the self employed were always treated badly in comparison with their employees and it simply is not fair or sensible because they are the people who take the risks and put all their efforts into making business viable and making work for others.

Yup.. I shall now be even more screwed.. What’s the point huh?

As a self-employed person for some 15 years I look forward to another year of sleepless nights!
Why? Cause I get NOTHING if things go belly up if my customers dont pay up despite the fact I pay into society like everyone else.
Fair? Don’t mind taking a bit of a hit but come on! This is crazy stuff.

Liking that you posted the rates. Disliking the actual rates

I pay €331 car tax every 3 months in Holland for my 2L car. It’s €710 per year in the budget. Not bad. However, we have decent public transport in Holland.

We don’t even have decent roads, we have expensive and inadequate transport system and with all the crashes around the country due to councils ESP Meath not gritting the roads. Sure why should we pay more for less?? Corrupt government again being let away with.

Totally agree, Terry. Although, in fairness, you can’t compare with the likes of Holland or Denmark – they are much smaller and don’t have a fraction of the rural areas Ireland does. However, the fact that there is no decent infrastructure from even somewhere like Dublin airport to anywhere in Ireland is an embarrassment.

@Michelle, very good point I lived in both those countries you mentioned, they have decent roads and a proper transport system put this country to shame.

@Michelle, you only have to travel up north to see the difference in roads. Its actually an embrassment. Went from donegal into the north a few years ago and it was a shock.

That’s great Christopher. Thanks.

Because he probably won’t.

Well said! A lot of people like to get on their soapbox about how well off those on welfare are, but if they were forced to rely upon it they would soon change their tune!
Especially if the reason that they were forced to rely upon it was due to their health. I wish you the best and hope that something positive will come of all this for you.

Who the F.. K gave you thumbs down. Heartless Bastards.

everyone else will take a slight hit, but because it’s pretty evenly distributed across society, it’s not really as bad as people say it is.

Totally agree. I cannot understand how the so called middle-class are expected to keep the whole country afloat while supposedly poorer working (or non working?) class do not have their welfare payments touched, as if to do so would cause the sky to fall.
It goes without saying that a society must care for its most vulnerable, but a huge amount of social welfare recipients somehow seem to live quite comfortably in comparison to even double income families! Regular foreign holidays, plasma tvs, X Boxes, cigarettes, pints etc with neither parent working is something my wife and I can only scratch our heads and wonder how it’s done. The ‘coping classes’ are not coping at all.

What world are you living in mate. Try live on social welfare for awhile with a small family in a rural with no prospects of a job. Do a bit more research, before putting comments up like that. You will get a little surprise.

Seamus it’s still money for nothing! It’s just disheartening to work so very hard to struggle so much to see the welfare class never be touched! Why get a fuel allowance, free tv licence, medical card, social housing, a lot on free travel passes etc… I’m not attacking everyone but the lazy lifers and long termers and I know everyone knows who I’m talking about

@Cholly, A lot of people forget that this country had the lowest unemployment rates in Europe during the so called celtic tiger. Plus a lot of those entitlements you mentioned are for the elderly with the exception of social housing and the medical card. A lot of myths are being thrown around, without any facts to back it up. Social welfare is an easy target, no union to protect them.

Rememeber, who got us in this mes in the first placand direct you anger towards them and not at people who dont have a voice.

Social Welfare is not money for nothing. While those unfortunate to lose their jobs, through no fault of their own, worked they paid lots of money in tax etc into the social welfare system.

The problem is that the cost of living is increasing, making it impossible for those dependent on welfare to survive on any less, so cutting core welfare payments is not a practical option.
However, as private and public sector wages have been slashed over the past 5 years, the gap between earnings in lower paid employment and welfare payments has narrowed, thus diminishing the incentive for the unemployed to seek work.
Coupled with this government and the last’s spectacular failure to implement any job creation measures whatsoever, the situation is unlikely to improve any time soon.
The cost of living is artificially elevated by businesses’ struggle to maintain the punitive overheads imposed by the state in the form of taxes, rates etc.
Welfare recipients are not to blame if it does not make economic sense to relinquish their payments in favour of some half-baked job bridge scam nor does this mean that welfare payments are excessively generous. Welfare payments are fair and only seem excessive in comparison to wages which have been decimated by successive governments’ mis-management of the state’s finances.

What world am I living on?! I’m living in a world where both my wife and I work full time, pay crèche and child minder fees, mortgage, medical bills, bin charges and universal social charges. There is no relief of allowances for us there. We haven’t had a holiday, apart from a weekend away in Galway, in three years. We don’t smoke and drink only a little and almost never go out as a couple because a babysitter is too expensive. I live in a world of universal social charge, pension loss, fuel increases, no way of getting loans to ease the burden, no one protesting for my rights. No one saying don’t take any more from them ’cause it’s not fair.
That’s the world I live in.

