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Dublin: 13 °C Saturday 25 May, 2013

‘We still live in a Magdalene Ireland’

The waiting game continues for survivors of the Magdalen Laundries despite report confirming direct State involvement in the system.

A general view of a plaque dedicated to Magdalane Laundry survivors in St Stephens Green in Dublin.
A general view of a plaque dedicated to Magdalane Laundry survivors in St Stephens Green in Dublin.
Image: Niall Carson/PA Wire/Press Association Images

CYNICAL. BIZARRE. BAFFLING. Disappointing. Disingenuous. Horrifying. Inept. Half-hearted. Shameful.

Those are just some of the words used today to describe Taoiseach Enda Kenny’s response to the Report of the Inter-Departmental Committee to establish the facts of State involvement with the Magdalen Laundries.

Survivors and advocacy groups expressed their disappointment at his failure to offer a full and official apology in the wake of Senator Martin McAleese confirming there was direct State involvement in the system.

“That is not an apology,” was a phrase expressed multiple times at two separate press conferences, held by Magdalene Survivors Together and the Justice for Magdalenes group, in Dublin’s city centre.

Mari Steed, the daughter of a Magdalene, went further in her criticism. “Today, if anything, showed us that Mr Kenny might eat his own words when he said we should no longer be living in a Magdalen Ireland. And I think we still are.” Her words were met with nods, and groans of agreement from the rest of the panel.

Apology for Magdalene Laundry women

A corridor in the now derelict Sisters of Our Lady of Charity Magdalene Laundry on Sean McDermott St in Dublin’s north inner city. (Image: Julien Behal/PA Wire/Press Association Images)

Claire McGettrick of Justice for Magdalenes added, “To get up in the Dáil and refuse to apologise to a group of ageing, vulnerable group of women…is frankly cynical.”

“This could have been good day…this could have been a good news story. But it is continuing and prolonging the torture. These women want a bit of peace before they die.

“Dragging out this process is cynical, cruel, torturous and not good enough.”

05/02/2013. Magdalene Survivor's together press co

Marina Gambold, a survivor speaks to TheJournal.ie, about her hopes for an apology. (Image: Sasko Lazarov/Photocall Ireland)

Marina Gambold is a survivor hoping with fervour that she will hear an apology.

“I would love him to say it. I would cry with gladness.” She has previous experience of how the words could help.

“I’d love him to say it because Bertie Aherne done it to the other schools. I was happy that day because my brother was in Artane. An apology to me would mean the world, a million dollars.”

Finding herself without adult family at the age of 16, the Wexford native was taken by a priest to the Sisters of the Good Shepherd laundry in New Ross.

“The day I went in, I was so sad when she said your name isn’t Marina anymore, it’s Fidelma.

“My brother when he came to find me when he came out of Artane school, he came in and [the sister] said, ‘Who are you looking for?’ and he said Marina Byrne. I thought it was very sad, he looked for me for three years. He is in Australia now – he’d never come back.”

(They now have a great relationship and talk most days. She also has another brother who she did not meet until he ws 15 years old.)

“I would love to have been brought up with my mother and father. I always felt as if I wasn’t normal,” the 78-year-old told TheJournal.ie. “They put a lot of fear into us.”

05/02/2013. Magdalene Survivor's together press co

Maureen Sullivan reacts during a press conference this afternoon. (Image: Sasko Lazarov/Photocall Ireland)

Marina was one of four survivors to talk during the Magdalene Survivors Together press conference following the release of the report. While they all welcomed the publiction for its ability to show they were “telling the truth” about their past.

They shared horror stories of their time in the laundries; of being fed nothing but bread and dripping or watered-down milk, of punishments which included eating that inhumane meal off the floor or being locked on an outdoor balcony for two day and two nights, of 15-hour work days which left them with “housemaid’s knees”.

The common painful memory of all four women was when their names were changed on entering the institutions.

