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RECENTLY ASYLUM SEEKERS in Millstreet Accommodation Centre, Cork and Hanratty’s Accommodation Centre, Limerick, protested against their living conditions. The general reaction to this tends to be one of surprise on the part of most Irish people – why are asylum seekers protesting? Don’t they get free accommodation, food, and a weekly cash allowance?
I suppose this is fine if your ambition is a subsistence existence where you raise a family in cramped one room accommodation and have no possibility for work or societal integration. These protests are not a manifestation of greedy migrants looking for more entitlements from the state, but the symptom of a deeply flawed and failing immigration system.
Too often the debate about immigration, integration or racism descends into a collection of well-trodden myths that obscure the need for a complex response to an evolving international challenge. This on its own is indicative of poor public and government appetite for the topic of immigration reform in Ireland. This vacuum has been filled by a somewhat alarming trend of what appears to be growing public support for the “send them all back to where they came from” position.
The current debate is unhelpful and prevents a substantive discussion about how we deal with specific areas, such as the asylum process and, more broadly, the inability of successive governments to address immigration; an issue that will not simply “go back to where it came from”.
While the belief that you can close Ireland’s borders seems like a simple solution, the truth is that is simply not possible. The Irish State does not exist in a vacuum and the challenge of immigration is a global phenomenon, not a national one. International immigration into Ireland is a result of global movement of people and our commitment to the International Declaration on Human Rights and obligations under the European Economic Area means that we have as much an ability to close our borders to immigration as we do to covering Ireland with a weatherproof shield.
The protests in Cork and Limerick draw attention to an area that is illustrative of the wider debate on immigration, and are wrapped up in the misconceptions around those seeking asylum and the operation of the direct provision system. At the core of these misconceptions is the notion that the asylum system is abused by those who are seeking to benefit from a State which has opened its doors to floods of migrants. In this instance asylum applicants are equated with the bogus migrant: someone who has left their country and arrived in Ireland purely for economic gain.
Contrary to populist discourse on the subject, asylum seekers are not driven by economic pull factors but more severe push factors. This is borne out in the lengthy application procedure that an applicant must endure which requires them to demonstrate the push factors which drove them to leave such as political oppression, human rights abuse, violent conflict and state failure.
It is hard to understand how the long slow application process that is involved in seeking asylum would act as a pull factor for a migrant seeking economic gain. At Doras Luimní we bear witness to the fact that asylum application cases can run anywhere from eight months up to eight years or longer. The current system requires the completion of an application where the applicant must prove they were persecuted on grounds of race, religion, nationality, membership of a social group or political opinion.
Only after this procedure ends must applicants raise their fear of returning home where they may be tortured or killed as part of making a case for leave to remain, and in so doing, start a whole new application procedure. This structure, where only one application can be made at a time, leads to further delays in the system. There is no getting around the fact that this is an inefficient system which costs the state and taxpayer and keeps asylum applicants in an administrative limbo.
Asylum and direct provision are not the only examples of the problems associated with immigration, but they are one of the areas where the lack of good procedures are most evident. We are currently working with outmoded tools to deal with evolving issues of immigration. The legislation which structures our immigration policy is poorly designed to deal with our current immigration needs, and this does not just apply to the needs of asylum seekers, but is also evident in broader issues of work permits, citizenship and social integration.
The current system is slow, costly, and detrimental to both immigrants and the Irish public, but what will drive the legislative change needed to fix this? The Immigration Residence and Protection Bill has been on the agenda several times, with versions of the Bill in 2008 and 2010, and the current government stating that they planned to publish a revised Bill in 2012, and yet we are still waiting.
The protests in Cork and Limerick accommodation centres highlight serious challenges in the asylum system which are largely misunderstood, and result in a lack of public support to drive reform. Many outside of the asylum system are unaware of the long stays, inefficiencies and lack of social integration which are inherent in an outmoded system. The Immigration Residence Protection Bill could be a crucial piece of legislation with the potential to change the way we manage asylum and more broadly immigration.
In the end it is not a panacea, but it is a good start to fixing a flawed system – if we could only see it on the agenda.