What’s your world like Seamus?
How do you cope?

Be careful, your heart is in danger of bleeding all over the place.

WTF – its always about Social Welfare and they have such a great lifestyle! Man I hear that one more time I am going to throw up!!!! Living on 200 Euro/week with a child NO family support some granny who can replace childcare or taking care of me is NOT A JOKE – but really NOT enough!!! Fact is I CAN NOT pay my oil bill in the moment! Any questions? Well the rich shud be now targeted for gods sake with all their ailes they find to pay NO taxes or so little. And ME I soon can not afford my car anymore and am applying nationwide for jobs so without car I am totally screwed. Living in the country so I can afford the rent and needing the car then to go to the job – and totally alone!!! SO WELFARE IS NOT A LIFESTYLE and not a joke but mainly sleepless nights of worry – no matter how many thumbs down i get!!!!!

Reduce social welfare? What a moron, you try living on E180 a week you clown

Never said it was money for nothing. Social welfare is a policy I totally agree with. However I also agree that recipients should not be consistently protected when it comes to making cuts across the board. It should be proportional, but involve everyone in society.

Sorry, that last comment was for the deluded goverment spin junkie above me, Colin

Dave,I think cholly is refaring to the free loaders who have & never have had any intention of ever working due to our outrageously generous social welfare system we have.Theres a world of difference between these parasites & the decent people who are now in financial free fall because of the decisions of a corrupt few.

Fully agree mate, plenty of people sponging off the system and not even being checked up on. Part time work that would equate to their allowance is fair

@Colin, I understand your anger but lashing out at the percieved lavish lifestyle of social welfare recipents (Regular foreign holidays, plasma tvs, X Boxes, cigarettes, pints etc with neither parent working) is woefully misguided.

Last year this governemnt published a study in partnership with social justice Ireland in which they found that poor families have seen income levels dtrop at a higher rate than income levels at the top and the cost of living has shot up.

Yet, today they are going to drive more poor families into the arms of money lenders so they can heat their homes and pay their elec bill.

Again, direct your anger at those, who got us into this mess in the first place.

I mean I agree that a single young man should NOT get welfare – I APPLY nationwide WHERE ARE actually jobs and with a child so shud be the young lads. there is NO reason at all for them to have a council house – time to leave mummy and go to search for work – spelled FLEXIBILITY!

I’m not angry Seamus, I’m sad and worried. Please don’t patronise me about reports and being woefully misguided and to blame the right people. I live in an estate where, in three of our neighbours’ houses there is 1 adult working out of 6. They all have children, as I do. They have the same house as I do, obviously. They have 5 cars between the three houses.
However, each of these families goes on a 2 week holiday every year (Florida, Spain, Lanzarote respectively last summer in fact). I know the lifestyle they have as I’ve been in each of their houses and I’ve seen the tvs and the x boxes with my own eyes. One family is going to New York for pre-Christmas shopping – the father is the only one working. Now these three houses are my neighbours and we get on great with them. However, with each household in receipt of significant social welfare payments of one sort or another they simply have not got the fear and constant pressure my family suffers. To hear people like you defending these ‘poor’ people regardless of the facts, doesn’t anger me – it breaks my heart and makes me wonder how did I get to this point with my wife and family.

@Colin, So tar everone with the same brush. btw pure hyperbole. I have never seen any family on social welfare living that sort of lifestyle. Unless they were up to their neck in criminal activity..

They’re saving the social welfare cuts for when they need a second bail out.

Well I have seen it Seamus. In fact I see it every day. Literally.Just because you haven’t doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen. I’m not tarring everyone with the same brush – I’m saying it doesn’t make sense to me how SOME, some that I KNOW, on social welfare can have a lifestyle that I and my wife cannot. I’m not begrudging them at all – I’m asking why they must be protected, lifestyle and all, when I am not. It’s that simple. I’m not mad at them, or jealous if them or conflating the whole problem that all social welfare classes are spongers. Just asking why are they untouchable?!

@Colin, and again it was not social welfare that got us into this mess in the first place. What about all those tax breaks for the rich n Only last week those going to private schools can claim some of that back. Or those hiding money in offshore accounts to avoid paying taxes. Do you see where I am going with this Colin and you have mentioned those in your estate at the other end ripping the system.

We know the problem, any solutions Colin rather than pointing the finger. BTW Colin my family and I are emigrating at the end of next year because we have had enough.

Seamus, that’s my point. All the tax breaks, all the privileged, all the loopholes should be treated with the same scrutiny and rigour. As part of that, social welfare should not be immune. We’re all in this together or we’re not.
I’m very sorry to hear of your personal situation and wish you and your family all the very best. Go neiri an t-adh libh.

