reason it’s still going on is because the govt is afraid of the unpopularity they’ll achieve if they do the right thing for the state.
If FF are to blame for everything why then are all the major european economies and the US suffering the same plight as ireland on the economic front
@ Mark: errr… Which major Euro economies Mark?
Never gave FF a single vote so it’s not my fault : )
Finna Fail’s new slogan just announced… FINNA FAIL. “Fail by Name – Fail by Nature”
All during the Tiger Era, we had Ahern and co gloating about how great Ireland was, how strong it’s smart economy was, how we were the envy of other western nations and further afield.
In essence, Ahern claimed credit for the boom.
Now the the bust has truly landed (and has a long long way to go yet, due to FF incompetence re bank guarantees, IMF/ EU negotiations etc) the same FF party want to be only associated with the good times, I.E. claim credit but deflect criticism.
Well sorry Mr. Martin, we don’t buy that manure any more. You too are personally responsible, and you should take care to remember that many people in this nation will always view you and your party as economic traitors, incompetents and gombeens. Take your pick of the insults, they will all sit easily on your shoulders.
As a nation of proud people, it amazes me why we have not actually criminally prosecuted these fools for their failure to do the jobs they were paid to do.
Sure we voted FF in three times in a row! We were in cahoots with them. They just rubber stamped and shaped the policies that the public wanted. Now that the tide has turned they’re the worst guys in the world. Really demonstrates the political and economical naievity of Irish people in general.
The “bust” was going to happen suddenly with a bang. The problem that FF was that they were too busy handing on the sweets to everybody from the public up. They’ve never looked at developing other sectors of the economy outside of construction. It was all about the here and now, have a good time and we’ll worry about the future some other time and we loved it!
We have no culture of personal responsibility in this country and that includes who and what we vote for. When it all goes wrong we want somebody to blame and somebody else to bail us out and make it right.
Unfortunately Brian, a look at the list of candidates, especially for political parties, for all these elections means that on paper many of the better TDs got in (without the respect of hindsight).
One problem is that our candidates seem to be male, middle-aged, with the wife at home and no social awareness.
So when we have political, economic and social ineptitude consistantly over decades in Irish politics we need to look wider than FF.
Personal responsibility is an issue with some Irish people. However, the state as it is has taken personal responsibility from them aside from voting from a long list of mainly gombeen types.
Correct Brian, we as a people are very bad at accepting our own faults and failings, this situation is a mixture of blind greed and ignorance by everyone from the government down to Joe and Shiela public. FF admit it made some mistakes but Joe and Shiela like to blame someone else for their mistakes. It`s a shame that Joe and Shila public cant accept their collective responsibility.
I dont speak for the Irish people…. but many people believed what they were consistently told by banks, government and credit institutions.
In fairness did any of you predict the extent of the disastrous crash of 2008? Are you taking responsibility for what happenned or are you just preaching…somehow exempting yourselves and your children from this silly post colonial “stupid Irish” explanation?
Well neither did the people who were paid to do so. They in fact told people the opposite. Even people in States like the UK, USA (stupid English, stupid Americans) made mistakes like ours and they have the benefit of several centuries of boom and bust. It doesnt therefore seem to be a problem due to “Irish people in general”.
There are fundamental flaws in our system and in the way the world operates.
If we want change we need to get the right candidates to go for election. Candidates who will make the changes we need if we elect them. Our failings are in not doing whatever it takes in getting these candidates in place. A difficult task given the amount of lies propping up our society.
Our problems are solveable. If your attitude is that our problems are a “bit Irish”, then you my friend are one of the losers we can so much do without……
This is a very valid point. In my view FF are responsible for most of our current woes but everyone ignores the 40% of the electorate who approved their policies on two occasions (2002 and 2007)
We all knew what they were doing, eroding the tax base while spending money like it was going out of fashion, an absolutely crazy way to run an economy and yet a significant minority of the electorate thought this was okay. Where are these people now and do they accept their role in this crisis?
40% is not “we” – it’s “them”.
Turlough, point was, people who took part in hype scene were all adults and must take their share of responsibility for their actions too. My comment refers only to the domestic problems, and yes, some saw the problems coming for a while, the mistake was that the situation was not handled earlier .The whole 07 election thing was wrong, people wanted more of the good thing, both main parties were prepared to pay a big price for their support. That’s the problem with a runaway train, it`s very difficult to stop. The wider crisis caused by events State side compounded our difficulties which has infested many countries and is a separate issue.
Agree the system is very flawed, the calibre of candidates need to change and politicians need to be responsible for their decisions and actions. I believe this will happen.
