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“MY GOODNESS, YOU are officers of the law and trained detectives – I am shocked.”
This was TD Mary-Lou McDonald’s reprimand of Garda Commissioner Nóirín O’Sullivan and her Deputy Commissioner Donal O Cualáin as the Oireachtas Public Accounts Committee (PAC) tried to nail down why serious irregularities in the finances of the Garda College were not addressed before now.
Her outburst followed a bizarre exchange in which the organisation’s Executive Director of Human Resources, John Barrett, openly contradicted O’Sullivan about a meeting they had in relation to these issues in 2015.
These irregularities included a fund that was used for gifts and entertainment, rent collected for a site that should have been paid to the Office of Public Works and the transfer of money to the Garda Boat Club, which was described by one TD today as “embezzlement”.
In the more than five-hour hearing, the Commissioner told politicians that she first became aware of the extent of the issues when she received a report with recommendations from her head of legal affairs on 28 July that year.
Prior to that, on 27 July there was a very brief conversation in a room after meeting in Templemore in which Mr Barrett raised issues around work he was doing.
“The meeting was over two hours – it’s in the minutes,” Barrett interjected. He had become aware of audits from 2008 and 2010 that identified accounting irregularities and flagged them with his chief administrative officer. He had then compiled a report bringing the contents of these two audits together.
“My memory is that it was a brief meeting,” the Commissioner commented, in response to his contradiction.
At this point Sinn Féin’s McDonald asked for a short break for O’Sullivan to read Barrett’s minutes, noting that a two hour meeting is not “brief”.
The executive director of HR went on to explain that his detailed notes included “believe it or not”, the order in which people came into the room. This meeting began, he said, at 5.20pm.
I left the meeting at 19.37 and I was the first to leave.
“This is deeply problematic,” McDonald told garda managers, before asking Deputy Commissioner O Cualáin, from his recollection, how long this meeting was.
“I just note it was a very long day in the college,” was his response.
“My goodness, you are officers of the law and trained detectives – I am shocked,” the Sinn Féin TD hit back.
“My memory was that it was not a formal meeting, we were having some tea in the reception room,” the Commissioner said.
‘Embezzlement’
O’Sullivan and her management colleague had been summoned by the PAC to answer questions about a recent damning audit report on finances at the college.
In its report, the force’s internal audit department said it could offer no assurance that the internal management and control systems in place to manage the finances at the Garda College are adequate. It also described a control account called Sportsfield Co as a ‘corporate veil’ and revealed a ‘laundry’ account was used to pay for gifts, entertainment and society fees.
Members of the committee were left frustrated as the answer to question after question was, essentially, ‘we don’t know’.
Garda management was not clear about who had made certain vital decisions after issues were identified as far back as 2008, though the Commissioner promised work is being done to find this out.
“It seems to me there were attempts made by people within the garda college to frustrate the work of GIAS [Garda Internal Audit Section],” TD David Cullinane commented.
Later, Marc MacSharry suggested the transfer of €100,000 from Templemore’s funds to the Garda Boat Club was “embezzlement”. Several other members of the committee asked the Commissioner whether there were grounds to support the fact that a crime was committed.
“I have asked the people who have conducted the audit to date if there is anyone in the line management stream – all the way from the chief administrative officer, Mr Barrett, all the way down, or Mr Kelly, who conducted the audit report – who has reasonable grounds to suspect that a crime has been committed at this point. I have been informed that there are no such grounds,” she told the committee.
Executive director of HR John Barrett, however, said it was “too early to say”.
‘Duped’
And the force’s head of audit, Niall Kelly, revealed he had sought copies of the 2008 audit of Templemore’s accounts that year and in 2009 but he did not receive them.
He said he brought up this issue with management at the time and in 2011 he noted this in a report to then Commissioner Martin Callinan. Kelly told the committee he later removed this paragraph from the final version of the report, having received assurances that the issues would be addressed. He said he regretted this decision.
“In hindsight, I would say I probably shouldn’t have taken the assurances that were provided to me.”
Later, when asked whether he felt he had been “duped”, Kelly said he did.