“They took my name, they took my identity,” said Maureen Sullivan. They also took the school books and pencil case she had brought with her, along with the expectation or reality of an education.

“I will go to the grave with the pain,” Mary Smyth proclaimed. “It is soul destroying. Worse than prison.”

What happens now?

Barrister Maeve O’Rourke explains that the incidence of abuse, forced paid work and incarceration across Ireland’s 10 Magdalene Laundries had been established prior to this report.

What Martin McAleese has provided today is proof that some of the excuses previously made by the State in relation to the women who survived the system are untrue. When Magdalenes were omitted from the Ryan commission and the Residential Institutions Redress Board it was because the laundries were described as private entities, run independently of the State.

When asked about State collusion or commitals, Ministers have claimed that the majority of women entered the facilities of their own free will and that no children were found in the convent dormitories.

“All those things – the idea that there weren’t children in the laundries, the idea that the State didn’t refer women and girls there and the idea that the State didn’t know because the State wasn’t inspecting – all those three reasons have been proved to be untrue,” said O’Rourke.

“UNCAT is watching this very carefully. It gave a one year deadline in June 2011 for not only an independent and thorough investigation but also for the women to obtain redress within that time. It is not going away from their desk and the Irish government goes to different human rights committees every year or two years.”

Katherine O’Donnell, also of JFM warns that the issue is not going away.

“There is significant international interest. There is international spotlight on Ireland and the news today is that there is absolute irrefutable evidence of State involvement in the Magdalen Laundry system and the State has refused to apologise. And that’s the story that’s going to be out there for the next two weeks, watching to see what the Government does.”

Samantha Long, who told her mother Margaret’s story on Twitter and to TheJournal.ie recently, is somewhat optimistic at the end of a day she described as “lonely”.

“We’ve been waiting so long for this. The report is very long and there’s a lot to digest. I’m glad that Senator McAleese’s inquiry has confirmed that there was State involvement in the Magdalene Laundries and I’m anticipating the Dáil debate in two weeks time. I really would like to hear a full State apology because that is what most of us are waiting for, as opposed to money or anything else.

“I hope the Taoiseach or the Minister for Justice find it in their hearts to to that for the women, for my late mother. She can’t have anything else, only a moral victory. That’s all that she wants. I hope for that for her.”

READ: Magdalene Laundries report finds direct State involvement

Religious orders offer apology for abuse in Magdalene Laundries

Magdalene Laundries made very little money, says report

In numbers: the report into the State’s role in the Magdalene Laundries

Taoiseach stops short of apologising for Magdalene Laundries, angering survivors

Read next:

Comments (71 Comments)

  • We should all cry out in rage over the wicked humiliation and maltreatment of these girls and women.

    It is a simple issue of right and wrong.

    The religious orders, the judiciary and the State are all culpable.

    I hate and I deplore the marginal profit issue. We barely made any profit!!!! how is that relevant?

    As for the absence of a full apology by the Taoiseach, this was an day of infamy in his political career. He is sorry for them!

    Reply
  • Black day for Ireland. Black day for justice.

    Reply
    • so far there has been no justice, only cold scripted words which could have come from any where being sent to any one, empty, cold and worthless.
      Clearly the land of good men and strong women has been lost down the rabbit hole

      (The stars are not wanted now put out every one;
      Pack up the Moon and dismantle the Sun;
      Pour away the Ocean and sweep up the wood;
      For nothing now can ever come to any good.) ” Funeral Blues”

      Reply
  • What was it if not slavery?

    The collusion between the state and these institutions between 1922 and 1996 is well documented in that the “state played a role in funding and regulating the laundries, which were commercial operations that never paid wages to inmates who often did not know why they had been committed or for how long.”

    What a terrible indictment of Ireland, the Catholic Church there and the religious communities involved.

    Shame on them.