Dr Matt Canon is the integration policy officer with Doras Luimní, an independent, non-profit, non-governmental organisation working to support and promote the rights of all migrants living in Limerick and the wider Mid-West region. He is also a lecturer at the University of Limerick.
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The problem is that the Irish government regard asylum seekers as, here’s the bit that some people find challenging, people looking for asylum i.e. looking for a place of safety from the unpleasant regimens in their own country. I think the great majority of Irish people are sympathetic with this, but ‘place of safety’ may not translate to much quality of life.
On the other hand, If people are coming here looking for work, social welfare etc then they surely are not asylum seekers, but economic migrants. That’s fine, we also have mechanisms for people who want to come to Ireland to find work. But if you are unskilled and can’t speak any English (or Irish) then finding work is going to be difficult in a country with 14% unemployment. The only way you are going to do it is by undercutting Irish people. To a free market economist that sounds great but you’re not going to make a lot of friends amongst working class Irish people.
In fairness, there are not many people who could make friends with the working class Irish, even at the best of times.
I just want to point out that in order for asylum seekers to get social welfare benefits, they must be legally registered here and have been working in the country for two years. This is what they are entitled to. But only if they can get asylum and work for over two years. They are not allowed to work unless they get asylum. Otherwise they get 14 euros a week to live on from our government which is not very much.
A lot of these people are coming from war torn countries or may have other reasons like escaping because they are gay and are running for their lives. We should not lock these people into a system where they are rendered useless for months or years. They are human beings and they should demand to be treated better. No matter where they come from.
I believe in education for all. If they do not have a proper education they should be given the chance to get one.
This is just my personal opinion.
…because they are “entitled” to….what about the ordinary tax paying citizen on this country….are they “entitled” to anything?
Yes tax paying citizens they are entitled to benefits. If they are legal citizens of the country, have a PPS no and have been been working for two years and then they can claim social welfare benefits if needed. The same rules apply.
“they must be legally registered here and have been working in the country for two years”
thats a load of b0ll0x
My neighbours …(nice people) , are in their house 3 years , never works a day in their life since coming here , and they opening say that to anyone who asks . the father even told me if I was on the dole I could get social welfare money for pet food …about €12 a month
Sean, can your 16 year old claim the dole from having never worked a day in their life? No they can’t. Something tells me you’re neighbours story is not the full story.
Subliminal you are forgetting about childrens allowance and single parents benefit.
Also jobseekers benefit is available to those who have never worked a day in their life.
Let’s clarify a few things here, asylum seekers in Ireland do not get only 14 euro’s to ‘live on’ all of their living expenses are paid for by the state, meaning the tax payer, this includes housing, food, medical costs, travel and any other necessity.
They get 14 euro on top of this.
I work 45 hours per week and have worked all my adult life and I am just about managing to pay for housing, food, medical costs, travel expenses etc. And my family before me have contributed to Irish society for centuries.
Also, as has been previously stated there is no such thing as a genuine African asylum seeker in Ireland. International asylum law states that an asylum seeker must claim asylum in the first safe country they arrive in after leaving their home country, since there are no direct flights from Africa to Ireland, it is a logical conclusion that Ireland has been specifically targeted as a destination, most likely because of our generous welfare system.
Another point worth noting, persons who are granted asylum in Ireland who subsequently start working here do not have to pay tax for the first 2 years of their employment.
I’m all for giving people refuge who deserve it but you’d have to be an idiot to believe someone could board a plane from Africa to Europe without a visa, yet when they arrive across the border into the Irish Republic they don’t have any documents, the reason being they burn their documents so they can not be deported.
I think the fact that these ‘asylum’ seekers are protesting lends weight to the belief that they are not genuine asylum seekers but instead they are economic migrants abusing the asylum process in order to gain residency in Ireland.
If I were a genuine asylum seeker looking for refuge because my life was in danger I would be more than happy living in a safe country with free housing, food, medical and travel costs as well as getting an extra 14 euro on top of this. Actually I’d be happy if I could even get that now as an Irish citizen.
You’re missing my point subliminal…ordinary taxpayers receive very little in terms of benefits from the state…yet you believe asylum seekers should be entitled to free education et al…you expect taxpayers to fund this……why…because they are “entitled”?