He told the committee he has never had a full staffing complement, as he was building his team right before recruitment moratorium kicked in. It should be at 11 – even now after additions to the team it is at 8.
The Garda Commissioner said an expansion of this section of the organisation had been approved and there are discussions now with the Policing Authority with a view to starting recruitment for the necessary skilled staff.
At the end of the more than five-hour hearing, the committee’s chair Alan Kelly described it succinctly as “extraordinary, incredible and frankly unbelievable.”
“I do not feel there is a unified team here, and I don’t have confidence the issues are being dealt with.”
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What is the governments long term plan for rhe renting population that reach retirement age?
Never thought about that, that’s a serious ticking time bomb!
I bet nobody in government has thought about it either!
I doubt the government even care.
Hotels, probably.
We can all live on simon coveney yoga mats in cold damp rooms ah he wanted homeless people to do in the homeless cafe
Ask him how many properties he owns that he rents out!
Ask him why kildare especially around Intel is not included in the new legislation. My rent has gone up 300 euro and I can’t sleep with the stress of trying to find the money. I can’t afford to save for deposit on house, so what help is he going to give
Catherine Murphy has been pushing this and she highlighted the daft quarterly report which shows Kildare has the 2nd highlight average rent in Leinster with the fastest rising rents. Followed closely by Wicklow. Both counties need rent certainty now and I don’t think 4% does enough. On a separate note rent paid should be a factor for mortgage approval but pur government wants everyone renting so their vulture pals can make steady profit.
Ask the minister what he has to say about my rent being increased 15% just 2 days before the new 4% cap was introduced. Obviously not illegal but immoral. The answer is to problem is so simple, build more houses and apartments.
@Brian Mc Donald: Were you given the 90 days notice you’re meant to receive?
Ask him why did fg allow vulture funds the run of the country.
Why did fg give vulture funds charitable status.
Does he agree with his leader that vulture funds have many needs including only pay €8000 in tax with billions in this country.
@LITTLEONE: Might aswell ask himself how he can look into the mirror after selling out the country
@Dave Kelly: your right. Better off just asking questions about what he eats for breakfast and does he thinks his fantastic . Because probably be only answers he will give. Everything is just optics like this charade of asking questions.
Bliderberg boy is only following instructions
We need to vote these people out or we will face another 5 years of rising rents, increased homelessness & profit for vulture funds
Ask him why his party are traitors to the Irish people?The Great Irish Sell Off on RTE tonight shows what Norman, Kenny et al have facilitated. Vulture funds are buying apartments and houses for 10 grand a pop in bulk while I pay that in one year for rent in Dublin!
*Noonan
I was gonna ask what’s Norman got to do with it? I quite like Norman. Noonan on the other hand….
What was he doing as an elected member of the Dail,going to a secret elitist meeting?
And how much he’s personally gained from Ansbacher.We let them away with murder.
Ask him does he do everything that his Bilderburg friends demand and how much or what are they paying him?
I’d like to ask a few questions of the Minister:
Can you please explain to me how my boyfriend and I, who are both newly qualified teachers, are supposed to afford an apartment within Dublin?
Could he explain to me why there is such a ridiculous cap on the height of buildings within Dublin which limits development?
May I also ask, if the minister has ever been to Manchester, a city of similar size to Dublin, and what he thinks of their amazing mix of high-rise accommodation, very affordable rent, and preservation of character of the city?
Lastly, why is Dublin being limited to such ridiculous limitations – if everyone wants to live near/in Dublin where the jobs are?
Ask him why homelessness has risen under FG. And give him stick if he brings up FF. Then ask him why I’m bothering asking yous this because he’s a politician and will have some sort of deflection and yous won’t even ask him this ok bye.
Ask him is there anything FG accept responsibility for without blaming FF or heading off on a deflecting tirade about SF …
I’d like to ask a question of the Minister: Can you please explain to your electorate the relationship between IMF policies and the housing crisis? Also would you let them know that the crisis can never be solved as the IMF won’t allow it? Thanks.