Of course the problems in Ireland are solvable and we alone can solve them. The UK, US, Greek, Spanish, Middle East etc are for others to worry about.
Finally, yes, people who did not party during the madness have to pay for the excesses of others, and people in negative equity with their family home will suffer. but I hope the govt will do something to ease their difficulties.
@turlough The downturn was predictable. If without external forces, everybody knew that as a small economy that we could not exist solely on selling houses to each other. It was unsustainable in the long run. Everybody knew but nobody wanted to acknowledge it. If you want an example of mob mentality here it is.
Having said that with the right policies in place we should have been using the tax dollars better – building this so called knowledge economy so we have a diversified economic base. We could also have a better legacy of the boom than a good motorway network. Health service comes to mind.
The way financial markets operate worldwide and derrivatives means that the boom to bust cycle is assured. Our over reliance on the property and construction sector meant that we were very exposed and any “bust” would be amplified.
In regard to the candidates, I would like to see the type of candidate you describe but we don’t seem to be that different to other countries – male and middle aged. We also treat our TDs as messenger boys and glorified county councillors that will sort out pot holes, passports that we forgot to apply for and sorting out granny in hospital instead of concentrating on national issues.
@ Edward
Don’t mind ‘Joe and Sheila public’. Going by your constant FF apologism on here, I’d say you can find someone much closer to home to blame.
Fianna Fail and the PD’s as the Government can be likened to a Titanic situation of a shipwreck.
They were the Captain of the Ship of State (which was actually a little boat but they spent like it was a cruise ship) steering it on a true course but unfortunately the Captain and his Bridge crew were partying hard with just the 1st Class passengers who wanted him to steer in various directions for their own amusement.
Alas then a serious collision with reality ensued and the 1st class passengers flew off in their private helicopters and were saved (Mostly), of the 2nd class a few got on deck to be rescued but everybody in 3rd and steerage were prevented from getting to safety by the gates of Bureaucracy and the gatekeepers-the financial institutions.
They are now forever below decks bailing out the ship and the Captain and his Bridge crew have been paid off and moved on to greener pastures.The new Captain and his Bridge crew are more interested in saying to the rescue services that they are bailing out more water than expected and arent they great rather than trying to help the remaining passengers.
Good analogy but the PD’s were at one end ripping steel plates off the bottom of the boat and selling them to their friends, while FF were doing the same at the other end.
In the Titanic, the Irish passengers, the ordinary people of this country were locked in to their holds, so as not to get in the way of their betters. That is what FF and the PD’s have done to us. They go away with massive pensions, directorships and contracts from grateful “friends”.
As for FG, they say they don’t like the above but keep shouting out “don’t rock the boat, don’t rock the boat”. The same mantra that has made them the most ineffective 2nd party in Western democracy.
Governments lose elections, the opposition parties don’t win them.
I agree that better management could have been in place, but I seriously doubt that the current government would have acted substantially differently.
When all this fades into the distance, people will look back on the Tiger years as a time of huge corruption and huge achievement in the Irish economy, but also a time when no-one was watching the store, or chose not to.
Governance is the province of Government, and whoever was in Government carries the can.
Absolutely agree. The only reason fine Gael were elected is because they’re not fianna fail.
Well, to be fair Elizabeth, and I have no love for any mainstream parties at this stage of the game, there was a suspicion that the years in the wilderness had put manners on Fine Gael and Labour.
The rot in Fine Gael personified by Michael Lowry had been cut out, while his “great, good friend” John “I didn’t know Tom Hand asked Frank Dunlop for IR£250,000 for the Quarryvale zoning” Bruton was also gone.
In Labour, Pat “I took a bung but gave it back” Rabbite was no longer prominent and there were still one or two good people left with a tooth in their heads – the Two Baldies, Noonan and Quinn.
Mind you Joan “The Dole as a Lifestyle Choice” Burton is still there and she makes the previous blithering idiot Mary “Architects need to face the reality of the situation” Coughlan look well-informed, no mean feat.
On the basis that they couldn’t do any worse, and might do some good, and were certainly motivated enough to give it a go, the current incumbents “got a go” at government.
But this isn’t the same electorate Fianna Fáil presided over for three terms of Government in Ireland.
Its in pain, financially stressed, fearful, intolerant and alert – there is no easy ride waiting for Fine Gael or Labour, and they have a hard job to do.
People are willing to give them a go at governing, but they will expect to see changes, and reforms and trimming of excess both in the Oireachtas and the Civil Service, and a decimation of the wages some of the top earners are paid.
