Like it or not it is a private V public debate as private pay funds public sector wages. Simple as. Despite the starting pay of new recruits can some one tell me the basic pay of a nurse with ten years service after working there basic 35 hour week without all the back stories and here say. How can we back you if you don’t give us real figures

And my public sector wages pay private sector wages, I buy groceries, use taxis, buy petrol, go to the cinema, pay insurance etc etc all of which directly pay private sector workers. Its not public vs private, we are equally dependent on each other

Chuck , INMO website will fill you on , and nurses work 37.5 hours officially ,

And of course public sector workers pay no income tax, prsi, pension levy or USC! Get real my friend the public sector contribute far more to the running of the country than people like you would like people to believe!

Chuck – have a look at Sham McSham’s comment. It makes alot of sense. Additionally you don’t have to ‘back me’ – I am private sector. its just I don’t begrudge paying decent wages to people who have saved my brothers life not so long ago and may one day be needed to save mine, or at least care for me when I’m at my lowest. Perspective is needed here.

There is still a big chuck of bureaucracy in the HSE and I believe this is the area that should be targeted for cuts – the problem is that the higher echelon of the HSE is too closely linked to government and therefore these potential cuts are not even being considered. Just a constant attack on front line services, which I disagree with completely.

Do not allow any one try to Divide and Conquer. We are all in this together.
The Public sector did not cause this recession , no more than the bank
tellers on the counters in bank, no more than a line worker in a factory or a
checkout operator in your local supermarket. Stand firm , support each other !

CABK
On that logic the toughest job of all is carried out by the State Pathologist who may also one day come across the remains of someone close to you and deal with the cadaver in a sensitive and caring way. So let’s triple her public pay because nobody else would do the job so well. While we’re at it lets talk about the embalmers ……….
The idea of including emotion in a discussion on pay rates and what the State can afford is so illogical it makes me want to scream.

Tax is collected from generated money in the private sector, only the private sector can generate money on labour and adding value to goods and services and profits.

This total tax take from the private sector is the pot that we have to pay the public sector.

We then pay them with collected taxes, and some is returned (the myth of public tax). It would be cheaper to pay nett, and forgo the sham of pretending it is new tax, it not adding to taxes just reducing how much taken.

So public sector PAYE, PRSI, USC etc are not adding to taxes, it is just LESS of the real private sector collected taxes being given. Understand?

If we did not ridiculously overspend on paying your pay and pensions then we would not be taxed so heavily, and we are, my marginal rate is almost 60% on my earning, and most goes into direct subsidies of public sector fat cat pensions and over generous rates, allowances, overtime and average earnings.

Saying that PS contribute to the economy by buying stuff etc is rubbish, they are spending taxes collected from private sector workers, taking money from their pockets, which they would otherwise have and spend. It is the same money, just taking from one and given to another.

A efficient well run, unwastefull, lean productive PS is what is required. Not the current overpaid, overstaffed, allowance and perk ridden cartel that currently exist.

Serious reform is needed.

You don’t pay my wages. The german and french consumer pay mine who buy my product. If you also want to talk about assaults etc i work fixing farm machinery and was twice punched while asking for the agreed payment on stud farms. My partner is a health care worker and she is smart enough to know what she was signing up for. Its not a lucky dip its your job. No one deserves an ounce of abuse in any sector and you should no by now using that excuse for looking at pay won’t cut it. Still no one has come out and tell us what a nurse with ten years behind them working a 35 hour basic week. I am now listening to a woman to a nurse on 2FM ask this very question and just responded…. I don’t look at my payslips, i have no idea what i earn. How can we support public sector workers if they are no up front with us

And the pay rate is ?