Ask him why are the rights of the citizens the very, very last thing on the list of priorities when it is citizens that pay his wages and who are the raison d’etre of his job as a TD?
Does the minister feel any guilt for the way his government carries on, their corrupt practices and the suffering that they inflict?
Ask him to describe Ireland in 5 or 10 years time if the corruption of FF and FG (and others) is allowed to go unchecked?
Will he be happy when no-one can afford to live in Dublin, with nurses and guards et al commuting for 4 hours a day?
If he can’t bring any real solutions to the housing crisis and homelessness will he commit to justifiably not running for the leadership of FG or will he resign as a TD?
Can the economy take the pressure when people realize that the only way they can survive is to demand, insist and even strike for more wages to pay E2000 for 3 Bed Semi and does he think he will be around to have to deal with that problem when it arises?
How much will health care costs, counseling costs, mental health services costs and associated costs be when FG is finished running us into the ground and will it have been worth it or will it turn out to be false economy?
Does the minister understand the concept of “long term thinking”?
Finally, did the deputy feel any shame when he partook in last years 1916 commemorations, did he feel any pangs of guilt for our real heroes and their sacrifices?
Why is he protecting and ensuring the renal market while he has conflict of interest and should he now do the honourable thing now and step down
Has anybody in the Dáil raised the possibility of restoring the rent tax credit that is gone from this year? It’s a small mercy to people renting, but makes a difference. It was a welcome support during the boom years, but was gradually abolished as part of austerity measures.
Why does Fg complain about rental increases when their policies have both driven up rental costs, ensured landlords leave the market, and weaken market demand for property and hence construction. Fg imposed 4% prsi + 7% usc on top of 40% paye tax so 51% tax an increase of 11%. When added to Lpt this means the effective rental tax rate in Dublin is aporox 62% an increase of 22%….
@gregory:@gregory: add to that why can an investor from outside Ireland pay less than 10℅ tax on rental income. Also that same investor can then sell on and make a profit and pay no capital gains. . Is it now true that being an Irish man is treated with distaste . If so you have treated us with treason and therefore should be procured.
Ask him how many pensions he has?
Ask him does he agree with ff proping up fg?
Ask him can he add? (hint 2,000,000,000)
Finally ask him does lying come natural to him?
Have price controls ever worked? Have the never heard of the black-market?
If a property’s controlled rent is, lets say €1,500 but it’s real market price is €1,800 what’s to stop €1,500 going through the books and €300 under the table?
Either the landlord will “suggest” it or a tenant will offer it to get ahead of the que, but it’s certain to happen.
Ask them their opinion on leftist fake news
Why you taking homes of family’s !! Then paying hotels to put them up it seriously does other make sense !! Do you know how many people committed suicide over losing there homes ! Do you care about our people our kids please answer .
Why can’t tenants on HAP payment stay on social housing list? They still cannot afford to completely house themselves and have little security of tenure in private rental market. What do they do when they hit 65?
Ask him why he’s taking so long to throw Inda in front of the bus?
My Question to put Simply is “Are you having a #$$@!^# Laugh”.
Can anyone ask Simon does he have any clue about how to solve this crisis????
The FG gov plan was to have the homeless crisis solved by 2016. (homeless because they can’t afford the RENT)
Does Coveney know what year this is?
I’m more concerned about my bins not getting collected anymore thanks to this government but I’ll wait until you can put my questions to the minister for the environment which will hopefully happen soon.
@Oiche Fairy: In fairness at least your bins have a home unlike many Irish citizens now days……
1) Name an example worldwide where rent controls have succeeded in doing anything other than causing massive underinvestment in the affected areas?
2) How many of the current cabinet / governenment ruling parties are renting, how many are landlords?
3) What about landlords who found good tenants and rewarded them with below market-price rents? They will now be penalised by limiting their rent increase to 4% per annum while taking on potentially risky new tenants.
4) Have you ran your plans past any independent economic experts?
5) Do you agree that rising house prices actually suits most of the electorate and thats why nothing will be done to reduce house prices, rather you prefer to give FTB grants which go directly to developers.
Ask him dose he fill his swimming pool with water from the tap or does he ship it in specially using the political discount.
