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Dublin: 19 °C Wednesday 19 June, 2013

Schools will need 3,000 extra teachers to cater for population – Quinn

Ruairí Quinn says at the current ratio, thousands more staff will be needed – but that’s if the current ratio remains in place.

Ruairí Quinn made the comments while addressing a conference in Croke Park yesterday.
Ruairí Quinn made the comments while addressing a conference in Croke Park yesterday.
Image: Mark Stedman

EDUCATION MINISTER Ruairí Quinn has said the expected surge in the number of children living in Ireland in the coming years will mean Ireland will need to employ 3,000 extra teachers by 2015.

Speaking yesterday, the minister said Ireland’s ballooning population of younger people meant the total number of people in full0time education at various levels would continue to grow – and keeping the current pupil-teacher ratios would mean schools would have to hire more staff.

The total number of people in full-time education by 2017 would be 1.13 million, and would continue to rise until 2026, the minister said.

Last summer there were 515,000 pupils in the country’s primary schools, with a further 323,000 in second-level and 170,000 people in college – meaning Ireland’s total educational population was just over one million.

The cost of hiring an extra 3,000 teachers could come in at about €100 million per year, however – meaning Quinn could opt to raise the pupil-teacher ratio instead of allowing circumstances where more teachers would be recruited, particularly if public pay remains out of reach under the Croke Park deal or a successor.

At the TASC conference on the Nordic education system in Croke Park, the minister also spoke of the pressure of ensuring that there were enough school buildings and facilities around the country to cater for the growing population.

Quinn hinted that the country’s disadvantaged schools may escape the Budget knife this year, commenting that Ireland was already a “deeply unequal country” but that this could be better addressed through formal education than any other means.

He later added that DEIS schools, which helped to address educational disadvantage, could “deliver a much more equal society – liberating families and communities from structural disadvantage and the blight of intergenerational poverty.”

And more equal societies see reduced rates of crime, improved general levels of health and the other social ills which have such enormous economic costs.

At the same event, INTO deputy general secretary Noel Ward advised Quinn not to attempt to make further cuts to the DEIS sector, pointing out that he had been forced away from similar proposals in the 2012 Budget.

Read: Primary teachers warn against Budget cuts to disadvantaged schools

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Comments (21 Comments)

  • Are there not around 3000 teachers looking for work?

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  • So we can expect higher teacher pupil teacher ratios to be announced in the budget!

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  • 100 million? Would that be around 1/10th or 1/20th the annual interest rate of the National Heist Bailout? Imagine if we even got that reduction in the Heist- Bailout-Loan-That-Isnt-Ours, that would cover the cost of the teachers.

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  • alan 18/09/12 #

    but can teachers who haven’t paid the houshold charge apply for work? Or would that be ‘unreasonable’ (in the ‘rational’ world of ruari quinn)

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  • Ironic to hear any minister talk of a more equal society – or even the value of education at all.

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  • we don’t need no edukashon

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  • How about some schools to put these teachers in?

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  • I wonder will the same logic apply when the Crime Stats and Prison population goes up..will recruitment be reinstated??

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  • He looks a bit like Ming the mercyless

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  • …and another 5000 guards.

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  • Good points Colm,

    lets hope the powers that be take them on board!

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  • And where is the money coming from?

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  • Hi Colm,

    Firstly it was never my intention to have a go at teachers. My gripe is mainly with the system by which they have to work within, the details of which you outlined perfectly in your comment.

    However a bit of “reflection in action” by some of your colleagues may benefit the delivery, monitoring, and quality assurance of the additional training programs you have received.

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    • Hi Tony

      I’m sure that you’re right about the need for greater reflection. One of the difficulties facing teacher educators is that those sitting in front of them are the beneficiaries and successful navigators of our existing system; the one with the focus on memory tests. It’s hard to convince them of the need for alternative assessment methods as they may fear that they would not have been successful in that system. One often hears the question ‘What do you want me to write in the reflective journal (for full marks)?’ They totally miss the point and it’s not really their fault.

      We need to completely rethink our curriculum and assessment philosophy and perhaps look to Scandinavia for a direction forward.

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  • Before we start churning out teachers we need to spend a few bob on a complete new system of education, starting with teacher training first. No point having 3000 new teachers teaching kids with the same old out dated methods and subjects. It must be soul destroying for teachers.
    Our teaching methods are stone age and our success rates in maths & science subjects are shockingly bad compaired to the rest of Europe.

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    • Hi Tony

      How familiar are with the teacher education programmes run around the country? I went through it 14 years and then again for an MEd 5 years ago. On both occasions there was a large amount of progressive content in the courses esp. those on Educational policy, psychology, sociology, curriculum and assessment and philosophy. We were taught about many great educationalists (I can list them if you’d like).

      As I see it teacher training at second level at least is not the main problem (though primary teaching should be secularised). Some bigger problems are the following:
      1. The mismatch between primary and secondary (student centred system and exam focused respectively).
      2. The lack of investment in education for decades (we always appear towards the lowest of the OECD rankings on spending). Thus schools need to pressurise local TDs for access to funds.
      3. The recent gutting of schools middle management structures.
      4. Little focus on interdisciplinary work in the curriculum.
      5. A points driven terminal exam which turns subject choices into Market decisions.
      6. Insufficient provision of in-service training- compare the number of teachers in Finland with Masters to Ireland for example.
      7. The dominant presence or religion and the absence of philosophy in schools (unlike in France for example). We need to train people to think independently not simply to reproduce rote learning.

      These are just off the top of my head. I suggest you should think about these before you simply start blaming teachers or teacher education. Both operate within the restrictions placed upon them by resources and the curriculum.

      Reply
  • Instead of locking people up make them teachers on community service problem solved fine Gael like

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