Not true subliminal, there are two types of payment for people who are unemployed, job seekers benefit and job seekers assistance. In order to qualify for job seekers benefit you must have worked up enough stamps i.e paid tax. You do not need to have worked to claim job seekers assistance.
Also the local welfare officers can make payments to people who are not receiving social welfare payments.
Although I’m sure none of the above applies to asylum seekers as they already have all their living expenses and personal costs paid for by the tax payer, they get 14 euro per week in addition to this.
you can claim a host of stuff without ever having to work a day in your life in this country ,
you can get the “free dole” , which is means tested ,
why do you think that during the an economic boom (as false as it was) , there was still 140,000 people unemployed , 30,000 had been unemployed for more than 20 years ….yet have a house and an could go on hols etc
Subliminal…you sound like a do gooder who believes there is no such thing as social welfare fraud in this country , be it from irish or non-nationals ,
wise up will you .
nearly every person on this island , knows someone who is on the scam ,
The whole system is to blame for this , its way to lax
by the way subliminal , an 18 year whom never worked a day in their life can claim the dole as soon as their leaving cert is over providing they are not going onto further education
Well said Joe
Unfortunately Subliminal, you’re wrong. Asylum seekers have no right to work at all while they await their decision and their welfare payment, the standard 188 euro, is subject to deductions for their accommodation. They receive in reality €19.10 per week from the state.
You’re talking about an immigration permission with the right to work attached, a Stamp 3 or 4 more than likely, which isn’t asylum seeking.
WanderArch, you are so right. The thumbs downers as usual are denial.
exactly, “undercutting Irish people” thats been going on for the past 5-6 years and has peaked. Interviewer: So whats your salary expectations?” met with the undercutting reply “I will work for… (inserts -5 to -10k figure).
Later while out with their buddies, the insults fly “ah the Irish are so lazy, they don’t want to work” – reality is: An incentive to work for 3 times your weekly salary back home (savings for their homeland!!!) is ALWAYS an incentive to work hard when in Ireland while undercutting the Irish who can only save with AIB and the likes :/.
i’m sure they all work very hard for €4-600 per month when back home.
exactly, all they have to do is get past the Habitual Residence test. not so hard from what we’re all seeing. All it takes is one Queen bee to land, the rest follows.
That is bullsh1t (the pet food) he is spoofing
If they don’t like it, don’t stay here.
Somebody didn’t read the article.
The question that needs to be asked is how many other countries do they pass through to get here….why choose here?
“why choose here?”
It’s the reputation the Irish have for being warm and welcoming.
Tongue firmly in cheek ;)
The only asylum seekers that I have seen first hand have 3 kids,
a brand-new 4-5 bedroom house
a nice car and a nice comfortable lifestyle
all supported by the state.
I believe that they even asked for some extra specific furnishings and fittings to be included in the house before they were willing to move in.
2-3 of the parents siblings have been subject to the same “terrible” conditions in other locations in Ireland.
The country that they came from is 8000-10000 miles away with no direct flights.
They have been here for many years and still have not made any effort to speak English.
They do not have jobs.
They have hit the jackpot here.
“applicants (must) raise their fear of returning home where they may be tortured or killed as part of making a case for leave to remain”
How many failed asylum seekers who were returned to their homeland were tortured or killed?
What about asylum seekers who claim to come from one country but when their asylum application fails and they are being returned ‘home’ they then own up to coming from a different country.
It is those that abuse the system that make it harder for true asylum seekers.
All asylum seekers from Africa have came to this country via another European state first witch means that they have broken our laws and European laws on seeking asylum as you must seek it in the first country you come to and ther is no direct route to Ireland from Africa so we shouldnt have any here full stop
I agree, most of these asylum seekers have clearly got their homework done and its no accident they landed on our shores….and with 300000 Irish people emigrating it just doesn’t make sense to have them here
This is very true …
One way to protect immigrants here is to properly police our own borders, especially within the EU.
Having said that Ireland is a much better place for our recent immigration … Ideally I’d love to see properly policed borders along with an elective intake of immigrants.
