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THE VEHICLE TAX system should be scrapped and replaced with a ‘pay as you drive’ system where motorists are taxed solely on fuel usage, one TD has said.
Labour’s Eamonn Maloney said the current system is costly, encourages evasion, and is unfair because drivers pay the same tax regardless of how much they use their car. He added that a lump-sum payment is more difficult for many car owners to deal with in the current economic situation.
Under his proposal, a further surcharge would be added to the price of petrol and diesel; this would then be the only tax paid by all drivers. The Dublin South West TD said:
All local authorities are experiencing major shortages in their budgets and a not insignificant amount is due to shortages in the motor tax accounts. The present antiquated collection system gives rise to considerable evasion, is very costly to administer amd utilises valuable and scarce Garda resources.More importantly it is essentially an unfair system in that car owners pay the same amount of tax for the same car classification regardless of the mileage or road usage.
Maloney added that his proposal would be “a fairer system for all vehicle owners”.
Conor Faughnan, a spokesman for AA Ireland, said there was “some merit” to the idea. “Currently, there is relatively high tax on the purchase and ownership of a car in Ireland relative to its usage,” he said.
But he said the scheme would not be simple to implement, adding that it “would negatively affect people in rural Ireland who are more car dependent.”
What do you think? Should drivers be taxed solely on how much fuel they use?
If the government are planning this. It obviously means it would net them more money. Which means we would pay more in the long run.
Great idea…
Am what about if you don’t have any public transport like a lot of small towns and villages across Ireland!
Here’s a revolutionary idea… Why not use the 70% tax they already collect on fuel more efficiently and scrap road tax. 70% of that extortionate price we pay for fuel is government tax already.
Put it up any more and it won’t be worth going to work. And all those shopping centres that can only be accessed by car may as well shut up shop.
an even better reason to go to newry! wouldnt that effectively close every petrol stn in the border counties? encourages more evasion if you ask me
That’s the way it’s done in Europe, the current method is outdated and expensive to implement
Tough shit
Good idea maybe if you have public transport option but what about people living in rural Ireland who have to use their cars more frequently to get to work/ shops etc….??? Maybe this could be implemented if they gave some kind of rebate or discount to people living in rural Ireland !!??
You choose to live in rural Ireland, I’m sick of these arguements, it like the people around the aviva buying a house next to a stadium and then complaining that there’s a stadium next door!!
Tough
well said Gav
Gavin
That comment about people choosing to live in rural is the dumbest comment I have heard all week. So, what are you suggesting? All the farmers should just migrate in to Dublin.
Get real.
@Gav: that is the most ridiculous statement I have heard in a long time.
I don’t think this tax would effect people who live and work in rural Ireland that much mopre the people living in Cities – would probably hurt the commuter belt people a lot more.
600 euro a year in tax for a car that if registered in 2008 would be 156. So here’s what i think, I’m being punished because i do not have the money to buy a 2008 car. So the more wealthy people pay a huge amount less tax. Thats some system. Also this twat of a TD is not in the real world, commuter towns sprung up everywhere where people could not afford to buy in the city. So once again we will be punished for buying a house(overpriced) in a commuter area and have to travel to work each day in miles of traffic. Those of us lucky enough to have a job that is. Its coming soon, another rebellion is going to start, there’s only so much blood you can draw from a stone.
I was just going to mention about the 2008 cars. They’re the ones that will be screwed more by this than the people with the high tax cars. The system is so screwed really.
The motor lobby is far too strong. They need to be sorted out. In today’s context they are equivalent to the tobacco industry of twenty Years ago and should be treated as such instead of getting endless support and incentives. Selling cars to each other is no better than selling houses to each other.
Outstanding idea. Heard it proposed and disregarded before – but it makes total sense. 10c per litre = job done.
Bring it!
At first this seems like a good idea but surely it would drive bus and taxi fares through the roof.
Taxi drivers don’t pay proper road tax, and would be exempt as would most people who drive for a living
Gavin your right, taxi drivers don’t pay road tax but for that matter neither does anyone else. If you have a car, truck etc you do however pay MOTOR tax.
So if you don’t have public transport you pay more??? Sounds like a truly Irish answer to an Irish problem!!!