Hello, agree if you can’t afford the service , do without
But what you do get, you will have to pay for
Some allowances appear to be unjustified? I honestly don’t know

Include all allowances into basic Pay today, except nights / weekend and public holiday pay which does deserve a premium
Then lets see if people are overpaid, don’t forget politicians and senior mgt grades

Chuck, INMO website, how many times , it’s there for all to see

@Richard, the state pathologists office has 3 working in it full time, the head (Prof Marie Cassidy) and 2 deputies, Also a part time pathologist who is on loan to the state depending on need.
Add to that, in most major hospitals you will have a pathologist based there whom can carry out duties on behalf of the State Pathologist if need be, and most general hospitals share a pathologist with another hospital (whom again is on loan to the State Pathologists’ office should need arise).
What does all that mean? Well it means the State Pathologists office is part of a network that works quite well in no small thanks to Prof Marie Cassidy who has actually managed to improve her departments operation quite vastly.

Finally a man talking sense….

Excellent, excellent, excellent post.

Beautiful ending willie ,

They can apply this to all new employees from now on.
If you don’t like the terms and conditions don’t take the job.
Simple answer to a simple problem.

We can compare wages with other countries, but if we do, we have to compare the cost of living as well. Other countries may have higher taxes etc but a lot of their services are free, and the cost of living is much lower. Attacking frontline payments like what the government want is small minded and cruel, as it looks as though they get ‘extra’ pay above others! Those over the frontline staff ie administrative staff are on much higher salaries, but they won’t attack their wages in the same way. Some of these staff have a lot less work to do, seems dreadfully unfair to me.

What do you work at Paul?

Paul I work in an office, but I have many family members who work on the frontline, many of who have suffered injuries and long term physical problems as a result of their jobs.

Yes Paul ur right they leave find work in other countries in 20 years we they no nurses garda under 50

Perhaps you should play the ball not the man.

Surely the factors you seem so interested in are irrelevant, and it is the ideas and points being made that are relevant, and whether they are correct and accurate?

Troll

Case in point

If you don’t understand what that means look it up.

Besides Google the thumbs up for my OP would suggest differently

@Google You are a troll and here is why: You would not use your arguments in real life to a person who is providing a public service such as James, when you are in need, this also links back to my OP. I’d like to know if some of the people here who are clearly so behind this current government are: 1) on social welfare 2) a government minister. I think that is a completely and utterly bona fides request. I revealed what I do, to some abuse I might add by your fellow right wingers.

@Pablo

The lessons of history have proven that the court of public opinion is not to be relied on, hardly a reliable metric, would you agree?
Of course the majority agree, didn’t the majority vote FF, didn’t the majority buy overpriced houses? didnt the majority follow the herd on “property ladder”, doesn’t the majority refuse to accept their greed is central to the problems? The majority doing stupid things is unfortunately a fact of life, and a result of intelligence being rare.

First Im not on social welfare, I generate money in the top 5 percentile in this country, private sector, i’m not a minister. And I am sick of the small minded narrow views that show no understanding or values whatsoever except obvious self interest greed and an ability to ignore obvious wrongs.

Second:
Every request is bona fides insofar as it means it is genuine, that is a world apart from being valid or relevant.
I cannot see any relevance other than group bullying, or attempted character assassination being the motive for needing such info.

Third:
If you disagree with honest thought out opinions of others, you are free to challenge them on merit, using reason logic, and debate. Insults, accusations, insinuations and so on belong in the playground, grow up.

Finaly sorry to single you out, nothing personal, your comments just are so bad.

Open debate is what we are dealing with here Google. I was under the impression that the minority caused this situation the country is in. Hey feel free to accuse everyone else though. I’m delighted you’re in the top five percentile in this country. If earning 28k a year is greed, I’ll also bow to your argument there, bear in mind that I pay the same for all services as you do, as do nurses, Gardai etc. My bona fides request is a genuine request; in that it is easy to shout from the rooftops when you are doing so anonymously and all public servants wages are public record. I have no desire to bully anyone. The only post that could be construed as an insult is when I called you a troll. Which if it bothers you so much I withdraw. Finally I have no problem with you singling me out, no problem at all. I know its not personal. Your comment about my arguments is your own opinion, and respected, though not agreed with.

Ok Pablo,

That ok about the troll.

