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TRADITIONALLY WHEN PEOPLE think of weddings they think of them in churches on sunny Saturday afternoons.
But Ireland, indeed the world, is changing and not everyone wants a religious wedding any more. So what are the options?
Right now if you want a legally-binding non-religious wedding on a Saturday I’m afraid you simply can’t have one. The only people allowed to conduct legal non-religious weddings in Ireland at present are State Registrars who work Monday to Friday.
So this is where the Humanists come in. Couples wanting non-religious weddings which are very personal and meaningful have been availing of Humanist ceremonies for the past couple of decades. However, in order for the marriage to be legally binding, those couples have had to have a civil ceremony as well. For the last ten years the Humanist Association of Ireland has been actively campaigning for their marriage ceremonies to be given legal status.
But change is, hopefully, about to happen. Last October Senator Ivana Bacik introduced a private member’s bill in the Seanad with a view to amending the current legislation so as to give legal status to marriage ceremonies conducted by Humanist celebrants. This bill went through its final stages in the Seanad recently and is now, hopefully, set for a safe passage through the Dail before becoming law later this year.
So what is a Humanist wedding ceremony like? A Humanist ceremony is very personal and meaningful; it is essentially two people celebrating their love for each other and making their commitment to one another, in the company of those close to them, with appropriate well-chosen words, readings and music and in a place of their choice. A couple deciding on this option will work closely with one of the celebrants accredited by the Humanist Association of Ireland and put together a ceremony that is appropriate for them.
Typical venues for Humanist wedding ceremonies range from country house hotels and castles to private gardens. Two years ago I conducted a ceremony overlooking the sea in Dalkey – the couple were perched on a large rock while I stood on another rock beside it and my main concern was not to let the rings fall! It’s not every couple who would like the idea of starting their marriage in the place where, sadly, so many end up: on the rocks!
Some years ago I got an enquiry from a couple in Australia. She was from Sydney and he was originally from Holland and they wanted to get married in Dublin where they had met – in fact they wanted to have the ceremony in the precise place where they first met: the Youth Hostel in Mountjoy Street.
Humanism, for those who don’t know, is a positive ethical philosophy of life based on concern for humanity in general and for individuals in particular. It is a view of life which combines reason with compassion. It is for those people who base their understanding of existence on the evidence of the natural world and its evolution, and not on belief in a supernatural power.
As well as weddings Humanist celebrants also conduct funerals and naming ceremonies. Humanist ceremonies are a good blend between formality and informality. Each ceremony is carefully crafted in consultation with those involved.
Those people who are religious will probably want religious ceremonies to celebrate their milestones of life; but, for those who are not, isn’t it nice to have a good alternative? We are delighted, not only for ourselves but for all those couples wanting Humanist weddings, that at long last we seem to be well on our way to having legal status for these ceremonies.
Humanists meet on the first Sunday of every month from 4pm to 6 pm in Buswells Hotel in Dublin.
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I got married yesterday in Blackrock Castle Observatory in Cork. A family friend was the celebrant. Of course, like the article says, we had to have a civil ceremony a few weeks ago to make it legally binding.
Congratulations!
Congrats Barry, I can highly recommend marriage after 25+ years, ups and downs but hey that’s life. Love and health to you both,
Congrats – but what the heck are you doing spending time on the Journal? ;-)
Yeah, should ya not, ya know, be doing the jiggy jiggy, hubba hubba ?
Congrats Barry. Hope you have many happy years of marraige ahead. It’s a shame there are people who think life stands still when you get married and others think marraige is all about sex and having babies. So Christian.
It would be great if Ivana Baciks bill passed. The current setup for non-church ceremonies is unnecessarily restrictive.
How many time has the feminist whinger been rejected by the people at the ballot box? She moved constituency how many times and failed to get elected?
What has that got to do with the bill in question ?
So paddy what are YOU doing then to make a difference?
He’s busy……………………worrying !
How am i a redneck Paul? I’m a normal working class lad. I don’t believe the government should be concerned making stupid laws like these when the country is in the state it is at the moment and all my friends are emigrating. I think thats a perfectly valid opinion. But a d4 sympathiser like yourself doesn’t want the likes of me to have a opinion.
