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Because in many cases it can become very dangerous, oppress people and stop people from thinking for themselves

Knock gets a plug. Oh the divinity of it all !

I think some atheists are the new zealots. The same sort of people who oppressed and mocked those without religion or spirituality are now the new righteous – mocking those with religion or spirituality. The world will always have their sort in one guise or another. They cannot let others get on with their lives. There. I’ve said it.

@ Síle

I agree (and I’m an atheist)

Remember though, that statement is a double edged sword – in other words it works for everything else.
Gay marriage, drugs, etc…

We knock it because legitimate scientists are held back by these nutjobs who would rather prop up the worlds greatest criminal enterprise (religion) than help find actual cures.

Waffler I get what you are saying but the people going to Lourdes are not the problem. They are entitled to express their own brand of spirituality free from oppression or mockery. Some atheists don’t respect that right.

They are part of the problem because rather than letting doctors conduct research on them they’d rather some clown in a frock lay his hands on them.

Waffler- “let doctors conduct research on them”….? Wow. What kind of society are you planning? Sounds horrific

A society where we may find a cure for cancer? Doesn’t sound too horrific to me

I think the problem with Lourdes Albert McEinstein, is that the people visiting are given false hope, and I don’t see any difference between places like this and ringing the TV3 psychics to help address problems, if people can be made better and have their health issues cured, it should only be done by trained medical professionals who make decisions based on proven research, it’s not fair that individuals can go to Lourdes and come away wondering were they not cured because they are a bad person, it wasn’t their time, they don’t believe enough etc., it’s just a cruel psychological situation, and these people deserve better

Well said Gaius

Thanks Waffler, it takes little steps unfortunately!

Look, if people get comfort from religion then best of luck to them. I wouldn’t knock them for that. Some would. I don’t like the mockery of any beliefs or none. Also please don’t disregard the placebo effect – I don’t think it has been debunked yet- the opposite in fact. Good night to ye.

If I find myself on my death bed I’d rather be there knowing I let science have a good crack at curing me (and possibly others) than wondering if I failed to live to the standards set down by a science fiction author two milennia ago

@Albert Some people get comfort from heroin or cutting themselves, doesn’t mean it’s good for them.

Hospital Operating Theatre staff wear different clothes including gowns why don’t people like the Pope kickers mock them as well.

Er…. That’s all that happens here usually. Hang around.. The lads rip each other to shreds and the sarcasm is worse than Come Dine With Me. Anything to do with banks, Cowen, Kenny, bond holders etc and it’s a bloodbath on here. Good to have you on board though

You mean you don’t have an answer?

And the reality is John your an atheist and I am a believer and neither of us can disprove gods existence or non-existence.

Sorry Ian, but there are so many incredulous claims associated with believing in a cosmic being that rules over us, that the onus is on you to prove this being exists, and not on John to prove it doesn’t. If you were at a meeting in work, and someone stood up and said that there were pandas in the next room, that person would be asked to back up their statement, not the person who said there were no pandas in the next room

Heehee. Like that.

Not everyone goes to Lourdes for a cure, some people go for inner mediation & comfort for themselves! There are lot’s of people who were very sick who went to Lourdes & may have lived longer in life for their belief’s, We are all going to die, even Lourdes won’t prevent this!

I didn’t say they just go for a cure

Do you research Gaius, there have been well over 7,000 cures, many of these people did not or have not gone through the exhaustive process to authenticate, and i agree with Liam, not everyone goes to Lourdes for a cure.

Gary – you say there have been over 7000 unauthenticated cures. H
Then how can you tell they’re authentic? Seems like a paradox. “Yeah, but there are thousands who never came forward and told anyone”.

Gary, it was an interview with Fr. Liam Griffin who is the Coordinator for English-speaking pilgrims in Lourdes, if he’s wrong, tell him to do his research

Somepeople go to Lourdes because they are brought there whether they like it or not .

I heard several trout had their spots cured today…

hmmm sometimes I go to Lidl for mediation and comfort.

A fool and his money………

I usually hit the ‘ blue Hackle” for a cure :-)

Jeez this is disappointing ‘ did we not have a covenant with god in which he committed never to flood the world again?

Jeez this is most disappointing. I thought we had a covenant with God in which had agreed never again to flood the world !

We had. We just broke the covenant with the global warming thing and all that.I think he may have had a few beers when he did the deal.Nobody is perfect…..

It’s not blind faith when it produces results

Tried leeches, realised there was no evidence that they wroked, abandoned leeches, if only religion followed the same pattern

Morphine and codine, both opiates, both commonly used painkillers, in fact the seeds of the poppy have since ancient Egyptian times been used as a painkiller as herbalists and doctors from the time experimented with them and learned that they had that effect and passed on that knowledge , the scientific method works, its only when science is mixed with or subservient mysticism that you end up with nonsense like humors or leeching or that the earth is the centre of the solar system.

Waffler the placebo effect also produces results. Gaius leeches do work for drawing blood out of, for example amputated and reattached fingers – continuing the flow of blood. The point is neither science not religion has all the answers all the time and to presume one has all the answers is the ultimate arrogance.

