Agreed

How? Sensible suggestions, please.

@Damien, You are correct about that in my opinion. They outlined their Principles very clearly in the run up to the election and they bandied about ‘treason’ accusations and told us all a load of lies.
I accuse them now of treachery, treachery against the memory of their founder and against the people who voted for them on the basis of their promises.
They are stroking their way to big fat pensions and dont give a toss for their voters or indeed their hundreds of councillors who will be turfed out at the local election, martyrs for the fat cats at the top.

every single promise has been broken..the grass roots need to get rid of the ones at the top..they have completely sold their souls and are even more right wing than there fascist partners in government

I think we are there already.

Why? What are their rates of Child Benefit? Less than the Irish I’d guess.

Ryan Germany have a less expensive cost of living :)

Sounds like budgeting lessons need to be given. If everyone had to spend cash, no credit cards, it would be interesting to see what spending habits would be.

To be fair the bondholders should be burned, we never should have bailed out the banks. But social welfare cuts are required too , getting us out of this debt is not going to happen by paying child benefit to everyone who miraculously popped out a kid.

There’s plenty of them kind of people out there :-(

i’m curious about the down votes. is it because the truth hurts?

@Olivia. You chose to have your children. Stop whingeing.

*pay child benefit*, not *buy child benefit*

It is up to u to support ure kids, not the tax payer / state. The allowance should be scrapped altogether, u chose to have ure kids, then u will have to shoulder the burden, if u don’t want the added expense then don’t have the kids. Harsh I know but it’s a reality.

@Alan. Especially in today’s economic climate. Times are tough for most of us. Not the current government’s fault. Realistically, Ireland can’t afford all the welfare benefits so drastic measures need to be taken. We pay PRSI to fund potential unemployment, health et al. Not children. Parents haven’t made enough contributions before children are born to fund 18 years’ worth of payments.

@ Chris ure right I will and have made arrangement for my old age, I don’t have kids and won’t because I just can’t afford to, I know my comment was harsh I know that, but it is a very cold truth that most people without kids feel but are not willing to say. I pay my tax I make provisions for my future. I won’t be be expecting Antibes kids to pay or me if I’m not willing to pay for them.

@ Chris ure right I will and have made arrangement for my old age, I don’t have kids and won’t because I just can’t afford to, I know my comment was harsh I know that, but it is a very cold truth that most people without kids feel but are not willing to say. I pay my tax I make provisions for my future. I won’t be be expecting Anyones kids to pay or me if I’m not willing to pay for them.

Hi Lisa, taxes that Alan will have paid his whole working like, so he is entitled to a proper state pension.

@Lisa. I don’t draw a pension. I saved for retirement.

Ignore completely everything FF have to say…a blind man with a stick can see that they’d do exactly the same thing if they were still at the trough. This Twiddly O’Dea doing what all FF are doing…licking our collective arse in the hope that we’ll forget 15 years of them.

Old Twiddle O’Dea got 90k in severance after he lost his Ministry last time, FF said that all that money would be Given back to the tax payer as he still had his seat but Twiddle o’Dea told the tax payer were to shove it. A promise from Willie is as bout as worthless as a signed affidavit from him.

*provided*

Olivia, the statement above sows me you have never put someone into a nursing home, Alan’s assets, old age pension and savings will pay for the nursing home while once again someone who never worked a day in their lives will get it free

On another matter Olivia, I have no problem with my taxes going to health care for the young and old alike which I believe nursing homes, hospices etc would come under.

@Olivia. It wouldn’t be if your children didn’t use up all his taxes now.

That’s odd. You have always been able to opt out. Some of my friends did.

There’s plenty of us who could afford them before the recession hit or have you been under a rock for the last 5 years

Your right and my comment was crass, I should have been specific, I just hate the culture in certain communities where people will have a child purely for the benefits involved like the single mothers allowance, housing etc… These try to justify raising a child as a career, well we’d all like to spend every minute with our children but don’t have the luxury. Like a car bumper sticker I saw “the governments not your babies daddy”

Don’t think the state should be giving money for communion or the like, that’s parental choice & church could tell parents that kids have to be in school uniform to help cut costs

*their*

Olivia, did you even read my comment? You stated that your children might have to pay for Alan’s care when he is elderly and I said probably not as he will most likely have to pay for it himself. You then turn around and give personal example which backs up my point.

I bet Fine Gael love your report especially the cost of it!

On a serious note this government is attacking the wrong people. Like Fianna F?il they are trying to solve the crisis from a bottom up approach ( the low lying fruit). However, what is required is a top down approach and no political party has the backbone to do that. They will have no choice eventually but at least they’ll be able to tell their friends that they put 90%+ of the population into poverty before touching the top 5%.

Stephen while I would share the view of welfare cuts Im curious about the people that are getting welfare & maybe paying off debt & feeding children & maybe just paying interest off their morgages now. If they take another ?50 off these people what would your advice be to these families that are down ?50 a week. What would you say that may comfort them & help them through more financial distress?

Stop paying out Unmarried girls mite stop them having so many kids

Mjhint – well id be in favour of overhauling the welfare system alltogether , consolidate all the payments together and have it all put on a laser card system where the payments automatically go on each week . This cuts overheads in the staffing of offices immediatly. You would not be able to take out any cash on this laser card, or buy cigarettes, alcohol, hholidays, sky tv or save money in a bank. You could only spend the money on food, clothing , schoolbooks, and the essentials. If you went over your allowance you would keep receipts and prove why you needed the extra money and the appropriate amount of welfare could be allocated at a lower cost .

