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IF YOU EVER happen to look at old black and white photos of Dublin town, you can’t help but notice the tram lines criss-crossing some of the streets.
Nothing unusual about that, you might think, but the thing is, those tram lines don’t belong to the LUAS.
No, they were laid down for a tram service that began in the 1870s and ran until the late 1940s, by which time they were considered a relic of the past and not fitting for a modern Ireland. The tramlines were all pulled up. Six decades and nearly a billion euros later, trams were re-introduced.
In 1799, A&R Thwaites in Dublin announced that they would pay two shillings for every dozen glass bottles that were returned to them. Closer to the present time, many of us remember the milkman delivering the morning’s bainne in glass bottles. The following morning, the empty bottles would be collected and taken away to be washed and then used again.
Why were these glass bottles collected for re-use? Because society realised the value of these containers, it made sense to take care of them and to keep them in circulation for as long as possible.
The point that’s being made here is that progress is not always linear, sometimes we have to go backwards to go forward. After generations without one, we now realise and appreciate the value of a tram system in Dublin. After decades of increasing pollution due to increasing amounts of plastic bottles and cans, we also realise the importance of doing something to try to put a stop to it. Step forward, Ireland’s Deposit Return Scheme.
Exact figures are difficult to come by, but it is safe to assume that, each and every year in Ireland, hundreds of millions of plastic bottles and cans are not collected for recycling in Ireland. That means that all of these containers end up as litter, in landfill or as fuel for incinerators.
By anyone’s understanding of the word, that is a shocking waste. It is a waste of precious, limited resources. And it’s a waste of everyone’s time, money and energy because it is avoidable.
What the deposit return scheme will do, in effect, is to place a bounty on each container. This bounty incentivises us to return these containers so that we can claim our deposit. Just think of bottles and cans as money, only it’s money shaped as empty bottles and cans! You can be sure that with that bounty on their heads, these containers will be treated with an elevated sense of consideration once the scheme is up and running.
One of the mantras that we live by in VOICE is that it’s the product we want, not the packaging. When I buy a bar of chocolate, I’m not going to eat the wrapper. Sure, it’s handy to identify the product and it keeps it clean but it’s the chocolate I’m after, I don’t want the packaging. You can think of it like this: you go to the supermarket and put a euro in to get the loan of a trolley. You fill up your trolley and then, when you’re finished, you return the trolley to its station and get your euro back — job done. You’ve got the items you wanted, you got your euro back and you’re not tasked with looking after the trolley anymore either. It’s a concept that makes sense to all of us, and it’s the same concept that applies to the deposit return scheme.
We’re not doing this in isolation either. At the time of writing, 14 other European countries have a deposit return scheme up and running with many more on the way. The reason for this is largely down to the EU’s Single Use Plastic Directive. One aspect of this directive mandates that each country must have a 90% collect rate for recycling plastic bottles by the end of the decade. They don’t mandate that each country should begin their own deposit return scheme, it just so happens that no one has come up with a more effective mechanism for getting to that 90% goal.
Another important aspect worth mentioning is its relation to the circular economy. That term has become more prevalent in public conversation over the last couple of years, but I’m not convinced that it makes much sense to the casual listener. In fact, I tend to think that once someone hears the word “economy” in a sentence, most of their brain switches to standby. In very simple terms, the circular economy means that we’re aware that there’s only so much stuff on this planet, and so we need to get better at looking after that stuff; making sure it’s designed to last longer, that it can be repaired, that we appreciate the value of this precious, limited stuff on our precious, limited planet.
The deposit return scheme will serve as an entry point to the circular economy. When you collect your bottles and cans, return them to the shop and get your deposit back, you are playing your part in making sure that these materials are being collected for recycling. You are bringing the circular economy to life. And it’s not some highfalutin new ‘green’ claptrap you’re engaged with, just a common-sense approach to ensuring we collect as much plastic and aluminium containers as possible for recycling. What’s not to like?
We recently engaged RedC to conduct a survey, gauging opinions about the upcoming scheme. Out of all the data we got, one result really stood out to me: support for the scheme was exactly the same from rural respondents as it was from urban ones. In these times of noisy culture wars and all caps rage, it’s heartening to know that it doesn’t matter where you come from on this fair isle, we can all coalesce around one good idea. After this? Well, maybe we’ll go back to the future and channel our inner 1799 selves as we look toward re-use but, for the time being, let’s enjoy the start of this new chapter.