    I cannot begin to imagine what went on in these Magdalen laundries, these prisons of bodies and souls.
    God bless those courageous, brave and determined women who are speaking out and fighting for justice.

    Sister Maureen Paul Turlish
    Advocate for Victim/Survivors & Legislative Reform
    New Castle, Delaware
    maturlishmdsnd@yahoo.com

    Reply
  • if the state was found to have been directly involved in the magdalene laundries, surely it’s time our president as head of state apologised unreservedly to the women involved, living and deceased.

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  • I love my country, i am the proudest irishman alive, but tonight i am ashamed. Utterly ashamed

    Reply
  • Th women should have received an apology from the State. They didn’t as the State would be left open to many court cases. It shouldn’t matter but this administration on behalf of the State has decided otherwise. It is sad and disheartening to live on this Island sometimes.

    And still the Catholic church wields influence in this State, instead of being kicked out of it.

    Reply
  • Our Taoiseach’s moral compass is off kilter.

    It is interesting and significant that UNCAT appreciates the true gravity of maltreatment.

    If the Taoiseach does not unreservedly apologise, then we will know him for what he is.

    Reply
  • Here’s hoping at some point justice will be done, and these women at the very least receive the apology they deserve.

    Reply
  • Makes me want to vomit – my stomach in knots reading about how they took their identity away, changed their name, and emotionally assasinated their childhood, and used them as work horses – lets get onto the streets people – no appology by Kenny, we should not appologise for getting out there and letting the immorality that went on here – we should make him appologise……..look at the judge 2 weeks ago who had to appologise and put a rapist in jail – only by showing our disgust do they ever change.

    The image that sticks in my head is the innocent child, described in the article above, standing there with her bag, entering this Nazi camp, and them taking thier little pencil case and calling them their ”new name” – the equavelent of a nazi number or a stamp , to dehumanise them. Imagine how lost and utterly terrified and alone that child would be. As a primary school teacher I am disgusted and horrified and even more so that the leader of our country will not emphatically and unequivocally appologise. He better get a grip and do it fast or I really think, in light of this unhumane treatment, we all have to stand up for the moral good – and get out and strike for the joke that is currently Ireland.

    Reply
  • Shocked at the blasé apology. Enda Kenny has let himself, his party, Ireland and most importantly the women who endured the hardships and stigma thst these labour camps inflicted. Truly despicable. Can anyone offer a reason why the apology was so half hearted? Is it fear of having to compensate these women? Baffled I am.

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  • The very least these women and their families deserved today was an apology from the state. The report makes for some very distressing reading, and a deplorable degradation of basic human rights.

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  • A disgusting display of cowardice by our government.

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  • Heart breaking for the survivors and no justice for all the women who lost their lives.
    Shameful for the Goverment so embarrassing for the Irish people.
    Michael D should step forward with an apology he is the champion of human rights. ?

    Reply
  • Unbelievable how Kenny won’t apologise to this women.

    Reply
    • What did he do? And in some cases they were incarcerated for committing crime.

      Reply
    • So you condone the abuse of “some” women?

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    • john, you should be ashamed of urself, trollin on this story. it’s horrific what happened to those girls. the state should apologise.

      Reply
    • John, F%^# off!

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    • drag your knuckles back under your stone john duggan. im ashamed to know a neanderthal creature like you skulks the long grasses of this country spouting verbal diarrhea…

      Reply
    • And what crimes were these,John? The fact that in those days, men weren’t seen as being able to raise children alone? The fact that they were orphans and their carers had either died or were unable to care for them anymore? Or the fact that they were born into abject poverty and their parents thought they were doing what they thought was best for their children and handing them over to what they thought were kind and compassionate nuns?

      Maybe you should go and do some research, and read about how some of the women who had fallen on hard times had resorted to prostitution of theft to feed their children begged and pleaded with them to send them to prison rather than the laundries. Because unlike nowadays, they didn’t have a weekly payment from the Social Welfare, because there was none. Now toddle off and either do your research or climb back under your bridge.