We have different perspectives, I do understand yours, I just think it is narrow.

Consider your point that a minority was responsible, I disagree because the majority bought the bull hook line and sinker. Purchasing overpriced homes and investment homes and beleiving in free money and property and equity rising forever. That was greed by the majority, and all people talked about, taking out equity release loans to buy ars and keep up with the jones’s

Before you say it, I agree this greed was facilitated by greedy bankers lazy regulators and corrupt government. Then add in the greedy unions benchmarking and lining their pockets (not entry level frontline salaries….but up the scale….and with increments, allowances etc)

If your basic is 28k that isn’t huge, and isn’t the problem. The problem is some nurses on 80k+ a yr and gardai on the same after relatively short periods. 5-10 yrs. (of course exploiting staff shortage to require huge overtime) then simultaneously complaining about overtime and protecting it jealously.

Do you see my point?

P.S. the top 5 percentile is only 55k + for an individual. The majority of people in this bracket are public servants…interesting fact isn’t it?

P.P.S I would disagree that you pay tax from a technical point of view. You are returning tax paid by someone else.

Fair enough Google, however I would point out that my perspective is from both sides of the argument. I had worked in the private sector until 2007 on just over 55k (including a 30% shift allowance) so I would actually have a broader perspective than a lot of people on the subject and not narrow at all. Perhaps I just rubbed you up the wrong way. We shall have to agree to disagree on some of our conflicting views.

@Pablo

Thats very fair, and we can agree 100% on the sentiment of your comment.
Best of luck to you and yours

Hello, bench marking gave greater pay increases to those at the top, small pay increases for the rest
Pay cuts have been similar for all
No bench marking was not good for all public servants

Google
Can you tell me where you got the nurse working €80k a year from? I’m a nurse/midwife top of the pay scale with a qualification allowance, & a long service increment. I work every second weekend nights every 5 weeks have worked every second Christmas since I started nursing in 1990 and I earn half that amount. You have no idea how much front line workers earn.

Sorry, but no, incorrect. By the time I get to any Sunday shift I’ve ever worked here Ive already worked my full working week, and then some. If I’m giving up my Sunday along with the rest of my week, I expect to be paid for both my overtime and my Sunday shift. The payoff is the fact that I’ve already worked my full working week and then some.

Apologies, that was for David Higgins below.

Well said. But you won’t get any sympathy for that with the majority of unionised journal readers.

@ James. You have so many issues with how you are treated. Why don’t you retrain and give us all a break.

Simon, I hate breaking it to you, but I don’t want to retrain. I’ve dedicated my life and education to becoming an expert in my field, I enjoy my work immensely, unfortunately I spend more time battling against a broken system than I actually spend doing my job.
Shocker alert, Ireland doesn’t treat it’s employees any way next in line or near the way a lot of other countries do. I returned to Ireland after spending over a decade in various health systems, I can tell you I know that employees in other countries are an asset. Here it appears we are an obstacle to be bullied into submission, and this disquiet is the result.
And rightly fricken so.

Sure Simon,

why don’t all nurses who work in difficult situations retrain and give you a break. I mean then if you ever need to go to hospital…..oh wait, there’ll be no nurses there to take care of you. Oh well, I’m sure that’s a small price to pay for you to not have to listen to them all whining on about their poor work environment.

What do you work at?

That question is to Simon too..

Arbitrary , your conditions are exactly what nurses have been doing,
If you work Sunday you deserve a premium rate,
And you will get the state payed old age pension when you retire, plus any other pension you have payed into

@ Pablo,

In the interest of informed debate maybe you should tell us what you work at as well

Local government clerical

@ Pablo,

Never would have guessed

Why’s that oh sage?

