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THE ASSOCIATIONS REPRESENTING Croke Park residents today received the terms of reference of the mediation process for resolving the dispute over Garth Brooks’ planned five-night stint at Croke Park this summer.
Locals are unhappy about the Garth Brooks’ gigs taking place at the Dublin stadium and are calling for the number of special events at the stadium to be reduced.
The Croke Park Residents Committee said they believe the concerts will not only breach existing clauses in Croke Park’s permission to hold such events, but also contravenes United Nations charters on human rights.
On 6 March, Croke Park suggested that the Labour Relations Commission chief Kieran Mulvey could chair talks.
Talks
Mulvey drew up the terms of reference of a mediation process that should be held upon special events being held at the stadium and these were presented to the resident and business groups today.
However, Croke Park Streets Committees Limited and the Irish Stadium Communities Association state that the proposed terms of reference are “most disappointing”.
The terms state that meetings will be held with community groups, businesses, the gardaí and other stakeholders so that the the promoters can hear “first hand” from those the events impact upon.
A report will also be prepared that will set out in detail the systems put in place to “minimise the impact” of licensed events on the surrounding communities.
The mediation process will be “undertaken with the utmost transparency and will seek to establish clearly the roles and responsibilities of those organising these special events and which will recognise the necessity of minimising inconvenience to those who live and work in the areas within and adjacent to Croke Park Stadium,” said Mulvey.
Feedback
Currently a community feedback leaflet has been circulated to 27,000 householders in the area surrounding the stadium and the GAA are organising a community forum for all residents that will be held on 29 March in Croke Park from 10am to 2pm.
Mulvey said that the mediation process, which he and a number of others are involved are “acting totally independent capacity” and that that they are under “no directions from anyone”.
He said that he hoped their would be “positive co-operation of everyone we can bring these matters to a successful conclusion…”.
The group state that the thrust of the terms of reference document “misses the point totally”.
They said that it is not about “how do we manage all these licensed events such as concerts in a way to minimise the affect on the community”, but that the “real question” is how to minimise the number of events back to the level of three that had been set down as a planning condition for the stadium by An Bord Pleanala, they claimed.
They added that the issue is a “quality of life” issue for the families who live around the stadium stating that they wish to “protect the value of our homes and our community assets”.
They concluded by stating that they expect Mulvey to deliver a binding agreement as the way forward, not just a report as mentioned in the terms of reference.
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Totally agree with Aer Lingus Pilots on their probability to go on Strike and I’m a regular flyer with Aer Lingus
No pay rise since 2019 even the lowest paid worker would have had a pay rise since then
@Geoff Bateman: – absolutely. I cannot understand how people would side with AL on this. They’re nothing but bootlickers
@Geoff Bateman: €250,000 is the current wage (I think).
@Thesaltyurchin: that’s a captain at the very top of the pay scale flying all his life. Basic is about €60,000 for the copilot
Well let’s hope they don’t strike and ruin hard working families holidays. The pilots are being very greedy with their demands.
@Sean Money: Are they not hard working? They haven’t had an increase since 2019 apparently so they’re essentially just keeping up with inflation, preserving the value of their pay compared to 2019, with a small percentage on top. That’s not greedy to me….. Their company is making huge profits and growing. Fair play to them I say. Hope they win. Their management are to blame here with their tight purses so I’d be directing any anger at them. It’s not 2019 anymore.
@another one? what’s going on is the semi state sec: didn’t seem to mention the interest free loan they received, did you mention the pension they receive? Do you mention the staff travel they receive via ID90 and company travel? Greed greed greed
@Sean Money: let’s hope the company avoid the strikes by giving them a reasonable and fair increase in pay. Not having a pay increase in the last 5 years is effectively a pay cut! The average increase in wages since 2019 is 24%. These men and women have received zero in that same period.
@Éanna o Sca: No I didn’t because it’s about wage increases……They have a perk of staff travel and a pension. WOW call the newspapers with that shocking information…… Don’t know anything about a loan…… Are they supposed to do nothing while their salary gets eroded via inflation while the company makes mega profits and gives them a BS offer. The offer is a 10% pay cut compared to 2019 due to inflation. No pilots no flying, they do the big important job for the airline…… Civil service has around 20% since 2019 with their agreements….. Wonder how much management’s salary has increased
@Éanna o Sca: To also point out. Other Aerlingus staff received a better deal than what’s on offer to the pilots percentage wise as far as this article shows:
@another one? what’s going on is the semi state sec: Just wondering, if aer lingus was still still a semi state entity would you be still of the same opinion? Don’t forget, our FFG/Labour leaders sold it off for 30 pieces of silver when it was making huge profits after a lot of sacrifice by the staff. Just wondering.
