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WHY DO FIGURES indicate that more than 70 per cent of students do not get beyond their first year of college in some higher education courses? Overall, about one in six — or just over 6,000 — students did not progress to second year according to research published in the Irish Times recently.
The flash points were Computer Science, Construction and Business courses which recorded some of the highest levels of non-progression. All in all, the university courses recorded the lowest dropout rates (between 10 and 12 per cent), while in some non-university courses, the figures are double that.
Unrealistic Expectations
Courses with non-progression rates of more than 70 per cent include Computing with Software Development, Computing and Games Development, Industrial Physics, and Computer Forensics and Security.
Thomas Dowling, Head of Computer Science in LYIT, says that students enter a Computer and Games Development course thinking they are going to play games all week long.
They forget that they are required to do programming, databases and basic communication. They also lack an understanding about what Computer Science is all about and that it is a practical course that requires long hours. The Leaving Cert doesn’t prepare students for this discipline. They can often envy students who seem freer on other programmes, and can get disgruntled about the commitment and attendance required of Computer Science.
As a preparation, he recommends that young people join for example, a CoderDojo before signing up to these courses.
Also, many students I meet were attracted to the Science, Technology, Engineering and Maths courses due to the marketing drive and promises of high wages.
Points Driven
When talking with young people I am acutely aware that many students have an idea of the points that they want to get, yet they don’t know what they want to do. This is a product of a system and society that is obsessed with points and grades as reflections of success.
A Leaving Cert student told me this week:
“I know I want about 450 points. My friend totted up his points at Christmas and he got 625 points. He doesn’t know what he wants to do. In fact, most of my friends don’t know what they want to do.”
I acknowledge also that parents and students are overwhelmed by the extensive choice. Some don’t know where to start. I spoke to one Educational Consultant in a Dublin university, who said:
“Students are not taking the time to do the research, go to open days, look at the course content and work shadow. They then land in a course which doesn’t meet their expectations and they cannot unpick their chosen field. Of course, the cutbacks to guidance in schools does not help either as the resources vary from school to school.”
This echoes Why Students Leave, a report commissioned by the National Forum for the Enhancement of Teaching and Learning, which finds that the main reason for dropping out was choosing the wrong course. This survey highlighted that most decisions were made in the lead-up to exams when students were under pressure.
Transition issues
There are various coping skills issues which lead to withdrawals. Firstly, students in secondary school are spoon-fed and hand-held by their schools. When they enter third level not all of them are prepared for independent and self-regulated learning.
Some may hit a bump on the road, fall after the first hurdle and may give up easily. Anxiety and mental health also play a role. Colleges are responding to this through counselling at red alert times: during the first six weeks, after Christmas and before final exams.
There are other issues too, such as financial considerations. This is a concern for many students since they either cannot get accommodation in Dublin or can’t afford the costs. Some students are travelling 1 to 2 hours each way, to and from college.
Early specialisation
Courses experiencing high levels of dropouts are highly-specialised courses. They offer the student little flexibility.
Students would be well advised to consider a broader or common entry degree in Arts, Science, Engineering or Commerce, which allow students to experience three subjects in first year, before specialising in second year.
Philip Nolan, president of Maynooth University, is driving this flexible approach to learning, whereby a majority of the college’s students are opting to study a wide range of subjects under recent changes to its undergraduate programmes. Maynooth University’s greater flexibility in subject selection and support is also helping to boost student engagement and combat dropout rates.
Age of distraction
In addition to the factors of unrealistic expectations, a points-driven culture, coping skills and early specialisation, we are living in an age of constant distraction. Young people are plugged into the Internet or their smartphone 24/7.
Student advisors tell me that students are unable to concentrate and sometimes have trouble staying awake in the lecture halls. They are attributing this to interrupted sleep at night. Sleep, as we know, is central to learning and accessing our ability to think, problem-solve and memorise.
It seems to me that it is important our students learn to unplug, rest, relax and sleep in order to make full use of their brain’s capacity.
Resilience
While this opinion piece attempts to uncover some of the many reasons leading to dropouts, I would also like to salute the resilience and the bravery of some young people who strategically leave a course.
In the past year I worked with four college dropouts who struggled in their courses. One started a Music degree, dropped out, got work, saved money and reapplied to college to do Primary Teaching. Another dropped out of Computer Science, worked in a bar, saved up and now is happily studying Marketing.
All of them used their time in college as a learning experience and learned about their strengths, talents, aptitudes and motivation. As a result, they made more informed choices.
