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LAST UPDATE | 5 Dec 2024
TDS FROM PARTIES on the left have been talking today, as government formation negotiations are underway, but are currently presenting a not-so-united front.
While Sinn Féin and the Green Party’s remaining TD Roderic O’Gorman seem to accept five years in opposition is ahead, Labour and the Social Democrats are leaving the door open for discussion.
Speaking outside Leinster House today, Labour leader Ivana Bacik swatted away questions if her party would join government alone, repeating to journalists that she intends to form a common platform with the Social Democrats and O’Gorman.
The Social Democrats’ deputy leader Cian O’Callaghan said his party are willing to discuss the possibility of entering government, but only if it is able to secure policy commitments from Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael before doing so.
Bacik today reasoned that the only way to secure those commitments was to approach those parties with a united voice:
“Anyone on the center left, who’s serious about delivering change, must look at how best to do that. The best way to do that is from a position of collective strength.”
Labour leader Ivana Bacik reiterates her intention to build a common platform for Govt negotiations. She does not rule out going into coalition alone when asked, says speaking to Greens and SocDems is sole focus @thejournal_ie pic.twitter.com/spM4oOxLFB
— Muiris Ó Cearbhaill (@muirisoc) December 5, 2024
Bacik is today going to meet with O’Gorman, who has already indicated that he will not be re-entering government, and the Social Democrats tomorrow to set out the guidelines of that common platform.
Labour has not appointed a negotiation team as of yet, hoping a group can formed after uniting the centre-left parties. While TDs from the party have said that they will not be entering a government by themselves - Bacik fell short of ruling it out completely today.
Asked about the views expressed by a number of party members, Bacik said there was a “spectrum” of views represented in Labour. “All of us have our own personal views, particularly on this very critical question at a critical juncture for the country,” she said.
Meanwhile, the Social Democrats today will meet with Sinn Féin.
Yesterday, Mary Lou McDonald seemingly accepted that her party would be sitting in the opposition benches for another five years and urged the Social Democrats, Labour and independent TDs not to “prop up” Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael.
O’Callaghan told RTÉ Radio One’s Morning Ireland today that his party was willing to go into government - but not just to make up the 88 TDs needed to form a majority.
He said the Social Democrats would enter government if ”we can get the kind of change direction in these areas that we’re looking for”.
O’Callaghan gave particular mention to housing policy, stressing that reforms were necessary to deal with the rising number of people entering in to emergency and homeless accommodation.
He added that his party were not entering negotiations with the next election on their mind. The concerns, however, are relevant in the context of the Green Party’s performance at the ballot box over the weekend.
Despite delivering key policy commitments O’Gorman was the only candidate to be re-elected. He told reporters that he believed the losses were due to, what he called, “smaller party in government syndrome”.
“I don’t think thinking about the next election is the right approach to take in terms of government formation,” O’Callaghan said today.
“What we want to do is get our policies that we ran on implemented in the next government. That’s why we’re in politics. That’s why we contest elections.”
Elsewhere, Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael – who yesterday made clear that independent TDs are in the frame to form a government – are entering into negotiations with other potential partners.
Kildare North TD James Lawless said discussions could go on for the “next couple of days” and told RTÉ Radio One this morning that he was unsure if a government could be formed before Christmas.
Lawless said if an agreement is found quickly, there is a chance that a government could be formed in the coming weeks.
Fine Gael today said it has had brief discussions with Fianna Fáil, Labour, the Social Democrats and “a number of independent TDs”.
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The gall of them. A bunch of left wing woksters get lost.
@Dan Murphy: ‘Woksters’: some kind of chefs?
@Dan Murphy: Lessons in how to destroy an economy and crests failed state. “Dublin West TD Ruth Coppinger indicated on RTÉ Radio that the party would also nationalise some major multinational companies in a bid to secure jobs.
The Dell question ?”
@Brendan O’Brien:
Just invented it. Do you like it,it has a nice ring to it, as in Get away ye wokster ye.
@Dan Murphy: these woke jokers! Thought the greens were bad???
@Dan Murphy: G’way ye extremist loon.
@Dan Murphy: You absolutely didn’t invent it. In fact, you misspelt it. Wokester.
@Ian:
Woosh!!
That’s the joke flying way over your head …
@P. J.: I thought that the joke was his main post.
@thomas molloy: what an idea, maybe we could buy Apple & give it to the people for Christmas!
@Ian: Oh no, a soy boy wokster.
@I’m a robot Robot: Because he is a government shill and mad
@Brendan O’Brien: No, brain-washed student activists like yourself!
@thomas molloy:
Only Ruth Coppinger would be T… K enough to come out with that.
@H Woo: No, she’s not, there’s a few more of them around!
@thomas molloy: Nationalise? A disastrous policy that has failed in every country that implemented it but bear in mind PBP call themselves Trotskyist party. That explains their pathetically stupid policy.