Y’know, that’s weird.. I know a family living on welfare (I know a few, but I’ll use one specific example).
They moved down the country during the boom because the price of houses near the rest of their family were ludicrous. The father was working – they were doing ok. Then the bust hit and he got laid off, 2nd time in the time limit so redundancy was taxed at a much higher rate.

Now they are in a county with no jobs in it or the next ones over, in negative equity, and reliant upon welfare (which they only got when redundancy ran out). They have a family member in citizens info, so they are claiming EVERYTHING that they are entitled to.
Family of seven, €350 per week – due to reduce a little due to cuts in child benefit. This is for mortgage, school, fuel, bills, food etc..
They can’t afford holidays.. The TV came from a friend who was upgrading their own, the Xbox was a second hand job – as are any games. Car is second hand, in fact – anything that they have was got on the serious cheap.

I’m sure they, and the family member in citizens info would like to know which extra payment these guys with the lavish lifestyles are claiming that keeps them so comfortable..

Seamus never said you were MATE! I also pay high rates of tax and have seen a drop income due to last couple of budgets, don’t have kids but I do not begrudge all you randy feckers pumping out those walking € signs called kids, obviously I jest but arguments can be made on both sides

Peace!

People who have difficulty paying their mortgages can apply for Mortgage Interest Supplement, and once they are in receipt of it, they will be exempt from the Property Tax.

why the budjet wasn that bad!i don’t support either party actually I resent them but they could have done a lot worse

whoever red thumbed you needs a good slap to wake them up.

Wouldn’t it be more constructive to pinpoint individual or multiple provisions that you object to?

Ha ha Vinnie priceless. You been sucked in by all this pre budget propaganda of what was going to be cut and taxed. The government has tricked you into thinking this way of accepting now what budget they throw at you. Congratulations. You are now part of the “it could of been worse” brigade.

@berg..it could have been worse..fuel could have been hiked instead they left it and will rebate tax compliant haulers which brings down cost of transportation of goods saving you money on bread milk and electronics..really it won’t strain anyone..
tax and vat will not increase how is this bad??
fags and booze up a bit boo hoo it costs millions to treat cancer and alcohol induced incidents….
a small amount in car tax can’t afford it get a smaller engined car who needs to #0

*who needs to do 0-60 in 7seconds

Do you rent Vinnie?

Any kids Vinnie?

@ theheathen picking out easy targets is just silly everyone is going to suffer a little..
but the budjet also decreased vat in construction all these little adjustments help a country grow economically..
I wouldn pay the house tax and won’t out of principle..
relax a 10r a month Isin much to give up on a child over all I’m down a lot more than that but it could have been worse..
you are just looking for something to moan about..

Good point, should be means tested. Any family earning over a hundred grand should not be getting child benefit. Fianna Fail made that a universal payment to win votes. An absolute joke, orignally it was brought in for poor families.

I remeber whatt it was like at your age as well , you dont forget . weekly trips by train to Dublin looking for a job then broke for the remainder of the week.

Not true. I’m the son of a farmer, got no college grant. There’s many more besides me, this believe that all farmers children get the grant is ludicrous. I know alot of farmers heavily encourage their kids to enter third level as there is no hope of them being able to support themselves off the land.

Wrong. Im a farmers son and had to take out a student loan to put me through college. The only people in my course who get student grants are those who dont actually have a farm. Stick that in your pipe and smoke it

Farmers produce the food that you eat every day, you’d do well to remember that. If you enjoy quality Irish food produce and not hormone laden Brazilian beef and Asian chicken then you should support Irish farmers. Most people can’t make a living from farming anymore in Ireland that is why their children go on to 3rd level.

Martin,, what?

Hang’em high is this your solution!

Very good point, its all about their contributions to society, is how our government sees them . Look at the savage cuts in our carers allowance for the answer to that one. The lack of funding and cuts to our mental health services . Cuts in child benefits, the rise in elder abuse in Irish families and society in general. Prisons full, hospitals straining over the lack of resoursces and staff . Really what contributions to these people actually make.????

Yes the payment of 1700euros has been reduced to 1350 that you get in June

And here’s the problem in a nutshell. No encouragement to look for work. Thank you Mr Deane for making my point. The “thank God social welfare wasn’t touched” mentality. A slap in the face to us poor eejits who do work and yet find ourselves no better off for it. I’m a worker, working hard all my life. I’m a father, i’ll go without so my family have. But because I work they say this is no problem for me. If I don’t work, this government will provide for me. So why would I work? Why do I work? Am I only kidding myself? Certainly looks that way. I hear people say they were working and through no fault of their own lost their jobs and are now entitled to welfare. By that logic, when I retire am I going to receive a back payment from the government for the welfare I didnt claim? Can’t wait for that!