Paddy, my friend, derestriction of where non-religious weddings can take place would create many new jobs, as country houses, deconsecrated church and other suitable buildings would be repurposed as wedding venues. People will spend for wedding, and they will spend more if they can have a chance at turning the wedding into a ” fairy tale”. This spending creates employment.
I’m very interested to understand why you think it is only people who live in the Dublin 4 postal district who would benefit? Is it because all the ills of the nation; godlessness, homosexuality, et al, spew forth from Donnybrook and only from Donnybrook.
Is it because, outside of this district, all Irish people are penitent Christian for whom a church wedding should be “good enough”? Do they not deserve to have their wishes tailor to?
Or is it because yourself have certain unresolved issues concerning your place in the world?
Well, Paddy, my working-class D7 son married (well, civil partnered) his husband last year. By doing so, they created a day’s work for a photographer, a baker, hotel staff, bar staff, blahblahblah. You are so blinded by your hatred of Ivana Bacik and your vile inverted snobbery that you can’t see what a self-satisfied little messiah-wannabe you are. Cop yourself on, man.
Stop attacking the person, attack the law – though I can’t see how you would. Not that I’m the world’s greatest fan of Bacik or anything, but this is one thing she’s dead right about.
We should be worried about creating laws to create jobs. Not tripe like this.
Paddy BeBop – you’re sounding awfully like one of the Tories in the UK. “Let’s not reform anything that prevents us from stealing people’s money, because middle England doesn’t care about it.” By that logic, women would still be stuck in the kitchen, we’d still have the death penalty, divorce wouldn’t exist, condoms would be banned, and we’d be locking up homosexuals.
@Paddy, yes we need laws that create jobs and this is one of them. Plus, a government of any hue should be able to multitask when it comes to legislation.
Congratulations Barry but should you not be doing something else besides reading the journal lol lol
Not to take away from the article, but we were married in a place other than a church, by a priest, several years ago, on a saturday. They are not all old fogeys who confine you to a church. You can talk to them about alternative locations.
Nice to have plenty of options for couples. I have been to a humanist funeral as well. Good to have a non religious ceremony available for that too.
Definitely nice to be able to find something that suits the couple. At the end of the day, you want something which reflects on your values to share with your family and friends.
Ivana Bacik is symbolic of everything wrong with the Labour party these days.
No working class people care about this issue – We want jobs and better schools and healthcare. Meanwhile the salmon socialists in Labour discuss issues around their D4 dinner parties in Donnybrook that no-one cares about like gay marriage, abortion etc.
Why are making this issue about Ivana Bacik? Can you not separate the issue from the individual? Also are you saying that there are no working class people who want humanist ceremonies?
Because we’ve more important things to be worrying about – like creating jobs to stop all our young people emigrating might be a start!
I think you’ll find that plenty of working class people care about “gay marriage, abortion etc.”. Just because you’re not interested and seem to have some vendetta against Ivana Bacik doesn’t mean that everyone else thinks like you.
“To generalise is to be an idiot. To particularise is the alone distinction of merit.” – William Blake.
@Paddy
going on the thumbs 57 people (and counting) care about those issues…
Lots of people care.
I’m working class, I’m a Humanist too and I care deeply about the issue.
Yes, because if she took that hour to work on the economy instead of, you know, allowing people to publicly express their commitment, all the jobs would be sorted, right?
Just because there are problems in the country doesn’t mean that the little things don’t matter.
Ha, loving the thought of all ye upper class morons probably replying on yer fancy apple imacs or something. working class people worry about feeding their kids every day, not some waste of time bill that will cost the tax payer god knows how much. Even in the celtic tiger people had no problem having a simple church ceremony. this humanist bill is a WASTE OF MONEY. Ivana and her dublin 4 dinner party friends are laughing at all of us.
“no-one cares about like gay marriage, abortion etc”
WOW! What a tool.
You don’t have to be upper class to have an iMac, I have one and I only work in a bar, it’s 4 years old, and due an upgrade next year, which I’m saving for. As for being happy with a simple church wedding, I don’t believe in a God, so why would I be happy with that.
Ahh Paddy, please tell me you’re trolling, because otherwise you’re just embarrassing yourself now…
Never mind a chip, you’ve got an entire snack box on your shoulder, paddy. AND onion rings.