Before the Election… Vote for us… Vote for change. After the Election, ah yeah, we’ll prop up FFG for another five years. A few ministerial pensions don’t be long helping them forget their election manifesto B/S.
‘We also know that people want genuine change – not a repackaging of stale parties, or policies, as something new.’
@Brian: the Greens were a party offering genuine change. The electorate in Ireland have no interest in change whatsoever. So, that’s the end of the Greens in govt.
@Alan: No change means billions of fines coming our way for not meeting our climate targets!! …. Wonder what services you suggest we cut to pay for that??? Not to mention the missed opportunities for not changing!! The longer we leave it, the harder & more expensive it will be. Sticking our heads in the sand is not an option.
@Gerry Keogh: that was the point I was making. No appetite for any change here, regardless of the consequences.
@Gerry Keogh: cut all payments to immigrants and for housing immigrants , save a few billion a year then
@Alan: Sadly, it is not quite the end of the Greens that I had hoped for. I was hoping they wouldn’t have a single Dáil seat after the recent election.
@Pork Hunt: Is it not Trillions? C’mon lets inflate this a bit more.
@Alan: Great news.
Greens were almost wiped out because they didn’t achieve what their voters wanted, they failed in their leadership and their TDs failed by going along with it for 5 years on votes like removing the eviction ban.
The media really needs to stop acting like it’s some unexplained occurrence for a small party to lose support in government.
@Rochelle Hart:
Your basic point is correct, the people who voted for the greens didn’t get what they wanted.
But only 7% in 2020 voted for them so what did they expect?
@Rochelle Hart: It’s not just the media. The Irish electorate regularly indicates that it doesn’t want to give an overall majority to any party but then punishes any party that goes into coalition as junior party. Their is every incentive for smaller parties to avoid the accountabilities of government but the arithmetical logic of the public’s choice is that some party (or grouping of independents) has to do it.
@Rochelle Hart: the greens got voted out because they got too much of what the wanted on the last government
@P. V. Aglue:
And almost none of it will be removed by the new government alongside bringing many more of the same.
Anything with R.O’G in it would guarantee to never get my vote.
@Sickof thisshit: Ronan O’Gara?
Don’t do it, Holly!
If they prop up ffg the will end up like the pds Labour and the greens there will be no re-return.
@5aeex4zc: They’ll amalgamate with Labour, virtually guaranteed now. Hearn for housing, the next Noel Browne
@Brian D’Arcy:
And what happened to him?
Let’s face it all parties have or will push wokism as it is part of the political agenda.
What I would hate to see is those of us not interested in such drive are able to say no and not end up like Enoch languishing in prison.
@AnthonyK:
Enoch should have run for election,
We could all do with a laugh.
@P. J.: He would have won a seat. We all don’t support that transgender bull.
I hope to see the SDs in government, as they have so much more to offer than a couple of independents would have.
@Brendan O’Brien: I’d like to see them in government as well but not with FF and FG. They’ll just be the next, Greens, labour and Progressive democrats. Go in with all good intentions and end up on the scrap heap after 5 years.
@Brendan O’Brien: ‘Trolling Thursday’ hasn’t really got off to a good start for you brenny?? LOL
@Ger Whelan: Quite possibly, but I would hope that they would learn lessons and be a bit more streetwise that those other small parties.
@Brendan O’Brien: I don’t think the parties are the problem it’s the people. They are the ones who take out the failures of the government on the smaller parties and keep re-electing FF/FG. It’s a rinse and repeat every election. I think the SD’s should not go into government this term. They are on an upward trajectory at the moment. Next election could see them possibly take 20 seats. Then they are in a much stronger position.
@Ger Whelan: Five more years of making no difference, though.
@Dave G Doe: Well said
@Brendan O’Brien:
@Ger Whelan
And there in lies the problem every non FFG politician has had since the foundation of the state.
Compromise, go into government, get some limited change(but not much!) and probably lose your seat…
Or stay out , stick to your principles, wait for a left lead government that could make major change…
That may never happen.
People don’t tend to change government when the economy is going well, so the most likely time for a left led government is when the enviable crash comes…..
But then the new government will probably be so badly in debt they won’t have any money for changes.
Hard to bloody win!!!
@Ger Whelan: It not the people.
Some small portion of the electorate gave the SocDems their support. Many, if not most, because they believed they would *not* go into government with FG in particular.
If they do go into such a government then it is to be expected they will lose that support.
The SocDems can grow their support base by staying away from the most right wing of governments, or destroy it by supporting such a government, as happened the the Greens, and Labour before that.
The SocDems can show us all that they have principles with which they will abide.
Or that they are no different from Labour and the Greens.
We all know about the failures of FF/FG governments.
So those who give their support to smaller parties are not blaming those smaller parties for those failures.