Ask him is he enjoying his xmas holidays, anything nice planned for the next week before he gets back to work?
Can we swap extreme rents for credit points towards pension, same with high interests on mortgages? What do you think?
Ask the Minister how has he left young children homeless ? How in God’s green earth can the members of this government FG, go to sleep every night knowing there is over 1500 children living in hotels throughout this country. It’s disgraceful. FG should be ashamed of themselves
When will the government be introducing new regulations on vulture funds to protect Irish citizens from flash eviction notices? Why wasn’t this done from the beginning?
Why did they not reinstate Mortgage Interest Relief or some other scheme to help mortgage holders out if they become unemployed or I’ll, as they do with renters?
If they had helped us with interest payment on our mortgage, until we got back on our feet and which was very little as we had a tracker mortgage, we would probably not have lost our family home.
Instead the state is now paying 3 times as much in rent allowance to help us pay our rent while we are at college and trying to get back on our feet.
A scheme like this could avoid thousands from losing their homes and falling into family homelessness. Completely avoidable!!!
On the question front can you ask him why SECTION 110 companies are able to deduct interest on property loans when calculating taxable profits, while the regular Irish citizen (real people) lost the mortgage interest relief a few years back. It seems crazy that companies are being treated better than people in the eyes of the law. Taking it a step further will robots soon have more rights than an Irish citizen?
From reading some of the epic comments here I can’t wait for Wednesday…
Why are you introduce rent controls?
It’s not fair on landlords who provide want a good ROI, and their assets. Where were landlords guaranteed rent levels during the crash. The government favours the Tennant, and once it swings the other way, you screw the landlords over.
As a society we should be looking to reduce the amount of landlords so it is only catering for short term renters who don’t want to buy. Its not morally right to trap people in renal accommodation long term who want to buy. Or for public tax money be spend enriching landlords instead of building social housing. A house is a home and shouldn’t be just an investment
@A.M: Mortgages are not increasing and if mortgages are not paid, then the landlords get years before the banks foreclose on them- yet rents are increasing by thousands of euro and people are being made homeless right across the country, at one months notice, if they can’t meet the rent. nothing to do with the real economics of the country, but greed.Nothing ever favours the tenant – been the same since penal times
Minister, what has been done to help the single applicant that wants to buy their first home. Unlike couples the 3.5 limit on borrowings isn’t sufficient with the increasing prices, will we see a scheme similar to the affordable housing for people under a certain salary with a clawback system on the property?
It’s clear to see that developers have taken advantage of the help to buy scheme in a upcoming development which was to be starter homes no home was to be over 300k these homes are now nearly 400k in a Nama funded project.
Why are the government so dead set against the obvious solution homelessness and spiralling rents.Which is having social housing built by city and county councils?
Lots of typos and missing words in this article. Makes it difficult to read. Can you fix.
My rent went up by €1000 a month. Lived in apartment almost 5 years and all that’s required by landlord is 28 days notice. Zero protection for tenants – how is this going to change?
Also, what changes are being put in place to improve quality of rental properties? Landlords getting away with murder – providing shoddy accommodation in a market of high demand – because they get away with it. In the winter of 2010 I lived in an apartment and the heat went – landlord didn’t sort for a week – what protection is there in that situation? Other than ‘contact RTB’ what immediate help is there available when something like this happens and what penalty is given to landlord?
This won’t be popular here. I totally agree with every single comment on this thread about rent being too high and at crisis point and I can assure you I am not a FG supporter but Simon Coveney does seem like a very capable, intelligent and honest guy. The 4% rent cap is by no means anywhere good enough to solve the issue. But it’s a start and it’s more than we’ve seen in the last 20 years towards addressing the problem. We NEED more houses, built and owned by Irish people at affordable prices and in a way that people can live happily, not crammed into shoeboxes that cost a fortune built by cowboys. I am personally going to give Minister Coveney the benefit of the doubt and hope he is up to the challenge of navigating us out of this crisis. Politics is glacial at the best of times and if he can actually start building houses as well as adding more renter friendly legislation then I’ll be a fan. But I do genuinely believe he is one of the good guys.