Thanks to this issue there will be a few extra jobs going as wedding celebrants . It is amazing how those catholic priests had all the good numbers and the free meal thrown in and the shindig. At least now the loot will be shared out with the humanist celebrants.
As a working class anarchist, Paddy, I think you’re a reactionary spanner. I care about marriage and people’s entitlement to it no matter their gender or sexuality, no matter the method or venue. You want to put every other aspect of people’s lives on hold until we achieve socialism? Ridiculous! Marriage is extremely important to people of all social and economic strata. I think if you get away from your computer and interact with people you’ll realise that a lot of working class people do care very much about this issue. So throw your bigoted pseudo-left rhetoric out the window and have a good hard re-think of your embarrassing position.
Well put, jimmy
Amen to all the above
Also Paddy it’s not tripe to people who want to marry but are in no way religious. Yes the country is in a state and the government need to deal with that but they can’t just ignore everything else.
We had a catholic church service followed by a handfasting. We did the church piece because we were both raised catholic and I wanted to stand on the same spot my parents did. I told my family that it was The last thing we were doing with the catholic church as neither of us really practise it. After we had a handfasting ceremony which for me was the real moment we were married. Now nearly three yrs later and we have a new baby And we made the decision not to christen her but to have a naming ceremony/day for her. Most people are fine but there are a few who just don’t see why we don’t just christen her “for the sake” of it. My point is this is it not worse for me to go into a church and outright lie and make promises that I know I won’t keep.
It’s nice that there not superstitious !
Agreed Karlswell. There seems to be a minority of non Dublin dwelling people that seem to believe that all Dubliners reside in ” D4 “. Where this delusion comes from, I don’t know. The percentage of Dubliners living within the salubrious grounds of “D4 “, is probably less than one per cent, yet certain commentators seem to use the county address of Dublin, as an guaranteed indicator of great wealth and an address in D4. The vast majority of Dubliners, like myself ( who was forced out of Dublin, due to the boom, for economic reasons ), are not wealthy, and are tired of the tiresome label of all ye D4 types. Less of the stereotypes, we are all in this together.
We are in the middle of sorting out our wedding for next year. Getting everything booked has been hit n miss but I’m happy to say we have gotten all the major stuff sorted bar the one thing I thought would be easy but it’s proving impossible – getting a priest.
We are marrying in a different county and we have to bring our own priest. Alas finding one who will Marry us is a growing pain. You’d think the church would be doing all they can to grow their flock in Ireland by making it easier for couples to Marry and to commit to raising their family with catholic values.
We are now both watching this bill very closely as a humanist wedding has a lot more benefits and is stress free!!
Finally this Republic is moving towards being, well a Republic. The one size fits all Catholic Theocracy is long past its sell by date.
We got married in a civil ceremony at 11am on a Friday in 2006. There was no other option at the time. Although it was a great day it would have been nice to have the ceremony in a more romantic location. Bravo the Humanists.
Are humanists agnostics or atheists ? I’m the later but sometimes I lapse kinda err towards pascals gamble way of thinking. Should humanists shy away from terms such as marriage and weddings, rituals and ceremonies which associate with religion ??
The word “marraige” must stay, the word itself guarantees the validity of the ceremony. Religions evolve from ceremonies, not to. And ceremonies are important to people, the pomp and circumstance add to the occasion, give it value.
I’ve known people who have said, when the topic has come up, that they were not prepared to bend their morals or beliefs enough to choose a church wedding, but the civil wedding ceremony was not the part of the day they most fondly remember.
It is a pointless and unprofitable restriction to place on a couple and their guests.
Does it matter whether they’re atheists or agnostics?
A humanist can be anything they please to be.Humanists do not have to be agnostics or atheists, in fact many humanists do practice a religion.
Humanism is, essentially, the belief that humans have intrinsic value. Belief or non-belief in a deity or deities is orthogonal to that, though some religions (such as christianity) have incompatible elements with this belief (such as original sin, slavery, and so forth).
A fabulous ALTERNATIVE idea for anyone considering a Marriage Ceremony outside the rigors of traditional Church or Civil Ceremonies
Marriage is more a state of mind between 2 people. If they are not committed to each other there is mo marriage regardless of the status if the ceremony , religious or secular.
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