It’s a law about which country bears responsibility and there are numerous valid exceptions. In fact, it specifically argues that the asylum seeker should not be disadvantaged because they applied in the wrong place.
If the asylum seeker had actually “done their homework”, they would have gone to Sweden, which accepts a FAR higher percentage of asylum seekers who apply for refuge.
This is just ignorance combined with the unsupported idea that the Irish treat asylum seekers better than anyone else in Europe – which isn’t true.
how can a Nigerian family get on the RAS scheme that requires them to be 18 months on Rent Supplement i.e also receiving SW, does anyone know? They seem to have it all worked out. Not saying they are or were Asylum seekers but they’re also Non EU. Theres 40 houses going to SW in my old area and i’m hearing most of them are going to Foreign families, but there will be out cry when many Irish families from that area are on the housing list for years. It doesn’t seem right, i dunno.
Grant them asylum. Don’t offer them housing or any social welfare for 5 years. If they break the- send them home. Easy
So you want them all living on the street? Great solution
You can’t grant asylum with such a clause.
If you grant asylum you acknowledge that they require asylum. If that’s the case, nobody should be threatened with being sent back to what they are seeking asylum from.
A holding centre is better, otherwise we would have camps along the M50 again! There are some committing crimes here, that’s hardly respect for a country who granted them access. Those who break laws here should serve their prison sentence then be deported immediately upon release.
Matt Canon is blind to some obvious facts. Ireland has no direct flights with most African countries. So most asylum seekers have to pass through another EU country where they could have claimed asylum had they decided to. But no they chose to come to ireland… why? Our generous welfare system.. thats why.
Regarding the push factors that force the folks here in the first place.. I am fairly sure most.. no. all the asylum seekers will totally exaggerate the cruel and harsh regime they are fleeing from.. and why wouldn’t they.. I wonder how many seekers say ” oh the only reason I’m here is to get as much welfare as I possibly can”
See how the amount of Africans coming here declined when we closed off the loophole that allowed anybody born here and their parents automatic citizenship? Sure some asylum seekers will turn out to be decent hardworking citizens if given the chance..but haven’t we got enough decent hardworking citizens of our own without importing them from elsewhere?
“See how the amount of Africans coming here declined when we closed off the loophole that allowed anybody born here and their parents automatic citizenship?”
Oh i did see it. Its like wildfire this news, its spreads from here to there very fast.
The Ash cloud was also deemed a farce, really lol. so that was not one of the reasons to employ SW inspectors at the border AND require all new signees to collect their dole at post office every week, in person and NOT into their Bank A/c. course it was, it was all part of it. The Ash cloud was plain to see if you could see through it. They’re very slow in the Dail to cop on. You’d need eyes on the back of your head, in 20 years time Ireland will have 10,000 eyes on the back of its head trying to lock up all these little loopholes.
It’s incredible we cannot afford our own , why should we support non nationals . Self employed do not get assistance from the state au why should these people.
Sorry Jane, self employed can get support provided they live alone, not own a larger than 2 bed property or have (I think) more than 5k in savings. Then they can have maximum €18pw. If renting for less than 120 rent assistance after they have paid 30 themself.
There you go meanwhile the employees they had to fire when the business and dreams went down, get full dole and benefits, can work legally for a few hours pw increasing income and can look forward to pension at contributory rates.
So we’re actually well looked after, at least in Dublin – capuchin fathers – food packs Wednesdays, breakfast etc other days.
This is a very badly written article that forgets one crucial point.
The only asylum seekers we can legally have in Ireland are those whose home country has a direct flight to Ireland. Anyone from any other country is in breach of asylum laws and should be sent packing back to their home country.
The ONLY reason they are here is to abuse our welfare system. Look at the amount of money transferred from Ireland back to Nigeria last year and tell me that is not abuse.
Note, I have nothing against Nigerians as long as they come here to work and integrate into our society. If you come here to claim social welfare and to impose your beliefs and culture in Ireland then I have a big problem.
That’s just not true – have you read the Dublin II regulation? It determines which country you should be processed in and “the country you arrived in first” is far from the top priority. The deliberate misunderstanding of immigration law seems to be used by Irish people in order to not feel guilty about sending gay people back to countries where they’d face the death penalty.