Minister, the RTE documentary “The Big Sell Off” highlighted the number of foreign based funds that own massive concentrations of rental properties within the state. How does the government plan on addressing price manipulation by these funds going forward? Can you also comment on the fact that these funds wouldn’t of bought such properties without certain assurances and tax guarantees by NAMA and the department of finance?
I know this be bad for the self employed landlords who bought as pension or those accidentally landlords, we all with hold our rent till they listen and make real change.
With a homelessness crisis and a housing crisis (DCC housing list waiting time is 15 years) why is the minister playing around with 4% rent caps (which will change nothing) when the only solution is to build houses.
Ask him if he thinks it appropriate that he and his colleagues in government remain as landlords. When they are supposed to drive legislation in a fair and impartial way? Ask him if that does not cover the term “conflict of interest”.
How can someone on a fixed income find another €350 per month to rent a home, on top of their existing rent? The concept of an annual increase is flawed from the start – rents are already too high in Irish cities. The balance needs to swing in favour of the tenant. For example: long leases with fixed rents, cheaper leases and more tenant rights for unfurnished properties, rents based on average income so that people are not paying 50-60% of their net income each month on rent. I disagree with this notion of ‘accidental landlords’ when they are raising rents, not based on their mortgage payments, but out of greed and opportunity. The government is not doing enough to protect tenants and the PRTB is useless also, that is why homelessness is so high in this country – the whole country- not just Dublin.
Do you think we should use €53,000 again to send ministers away for St Patrick’s Day or do you think we could invite heads of state to Ireland for a change? Then we could use that money to help support people who need it?
Surely the horse has bolted its very easy to put a 4% cap on it now. The prices have gone over when this Country crashed .
Are you a Landlord Mr Coveney and how many party colleagues are also landlords?
Will you resign over your abject failure to address the issues surround Ireland’s failed housing market. If not will you ask the ecb for the necessary funding to end this national emergency in homelessness, rising rents and decade long social housing waiting lists?
Does the Minister see any conflict of interest with sitting members of the Oireachtas voting on Housing Legislation when they and/or immediate family members are property investors / landlords?
Hi Simon – hope all is well.
Looking to the future….
How do you regard the long term viability of paying more then the original purchase of the property on rent over a 20 to 30 year period…
1300 euro per month equals 312000 euro total rent over a 20 year period. This assumes NO increase in that period.
This requires consideration if we are thinking of rental as a “lifetime option” and what “a viable rent is”.
At 312 k* over a 20 year period – then some sort of rent to buy set up seems logical.
It’s also important to start developing a culture where the good tenant who pays their rent on time and keeps the property in good order and doesn’t do anti social behaviour – is seen as a customer.
Could we get to a point where renting your home means not dealing with completely random people but instead has a more professional approach.
Do we need for example to make the delivery of sustainable homes for the long term a professional business rather then as it is now someones bit on the side.
Eugene
I d like to ask him why are the PRTB not going to monitor whether a landlord breaks the 4% rule when a new tenant rents the property. Landlords are abusing this already !
Simon, will FG hold a Referendum to give the Family Homes special protection in the Constitution, like Germany.
https://www.change.org/p/referendum-on-family-home-special-status-in-ireland
It’s very simple really.
• build more houses & apartments.
• relax the stone age planning restrictions
• give builders & developers tax relief per property built. They can make their money & keep prices down.
• give the first time buyers grant to second hand dwellings as well.
• if all this can’t happen because lack of funds, then call in the money owed by Apple. Problem solved.
It’s not a case of implementing rent caps or any other rubbish. Money under the counter will positively happen now.
These guys in government can’t come up with anything that will work in reality, because they don’t live in the same one as most people do.
I d like to ask him why are the PRTB not going to monitor whether a landlord breaks the 4% rule when a new tenant rents the property . Landlords are abusing this already !
Why is he punishing landlords who have been working with their tenants and charging them below market rent by fixing the rent they can charge at those below market rates and seriously devaluing their pension funds?
have your say