Choosing a career
Making career decisions can be a difficult process. Academia is not for everyone. Some people flourish in more practical environments. Vocational courses such as Post Leaving Cert courses and apprenticeships are an equally viable career path.
Dropping out of college is a tough learning experience. It costs parents and families money, and young people can experience it as a setback in confidence and in their self-belief. So, before you go climbing the ladder of success, make sure it is leaning against the right wall.
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Finally a topic that is not getting enough attention. The focus is solely on points and places not setting aside time to research careers or do work experience.
There is also an unhealthy obsession in this country with university and IT courses while PLCs or apprenticeships are frowned upon – look at the media obsession with the so called ‘league tables’. It’s time we change the focus!
@Richard Prendiville: Totally agree with you Richard. My son graduated from Tallaght IT 5 yrs ago. Couldn’t buy an interview. Went to america on a scholarship to college to study business & corporate law. Not what he studied here a total change of career. In america you must do an internship for 1 semester before you graduate. He did. Was offered a job with the company. They are sponsoring him for a green card. Hope it will be through within a few weeks as the final details have been sent in. He loves it out there. Has a great life. Would love for him to come home but want him to get his green card. We have to be realistic that points & college isn’t the only way to go. We forget about the people who don’t want college. He has friends here who love working in the local pub, supermarket, shop. The SNA in the school, the local painter, handyman around the corner that the IT graaduate calls as they have no idea how to wire a plug. We need to step back & look around us as to what is happening out there.
Maybe it would be worth considering apprenticeships for addressing the gender gap, if women are serious about getting into the workforce this is one way…
@bings: Google for “MIT graduates cannot power a light bulb with a battery” and you’ll see that world higher ranked engineers can’t do simple wiring, not even mention plug wiring.
There may be a lot of things wrong with MIT and its insufferable graduates but, in fairness, being dumb isn’t one of them and that stupid video offers no meaningful evidence to the contrary. I was reminded of that Rock Bottom episode about Homer Simpson’s sex crimes, “The Babysitter and the Beast”.
And some go to college with 200 points, get the grant, few months drinking, great craic and then drop out.
@coyote ugly: And, some go to UNi, drop out and go and do a PLC course and get a great job – this is especially true in media circles.
Colleges bear a lot of the responsibility. They take students into courses knowing that they could not possibly get through. Computer Science has a strong maths requirement yet they take students who have barely passed in the Leaving Cert. The young lecturer with a Ph.D. In Maths can’t see the problem, students can’t see the issue. The twain must part ! The media gives the impression that anybody can do anything and that we need more computer science graduates. Many simply are not able. Some kind of aptitude tests needed before entry.
@John Bennett: We’re told about the ‘gender inbalance’ as if there are some sorts of checks at the gates to these courses where everyone’s gender is verified and there has to be a higher proportion of males than females allowed in. We’re told this as if any gender inbalance is a pre-meditated deliberate act when it isn’t.
Of course in reality nothing could be further from the truth. The gates are open to everyone to apply, gender is irrelevant. Yes, it’s true that sometimes each gender may tend to gravitate towards particular courses, but then that’s true for life in general and it may fluctuate with what’s popular at that time. For example where medicine was once a male dominated role it’s now dominated by women.
Students cant cope with 1 or 2 hrs travel to college wait until they get a job, morgtage, car loan, utility bills.
@bings: And the rest! I’ve worked in a college and students would refuse accommodation they couldn’t walk from!!
The real world is going to kill them!
Most students will see the dollar signs or be pushed towards it due to there being loads of jobs at that point in time. There’s very little done in schools to expose students to these disciplines early on to see if they have the patience or aptitude for it.
No real life consequences. If they had a $15k student loan to pay off they’d follow through quick enough. This “no fees” rubbish needs to be abolished. The costs of attending are so high anyway may as well make it reality.
We are going to have to cripple ourselves to afford to send our daughter to college next year. 3k in fees may not seem much to some, but when you don’t have it, it’s huge. Especially when you have 1 starting secondary the same September and another the year after.
But she is adamant she wants to do midwifery, the hours are harsh, the wages harsher, but she has her heart set on it.
To pay more than 3000 we wouldn’t be able and we certainly don’t want her saddled with 60k debt at the end of 4 years, try getting a mortgage or car loan with that much debt. We think we are stressed now with the debt we carry, but college debt will give them no life after they qualify. I don’t want that for my kids! Do you want that for yours?