Nick the Dublin II regulation states that an asylum seeker should apply for asylum in the first EU state they enter. This is very rarely Ireland.
No, it doesn’t. It says that the asylum seeker should apply, in order of priority, somewhere that they have family, somewhere that they had a visa for and (if neither of those apply), the first country they entered. It also states that an application to the wrong state should result in a transfer to another state, not total rejection.
It’s disappointing that so many people choose to condemn asylum seekers without bothering to READ Dublin II.
Nick the first country they enter us very rarely Ireland – that’s my point.
Also the 5 month clause is effectively useless given the delay in processing applications in Ireland.
The family rule is also open to abuse as there is little basis for rejecting it and it does not specify immediate family or distant relations.
But that’s the rule – so if they pass through other countries and come to Ireland because they have family there, they are actually following the rules. So why are you arguing that they should be deported and sent home (where they could possibly be at risk of serious persecution) when they’re simply obeying the Dublin Convention?
Similarly if they had a visa for Ireland and passed through other countries, they’re obeying the law. So by claiming “the only asylum seekers we can legally have in Ireland are those whose home country has a direct flight to Ireland” – you are mistaken.
Nick I understand it is a regulation but it is one open to abuse. For example I can claim falsely that you are my sister for the purpise of asylum and by the time thus us fully investigated I will have been here for 5 months at which stage my application must be taken regardless.
I fully understand the laws but I do not agree with them as ultimately they are abused and our welfare system is taken for granted at the expense of Irish people.
But by claiming that all “the only asylum seekers we can legally have in Ireland are those whose home country has a direct flight to Ireland”, you are spreading erroneous information. There are asylum seekers who are in Ireland correctly, even if their country of origin doesn’t have a direct flight to Ireland.
While you may disagree with the asylum system, the person to blame is not asylum seekers who are following the existing laws or to generalise that none of them should be in Ireland. It’s just not true.
A fair point Nick.
Our system badly needs to change to allow genuine cases be processed quickly. We also need to look at ways of reducing the abuse of our welfare system by those falsely claiming asylum.
Thanks Nick – I always enjoy our chats :)
To be honest, I totally agree with you that the situation needs to be better so that there’s a speedy resolution. Of asylum seekers, some are genuine refugees, some are fleeing turmoil and oppression but simply don’t meet the narrow definition of refugee and some are economic migrants. It doesn’t benefit any of them, nor the Irish people, for them to be waiting for years for an application to be heard.
It just seems that sometimes asylum seekers are scapegoated for bad laws which they certainly didn’t create.
It’s the folks who didn’t have the means to get out of their respective tyrannies, that I feel sorry for ! Stuck in such terrible dictatorships, should we not b feeling for those poor maligned ? …. and not those who are now SAFE here ? ?
Lets flood Ireland with this lot,and the lets get Irish women abortion on demand. True liberal madness…
That was a excellent debate between Nick and Alan. Fair play to ye both for arguing intelligently with each other and actually listening to each others points. Pity this attitude is non-existent in government.
Thanks, I really appreciate that. Nick is one of the more intelligent contributors to Journal and I always value her input even if her opinion may at times differ to mine.
She provides informed, researched opinion and I like to think I do the same. We learn from each other.
people seem to forget that’s it’s the government’s job to protect it’s citizen’s , which mean’s policing our boarder’s and not just allowing anyone stroll in ..this is not racist it’s common sense and a country’s duty , America ,australia and various countries do it and view it as their obligation to there citizen’s , we dont want situation’s like that soldier in England ect…I dont understand why everybody would’nt want their children to live safely…and calling people racist for wanting this is ridiculous . I dont care what colour ,religion and race you are if you are willing to work for the good of the Irish people and Ireland as a country if you are willing to integrate and adapt and respect the law’s and citizen’s of another country ,then there should’nt be a problem going through the right chanel’s…just dont sneak here and once here treat people like crap !!
Surely those seeking asylum must have done some preparatory work before coming here? Many are from far distant countries. They had to pay for their passage. How do they find their way here?