      Reply
  • Of course these women and all who were mistreated deserve an apology. What will it achieve though. They deserve so much more than that, compensation for a start and anyone who is alive who bears any responsibility deserves punishment of some sort. Name and shame as well.

    I am sure a more definitive apology from Enda Kenny will be forthcoming, but he was probably prepped by his pr men today, perhaps badly, to say what he did. I am not defending him, as I am no supporter of Kenny, but this is a likely scenario. Was it dealt with poorly? Yes.

    I am not surprised either by the state involvment / knowledge of what went on. And like it or not we do live in a different country now. This could not and would not happen today. We are only a generation or two past a very old fashioned country that allowed so much to go on without anything being said. People forced into priesthood and the nuns against their will. Abuse of all sorts carried out by religious orders, and so much more.

    Enda Kenny may not have covered himself in glory today, but this report coming out is ultimatly good. Good that there are no more cover ups, good that the abused have some vindication, good that this won’t happen again, good that the government and the church will no longer silence people. People are now not afraid to stand up to institutions.

    I hope the women abused by the magdelene laundries can find some comfort somewhere, somehow. By god do they deserve it.

    Reply
  • Why won’t the government issue an apology, what are they afraid of. Most of these women are in their twilight years and for them this is what they need.

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  • Its heartbreaking to hear/read, and it makes one very angry too .. feel for all involved

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  • A direct apology means admission of culpability and thus can open the door to massive claims for compensation. They are not sorry.

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    • #Garry I agree, but what are the people of Ireland, not just those who live in Ireland but people like my self who are expats to do any sort of strong group resistance, I would close every door of every church in Ireland having turned off the lights first.

      Reply
  • Enda Kennys comments in the Dail today were very wrong. The survivors must have been very hurt by his response.
    Shocking his advisers aloud him to say what he said and Labour Party members said nothing.

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  • For everyone angered by the Magdalene report, a couple of questions:

    – If you are married, did you get married in a church?
    – If you have children, do you send them to a church-run school?

    Irish people are among the biggest hypocrites in the world when it comes to the church.

    On one hand, they are happy to be a catholic when it suits them.

    At the same time, they are fully aware of the injustices visited on the people of Ireland (& worldwide) by the church.

    The best way to fight the CC is to remove them as much as possible from your life.
    – Stop going to church
    – If you’re getting married, go for a civil ceremony. Sure, some older relatives might be unhappy but it’s YOUR day!
    – Send your kids to non-denominational schools
    – Refuse all requests for donations. Having visited the vatican (& their museums), I can confirm the church has no need for your weekly couple of euro. That’s not to mention their Mussolini/fascism funded property empire…

    Unfortunately the majority of people here will just leave a comment saying how unfortunate the whole affair is, feel a bit better about themselves & get on with their daily lives. Shameful.

    Reply
  • The hypocrisy of an Taisoseach is unreal. In July 2011 he issued a stinging attack on the Vatican for doing exactly what he is doing… Declining to take full responsibility for a direct role in institutional abuse.. Absolutely disgusting…
    What is it about our political system.. which means in opposition, politicians have a conscience and integrity but once in power, they become duplicitous, defensive and ultimately dishonest…

    Reply
  • ,a state where leaders of that state refuses to say sorry for holding children, girls and women against their will as in”"” genocide”"” is a state where people power needs to remove them by force if needs be, shame on the lot of you state/church/gardai/courts/judges/ the legal profession and any person in the knowledge of this

    Reply
  • Having heard a number of these women in interviews, they aren’t bitter or totally broken, I agree totally shame on our state and government but bless these women.I’m no great believer, far from it but I doth my cap in life to these brave, strong women. I wish you nothing but happiness and lots of family, all that, you were denied as youngsters. I’m from a big family myself and to think one(of many I’m sure) lady’s brother tired to claim her on her orignal and rightful name, I have 10 brothers makes me want to cry. God bless you all, I can say that as a young woman and mean it from the heart cos God has nothing to do with the Catholic Church especailly the Irish Catholic Church. I’ve always been proud of my nationality even after our malaise after the recession hit and our people are on there knees but I’m still thankful we aren’t on our knee directly to the church anymore. RIP all those that have passed I hope your memories survive for you and your families and for us drones to always remember and never let history repeat itself again.