Colin O’Byrne is Project Manager with VOICE Ireland and led the Return for Change campaign to raise awareness about Ireland’s deposit return scheme.
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Who gets to keep the deposits on the millions of containers that will not be returned?
@Oh Mammy: Whoever bothers to return them. Seems fair enough to me!
@Oh Mammy:
Sugar taxi people
@John H Green: Hey young people! You’ll earn 40k for life, never be able to afford a house or retire before you die…. but do return your bottles.
Haven’t heard anyone mention the fact that the government will collect big on VAT. Yesterday you were selling a can for €1.50 and paying 23% today you are selling the same can for €1.65 and paying 23% so the seller is actually out of pocket by a couple of cent, now multiply that by millions of cans and bottles.
@The Green Monkey: true, and full collection of the fees if you happen to recycle them in your recycling bin….. stealth taxes again.
@The Green Monkey:
That might be because they don’t as the deposit amount is Vat exempt.
@The Green Monkey: nobody has mentioned it because it won’t happen
@The Green Monkey: You are talking rubb!sh . It’s a 15c add on deposit,redeemable when returned. How can extra VAT be charged?
@The Green Monkey: Please read up on how systems work before you choose to comment on them.
We have been recycling for decades… Yes the glass milk bottles years ago… But most of us have been using the bottle/can banks for a long time… And also our green bins… Most of these bottle/can banks are collected by various charities and now they lose out. How much money has been spent putting in these mini recycling structures outside every major supermarket ? And how much electricity is wasted having them there ? Yes, the supermarkets have built them, obviously knowing they will make money from them…. And who loses out ? The Charities…. Another wonderful idea, no doubt pushed by the green party… Roll on the next election…. The greens will be extinct the very same as the PD’s..
@Blue Moon: but the problem is that many people don’t recycle. All you have to do is look at the side of any road in this country and you’ll see countless cans and plastic containers. Its defintiely way worse now than it ever was, even in the last 10 years theres been a huge increase in litter. Blame the effers who fly tip so they can save a few bob on bin charges.
@Blue Moon: if there was a charity who collected the bottles, it would give far higher returns then the glass banks ever would.
While it may be a PITA and have a cost for people, there are opportunities there too
@Colm O’ Shea: That’s an excellent idea. I’ll not physically be able to return my bottles, though I’m obliged to buy loads every week. If a charity could retrieve the deposits paid I’d be very happy. (As it stands, Im concerned that the private enterprise shower who are administering the DRS will trouser all such ‘overpayments’.)
@Blue Moon: not just the charities but small retailers who can’t afford to install these machines. If you buy your can in shop A, which has no machine and you go to B to reclaim your deposit, shop A loses out. Why because the shopper has to use the vouchers in shop B, so they shop in B and A loses their custom and ceases trading. This system has not been thought out properly. In China you can redeem your vouchers for public services, such as buses, metro and trains. I’d have to check with Chinese friends but I think you can pay for charging your electric car with them. The retailer doesn’t have to install the machines as they’re at bus and metro stops and in communal areas. They don’t have to deal with vouchers and don’t have to compete on an unlevel playing field.
The town I live in is charging the 15c. However, the nearest returns station is a 15 min drive,
How is this helping the environment
@Bilko: The best idea would be not to drive to the returns station every time you use a container.
Gather them up in a bag and maybe 2 months from, bring them with you when you realise that you will be passing the returns station on the way to somewhere else.
You’re welcome.
@Patrick Perill: Grand if you’ve a vehicle.
@Ronnie S: just make sure it’s an electric vehicle – they only cost 10 grand more than normal cars and instead of filling up with pesky fossil fuels – you get to use electricity – which we generate using fossil fuels – so we make very little difference to the environment but spend an thousands extra in the car – which resale at a fraction of what it cost you because the batteries deplete every year reducing the range- go figure – we use to call this A swindle – we also use to just put the cans and bottles in our green bin – now we have to pay extra to buy them and will still just put them in the green bin – I’d still call that a swindle
Incentesied my arse, blackmailed to return in “full form”, while withstanding ques for the privilege of getting back out own money stolen by our own government, while a beautiful blue bin is outside my door.