They must have some knowledge of our immigration system and our culture.
Their living situation here is far from perfect but they have choices and one of them is to go elswhere or return home. However, we Irish should not allow racism to determine how we structure our regulations.
If they dont like the way they’re treated here let them return to wherever they came from….bite the hand that feeds you….they have a cheek
There is no war in Britain, France or Romania. Welfare rates should be the same Europe wide.
What does welfare have to do with it?
Even though the cost of living isn’t level Europe wide?
Joseph – nail on the head.
I’m never surprised with how completely blinkered some people can be with comments like “level welfare across europe”
To have that, you’d need each country’s economy to be close to identical. The same people talking about leveling welfare levels are up in arms about the troika dictating our economic policy.
Just shows that the EU is a disaster, doesn’t it? Why can we just agree on free trade?
This is an issue that needs to resolved but a long article with few specifics. Some facts please;
- what is the mean and median waiting period?
- how many people are currently waiting for their application to be approved?
- what are the annual statistics for applications approves vs rejected?
Very hard to know specific numbers waiting, you could add the numbers living in DP, a few thousand, but there are a few who live outside the system using their independent wealth to do so. The figure is a little fluid, but you’re talking a few thousand effectively.
Last year, over 93% of decisions issued were negative.
458 people claimed asylum in Ireland last year. 330,000 claimed asylum in the wider EU.
Wait times for a decisions average, as far as I know, at 36 months, but many find themselves waiting up to five years in the system.
Those are the facts. The Refugee Council and MRCI, along with the Reception and Integration Agency publish reports that offer these figures annually, and other information. Worth a look. But these are the facts as requested. :-)
Started to read article stopped after first paragraph as the writer appeared to be confusing asylum seekers with immigrants and refugees from countries/areas where war (declared or not) is goin on.
They are 3 different classes and have different needs.
It’s a joke, our own people struggling to get by everyday and here we have foreigners marching, protesting and demanding rights!
But aren’t there many Irish demanding rights in the USA despite millions of US citizens struggling to get jobs!? Its human nature Paul, people like to live in a better way..
No, actually I’ve never seen Irish protesting for rights in my country. In fact, despite the fact they faced a great amount of discrimination the Irish people still managed to succeed in the USA without government handouts or other free crap.
Whether they are asylum seekers or immigrants protesting that they want more free government handouts they are nothing but spoiled whiney little freeloaders. They should be grateful that they are even allowed in Ireland to begin with. The fact of the matter is that even if they were homeless, their standard of living would be better in Ireland than sheltered back were they came from.
Look just give them what they want or im going to orginise a rebellion to take back Butlins
Here’s an idea,for any person who arrives at an Irish airport without the proper/or any documentation,the airline they travelled with shall be fined E50,000.
You’ve just bankrupted 40 airline companies
Britain fines airlines and ferry companies who do this, I’m not sure how many countries also do, but the EU came up with the idea around a decade ago too.
Right so we have no direct flights between Ireland and just say the African continent, And for anyone boarding an aircraft to Ireland they must have the correct documents in situ before being allowed on the aircraft.
How come so many asylum seekers arrive with no documents? Now I do believe that we should offer assistance to those really in need of our help, But it boils my blood when I have seen these so called asylum seekers fook off back to there country for 3/4 weeks holidays.
Yes back to the place they seemingly got away from as their lives were at risk.
Now who remembers the lord mayor from Portlaise who sought asylum here and it was later proved that he worked on the Tube in London, We are being taken for a ride here with some of these so called asylum seekers I would be more than happy to have people who really need the protection of the state be here ala Syrians etc.
Also the appeals process along with the naturalisation is big business for the legal profession.
How does everyone forget that Egypt is in Africa? We have direct flights to Egypt. And we get Egyptian asylum seekers, incidentally- Coptic Christians usually. Either way, the flight exists.
An actual flight from Africa to Ireland, imagine.
And Morocco, South Africa, Ethiopia, Nigeria. I really don’t understand why people are saying there are no direct flights to Africa. Now, I’m not arguing that some asylum seekers/refugees/’economic migrants’, most definitely, flew to another EU country before Ireland but to say there are no direct flights is just silly.