@another one? what’s going on is the semi state sec: my heart bleeds for them and their €100k plus salary right up to €230k
What about the junior doctors / teachers / nurses? Did you get their take on it?
Re:Pension – they contribute 5% and company contributes 20%, is this normal?!
I suggest you ask AL pilots exactly what they get.
@Fr. Fintan Stack: Yes I would. If they were still semi state they would probably have something in line with the public sector increases which is about 20% from 2019 to 2025. EI management are a shambles to have allowed this to get to this point with what appears to be an insulting offer. Especially after COVID. Less than other EI staff percentage wise. Management also used COVID to bring in lower pay scales for new entrants apparently which is another shocking play. ……. If they were still still semi state they would be giving back a tidy profit to the exchequer yearly….. I’m not sure what point you were trying to make
@Éanna o Sca: ah good old Irish begrudgery at its best.
@another one? what’s going on is the semi state sec: The average aer lingus pilots wage is €88,287, which is 86% above the national average. Let me know of one sector outside of government whose wages increased with the rate of inflation. Aer Lingus reports operating loss of €82 million for Q1 2024 so please do let me know where the massive profits you assume they are making come from? IAG have generated 68million for Q1, but that’s not from aer lingus. If the pilots arent careful the airline wont be sustainable and their greed will cost them their jobs.
@Unridden Ana: Wrong, the average pay increase since 2019 is 13%. Aer Lingus pilots earn 86% more than the average wage. 24% is not justifiable. If they don’t like pay and conditions, look elsewhere. Its pure greed and they are taking advantage of the holiday season which is an attack on the average member of the public who work hard for their holidays. Aerlingus operates at a loss as it is. They don’t deserve the 24%
@Éanna o Sca: What about them? Didn’t they got around 20% with current govt pay agreements?!?! As is my understanding pilots have had none since 2019 and 9.5% is on the table. Inflation is 20%+. Nobody wants the value of their pay cheque to be reduced….. Pilots pay 11% into pension, loads of ALs due to shift work and the stressful nature of the job I assume, 30+ days…. I think everyone should be getting pay rises to keep up with inflation and I think it’s even worse when a highly profitable company doesn’t respect it’s staff enough to do it. Also, even with any pay increases the govt are fleecing us with out of date taxation thresholds as if inflation hasn’t exploded. Their take has! Why don’t you train to be a pilot and get some of that high salary?
@another one? what’s going on is the semi state sec: don’t be getting nasty now! I have and I am
@Mike Carson: I think asking 98% of the balloted pilot body who are clearly not satisfied with their their pay and conditions ‘ to look elsewhere’ for a job would have a worse affect on ‘the average member of the public who worked hard for their holidays’. Who will get them there? I wouldn’t put myself forward to the board anytime soon if I were you.
They are asking to be compensated fairly in line with their colleagues and for an increase in pay in line with inflation. I’m unclear as to how that could deemed ‘not justifiable’.
@Éanna o Sca: How is that nasty? That’s generally the line when dealing with someone so vigorously giving out about someone’s great terms and conditions. You’re a pilot?!?!
@Mike Carson: they had a profit of €225m last year, so you’d want to get your facts right. Google “CSO figures wage increase” and come back to me where it says average was 13%. Oh and stop embarrassing yourself in the comment section
@Unridden Ana: The difference between average wage between 2019Q1 and 2024Q1 is 25.6% according to CSO…. Bonkers!…… Need to get onto my employer!!!! Must be all the management level increases while keeping the average worker down!
https://www.cso.ie/en/statistics/earnings/earningsandlabourcosts/send
@Mike Carson: aer lingus is not semi state. It is owned by a English Co. Enda and Co gave it away
Does anyone know of any pilot not living in an upmarket area with a car that’s worth less than 50k.
Yes they deserve an increase but their plight needs to be put in perspective and both airline and pilots need to be fair and reasonable.
@Mr “JonnieBoy” Johnson: I think a 25% increase is reasonable considering they haven’t had a pay rise in 5 years. Where they live and what car they drive is irrelevant. Good for them for standing up to their greedy and miserly paymasters
@M To The B: not irrelevant at all. They are in the top quartile and not struggling existensially.
@Mr “JonnieBoy” Johnson: That doesn’t mean that they should be taken advantage of by Management.
It isn’t about what other jobs pay, or whether individual pilots are suffering. That isn’t a relevant argument to refuse to discuss salaries .