I already pay for 100% recycling ( which is often burnt to make cement ) but still I do recycle everything I can.
Incentives to recycle, bull, it’s more like BLACKMAIL
Will my recycling bin come down in cost ?
What a load of bollox and two fingers to us that already recycle 100%
Mr. Joe Average
Ahh well, Tom average
There are twenty firms behind a third of the world’s global emissions but it’s your bottle of Coke being taxed that makes a huge change.
@Conor Craddock: sure if my neighbours house is a tip why should I clean mine. They’ve been doing this in Europe for over 50 years without the usual whingebags like yourself crying over ever little thing
“We are finally seeing the value in the small everyday products we use” This dude smells his own farts
Are we still paying the increase even though cans/ bottles do not have the return logo on them yet?
@Maria Fleming: I know there was some confusion today but you shouldn’t be paying it on old stock as you won’t get your deposit back also the vendor hasn’t paid the deposit at the wholesalers.
@Maria Fleming: My wife had to in Tesco today. They said bring back the empty with the receipt and they’ll refund the increase. Avoids confusion with double pricing they told her. We’ll see……
Been using a process like this abroad for years. Great to see it being introduced in Ireland. Finally. We’re way behind, as usual but better late then never.
@Tom Dillon: Imagine being of 2024 brightness, and not realising you could get money back on jam jars in 1964? Or that your bread might be delivered “electrically” by JMO’B. Lovely dance moves. 2 steps forward, 2 steps back. Then along come the shinners (provos) and fcuk up everything. God save the King
@james rowan: Myself and classmates at school used to go around our tourist hotspot and collect discarded glass bottles and return to the local shops for deposit. Made a tidy sum each week. At the time,littering wasn’t considered a blight on the landscape,but was welcomed by us kids as a money making enterprise.
This will have people turning your green bin upside down in the hope of finding the bottles, now your pickin up the mess outside your house,I’ve seen it being done for yrs in NYC…
People will eventually get tired of being them back..
@Donald Hegarty: ‘Green Bin’ ? I think you mean recycling bin – where I live the green bin is for refuse/rubbish
This is exactly the same as the Water Tax Gaslighting.
They didn’t even begin to try or attempt to engage with the public. Just barged their way in with meters and declared that would instantly apply charges to all-and-sundry for every drop from the very first drop.
The State failed to:
- install meters for purpose of research.
- establish quantifiable evidence of useage per Season and through Seasons.
- establish quantifiable evidence of useage averages per household.
- establish quantifiable evidence of probable useage per person per household, from 8 person households to single occupant bedsits.
- proceed with Public Messaging through Informational and Educational Advertisements.
- provide Public Information about useage in excess of averages need to change, or average useages need to reduce in general because reservoirs or treatment plants cannot keep up, but also: Conservation is Good anyway.
- make factual information available to the Public Broadcaster for them to interrogate, challenge, invastigate, refute or verify **over a number of years**, and present to public for National Discourse and Debate.
- remind the thick Public Broadcaster that it is *on them* to research and engage with adaptive behaviours and solutions to water conservation (eg: “Room To Improve” might improve some bathrooms with sink grey water supplying toilet cisterns. Engineering tv shows might explore ‘Water Towers’ merging dual useage: reservoir back-up AND Supplying Power Grid by turning mini turbines inside the tower as stored water is dropped and released into the reservoir re-supply pipelines).
- follow-up with further research. Have behaviours **quantifiably** adjusted downwards?
- if not, why not, ask the public. Implement more information and education campaigns to drive down consumption.
**THEN, when ALL of that has actually succeeded in bringing down consumption and/or inspired adaptive behaviours (like water butts to water gardens/wash cars) – then, and ONLY THEN, introduce charges for every gallon *above* the well established average per person useage.
As for Colin:
“They don’t mandate…….deposit return scheme, **it just so happens that no one has come up with a more effective mechanism for getting to that 90% goal.” – O Really? Have they not Colin? Did you actually ask anyone? Did they, the Irish State, ask anyone for alternative ideas? Did any of them even bother to lazily view the extensive non-RTE, massive body of International Media & Journalist engagement, research, and broadcasted FREE Public Service programming literally available all over YouTube – from Financial Times to Business Insider to (now neo-Fascist Israel-apologist) Deutsch Welle and even Al Jazeera, fer jaysus sakes – well, did they???