@josh still waiting in you to inform us what you do

@ Pablo – I am Irish but not based in Ireland (thank God). I voluntarily left in 2008 during the celtic tiger. I was in the top 2% pecentile income earnings in the marketing industry but disliked the way in which Irish society had utterly disintegrated. I moved to a new country without the language, was unemployed for 9 months, worked in a menial job for 9 months @ 750€ per month, ye month. 4 years later after hard work and determination I run the EMEA marketing function for a global technology company . Am I saying this because I am looking for a clap on the back, I’m saying it because you had some judgement in your mind of me, and now you know it is wrong. You, I suspect, have spent the majority of your career well paid, underworked, with plenty of daily breaks, holidays, subsidised canteens, defined benefit pension which you barely contribute to compared to what I have to (100%). You probably even have a beard, from which you lick your subsidised fried egg off after your morning break.

@simon, how wrong you are. Never judged you whatsoever. I worked in the private sector for 15 years. Took a 50% paycut in 2007 to move to LG. was laughed at, at the time. Now pull your claws in mate because like most of the pro government side in this debate you are ill informed, and YOU are actually judging. For someone who dislikes Ireland so much BTW you have an unhealthy fascination with Irish current affairs.

BTW I started in 23K and now on the dizzyingly high salary of 28k. Not highly paid at all. Also before you ask I am at home today childminding. I will only be €10 down today because Ill be saving on childcare. Fact.

@ Pablo, would I be right to say you opted for the easier life because your wife is the primary income earner?

A) I am not pro government, I am pro tax payer.
B) I dislike the society that Ireland has become, but am still proud to be Irish, there is a difference. The irish diaspora I have found to be more tolerant and interesting than a stay at home paddy.
C) B is why I have an interest in Irish current affairs – I’m Irish.

As I still have family and interests in Ireland it is normal I would have an interest in the states current affairs.

@ Norman – james is well able to fight his own battles, he does so with me admirably on a weekly basis

@ james – ok fair enough

Sorry Pablo had to change the tracks on a D8 CAT. Looking at your posts though you should probably get on with the ironing. She’ll be home soon for the lunch

@ mr judgemental, no she worked part time in a pub when I took the job. I assumed promotion propects may be available but they are not anymore. Get a grip will you?

@josh sad mate sad

@ pablo – calm down. i was asking an honest question. I was curious as to why you would take a a 50% drop in salary – thats all! Plus I think Josh was just kidding. take a deep breath!

@simon in fairness you were asking a rhetorical question. To answer you now though I seriously thought there would be career prospects, now there are not, I would nearly be honestly better off on the dole. That’s the whole point here. Look I can see your side of the argument too, but I have worked in both sectors and it not as cut and dried as you keep saying. As for Josh, I have a degree in Manufacturing Engineering (which incorporates Mechanical Engineering) and up till 5 years ago I fixed machinery that was far more complex than changing a track on a tractor.

They get time and half, and are safe in the knowledge that their employers will be fined out of existence if they flout the EWTD rules and regulations.
The gubberment as an employer has never heard of this EWTD thing I speak of.

99 % do not get time and a half. Stop speaking shite on something you don’t know.

A lot of retail staff get Sunday allowance

Then 99% have a case for the labour court, not my problem.

Comparing retail work to the work nurses, guards, prison officers and firemen do is ridiculous. We get paid double time because we are putting our safety on the line every time we clock in!

James, there is no longer a requirement in the private sector or public to pay time and a half or double time on a Sunday. You have to pay a Sunday premium but once this is above the standard pay rate it is ok. So in theory if you have an employee on e15 an hour standard an employer can pay you e15.01 an hour on a Sunday. Only reason I know this is I contacted NERA a few months ago on it.

I’m tired of hearing this “putting my safety on the line” quote spouted whenever a discussion about frontline pay comes up. You essentially value your life as nothing more than the premium pay/ overtime/ allowance you get for the shift you do. Farmers and fishermen have very dangerous jobs and there’s no unsocial hours or premium pay for them yet they don’t preach about it all the time. As for Sunday allowance for retail workers, there used to be time and a half but Richard Bruton took that from us. There was no clear backup from any unions for us, they just rolled over and let it happen at the time but hey, the mere suggestion a nurse or fireman might lose their Sunday premium and no, you couldn’t expect anyone to deal with that!