@Lily:
Lilly I feel your pain and no family should be disadvantaged more than another by sending their children to University. That’s the beauty of a loan scheme which can be tailored to the needs of a specific family circumstances. Loan systems are setup to payback over a working lifetime and not on a short-term basis. Families (parents) can if they so wish can fund that loan without their children be burdened with it or parents being put to the pin of their collar to pay for 3rd education as you are at the moment. One can fall outside the “grant” system by being a few hundred euro over the criteria. To me it’s either free for everyone or it’s paid for by everyone! I accept the idea that something not earned, given free or for nothing is never appreciated! It would be interesting to know what the percentages are of those dropping out or “course changing” are from the “grant” system and from the fee paying system? Think your 60K figure is a bit on the high side. I have one currently down the country in a 3rd level College and another who has fished from a Dublin 3rd Level College. Average cost was/is around 10K each p.a. Both subsidized their college years with part time work during the semesters and holidays. Good luck!
“I accept the idea that something not earned, given free or for nothing is never appreciated!”
Let’s make all the primary schools fee-paying so.
‘Some students are travelling 1 to 2 hours each way, to and from college.’ … in Dublin, that only means from one side of the City to the other … eg Artane to UCD or Dun Laoghaire to DCU …. Where is the problem?????
Commuters get woken up by the snoring ;-)
I cam wholeheartedly recommend dropping out of computer science in 1st year. What a total ‘mare that was.
Big problem is the amount of students , especially those from middle to lower middle incomes, who have to work part time to get through college. Most ITs put this number at 50-60%. Many just can’t do both.
I think you’re spot on there Danny.
Most of these are farmers sons. It basically works like this: The aul lad cooks the books the year before your leaving cert so they get the grant. They head in for the winter cause not much happening at home anyway, cattle are in etc. They then spend a few months farting around, then at the end of february/march, quit college casue there’s lambing and calving to be done, or else a heap of ploughing and sowing. Ah sure twas grand to see if you’d like it, sure it cost nothing!!
@Lord Clanricarde: Totally wrong – sons and daughters of farmers have the lost dropout rates of all, along with sones and daughters of higher professionals.
How many off the 70 percent are on the grant????
the issue is that college is not a guaranteed job. I have had with phds and got all a1 on leaving cert but had a really hard time to find work. what’s the use of being highly qualified with loans and no job.
Great to read the comments, it is very clear to me that schools are not equipped to provide up to date career advice, for this to happen the teachers tasked with career guidance should have practical experience centre of career sectors, not just academic knowledge. The Leaving Cert is wholly inadequate as it stands to qualify students for University, in fact on entry to TCD students who had attained a high number of points for their discipline were told to forget the LCert as university was far tougher. I would strongly support Maynooth in opening year 1, and students need enough time to change their minds in year 1, as this is often the first time they are asked to make a serious decision that can cost them and their family dear.
I really struggled in first year with the jump in difficulty and the lack of formal framework. I barely scraped past with a fair few repeats but I was able to put it behind me and I graduated with a solid 2:1 before doing my MSc. It’s not that students are stupid or incapable but the jump is absolutely enormous, especially with the course that I chose. Having said that, I never regretted my choice which is the biggest reason why people drop out. I know far more people that dropped out than actually stuck with it.
So yeah, I’d echo the sentiments here. Students need to be much better prepared in terms of the learning style and their expectations for what they’ll actually be doing. The Universities can do more here too, maybe run a one week introduction with full lectures and labs during the summer to give a real sense of what the student would be doing.
Student life is just one big party lol.
We live in Era of Choices and we have to face it. Era of Learning and Era of Inventions are gone – the new philosophy of living, working and learning is approaching. Young people join this new era naturally and it is our problem if we can’t adjust and flow with it.
@Dearbhla Kelly .. very good piece. hope parents and grandparents print out to be read by their kids …
Perhaps some 3rd Level fee and posts gouging also … get em in and get the posts and fees. Should be more onus on 3rd level staff to deliver results with the students that present. Very unfair on young people to be deemed failures.
Good advice here …
Making career decisions can be a difficult process. Academia is not for everyone. Some people flourish in more practical environments. Vocational courses such as Post Leaving Cert courses and apprenticeships are an equally viable career path.
Keep an eye on Khan Academy … maybe the way of the future .. signalling an end to Universities as we know them.
https://www.khanacademy.org/
@Neuville-Kepler62F: Khan academy is great but it’s no real substitute for a full degree, especially in the sciences. You need the practical experience.
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