Should they fail to do this, the current government won’t last pissing time.
The Soldiers of Density tent at the Galway races.
Nuff said.
Not quite “nuff said”; the Galway Tent hasn’t been around in a few yrs now…
They tend to present a dispersed target these days, but rest assured, they are still there.
I reckon some (most) of your party colleagues look back on those days of envelopes and dig outs with a wistful eye, when they see FF’s balance sheet today.
No doubt there are some alright…
Still, I’ll say what I’ve been saying at every Fianna Fáil meeting I’ve been at since Feb; the Feb ’11 electoral wipeout has been good for the Party in the long run. Nobody who wants to make money out of politics will be joining Fianna Fáil for a LONG time, based solely on the fact that we’re likely to be out of power for a LONG time!!
In other words, if Fianna Fail ever gets back into power, the making money out of politics will restart through the usual means of payoffs and bribes…
I sincerely hope not. But people who are interested in power alone will always be around.
There should be a Bertie/ McCreevy option. They simply weren’t smart enough for the job.
They were not stupid, any more than Bush Jr. was.
All three main parties (FF, FG, Lab) had almost identical manifestos in 2002 and 2007. Since taking power in 2011 FG/Lab have continued exactly on with FF strategy. How can anybody not answer option C.
A. That’s like getting caught for comitting a crime and saying ‘Shur everyone else is at it…’
B. What other strategy would you suggest considering that the EU/IMF is in town? They call the shots now… As you well know, the current gov had SFA say over the strategy FF decided upon from 08′-11′. It’s now a case of put up and shut up, just get on with it….
@ James Lawless
Read the poll at the top of this page and argue with that.
The reasoning behind the sentiment of even the floating voter is thus –
Fianna Fáil were in power – a continuous thread of government for three terms
Despite all the other Eurozone Ministers asking for restraint, Six-Bedrooms McCreevy gave them all the finger.
After that, the Fianna Fáil’s party’s collective arrogance in power became the stuff of legend.
And was readily turned into a big stick to beat them with last time out.
Is Fianna Fail to blame for everything? The collapse of the world economy? The shooting of JR? The Roswell landings? Joe Sheridan’s Goal against Louth last year? Let’s all blame Fianna Fail for the bad summers we’ve been having! And the snow last Christmas! My water pipes froze over. I blame them for that too! I blame Fianna Fail for Daniel O’Donnell and Cliff Richards! I blame Fianna Fail for Brussel sprouts, Long Masses, Jedward, and Loose Chippings! What is the point of those Loose Chippings?….
Loose chippings are handy, they can sometimes fly up and remove that plank from your own eye, as you trudge your weary way to the South Monaghan FF cumann meeting.
As a direct relation to De Valera, yes FF misled the Irish People and let the civil Sewrvice get out of control.
Who cares if you are related to Dev. The man with whom the rot in political ethics started in this state.
They let the civil service get out of control, more FF lies and deflection. Are FF TD’s and Ministers such weak beings, such unthinking fools that they just roll over for every civil servant who put a plan in front of them. No of course not, they were paid well to put the plans they had to in place. Bought and sold the country once again.
Since when did an out of control civil service cause our economic collapse? I thought it was the bursting of the property bubble and the following bank guarantee and that sort of thing?
There is the qiestion of leadership. Mandela once said that sometimes leadership is telling the people when they are wrong. Think of, for example Churchill’s warnings against appeasement before WW2 even though it was a popular policy at the time. There was no leadership under FF and whether there will be under FG/LAB remains to be seen.
@SMcB It’s a limited poll with limited options so one can only reply within its parameters.
The 02-07 government was populist in that it gave the people what they wanted. That’s probably why it kept getting re-elected. A great many people in all walks of life benefited during the boom and very few cried stop, even fewer voted for anything different. The phrase “everyone partied” whilst derided, referred to the fact that almost everyone “got something” materially from the boom, at least at the time. The public sector got increased pay and perks, the private sector got lower taxes and greater incentives, those outside the workforce unemployed or retired got increases in welfare and pensions. The 2007 election was auction politics on steroids and the people voted for it in their masses, across the three main parties. The Labour party in particular sold its soul in its attempt to out-bid the big two with higher spending and lower taxes.
The FF government only began to behave responsibly after the bust hit. Cutbacks won’t make anyone popular but they reversed in two years the increases that had been allowed to accumulate over the ten previous. Whether it was the IMF or the markets proper nobody was going to finance a continued operation otherwise.