True that! I don’t even get paid/time in lieu for bank holidays!

“Dangerous”.
Since I returned to Ireland in June of last year I’ve had to deal with the following:
Knife point (x2)
Physically abused (minor, x2 (bruising minor cuts), major (stitching, relocation of shoulder))
Now, I work in a hospital, I have security at the touch of a button, I can only imagine what it’s like for the various paramedics, Garda and firemen who don’t have it so “easy”.
forgive me but there is no job where you are expected to take any abuse and continue your shift like it never happened. None. This is the reality.

Sorry to burst your bubble dude but there are a number, we are the bar staff and security of the pubs and clubs of this country. I have been hospitalised a few times thanks to my job and as for abuse? I can tell you stories but I’ve been back doin what I do within minutes of it all. Ironically it was a hospital worker who put me in the hospital once, got a laugh out of that for a while!

@ everyone – dont argue with james, he knows everything, and everything he knows is right. Can you imagine having to work with him, or worse, having him as an employee.

Simon well done,you don’t like Jame’s comments so you attempt to belittle him.Says more about you than him imho.

Ok, Mark, I can play that exact game and I can guarantee you that I will most likely win. If you’re comparing bar staff to nurses, doctors, paramedics, Garda and firemen, all of whom are registered and legally accountable for everything we do, then no offence, but you’re fighting a loosing battle.

Simon, has it eluded you that actually I might just be right? Not all of the time, I agree, but I like to think that most of the time I am actually right. You might personally be thankful for that someday, when you’re under my care, but of course you’re indestructible, and will never ever ever require a lowly nurse to look after you.
Ignorant. Just ignorant.

You say that the next time you in hospital A&E when you see staff run off there feet and been abused . I think double time is very fair. Front line staff have been hit extremely hard and this cut to premium pay is the final nail in the coffin.

I dont work as a front line professional but I admire and am very grateful to every single woman and man that perform in that area.

There heroes to me every single one as I know some day they could by my saviour that includes all of them.

What do you work at David?

Oh, David , it’s worth double time, you would agree when you see the empty care park on Sunday, only vital staff are in , those that can be done without are at home enjoying the day, deservedly so.
Remember a cut to this rate, effects our take home pay, while leaving other groups free from cuts, it’s could end up being another cause of resentment between groups of workers
That we can do without

He’s a member if YFG studying political history and mathematics in trinity or so he says?!?!?!

So he’s a student getting big grants from the state to keep him and his pals in beer and dubarrys.

Question for you David. Honest answer. Do you think Frontline workers deserve to be paid allowances for working 24/7/365 in our A+E Depts, Garda Stations, Prisons, Fire Service, Ambulance Service etc…the places the majority of the population do not want to be…ever. By allowances, I mean a night allowance, sunday, bank holiday as a recognition of the work they do while the General Population go about their daily lives and sleep in their beds. These Frontline Services deal with the carnage and dregs of society day in, day out. Night in, Night out. They see things no ordinary person should ever have to see. Most ordinary people are oblivious to what is really happening on our streets, in our homes up and down the country. I have family who are, Gardai, nurses and paramedics. Some of the stories I hear of what they have to deal with on a regular basis would make your blood turn cold. Yet, at the end of their shift they go home to their families like anyone else. Why shouldn’t they receive a hard earned allowance to supplement their average salaries for the crucial jobs they do. Why don’t you ask these Frontline Services where they think savings could be made. The people who do the jobs and see the rot. I voted FG in the last election, Why should I vote for you again, when I see my family members who work in the frontline, hard working decent Irish men and women who give their all, struggling with mortgages, childcare trying to keep the show in the road, for what. Why David?

Seriously David, you’re just a kid. What in gods name would you know about what’s reasonable Sunday pay. You come on here all the time spouting muck about things you can’t possibly know about or learn in a college lecture. Get some life experience, then come back and tell us all how wonderful it is. I’m beginning to think you’ve just been trolling all this time.