Fair enough I forgot about the North African countries that my parents normally visit on a yearly basis, But if you look at a map of the continent there is a good few countries en route before landing at the north African ones
Which, if we’re fair, you’d be more likely to travel through on foot or by car. Depending on the landscape, you could also fly with an African airline which doesn’t have stringent security like we do in the EU; that’s why most African airlines are actually blacklisted from European airspace.
I’m just saying, it’s an issue people point out a lot but the reality is there to see.
And I didn’t mention boats, which are how thousands of people reach European land mass from Africa anyway.
There is NO direct flights to South Africa or Ethiopia from Ireland and yes many people including my self forget to mention about flights to the North African countries.
Also the majority of flights to the likes Morocco & Egypt from Dublin are charter flights which means you cannot rock straight up to the plane and book a seat.
The majority of these asylum seekers use the likes of Paris & Amsterdam as a hub before arriving here.
Here’s an idea go to Australia or the USA with nothing, and let me know how you get on.
I moved to Millstreet 4yrs ago and, I may be wrong bt from what I experience, except for school, the asylum seekers are completely segregated from the community. Neither side making much of an effort to integrate.
Reading most of the comments there is a real bad, somewhat jealous, attitude towards asylum seekers. I met an asylum seeker Irene. Standing at a bus stop with her 3yr old daughter who had soiled herself. I offered them a lift home. We drove into the complex which looks absolutely beautiful bt she directed round the back into an unseen corner to a crappy looking prefab like building. These people are not having the time of their lives and they dont like free loading. As you can c from the protests they want a normal life
I think Irish people are sympathetic to asylum seekers, I wouldn’t think people would have a problem with taking in asylum seekers from Syria for instance, due to the size of the upheaval there. But there is a feeling of Ireland being selected to to its very generous welfare system. If I lived in a corrupt shantytown in SA and heard there was a CHANCE I could get a 3 bed home, and money from the government but I had to live frugally for a few years – I’d do it. Google ‘nairaland welfare ireland’ it’s a Nigerian forum – some cannot believe you get €1000 for having some children.
There’s a feeling – it just has no basis in reality, if you bother to look at statistics. If an asylum seeker was choosing the most generous country, it’d be a Scandinavian country, which treats asylum seekers much better than Ireland.
The scandinavian countries present a greater language barrier so they are ruled out as an option.
Then why do they accept a far higher percentage of Iraqi refugees than Ireland and offer a more generous welfare system? There’s no language requirement in Scandinavia and there’s a high level of English literacy. To be honest, I’m shocked at how few people commenting on the situation seem to have bothered to do any research on the actual situation in other European countries.
Hmmm I would put that down to Iraq being closer to Scandinavian countries than Ireland and also a larger Muslim population there than here, allowing for use of the family clause.
@Nick Beard
You have got that all wrong. Asylum seekers are not treated any better here. Of course you have to learn the language to get any kind of decent job. I’m shocked that you don’t do your research a little better.
Elaine I have to stick up for Nick here (not that she needs it).
Her opinions, while differing to mine on occasion, have always been well researched and informed. I have learned new things fron debating with her as I am sure she has from me.
I live here in Denmark, so I know what I am talking about. The Danish Peoples Party changed a lot of rules and regulations here when they became the second biggest political party and made it a very unwelcome place for foreigners. The ruling political party are now trying to undo a lot of that.
Ms beard – a quote from nairaland forum: ‘Most nations with good foresight have a very robust immigration system to attract skilled professionals but Ireland choses to attract unskilled, lazy and greedy people to their country. I don’t know if the situation has changed but I use to know that was very much easy to claim asylum in Ireland than to renew your work permit, so if you have policies like that you can have no one to blame but yourselves. ‘
Nic – why are there asylum seekers here if it is not for a perceived better life? If a war broke out in Dublin, I’d move my family to cork, Galway, uk or Spain. I don’t think my instinct would be get on a plane to England, stopover then another longer journey onward to Canada where I finally claim asylum. Is it too much of a stretch in logic that people granted asylum in Ireland are telling their families back home of the generous system we have, which encourages further applications?