Tough luk
It’s a *terrible* idea. It would send the cost of food through the roof because of the extra costs of delivery. Also it would marginalise rural communities. Completely stupid.
It would marginalise rural communities. How so? They have smaller mortgages and bigger houses, does this marginalise urban communities?
…and usually less pay too
Tough luck
To Oil Foster
The idea that you are peddling is that somehow people in the country side have it easier/better. In the countryside these is invariably less choice, fewer services and it is also often more expensive however there are other benefits to country living that compensate to some degree.
Those who seek to perpetuate the idea that there is a great disparity between urban and rural living are plain naive. Each have their benefits and drawbacks. Trying to put a divide between the urban and rural dwellers is a backward, 1970s neanderthal way of thinking.
oh electric car technology hurry up! but we will probably have a Universal electric vehicle tax by then;
Those thieving swines would over charge us even more on fuel and do nothing to the roads. In theory it’s a great idea but the greedy feckers would ruin it in practise. Boo!
And I wonder how many years it would be in place before some bright spark in government decided to reintroduce motor tax on every vehicle, and conveniently forget to reduce the fuel tax…
Ridiculous idea! What if you drive for a living, you pay more in the long run! The cost of fuel is high enough as it is! Wouldnt mind but a lot of the roads are in bits and the cost is high enough for for drivers to keep their cars on the road! Also at least if you pay your tax in one lump sum it’s done and dusted, where it would be difficult to keep track on the real cost we would be paying!
How about…. NO TAX!
I like your thinking CJ.
"The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims. The most perfect slaves are, therefore, those which blissfully and unawaredly enslave themselves.
Dresden James
Fantastic idea
Gavins comment is moronic. People are born in rural areas, make their livelihood there just as in urban areas. Do you think everybody on the island should migrate to city areas? I live 20 miles from Dublin city. There are 3 buses per day. Then a 3 mile drive. The train is ten miles and packed like something from Slumdog Millionaire. It’s a great idea for countries with a well resources infrastructure, not for Paddy how backwards land. I have friends in Holland where this system is in place and works well. Asking the politicians in this country to organise a proper transport system is like asking a group of chimps to make a watch.
That green party have a lot to answer for,the price of home heating oil and petrol/diesel is ridiculous,makin out Ireland was responsible for the ozone layer,now there talkin bout a mini ice age comin for a few years so you think this current government would drop the tax intake!!not a chance,once again screw the motorist for more money..insurance,tax,running costs,nct,tolls on roads,where will it end
Yeah the green party, they’re the ones to blame… In general, you drive more, you pollute more, you cost more – so you should pay more. Wherever you live. Whatever you do. Maybe a hike in cost may lead to some imaginative solutions. I think the greens had a few actually….
They allowed developers to push house prices up and push people into the driving longer distances to work and their solution is to tax them to drive back. Genius !
Petrol prices will go up higher than any savings on "road tax", and business will be put under further pressure for logistical costs. If exports are our saviours, moving products must be cheaper for business’s i.e. Revenue generators.
Less people commuting long distance and more looking for welfare: what a bunch of idiots!
Donncha what you on about,people can’t even afford to buy home heating oil this year cos they have no money no jobs,we are a nation of under 4 million people and were been punished for emissions,the rest of the super power countries don’t seem to show half as much care as us,the people outside the cities will be punished worse,so donncha wise up before you speak
Obviously only talking about petrol as that was what the post was about. It’s a bit short sighted and lazy to blame the greens for our over reliance on a fossil fuel and the ever increasing costs. Taxing by use is the fairest way. People can’t be subsidized for living in rural areas, or far from where they work. And I don’t think you can blame the greens for the policies that lead to this situation either. So wise up…
We already have a system where the people who drive more pay more. They spend more on diesel and petrol which is hugely taxed.
What was the point in encouraging people to buy more Eco friendly cars to save on motor tax? Buy this nice new car and save on motor tax, oh now you’ve bought it, let’s scrap motor tax and charge via fuel.
Ah well, it’ll give the politicians an excuse to increase their expenses per km. Happy days.
this should apply to motor insurance. pay according to the amount of time spent on the road. If there was no individual insurance, people would be insured to drive any car.