The pay your FG colleagues receive whilst telling the rest of us to accept cuts is the real joke David, that blueshirt elitism and well known ability to look down at the small man is really showing through in you recently.

When did double pay on Sunday first begin? Was it originally on religious grounds? If there was no double time I imagine single time would be higher.

I’m not on a grant so I work 20 hours a week.
I get time and a half on a Sunday which I can’t understand.
Sunday is a normal day just like any other for me.
I’m not 50% more productive on a Sunday.
It makes absolutely no sense.

Wait till you start working in the real world with a family.

Fair play to ya Jimmy. Well said

So not a real job then. When your older you’ll understand. There must be a real important lecture on soon so run along.

David I hope you never need the services of our fine front line staff beacause if your robbed we will look after you, if your hurt the nurses will care for you if your stuck in your home in a fire the fire service will save your backside and If you break the law in your political career or other the prison staff will treat you equally. All this they will do even though you slate us and insult us at every opportunity. Your really selling your party very well…

@jimmy of course Front line Staff should get extra for working Nights and Bank Holidays. I never said they shouldn’t. But Sundays are a different category altogether. Why not also have extra pay on a Saturday? Time and a half seems like a fair deal to me. It’s what I’m on and even I think that’s too much.

The choice is a horrible one but if the government can’t get the PS pay-bill down significantly, there won’t be the money there to maintain existing services. Then we won’t be talking about the workers suffering, but about patients and pupils.

David when u have kids you know Sunday not a normal day.

Most 24/7 staff get about a fiver for working sat

93k plus expenses for TD’s is the REAL joke David

To be fair David, you are on time and a half working in a supermarket on a Sunday. You cannot compare your job to someone working in an A+E dept or as Gaoler in a Garda Station. You are comparing apple’s and oranges, no pun intended. Do you not think someone working in an A+E Dept dealing with a victim of a traffic accident or in a Garda Station with a violent rapist and the aftermath for example on a Sunday deserve an allowance to compensate them for the manure they have to deal with? Seriously!

David once again I ask why members of the Oireachtas including those in your own party can’t take a substantial cut in pay, why can’t their advisors ( some of whom actually got increases ) take a cut in pay, why can’t legislation be brought in to force the heads of banking to take cuts in pay and pensions. There are loads of ways to lower the wage bill but of course God forbid that Fine Gael would harm the well to do in this country, go after those who have already sacrificed much, go after the low and middle incomes, go after child benefit, do nothing about mortgage rates, the extortionate cost of living and the total lack of help and support to people by the banks, in other words David don’t give a toss about the people, as long as we are Europe’s good child and those with high social standing are able to maintain their position so what about the rest. You might be happy on your Sunday rate and happy to tow the party line like many other spineless Fine Gael and Labour TD’s but my wife and I are struggling to maintain our home, one car and raise four kids and both of us are frontline workers so we are not willing to sit back and be destroyed, you need to come into the real world and get out of the Fine Gael bubble your in

David, the problem is that by the time we get to a Sunday shift we have worked our full week, some of us have worked two of them, and have no choice but to keep working.
I get paid double time on Sunday because it is overtime, and because it is Sunday. If you reduce my overtime then I trust you make sure gets better? That I don’t have to deal with the drunks, the drugged up, the domestically a used, the suicide attempts that inevitably arrive in on a Saturday night? I presume that’ll be the case, yes?

In support of David he is making valid points.

Personal attacks on him based on imagined circumstance, unfounded assumptions he is on the dole, lazy comments of “you’ll understand when you….” etc are ridiculous, and obvious diversions. The hyperbole, melodramatic, and exaggerated responses don’t help an argument.

Address the point: Why extra for a Sunday? If it is for religious reasons, are these not outdated? Why do you think Sunday should be so special?

Suggestions that it is because of previous hours works and is a cumulative extra to compensate for excessive overtime is NONESENSE. The sunday rate applies irrespective of previous hours worked during week.