What did for FF in the main was the attitude problem and the profligacy of rogues within. If the house had been kept in better order party wise (the abuses stopped at source etc) the medicine would have been a lot easier to swallow for all concerned when it all hit the fan economically.
Good one Paul, mistakes and errors of judgement. Hilarious
How about a poll on the p*ss poor Opposition provided by FGombeens and Labour & others??
Each of their TDs was receiving cE200,000 per year including expenses. What did the taxpayer get for this money?
Did they consistently grill the Govt on bank regulation? Were they asking the right questions about Anglo? No they were more interested in Bertie and Celia’s carpets and curtains. Joe Higgins provided the usual slapstick which we all enjoy but is it good Opposition?
Surely if these people were not asking relevant questions in Opposition the same mistakes as FF if they were in Government at the time. Look at their spend spend policies at the ’07 election. They didn’t see the crash coming so why should believe they would have done any better if in Government than FF.
As someone who remembers the inept Spring/FitzGerald coalition of the ’80s it’s
What about our glorious media who got their collective knickers in a twist over Tribunal trivia and clamoured for more spending while the real problems were developing, barely noticed, hardly reported? Useless shower!
Opinions aside, this is probably the most “leading” question ever polled on this site. The question and answers alike.
Disappointing.
Actually “on mature reflection” I think that not only is this question fair, but it could be considered generous to the Party of Doom, to ask if anyone else could be apportioned the blame for this state of affairs.
For my part, I spend an occasional quiet moment contemplating what additional societal ills can reasonably be laid at the door of the Bert. It’s quite therapeutic.
The FForce is strong in this one.
Tony, I believe you are operating through rose colored glasses. Truth be told, FF lost the run of themselves, forgot what they were elected to do and got completely carried away with the cheap credit, , banking, development click….but Mean while the self righteous FG gang, moaned, groaned, paced, fought amongst themselves….when they should have been doing their job og opposition….not tit for tat opposition by nit picking individuals but solid informed and informative opposition. Had they been doing this they would now be better placed to move the country forward. But sadly they are as lost and dismayed as FF because they too were participants in the creating of the mess. Yes the global economic situ did not help, but both Gov & opposition had us well and truly in the stew anyway….
FG now planning more cuts….this will choke the economy further depleting possible spend, signing the death warrant of struggling businesses….
Time for some forward thinking, trust in the Irish citizens and fresh governance, and an Ireland first approach….
This is a real when did you stop beating your wife type survey, I ticked the all would have done same box as it was best fit of four but genuinely don’t think this was the right answer either! There are several options missing and both the article and especially the poll itself greatly over simplify something which requires much deeper analysis.
It is customary for Fianna Failers to denigrate the messenger when they don’t like the message.
And to drain the blood of innocent children to sacrifice at the alter of Satan…
The only analysis required is a proper Garda investigation
You said it Ryan. If all else fails and they cannot return comment with retorting honest facts to refuse what is widely know and on records – its then a known cheap methods to make even cheaper and stupid jokes – as if trying to make light of such matters, as “…a sure, it nothing…”.
Typical FF attitude!
Ken, the failure to regulate the banking industry is largely what has us in the mess we’re in at the minute. Fianna Fail were ultimately responsible for insuring that this didnt happened. Clearly they failed spectacularly on this front. Banks by their nature are vehicles for profit. The regulator didn’t regulate as they should have. When Banks have the blessing of the people who are ‘supposed’ to keep them in check what do you expect?
@ Ken Curtain
Charlie McCreevy told the combined EU to feck off when they tried to warn us.
The rest of the government displayed astonishing arrogance and disdain in every sphere.
This kind if ignorance was systemic in a government that squandered our wealth and destroyed us.
Please don’t insult the intelligence of everyone by claiming there are subtleties they have missed when voting.
Lets roll this chap out again, bang on the money: http://youtu.be/Pu3IT1kGavE
I suggest we all post this piece .
Fianna Fâil were certainly responsible. We can’t change that fact. But let us not forget the ECB whose remit was and is to sustain stability of the eurozone and control inflation thru interest rate – see its website!. The ECB poured the petrol of cheap money on the fire of a cyclical unsustainable and inflating economy. This goes completely against it own purpose and mission!! I mean what did they expect to happen? Me suspects that there would little difference as to the outcome no matter which parties had been in government.
(nods)
This is the unpalatable fact the electorate has to face.
We have people in the Dáil running the state who can only turn taps on an off.
This is true whether they are in mainstream parties, recent paramilitaries, or independents.
If we had people of integrity who had to undergo examinations in political and economic theory based on empirical studies before being allowed on the ballot paper we might have a chance.