    Reply
  • i pray these women go to UN for help,,our government cant even apologise, UN ordered this investigation,, sorry Enda should be kicked out on the steps and never again to be seen or heard of,,, he is unreal heartless ,,, fg and labour will never again get a vote from me,,, enda trying to shift the blame to sf what a joke,,,, the ira and sf are two different identities enda,,, sorry but its true,, why or could i vote fg in,, i am paying for my sin,,,

    Reply
  • Slave Trade

    The laundries “made no profit” despite big laundry contracts with the Defence forces, large hotels, cross channel ferries etc and an unpaid workforce. “No physical abuse went on” either. Establishment Ireland at its finest, waiting for the victims to die off.

    Reply
  • Every country has a secret of abuse in some form or fashion. Redemption is in how the abuse is realized and resolved. Forgiveness can only be given when acts are made to insure such can never be repeated again.

    So I ask you… Why should anyone apologies at this time. It would be far to soon for an apology. Nothing has been done to remedy the situation. The church and the state are still tethered together by our constitution.

    Together the church should stand hand in hand apologizing. While supporting the division of church and state as they handed awards to survivors and immediate family members.

    Reply
  • Again I am appalled when i read the stories of a by gone Ireland, this fills me with dread when i think of these women many i have met they have never been un able to voice their feelings as they were compleaty affected by this thoes still living will never get over it, and I am talking about real life expierence, they were used as slaves to make money for the Catolic church I for one have seen it from the inside I was very unlucky that day in Dublin to have met with two Nuns Rev Mother Sister Margaret, and Sister Carmel, their was no hesitation please do not belive them they made so much money because we all know the church owned the land, and it was only then 133 bodies were found burried withine the grounds of Hyde Park, this will stay with me forever, but they frequently took young girls, and yes once you got inside their was no escape, they were cruel beyond believe,

    Reply
  • day 2 of cop out,,, enda should be whipped and stripped and thrown in to slavery,, see how he likes it,,,oh and shave his head,,, good for the some of the people of ireland but his above us,, and yes i voted that dictator in,,,

    Reply
  • Dr McAleese’s statement about the Religious Congregations involved: “Their position is that they responded in practical ways as best they could, in keeping with the charism of their congregations, to the fraught situations of the sometimes marginalised girls and women sent to them, by providing them with shelter, board and work. They state clearly that they did not recruit women for these institutions. The committee found no evidence to contradict this position.”
    The report also states that, the laundries operated “for the most part on a subsistence or close to break even basis.”
    It is important that religious orders acknowledge the part they played in the entire issue and it is also important that a system which had the support of many sectors of Irish society is not now presented as a matter only for religious orders if the necessary healing and reconciliation is to be found .

    Reply
  • #Grainne Campbell . Not for a moment are those women allowing themselves to show how ‘bitter’ or ‘broken’ they really are. their teaching thought them to accept blindly. All part of the psychological mind control imposed on them.
    How can you believe in a God that allows some thing like this to happen ? just thought I would ask ?

    Reply
  • I hope all these so called survival groups both in London and in Ireland will stop giving false hope to survivors it is not helping with the healing thease so called meetings are doing more harm then good, Gabrielle

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  • The Magdalene laundry orders are still in 2013 abusing ‘fallen women’ and the Government is still funding them. How can there be any genuine apology in these circumstances? http://www.paddydoyle.com/laundry-orders-run-sex-workers-aid-group/

    Reply

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