So……why is time and a half unreasonable for a Sunday and why any different from a Saturday?

Put it this way so, if you are cutting my pay are you making my job better?
Yes, then I have no problem reducing my pay.
No, (which is the case here), then sorry, but no, I will not stand for what is a Paycut to work in a system that is quite literally falling apart around my ears.

@ JImmy – can I respond also?

You say: ‘Do you not think Frontline workers deserve to be paid allowances for working 24/7/365 in our A+E Depts, Garda Stations, Prisons, Fire Service, Ambulance Service etc’

I say: They dont, they work some of those 24/7/365 not all of them,…Plus if you are an ambulance / fireengine driver and you work a week of nights, not only do you get an allowance you also get several days off! You cant have it both ways.

You say: …the places the majority of the population do not want to be…ever.

I say: They knew this from the outset, they elected to do this type of work.

You say: By allowances, I mean a night allowance, sunday, bank holiday as a recognition of the work they do while the General Population go about their daily lives and sleep in their beds.

I say: They also sleep in beds when other people work – this is a non argument.

You say: These Frontline Services deal with the carnage and dregs of society day in, day out. Night in, Night out. They see things no ordinary person should ever have to see.

I say: Again they knew this from the outset, not an argument.

You say: I have family who are, Gardai, nurses and paramedics. Some of the stories I hear of what they have to deal with on a regular basis would make your blood turn cold.

I say: So do I – they are all very comfortable with plenty of money and time off where they can do nixers.

You say: Why shouldn’t they receive a hard earned allowance to supplement their average salaries for the crucial jobs they do.

I say: Why should they? They are already on a salary? what does ‘hard earned’ mean? Does a bin man not earn his money hard?

You say: Struggling with mortgages,

I say: I have yet to see this in reality, plenty of talk about it though, Is your argument that we should keep paying generous allowances to subsidise people who made bad investments in the good times? By that rationale private sector employees should be able to apply for grants for the same.

It’s not double time. It’s normal wage + 1

Simon, allowances are only paid if you work them, ie if you have no premium hours, your paid flat rate,
When on nights I do 80 hours that week , this results in the following week off,
Time off on days , I do 37.5 hrs paid over three days, 12.5 hrs daily, this results in the time off you talk about, it’s not free time off , it’s time off with your weeks work completed

Wow Simon. Now I know you are a troll with a big wooden spoon for stirring. You say you know plenty of Gardai who have plenty of money doing nixers on their days off. I say you know damn all. Because if you did you wouldnt be coming out with statements like that. You wouldn’t last 5 minutes as a Frontline worker. You obviously have a problem with Gardai, Nurses, Prison Staff, Firefighters and Ambulance Staff. I hope the next time you require urgent assistance there us a long delay due to cutbacks….enjoy quivering while you wait for help!

We are public employees, all information is publicly available. You don’t need to ask for it.
On a side note, if you fall below the cut off for the 42% you’ll pay 30% approx in levies, tax, and PRD’s, if you fall above the cutoff, it rises to 55%-60%.
Also, most overtime is taxed at 42%.

Thanks for that information James but I’m still none the wiser.

http://www.inmo.ie/35
Even that is out of date.

As the government are proposing the 80% starting salary for nurses ( which I do not agree with btw ) does this salary include payments for weekend/nights/bank holidays or are these a separate payment.?

They’re a separate payment, but rely on the salary. That is, if salary goes up, hourly rate goes up, and vice versa.
The hourly rate is calculated on the basis of a 37.5hr week, across 52 weeks. (IE, divide salary by 52, then by 37.5).

Ok tks, so how much will a nurse with 5yrs experience after graduation lose in actual cash. ? And that’s my last question James.

@James

Tax is levied on everyone, using it to indicate you are not being paid much does not make sense.

Let us know what you are paid before Tax, we can all understand and compare to ourselves. Then we can determine relative to different sectors how well you are paid.

What is it a year as per your P60 gross, including all overtime etc ?