I mean, really, did you – Colin – even read your own Article before submitting it? Before publishing it? Because you literally placed a historic solution into a modern problem, that could cancel the need of deposit-return, and then completely ignored it as a solution.
Glass!!
There is no reason whatsoever why we cannot change to glass bottles from plastic. We wouldn’t even need deposit-return because glass doesn’t create more plastic nor break down into microplastics. It would 100% eradicate single-use plastic bottles from the economy and ecosystem.
Oh breakage, you say?
There *are* can/bottle grips that you just sqeeze to open, slot the can/bottle in. The purpose is currently comfort – less cold and wet fingers, less slip more grip. Most are currently made using polluting petrochemical synthetic cloth materials.
BUT, there is no reason they cannot be recommissioned as reusable Silicone grips so that they create a “bumper” barrier to breakage. To be as common as an oven glove in a kitchen. No reason the brands cannot create and sell their own branded bottle grips to be re-used on their beverages (and at home on sports water bottles,or any beverage bottle like a reusable bag). Also no reason every small shop to large shop can’t sell cheaper unbranded versions incase a customer forgets theirs.
That said.
The more I read on this topic, the more “articles” that come out, the more I am being provoked and incited by Gas Lighting, Greenwashing, Hand Wringing, Government Apologists for this atrociously bad Policy, Apologists for Government failure to engage with the population + failure to inform with Public Messaging/Education + failure to venture out and ask the public face-to-face or invite suggestions/solutions at Local Council-level, failure to provide *widespread* (not just token handful) segregated street waste collection [bins with a plastics barrel, an aluminiums barrel, paper barrel, compost barrel and refuse barrel] aka failure to **enable** public engagement in general, and/or just plain old Beligerant Bovine Stupidity.
It’s like this nonsense of residents complaining that public bins attract langers at night.
Some *responsibly* finishing their kebab at the bin so they don’t litter later, but, yennow – being loud langers or fighting while they’re at it.
Others stopping for a piss….”hiding” behind the bin.
So Council removes the bin.
Like, …PARDON??
Why won’t they simply *add* a closed street urinal that lads have to open the container to hit the “target” inside, so its not dribbling down the streets. Funnel it into the flower planters, or directly channel it to the drains. Have the council hose it down during street cleaning.
And, probably more importantly, create a 10c digital swipe charge – and if users don’t break the machine or piss on it, ye get yeer money back.
Now that’s a true and legitimate ‘circular economy’ deposit-return I can get behind!!!
Contribute your urine waste to watering and nourishing the public street plants. Extra beneficial contribution to the “circular” system during Summer Water Shortages and Hosepipe bans.
Restore civility, a crumb of dignity, and self respect to “wild urinating” as a pathway to ending it and restoring respect for whole community and shared spaces.
As for article writer directly:
First of all – you completely did not explain “Circular Economy”.
An effective Circular Economy definitely does not start with the consumer returning recycleables. Especially not mere plastic bottles.
Please do not be so feableminded and pathetic.
Please do not treat the ‘Journal’ readership, or the population of Ireland, like half-witted thicks.
This is not America.
This fella is only getting away with this empty-headed waffle because RTE have totally and utterly failed in their responsibility of Public Service Broadcasting supplying the post-Education Adult population with Informative and Educational … “Updates”.
“Circular” has not even begun to begin yet.
“Circular” still needs to start with establishing grading of textiles for re-use after recycling, and effective correctly graded streams. Not to mention creating large vats for washing and sterilizing food-contact plastics that missed a wash or who’s wash was incomplete at the domestic level. Not just fecklessly recycling and rejecting large swathes because the plastic is “too flimsy” or “too food contaminated”. A significant amount of thinner/less robust plastic beverage bottles (like “Sparkling Ice”) are considered “useless” to many recycling plants, just like Clingfilm, and plastic films over trays of food, or fruit. They all get redirected to landfill.
So cut the c^@p please.