You can tell he represents an urban constituency that isn’t clode to the border…
A better option again would be no tax on cars or fuel, but pricing on all roads. That way you can deal with the urban/rural problem by different prices. Although that becomes a civil liberties nightmare.
how would one enforce it?
That depends how thorough you want to be.
If the limit of your ambition is N roads, R roads and city centres, number plate recognition is enough.
A more advanced system would use some kind of GPS logger. That might actually work out cheaper.
Now, there are disadvantages
– It effectively gives the government a tracking device in every car
– What if the device stops working?
– How do you charge foreign drivers?
– How does a driver know the charge band for the road they are on?
So it needs to be considered in that context, but it does probably provide fairer pricing than just a fuel duty.
Now, Chris, you are mentioning something I was thinking of as well. Foreign drivers. With this supposed system the question rises if they have to pay road tax in Ireland too? Or would foreign registered cars get a cheaper deal? In that case, all of us, up to the next signwriter ;-)
won’t work. we could buy petrol in the north.
only if you live close enough to the border to make it viable. also abolishing motor tax would mean that there would be no proper check on n.c.t’s being up to date, as you can’t tax your car without a current n.c.t. .
What about people they drive for a living ie taxis, and the extra expense on hauliers, tradesmen etc
I thought this was a good idea but it could be just another thing that makes working unaffordable for people on low wages – for a hour each way commute to work E50 a week petrol is a big hit for someone on the minimum wage if they have to drive themselves to work, add a higher motor tax and working is even less affordable, for a retired person or an unemployed person it would be a good thing but seems just another way of taxing the hard up active younger generations who are already struggling with mortgages, rents, childcare, you name it.
What a gimp! Most people have the choice on what size engine they drive around in so if times are hard you can drive a 1 litre car pay less road tax and less on fuel to fill it, so if they decide to tax petrol instead you pay the same tax as someone who drives a Car with a 4 litre engine !!!!!! I say again WHAT A GIMP !
the guy with the 4 ltr engine would pay more as he uses more fuel due to his larger engine, so those who use the roads the most would pay the most,unless of course they all switch to 1 ltr cars.
Don’t know if it was said above, buy why not use the exorbitant tax to specifically improve public transport. You can tax the shite out of private transport and then reduce public transport operations as they have now. Our kids looking back are going to look at these policies and say WTF were they thinking?
I hate iPhone predictive text….
Yes it’s a pile of shirt
Yes Jim..I’m with you on that!
So if the charge is to replace VRT then presumably that means that it will only apply to new cars…
Oh he means road tax. I see. So in effect by introducing this its essentially reversing the Green’s motor tax emissions nonsense.
It would be a huge cost to a taxi driver
No offence but boo hoo hoo to te poor bloody taxi drivers!! There are other road users and people who travel around to make a living
This is the most ridiculous thing ever. I travel the length and breadth of the country to visit potential and existing clients. Last year I paid 500 euro in tolls and 1300 in motor tax. (yes I drive a big car). They want to put more tax on me trying to keep my business afloat? I’ll shut up shop and emigrate before they get another red cent our of me. Bastards.
@Shane,think this idea through before you pack your bags :-). How many liters of fuel do you use in a year? Would 10c a liter extra balance out the 1300 you would save in tax? Aside from the fact that government needs to ease the burden on small business on all fronts maybe the introduction of this measure would actually be of benefit all round? Just imagine that if every car on the roads was paying its share of the overheads.
I have a better idea, make people with 10 year old bangers pay more road tax than those in â
just because a cars 10 yrs old it doesnt make it a banger, my car is over 10 yrs old but is serviced regularly and well maintained and passed its n.c.t. with flying colours, if you look after a car and dont go around razzing the arse out of it or bashing into stationary objects, then there is no reason why it can’t last 20 yrs or more.
Lol Thomas ya bold fecker hahaha
And ya know what!!! Tough shit that I’m moaning lol :-D
Your screwed if you drive a commercial vehicle.
the newer efficient engines would be a better option if you had the money to change but does anyone know how much the suggested hike would be?
its a fair point about the nct and I don’t think scrapping road tax would free up any garda as they would still need to chase nct evaders. if such an absurd policy came to pass could you imagine how much bus fares would cost or how much your taxi home would be?