A Nigerian mans perspective from the nairaland forum: I left Ireland about 5years ago when the economy was still booming, there are quite a lot of Nigerians living in Ireland who are very hardworking but there are so many who have discovered a new career in procreation. These set of people are not ambitious, they are ridiculously lazy, have no skills and completely useless. Some of these people get as much as 1000 euros a week in child benefits, unemployment and so on. Thank God for some few doctors and nurses who are doing so well to salvage the Nigerian battered image which these set of people continued to damage.I’ll like to hear from Ireland residents if their govt are still paying so much to these dregs, sometimes i wonder why Ireland attracted these set of Nigerans when there are more qualified and hardworking Nigerians who could contribute more to the country’s devt. I commend those Nigerians that are hardworking and refuses to be trapped in benefit waters.
@Scarr: This is very true. I have seen it myself
If you had family members in Canada, you very well might, however. Remember: recognised refugees have demonstrated that they’re being persecuted for their race, nationality, membership of a particular social group (such as being a member of the LGBT community). If you’re being persecuted due to you race, it seems likely that your community will seek to join you.
Elaine, I will admit, I was primarily considering Swedish and to a lesser degree, Norwegian figures, which are far more generous than Irish ones. I always note that comments such as “we treat refugees better than anyone in Europe” are rarely born out with actual figures – which is missing from this discussion.
You’re too kind, Alan. I too enjoy our discussions. ;-)
Beard – I’m sure you know yourself you’re offering a very weak argument for people travelling half way around the world, over and through multiple countries in order to claim asylum here. Look on nairaland, some Nigerians are aghast at our generosity. The ones claiming asylum are not the poor and downtrodden like you wish to believe, they’re middle class looking for a better life, and I’m sympathetic to that, but our system has been exploited.
Eligibility for asylum requires people to be persecuted – political prisoners can be middle class as well. It was never meant to encompass economic migrants – are you sure you are dealing with asylum seekers as opposed to economic migrants? Because a lot of people blend them all together.
Break the law- I meant
Swim your ass back to Africa then. It’s so wonderful over there.
The Poor Farmers are being taken on by the poor asylum seekers in a race to the top of the lottery – I am not racist but and there’s always A But , however riddle me this as you protest about your various ‘entitlements’ you feel are due to you , The First Cavalry arrived , invited to Ireland by the army of do gooders of which many do gooders opened their hearts to asylum seekers and closed their hearts to Irish People in one fell swoop , offering greedy landlords ‘that little big extra’ aided and abetted by the then health boards and the pen writing instant cheques for clothing , housing and the buggies , cars for the asylum seekers were financed again by the never ending roll of the parker pen as those of foreign lands moaned they couldn’t travel on public transport so needed a car in order their feelings were not hurt, insured, paid for vehicles driven by asylum seekers to the post offices where de money was counted out in the hundreds as our own looked on , we in Ireland were left in large flat complexes whilst the asylum seekers are given 3/4 bed houses via rent allowances , not to forget a handy little law to prevent our right to free speech so as not to be seen as critics associated with racism – Irish people have accepted you as people but to continue to rub our nostrils into the ground and to see you asylum seekers walking or driving around with your arrogance looking down on the hands that fed and educated you is a bit much , be thankful of what you have gotten & IF you are not contented then may i suggest you take a flight back to where you flew in from and leave us in eternal peace .
>>>This vacuum has been filled by a somewhat alarming trend of what appears to be growing public support for the “send them all back to where they came from” position.
Yea, we wouldn’t want the government serving the people of Ireland, now would we?
The asylum seekers are revolting, would you say?
The direct provision system is required to prevent economic incentives to claim asylum. The huge drop in asylum claims from 12000 a year (2002) to maybe 2000 now is a vindication of this strategy, as well as of the Citizenship referendum removing automatic Irish citizenship from Irish-born children of asylum-seekers. If they want their waiting times to end it they should have a chat with their solicitors who are largely to blame for delays because of their kitchen-sink strategy of obstructing deportations.
Pure rubbish! 99.997% of asylum seekers are not refugees of any kind but negroes or people seeking an easier life.
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