This stops the abuse of the down the pub welfare culture, people ising welfare money for drugs or saving or holidays, and appropriates it where its truly needed, versus a one size fits all model. The first year it would probably cost the guts of a billion to set up, but the savings made by cutting out scroungers would be far greater.

Stephen a totalitarian system so? You are correct that welfare is abused. However last week I visited a man on disability. He had no tv just a laptop internet connection & a phone. He doesnt drink or take drugs. He has a car he cant drive cos its too expensive. He gets rent allowance but has to top up by nearly as much & he cant declare that because he will loose his allowance. He has mental health problems & eats fast food cos it costs a fiver for his dinner. He has nothing & maybe his health will be his next loss. He worked most of his life & circumstance has him here. Now Stephen advice please cos I really cant help him. I dont know what to say to him!

Under the system ive proposed above he would be able to prove he needs more money and he would get it. Everyones seeing what ive said as a cutback for all , in reality families that are truly struggling would receive more , but the abusers would all receive less , cutting out social welfare abuse helps everyone , it gives more to those truly in need and lowers my tax burden . Cash is the enemy here , its untraceable, with the analytic information from a laser card system , a computer could accuratly calculate the needs of families and we would also save money on surveys and expensive reports done by consultants and ministers. Its a win win scenario unless you use the dole to get pissed or buy drugs / holidays / laze around watching tv all day.

I asked you 2 questions Stephen & still no answer. I already agreed with you on the charge of welfare abuse. The problem I face with you is the attitude that all welfare claims are being abused. The system you proposed can still be abused. Actually even more than cash. Just like you I have friends working that are at a stage where work does not pay. In my view this will get worse. So now the most vunerable in society are next & all thats going to happen is we are all going to be poor & some will die from this. Stephen if want things to change get the groups that caused this to pay for it. They have the resources. You will in the future see that you yourself will be affected by poverty in some way. Then you will see the truth. We have very rich people in this country & very poor. The trend is the group in the middle are joining the poor. Both your idea & the governments are doomed to failure. You want fix this? Get people back to work not make them poorer.

Stephen, that’s ridiculous. A system such as the one you suggest would cost a fortune to run. You want to make it automatic with no one administering it. But this would be an extremely complicated system. Who would examine the purchases and review the receipts that you say should be submitted? You haven’t really thought this through, have you?

Yeah Stephen, let everyone who is out of work just starve and live on the streets! Well thought out comment that! As long as live is rosy in the garden for you that’s all that matters yeah? If unemployment benefit was cut there would be a crime wave like nothing ever seen before and I mean violent crime. The country would turn into America during the great depression. So lets not hear from all you hard liners with your statements about taking away in some cases the very life blood of the majority of people on the dole who actually really want to work but can’t find any! I hope you never lose your job pal!

@gerri – thats what Id do with the civil servants currently doing nothing so as not to add them to the live register.

The system would only be expensive to run for the first year or 2 , after that the true financial needs of most family catagories would have been calculated and the vast majority would not have to submit receipts for going over their spending limit.

To anyone giving me a thumbs down – well if you believe anyone on the dole thats living out of mine and your pocket s should be entitled to go on holidays, gamble , buy smokes / drink / drugs or save our tax money away then i truly feel sorry for how misguided you are about the reality of Irelands welfare culture

You have just shown, why people like you shouldn’t have a vote and be gagged till you have experienced life a little! All your money, that keeps the welfare spongers going. it is spent in the economy, keeping jobs going! so everyone on the dole should, be thankful to you for all the money you give them. Grow a little tash, get a doberman and a swaztika for yourself!

I’m guessing Stephen that your experience of life or actually working is incredible small. Certainly not in a productive field of employment anyway.

You got all that from, where pat? I own my home at 40, worked most of my life and wondering why i am explaining myself to You. Whats your life experience, maybe its none of my business and since I asked? Tell us what you achieved Pat, what you think should happen and are you a FG blueshirt supporter?

At least Stephen has the courage to say what he believes in, What about you pat? Why are you so shy about who you are, hiding your identity and attacking others. Are you another college kid, or Stephen himself?

@stephen murphy , i think his comment was meant for me although on thejournal you can never be sure.

Also pat im not a college kid living at home , left home at 18 earning my own funds and Ive been running a business since 2004 , So I think I might have a rough idea of how things work.

Totally agree!

I work, I can barely pay my bank loan and haven’t been on holidays in a few years. Worst part about it is, I wish I had €40 at the end of it.
I’m the person paying the taxes for your social welfare and it seems I might be worse off than you. I agree with the cut to child benefit but I also believe it must be universal cut so that middle and working class Ireland don’t get screwed, while people who never even worked in the boom get the same as they always got.

Nothing in return? What a man! You must have a teleporter, use your torch all the time, have your own well that by the luck of God has clean water, have your own security, have never been sick or choose to have your own doctor educated at your expense. The list goes on. Get a life! We may not receive cash transfers but generally the wealthier you are the more you benefit from your taxes.

You probably don’t need a torch if the teleporter has lights, as you wouldn’t be walking anywhere.