@Tricia G28: it’s a natural levelling over time based on more accessing the profession and increase in technologies to support pilot. The days of a pilot being a God are gone. He’s got a safety related role just as a flight controller, aircraft engineer or a public bus driver or a train driver. All safety related jobs with requirement for getting it right every time.
They’re going to have to make them a realistic offer. I was shocked to see that Co pilots start on €59k while their long haul captains earn €287k a year.
@Paul O+Brien: That’s in order to pay back training costs
@seanmoney You might consider that the threat that looms over ‘hard working families holidays’ and the ability to bring things to a resolution lies with the well paid senior management team in Aer Lingus and not with its staff. It’s been well documented that the issues around pay have been ongoing for several years. You might also consider that the ones being ‘very greedy with their demands’ are actually the management, stakeholders and shareholders of a company worth billions of euro. A simple google search will tell you that BA pilots who are owned by IAG, the same parent company as Aer Lingus were awarded the same pay increase that they are now refusing to award to Aer Lingus pilots. I certainly wouldn’t do the same work as my colleagues for less pay.
@: BA is making money Aerlingus is losing money, which is why ba pilots earn more. Also, BA flies more long-haul flights, where pilots earn more.
Wrong, €225 million profit in 2023. Forecasting growth this year.
https://mediacentre.aerlingus.com/pressrelease/details/108/19118#:~:text=Aer%20Lingus%20recorded%20an%20operating,haul%20and%20long%20haul%20routes.
Looking for the same percentage increase is not the same as looking for the same salary. 9.5% offer is a joke. Other Aerlingus staff agreed 13%.
https://m.independent.ie/business/aer-lingus-staff-to-get-almost-13-pay-rise-and-lump-sum-payment-to-combat-cost-of-living-crisis/a2085901733.html
A pilot lives three doors down from us in a very ordinary estate and drives a family saloon. I don’t know his income but his lifestyle, on the surface, seems to indicate nothing extraordinary.
Heard Michael O’Leary on Pat Kenny show this morning spouting unadulterated tosh
In relation to Aer Lingus pilots he boasted that Ryanair had restored pilots pay to precovid levels and had a four year deal worth ,I think, 14%. He then went on to say that Aer Lingus pilots were engaging in industria lblackmail for looking for an equivalent deal. Spoofing.
@Padraig O’Brien: Wish he’d run for office, everything he said about infrastructure is 100% on the nose, currently we’re just no able
@Thesaltyurchin: Why do people still believe the nonsense that a successful business person, focused only on profits could then lead a country where the intent should be to improve the lives of every (most) citizens? They’re two opposing ideologies.
@Tricia G28: Every aspect of life carries contradiction, we too as a people need to build things to provide ourselves with necessary infrastructure to live, but we’re a reactive people with little social foresight. I would think a ‘business person’ who works in transport and deals with the associated logistics on a daily basis would potentially be a really good person to build some infrastructure here, particularly in the Transport sector. Potentially he could save money and deliver to schedule, he certainly talks about transport far more than our Transport Minster who hasn’t mentioned anything to help the hundreds of thousands of commuters. Maybe Eamon Ryan can do it, he’s siting there smiling like he has a plan anyway.
Give the pilots what they deserve.
I have been on a good few scary flights over the years (3 of those with aer Lingus) and I am always glad to know that’s there a trained, skilled person behind that door. We take for granted what these people do on a daily basis.
Same with all company’s take all give little in return always the way people are sick of it now
They are looking for an extra 50k on top of what they earn already. I would be grateful for the 50k a year, just saying.
@Annette: become a pilot then. You ready for the early mornings, missed family events, responsibility of 300+ lives literally in your hands, thunderstorms and high winds? If you’re not willing to sign up to that and more, then don’t begrudge the guys and girls who are willing to do so getting paid for it.
@Unridden Ana: I’m not begrudging anyone. But that’s their chosen profession. I will probably guess the cabin crew have to give up their lives as well. Sacrificing something for their profession. A lot of us had to do it in some way.
@Unridden Ana: a navy rating has to put up with these things too.
@Unridden Ana: Are you willing to pay 24%+ more for your flights? You honestly believe any employer at any level can afford to pay 24% of a pay rise. Aerlingus is operating at a loss of 82 million. What about ground staff and air steward’s? They have a harder job than the pilots locked away in the cabin. They have to deal with unruly passengers, sick passengers, and everything in between. All a pilot has to do is take off, land, and follow directions from air traffic control. The rest is automatic. I do begrudge someone who accepts a job and makes the general public suffer because they want more money later. They already earn, on average, 86% above the national average wage. As per your off-the-cuff comment, if they want management-level pay, maybe they should quit being pilots and become managers.
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