We should be forcing Government to launch an immediate “deposit – return” on heavy duty reusable shopping bags (i.e. give you money for returning all heavy duty plastic and immediately cease and ban any further manufacture or distribution).
All that said. The simple fact is – all petrochemical food contact plastic should be brought to an immediate halt.
Immediate.
Not recycled.
The Irish Government have wilfully chosen to “misunderstand” the call to end “single use plastic”. We need to cease the *production of* single use plastic. There no longer is any need for it. None!
We now have at least 3 plant sources of Bioplastics being manufactured in the world.
Some are currently being developed and tested for consistency of purity/non-contamination for use in **Medical** Single-Use plastic practices.
So there is no excuse for single-use food contact, petrochemical plastic anymore.
None!!
We, the people of Ireland, are beyond the last bleedin’ straw on this “public must pay financially, as well as cooperatively, to save the environment”.
No. We definitely did not need a Charge on non-compostable, non-recyclable Disposable Coffee Cups.
They could have simply been outright banned.
There are a minimum of 30-40 alternative textiles in existence for the past decade. DECADE!!!
No other population outside Europe has been as amenable, nor as eager, to take to Recycling from Wheelie Bins to City Bottle Banks.
You certainly would not have anywhere near as much uptake in USA.
But we do not take kindly to being told what to do, to being financially coerced, or to being forced into *compliance*.
Never. Before this Decade. Had I ever had cause to use my Grandmother’s rural vernacular.
Shtop vexing me the lot of ye ye dose of gombeens!! I would git more sense out of the dunkey (donkey).
@Pink Freud: Yawn
@Pink Freud: someone got around the 800 character limit for an epic (but ultimately demented) rant!
The proof will be seen in a reduction in the amount of plastic taken out of the environment. It’s worked elsewhere and should do here too. In that case it will be worth the extra hassle.
@John Moore: yes but ‘elsewhere’, you also find citizens leaving such deposit-paid bottles and cans for the indigent population to retrieve and on which to obtain the deposit back. Here, the bottles would be wantonly damaged/ poisoned/ nicked by the un-needy.
@John Moore: My recycling bin has maybe 10% ‘bottles and cans’, ultimately I’m not too bothered about taking them out of that system and putting them in a new recycling ‘revenue stream’ but what about the other 90% of recyclables in the bin?… Who knows who cares.
Only doing what the generations before us did. Hopefully we will continue to go back there for a cleaner environment.
@Marie McPhillips: Not at all really, the circumstances and reasoning are vastly different. but judging from the replies no one cares. I suppose we’re used to it by now tho
“The following morning, the empty bottles would be collected and taken away to be washed and then used again.”… a great idea!… *hops in Ranger Rover and sits in M50 traffic*
This is just another stealth tax. The majority of people won’t bother about the refund.
It was used in Ireland in the 1970s on glass bottles 6p was the cost and you got it back once returned , no one moaned or complained about it , is it not a similar idea as to how you buy your bottle of gas today ?
Vouchers! I don’t need any stinking vouchers.
Gimme the cash!
Joe Duffy did his best to put people off using the scheme with barely hidden scorn & contempt in his voice as he ridiculed the scheme only half a day old. Ranting on about “quangos”& “taxpayers money” he certainly showed which side of the debate he was on. This was not balanced public service.
Mine will have to go in the recycling bin as usual because I live in the sticks. I get a taxi into town one day a week and do my shopping and get a taxi home. I’m not carrying a bag of old bottles around with me for the day just to save a few cents. This should be an option in scheme if people want it. But I’m being forced into a scheme I have no way of using simply so the greens can feel good about themselves. Which, let’s face it. Is the main reason we do anything in the country. So that Eamon Ryan can look in the mirror and give himself a pat on the back! Preferably right into the canal with the rest of the old bikes….
I read somewhere stores aren’t including deposit price on the shelf price. If so, this is against the law as it needs to reflect the complete price (the deposit would be considered an extra), as its misleading otherwise.
“The deposit return scheme will serve as an entry point to the circular economy.”
Almost every article written by these evangelists imply something similar: this is only the beginning. What’s next on their list? Limits on amount of meat we can eat? The diary we can buy? The gas we can buy? All possible now we foolishly move from cash.
have your say