I work away 3 weeks on 3 weeks off so bring it on I say,my car is on the road less than 6 months A year
We have over 30 motor tax offices in this country collecting motor tax. The cost to the tax payer in wages, maintenance and administration is enormous. Also the cost on the State prosecuting people for no road tax is a drain on resources. The present system is totally in-efficient and encourages avoidance by some. The pay as you go system had merit IMO. Business people and commuters should be allowed a rebate/income allowance against the tax. It could work.
I’m surprised at this TD.
Doesn’t Motor Tax currently fund the county councils?
So this is nonsense.
Surprised no one has noticed this.
I’m paying
People like me with classic cars and currently paying a flat rate of 48 euro a year won’t like this idea too much. Bad enough putting petrol into the thing as it is, being a 3 litre engine.
I’d agree with it because I pay more car tax than many of my colleagues yet I drive a fifth of what they do.
I also know quite many people who avoid paying car tax altogether; they’d find it a lot harder to avoid if it was added o the petrol.
i voted dont know.. because, I know of a guy who has no problem putting 70-80¢ a litre of laundered diesel into his company car, claims back the mileage from the company, so straight way he will be AVOIDING tax on the vehicle and AVOIDING tax on the fuel, more and more people will be willing to risk kangaroo juice if this is the case. I’m a regular car/van/train user and notice that the roads are in poor state if the government got the companies who dig up the roads ntl/gas/eircom etc to repair them back to original then it would save a lot of tax payers money.
@jrbmc I suggested this to John Gormless many years ago when he came to my door looking for a vote. If I have a 3.5 litre car and drive 3000km a year and pay â
Eamon !!! That’s the greatest load of Bull shite I’ve ever heard !!!!! What about the people the use Petrol and diesel for different uses than transport !!!
The Irish Vote with their Wallets!
Current Irish annual car tax system is Daft!
1000 Euro pa is my car tax demand for my 1993 motor!
392,000 car owners ( mainly pre-2008 ) refuse to pay this unfair penal tax.
That is 23% or nearly 1 in 4.
Looks like people have given up voting in the polling booths and are voting with their wallets!
France has no annual car tax since 2001.
It would be ideal to collect motor tax on fuel and tolls, like France.
BUT, making up the “sudden” loss of annual car tax on fuel would mean:-
everything in the shops would increase in price due to the additional transport costs.
Tourist industry would not like it.
Rural communities would not be happy.
Can I suggest getting the NCT to record the annual mileage.
A. Use it to calculate the annual car tax (CO2 part) based on: annual mileage x your car’s CO rate per mile.
Provide an exemption or discount factor for commercial vehicles.
B. Plus a fixed annual car tax rate based on the value of the car like the US system.
Use VRT method to calculate this fixed part each year.
(Give exemption for low value cars (less than $6,000 in the US).
This would meet the progressive tax requirement. (those who can afford to, pay more)
This would:-
1. Prevent 6 Billion p.a. cost of new cars “drained” out of our economy due to the daft tax bias to buy new cars.
(A private vested interest operating here – never!!!!!)
2. Provide a lot of Irish jobs in 6 Billion p.a spent instead on Irish goods, services and investments.
(import substitution at its best)
Any “Irish car tax petition” that I can sign?
Happy 1993 car driver, confident of another 10 years of reliable motoring!
- “Vorsprung durch Technik” : Not so happy with the Daft Irish Car Tax System. (apologies for the long post)
They have a similar system in France pay as you drive and god it’s expensive used to drive from Cherbourg to Belgium and that’s nearly â
not need tax should be free
It would make the cost of mowing my lawn prohibitively expensive.
Seriously, though. There MAY be some merit in it, it depends on the actual level that the fuel levy is set at. It also makes it easy to ramp up costs as the government can raise the fuel duty very quickly, in contrast to the road tax occurring once a year.
Suppose a pump levy of 20c/ltr, and annual mileage 20,000 (I think that’s sort of average) then that’s €400 a year to pay. Think of it that way, and how does it grab you???
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