But science doesn’t claim to have the answers all of the time, the whole point of science is to try and disprove something, before acknowledging it to be fact, that is the most fundamental element of science, but in religion, it is acceptance without question, and when you ask a question, all you get back is anecdotes and bible passages instead of evidence

Sorry but I can’t see anything in any of your comments that would suggest that your educated, unless of course you count sarcasm, and no i am not a creationist nor am I religious, however I do believe in god as I understand him, and I can totally understand why you don’t do those arguments you don’t have one

Ian, people only believe in god because of their upbringing and their parents, indoctrination in school and at home, words from adults mouths to a child, words in a book, black print on white pages, and that’s the end of it, nobody believes in god because they saw ‘him’, or found evidence of ‘him’, the human brain is an extremely sophisticated machine, and it requires more than stories, unless one chooses otherwise

You should qualify that ” relatively educated” people. Read some Socrates and wise up man !

Brilliant. If you don’t mind, I’m going to borrow that one.

Jesus Barry that’s the oldest one in the book.

It has thanks to the beliefs of those who dont. Try your blind faith in the 14th century.

If you have blind faith, what purpose does ones brain serve?

Well done Mary keep the blinkers on. These atheists with their fancy words and even fancier science are going straight to hell anyway.

Well done Mary keep the blinkers. These atheists with their fancy words and even fancier science are going straight to hell anyway.

And there are others who have very good reason and are silenced by the Catholic Chruch

U don’t think people are confining the vile spewing to the catholic church ! I would hope they mean all supposed revealed religions. Abraham spent too long in the sun !

I may be wrong but I think he’s dead.

Waffler you really do live up to your name

A quote that proves nothing,and an example of anecdotes instead of evidence re: St.Bernadette

Said the 10 year old boy who would shortly die of influenza in the year 1370.

What if your wrong?

If I’m wrong I’d be having a few choice words with god and the first thing I’d ask him is how he made an absolute b**lox of everything, given his super powers and what’s not

Nobody died or was seriously injured, so you could argue he was protecting them.

He’s as close to me as your Satan is to you.

Don’t actually think God was at Lourdes! it’s a shrine for our Lady & St. Bernadette!

Taking a swim.

If it had happened in Mecca or Hebron or any Islamic religious city I bet you wouldn’t have the balls to make a comment like that.

The thing I find funny about atheists is this, they are always talking about god !! And he knows it

Before the beginning,On one hand you had nothing, and On the other you had God.Then you had the universe ! So which was more likely the reason for that I wonder.If you are an atheist and a true one at that,God will reward you for your honesty. Pity about the flood.Glad everyone is okay.

Before the beginning you had God? So the presence of God doesn’t even warrant a beginning? Is it just me or does that make NO sense?

It does’nt…your just not supposed to point that out…..ty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Time is a construct, therefore you cannot constrain ‘I am’ to before or after…

@ Gavin…Thank you for that…please explain now why you state so….It went straight past me!!!!….lost!!!!! help!!!!

Seriously charlie, did you take your pills today??

Need an ark?…. I Noah guy..!!

Sorry. Couldn’t resist.

@ Barry….good one ! I noah you mean!!

“Our god Rains ! ” was the old hymn at school. I heard it wrong ??!!

Short answer we dont. The whole no atheists in fox holes is bs. Its not that we are any more brave than religious either.

No they dont my eldest sister died of pancratic cancer, a logical person who didn’t call for god, she called for us, her family to be around her. She didnt believe in the afterlife. Why do you speak so condecendingly about people with beliefs different to yours

Do you spend your spare time hanging around hospitals Jeff or is that just something you made up .

Jeff, you have just shown what religion is all about, controlling people with fear, thankfully, atheists don’t worry about god flicking through his records on their life when they die, I’m sure he’s far too busy ignoring genocides and natural disasters to pop around to the hospital and get an e.t.a. from the doctor for when we’re going to pop our clogs

They do a lovely stoning

Switching to Islam would be folly ! All religion whereby a so called prophet claims to have chats with god and reverts to mankind with instruction is dangerous. I would suggest you explore Deism. My reason dictates that the is some form of creation. Not the simplistic Hebrew model but something beyond mans understanding at this point in time. I see the evidence of this creator in nature and written all around in the wonder that I see each day this is backed up for me by mathematics and the constants that exist to maintain all this beauty. Enough!! Enjoy your Sun-day off and have a peaceful day ! God in Nature.

Yeah he was an atheist, who had seen the errors of his ways.

Ah sure his time is up Paul if those pesky doctors weren’t treating his cancer he’d probably be dead by now , all part of the master plan . That’s something I often wonder about , if the church had their way we still wouldn’t have modern medicine and people would still be dying of curable diseases and it would be gods will , so shouldn’t the priests , bishops and all the rest all the way to the pope refuse medical treatment after all it is gods will . The hypocrisy of it all .

On his way to mass to ask god to save his ass !

Pray cancelled due to flooding….

No I can’t, but I can know it, I find it utterly depressing that adults systematically engage in fantasy, it’s an indictment of mankind, we’re probably looking at another 200 years before we’re free of it

Sorry to burst your bubble god is eternal, and how can know about something that you think does not exist

I know about hobbits from J.R.R. Tolkien’s Lord of the Rings, and Luke Skywalker from Star Wars and the Tin Man from The Wizard of Oz, they don’t exist either, so I don’t understand your point. What exactly is meant by ‘god is eternal’, I find that statement fascinating?

And will cry on his death bed pleading to god.

I disagree with both statements, there are planets that we cannot see with our current level of technology, but we will be able to see them in a matter of months, maybe years, therefore, although we can’t see them, based on past discoveries, the likelihood is that they exist. And I am not an atheist, I am an anti-theist.

@ Gaius – if you are “anti-theist” why did you choose your avatar name? I presume you know about one of his last actions in the temple of Diana before he died?

How much research has been done into the non-existence of Smurfs