United people is right, the only unity in Ireland is a collective denial from a Joe and Mary public who partied, invested, holidayed, etc and wasted the money through blind greed and ignorance. FF accept and admit mistakes were made by them, absolutely, but for Joe and Mary public their greed has shattered their dreams but the ignorance lives on. I sincerely hope the current government will make inroads into the difficulties, so far, every meaningful saving has been made from existing FF policy, I hope they develope a mind of their own and come up with other useful policies. As for Fianna Fail, the bad news, you will have to live with them, the party will be there, lessons learned, wiser with that new vision the country needs badly.
Edward, As you are casting a large stone, Im assuming that you and yours are exempt from this tirade against the Irish public?
Remember, Edward that although there was a rather large middle class in Ireland, they were a minority and not all of them partied. What happened in your circles was not replicated in other parts of our society. It is ignorance on your part to think otherwise.
So 118 Joe and Marys owe all the debts incurred since 2008.
Turlough, point was, people who took part in hype scene were all adults and must take their share of responsibility for their actions too. My comment refers only to the domestic problems, and yes, some saw the problems coming for a while, the mistake was that the situation was not handled earlier .The whole 07 election thing was wrong, people wanted more of the good thing, both main parties were prepared to pay a big price for their support. That’s the problem with a runaway train, it`s very difficult to stop. The wider crisis caused by events State side compounded our difficulties which has infested many countries and is a separate issue.
Agree the system is very flawed, the calibre of candidates need to change and politicians need to be responsible for their decisions and actions. I believe this will happen.
Of course the problems in Ireland are solvable and we alone can solve them. The UK, US, Greek, Spanish, Middle East etc are for others to worry about.
Finally, yes, people who did not party during the madness have to pay for the excesses of others, and people in negative equity with their family home will suffer. but I hope the govt will do something to ease their difficulties.
No irish person is insulated from the difficulties in our country.
Although I never voted FF, I did buy a €200 coffee machine, so it was me. Sorry everyone.
Turlough, Your last point first, if what happened in my circles was replicated in other parts of society the country would be in fine fettle now to weather the current international crisis, with no property bubble.
Your first point, my children, my grandchildren, my family, my friends and myself are not exempt from the difficulties in Ireland. We all suffer because of the antics of others.
Your suggestion of my ignorance and your assumptions aside, I believe heaping all the blame on FF is not right, whatever party was in power would face the same problems and I would still believe there was a considerable number of very irresponsible people that drove the economy to where it is today.
A FF-voting auctioneer blaming the ‘antics of others’ for his problems.
What’s wrong with this picture?
The fact that people cannot see the error of their ways.
Certain individuals would love to see people queuing up again, just to get the 1.5% commission in the door.
The neighbours just traded up to a new X5, you understand.
But yes, we all partied…
Fianna Fáil must face part of the blame, but so too must the opposition. Not to mention the public sector unions, who to this day hold the power to shut down the government. Then you have the media, who acted as cheerleaders for the boom, made most of their money from property advertising (including the Irish Times – our only half-decent newspaper). Europe has to take some of the blame, but I think that it has to be pointed out, that even if the Eurozone economy was booming right this minute, a strong “correction” was coming for us. Oh and those banksters, whom I may point out, are not technically Fianna Fáil.
There’s truth in your post Fiachra, but a smattering of over simplification as well.
You’ll forgive me for not going into more detail, but ’tis late:)
to but 100% blame on Fianna Fail is a dangerous game to play. yes they have much responsibility in their policies, but chances are most of the other parties would have down pretty similar things at the time. Like Greece, portugal and the rest of the world…it was the greed of the banks that brought us down….the innevitible outcome when Cowboy Capitalism is let run wild without anyone with real power or even the inclination to hold them back.
And since then, those dreaded Ratings Agencies…Moodies et al who have had the world economy in the palm of their hands and any of their whims to downgrade a countries status can really have a massive effect on its populous. These agencies have way way too much power these days and must be reigned in!
It’s like the people were a spoilt child and the government an indulgent parent and kept giving them what they wanted. And the child kept screaming more and more and cheering when it got it. And when the parent couldn’t meet the demand any more the child threw a strop. Only they weren’t children, they were adults.
We need term limits ……..
Term limits as in at the end of each week we all call in as they face the public vote.
For anyone that doesn’t think FF were wholly responsible, just remember that board positions, regulatory roles, council seats, mayoral duties, all get dished out by the ruling party. From there, the proverbial shite just rolls down hill.
We need prison terms.
Bertie and Biffo…LOL!
have your say