Hello, all due respect, it’s none of your business. I actually had a patient on Sunday night, who I was trying to stitch up but kept moving, in the middle of it he asked how much I was being paid to tell him to keep still, to which I offered the response “not enough”.
I am paid a salary of 55k, however, I disagree that tax doesn’t matter because tax does matter. If you ask me how much I take home, the answer is extremely (startlingly) different, I take home closer to 20k.
20k, for 5 postgrad qualifications. I feel so, so valued as an employee of this state.

@James

Yes it is none of my business except that we pay for it, and it is being reviewed, and it is substantially relevant to this thread and the repeated assertion that nurses are not well paid.
That is why I ask, it is the most relevant facts we need to be told.

With the greatest of respect, and don’t for a second think I don’t have respect. We all have to pay tax….

My own salary has been destroyed, PAYE + all the stealth taxes have increases, + new taxes have been introduced, I am substantially down, as a member of private sector we are struggling to survive, working longer hours, harder with more value for money being squeezed at every corner. To maintain customers and service levels.

Every penny I get paid I need to generate in real economic terms, and the tax I pay is wasted in a lot of cases. The allowances given across the public sector are often literally unbelievable, and belong to a parallel universe.
People in the public service seem to have a disconnect between the value of money and the property bubble, they still have a mindset again with respect that a salary of 55k is not high. (add another possible 40% for overtime and allowances, safe to assume).

I have a salary of 60k and have to work overtime for free, results are required, and deadlines have to be met, we are short staffed to maintain competitiveness, and all employees and rowing together to make the company survive.

I too hold primary degree, and multiple post graduate qualification, and only receive payments for any directly relevant to my job. There is no entitlement based on qualification level for a direct correlated job / salary level.
It is governed by ability to pay, profits generated, productivity, the economy etc etc……..even whether a job exists.

You are being paid very very well, and if you cannot realise that you are out of touch.

Hello, you’re paying for it, so am I. I pay tax, and whether you like it or not I will always view that I do.
I agree, 55k is well paid, however the take home does not reflect this, nor a figure anywhere near it. When I work nights, as I am now this very week, I am the 2nd most senior clinical person in the entire building (I work in a major referral centre). There are people sweeping the floor who take home more than I do. (No disrespect intended to those that sweep the floor).
I do not get paid overtime, I have not since January 1st as my employer deems it unnecessary, (despite my routinely working 80-90hr weeks), and my “allowances” are 3K a year which are also being reneged upon.
Short staffing: I work with 3 similarly qualified personnel, there has to be one of us here 24/7/365. That is physically impossible without doing overtime. None of us can take holidays, study leave (which is extremely important for us to remain current), nothing.
I do not receive any allowances for any of my qualifications, whether related or not to my area of work.
Any further myths you wish for me to dispel?
I realise I am well paid, the fact is that I am treated by my employer like something to be trodden on.

@James

Im sure you do a good job for the money you are paid, and glad to hear you appreciate it is good pay.
I can 100% understand the frustrations that must be present for you working there, considering the terrible managment and the hogtied position all levels are in admin due to union restrains. The entire system is frozen, misaligned, inflexible, doesnt reward good work, seems to reward networking more than acheivement, and there seems to be a complete lack of any appreciation for individual achievement.
Just to mention a few things that would drive me mad…..im sure you could tell me a lot more.

My point would be that these are exactly why complete reviews need to take place, proper reform, breaking of union stranglehold on organisation and efficiency etc.
I just think that the review also needs to objectively analyse pay, allowances etc as I said.

If it is unfair Ill support you, dont doubt it, but I agree it should take place. There has been no better time.

RE: the cleaner earning more than you……if that is true and they are public sector, how can that be justified????
It does not indicate you are paid too little, just they are incredible overpaid.

We should all just put up and shut up like the good little housewives that we are and get back into the kitchen.

Promise to shut up, if they withdraw treats to premium pay, honest,
Until then guess I’m going to remain an irritant