Rather they are blaming those smaller parties for enabling FF and FG.
@Brendan O’Brien: What difference can you see them making as a minority partner?
@P. J.: I agree. I have a genuine belief if the don’t sell out Sd’s stick to their principals, they can be the genuine alternative to FF/FG they are on an upward trajectory. It may take a couple of more elections for it to happen but if they sell out now it’ll never happen and we’re back to square one. With no real alternative.
@Ger Whelan: Rory Hearne could make a difference as housing minister, for example, as he has actual expertise, which is what governments generally lack in this country.
@Brendan O’Brien: you are king woke troll!!!
@Brendan O’Brien: could. But in 5 years time they’ll be out and then what?. Going into power with FF/FG is like singing a deal with the devil. You’ll think it’s a good deal but in the end you’ll suffer
@Ger Whelan: Maybe, but if you can manage to do a good job and market yourselves well (unlike the Greens, who were terrible at marketing themselves), you may just be able to buck the trend.
Otherwise the years turn into decades and you still haven’t had a shot at governing .
@Brendan O’Brien: The next Noel Browne, you’re in fantasy land if you think that the housing policy since 2016 will change, no matter what party, no matter what minister, it remains exactly the same. You seem to have a very positive attitude to politics which begs the question, have you been in Ireland long not to know our political history.
@Brian D’Arcy: Policies change all the time. If they didn’t we’d never need to have an election.
You believe that nothing can be done about the housing crisis: that there’s no point in even trying?
@Dave G Doe: lol
@Ger Whelan:
I have to agree with Brendan on this.
In 1923 the labour movement got 22% in the general election, 100 years later it’s about 40%, how long could it be for the other 10?
By that metric we might have one by 2075….
You see parties like FFG have a built in advantage, the people who vote for them are inherently conservative, they don’t want much change. It’s a lot easier for a politician to satisfy someone who doesn’t want much.
If we were to get a left led government the expectation from some will be enormous and certain to fail.
Look at Slaintecare, that has all party support but other vested interests have bogged it down.
Change is extremely difficult to do , even with the best will in the world.
Vested interests, of all types, have a way of beating you to death by delay.
@Brendan O’Brien: if they go into government now I hope you’re correct and they can market themselves and not lose support. I would hate for them to lose everything for a sniff of 5 power. But we’ll see how it goes
& I’ll be a right miserable so & so if I don’t get a new BMW 5 series from Santa…… Fair play to the SD’s on a great election result but I don’t really think they have any appetite for going into the driving seat
@Kevvy kerrr: And you do describe them as ‘woke nutjobs’ in your ‘Dave G Doe’ profile (which seems to be your ‘edgy’ one currently).
@Brendan O’Brien: where oh where did I say anything remotely of that sort???…. you’re an out & out LIAR….. OH, BTW I’M a supporter of the SD&s….. they unfortunately didn’t have a candidate running in my constituency. Seriously, this 24/7 lying & trolling can’t be beneficial to mental health —- go away down the strand with the dogs….. You’ll thank me for it
@Kevvy kerrr: I would have thought the Soc Dems are way too woke, pro immigration and anti Trump for you – but hey, I guess none of your posts make sense, so why would I think that your political affiliation make any sense either. And while I’m here, isn’t it funny how you have the same turn of phrase and inappropriate use of punctuation as Frank? Isn’t it mr fraud?
@Kevvy kerrr: SocDems ran away twice from Govt in 2016 and 2020, and have zero experience so far better to go with reliable Independents or Labour
@Brendan O’Brien: woke nutters like you
@Kevin Kerr:
Same as you and Brendan. I used to think you were separate fellas but I’m not so sure now…. Always online together and spouting the same stuff. Hmmmm…
@Regular John: good grief, Regular John – easy to see how you would be taken in by someone like Frank/Kevvy
SF as usual somersaulting around the place in a delusional state. They did not by a long shot meet their goal of a majority government or even the potential of a coalition , one that they could lead. All of a sudden in a few days they have declared they are left wing party after trying to be all things to the electorate a week ago. Some reflection is needed with a new leader appointed by the guys in Belfast shortly thereafter.
.
@Camio 55: Agreed they are absolutely all over the place time for Mary Lou to go she is clearly out of her depth.
@Camio 55:
Their election posters are still up in my area, moral must be low. Can’t get the troops out.
They are always first up and down after the results are out.
@Trump24:
She has being living off ” Not Gerry Adams” bounce until now, but people now realise she could easily be replaced by a set of bagpipes in the Dail.
Senior Minister for Disabilities, first on the list
Social Democrats Great as a debating society rich on policy and ideas but how many elections now four and they’re still willing are unwilling to participate in a government to get those policies implemented.
Getting close and into bed with Sinn Fein not a party of the left we result in them being cannibalized
Not everyone looking Happ in The picture l guess
have your say