Comment of the Week ! :)

Brilliant!!!

Brian! Say that again, I’ll smmmmack you….

How can you be sure?

thing is, too many kids arent as lucky as you only getting a smack on that hand

Very intelligent comment Ryan Murphy.
The states increasing interference with individuals is beyond tolerance.
This does not mean that I condone physical abuse on anybody but if a mild clout on the ear is an offence then the system is out of order.

Where’s it say it’d be a crime? You’ll get such a slap if you don’t read the article properly…

Mickey is takin to government about making that a near soon reality :)

I agree. A smack is not to hurt a child, just to give them a short sharp shock. Beating a child black and blue is what is completely wrong, but that is very different to a smack on the hand.

omg you ought to be ashamed.. hitting an 18 month old innocent BABY!! how about engaging your brain and taking the time to explain why what they did was wrong?no too much like hard work? you make me sick

I doubt if a ‘light smack’ is what they’re talking about

Certainly ok to report her to social services. In the order of things, I would believe it should be a higher priority for the minister for children to protect the children begging on the street, those not in school and those in dangerous alcoholic or drug abusive homes etc.. Legislating for the low hanging fruit first is not the best way to go.

No it is not ok to slap any one elses child or children . Why not take them out for the day to some where nice and reassure them that life is good and that you are one of the good people !! Get the mom some help ,

Eileen, I think you misread the original comment.

Oops ! No don’t slap her . Get her some help and report her to child welfare . It does not always mean children will be put into care , but maybe for a short while til the mam cops on …I would still let her kids know that you are one of the good guys .

Yep. Will we smack Ryan first, or Cormac?

What will they ban next, the naughty step???

Ted…..I see nothing wrong with a slap if you’ve been naughty !!

You always do it when I’m bad baby ;)

You’re always good Teddy boy !!

Wonderfully succinct … and in yesteryear I was “CANED” at school?

Didn’t make me out at asa total psycopath?

EXCELLENT COMMENT …

Actually Hitler’s mother used to protect him from his father who had a violent temper and used to beat Adolf around the place.

You must be thinking of another hitler it’s quiet a common name

Ah the Hitler play…

So Hitler had an over protective mommy and a violent daddy ?

“Now I’m not going to jump completely on the bandwagon here – my parents never smacked me, or at least that I can remember. I don’t think that I’ve turned out a worse person, for a lack of physical discipline.”

Nah, you didn’t turn out a bad person at all, you just joined Fianna Fáil.

Oh jack. That was very flucking funny! Sorry Fiachrra but bet you laughed too.

They didn’t slap ‘im, they bribed ‘im. That’s how *they* roll.

Fiachra. We’re only joking. Your name pops up on several threads and your comments always well considered. I couldn’t help laugh at Jack’s comment tho! But we can’t blame you for FF. Happy new year ;)

Réada:
I’m sorry if it sounded like I blamed divorced/separated parents for spoiling their children. Not at all. I did include family situation in a list of usual roots of misbehaviour, because unfortunately it can lead to it. My main point is that lack of physical punishment is not a part of that list.

Clara. I am the mother of a blended family so for me it was personal but I accept your response with its good intentions. My husband’s son has lived full time with us since he was 7. I love him like he is my own, but don’t think he knew it until I gave him his first smack at around 8. I’ve slapped him about 3 times I’d say only but he’s a great kid.

I do bring my kids up to have respect for other people and explained to them that if we were in a hotel for example that the other people there didn’t come out to watch them being bold and running around. A trip like that where they had to behave themselves would be followed by a stint at the playground where they could let themselves go.

I think talking to your kids and instilling respect in your kids is first and foremost but the odd smack should not be off limits. I repeat that there is a world of a difference between a smack from a loving parent and a beating from a out of control one.

Eileen Gabbett:
I’m going to clarify once again, so that you can’t misunderstand the meaning of what I said.

I do not intend to make a comparison between single and two-parents families; I do not believe that a single parent (who has enough in their plate and in most cases is giving a hundred per cent to their kids) is more prone to spoil or slap or in any way lead their child to a criminal life; the list I made of typical problems in misbehaved children does not imply that all those come together (so no, in no way did I think you could be taking advantage of the system. Some people do, with or without a spouse, and that Is giving their children a bad role model, don’t you think?).

The comment about family situations sprang to mind because I have currently four students whose parents are getting divorced and their suffering is being shown in a sudden great deal of unruly behaviour. It was included here with some misgivings, but even though we don’t like it, that’s a fact (I deal with 180 students daily in a 1000-pupils school, so I’m not talking about a limited experience). I thought we’d all be adult enough to take things for what they are, and not as a personal attack.

A personal attack is more like comments such as “Wash your mouth out with soap……. I bet you teach religion……”, which sound a bit aggressive. Even if it’s none of anybody’s business, no, I don’t teach religion. My subject has nothing to do with morals, though, like all real teachers, I’m not there only to get through a series of academic facts.

For the last time, the original point is that lack of physical punishment does not breed unruly children.

Clara O Riordan ….
Happy New Year :) :)

I’ve never smacked my kids with my butt, doesn’t seem right ;-)

I’m not going to scream that you’re a psychopath for giving your children a smack, but neither do I understand that you boast about what is nothing but a failure of your discipline system. On top of that, saying that corporal punishment is the only form of communication small children understand shows a really poor perception of reality, and before you ask, as a mother and a secondary school teacher, I do know a little about stress and anxiety (so I hope you’ll not deem my comments worthless).

Physical punishment is the only resource of those who have been unable to establish discipline in any other way, it’s a shortcut towards solving the probem only on the surface and it’s the primal evidence that you cannot control yourself. I spend a good part of my week teaching that to students who, often enough, have parents who do slap them when they misbehave, when they answer back, when they slap their little siblings for breaking their mp3s.

Do you really want me to tell you what goes on in the homes of my most problematic students? Parents are divorced or in the process of (surprsingly enough, no matter how civilised their parents’ separation is, children are affected by it, and their behaviour shows it); parents shout at each other; one parent is absent and the other is working all day, so the child is alone all evening/wakes up alone/lives with spoiling granny; parents do not believe in, and show it, responsibility or decency (taking advantage of the social welfare system and proud of it, life is to live it, grab as much as you can); parents smack them but then buy them an iPhone or pay for their nose stud; these among others.

It’s not the absence of physical punishment that makes children unruly. It’s the absence of discipline, which is not the same thing, or of respect, or of love. Do you think that law would be impossible to implement? I agree. However, I still think there should be no need for that law. Parents should be honest with themselves and analyse what brings them to give their child a slap, a smack or, hopefully never, a beating.

Clara. You were doing fine until you started generalising with your divorce, separation stuff. Plenty bold kids with both parents together spoiling them rotten with goodies too.

Clara O Riordan
Wash your mouth out with soap…… I bet you teach religion… That aside i agree children need discipline and that some times comes with a slap, with fairness, love and security.
I am divorced and a mother of 4 well adjusted and sensible ‘normal’ people. They got their slaps and other forms of discipline , removing priveleges etc., but all it took was 1/ 2 times. They knew their boundaries. oh and I have never received SW in my life only children’s allowance.
I do not like your comments …. ” Parents are divorced or in the process of (surprsingly enough, no matter how civilised their parents’ separation is, children are affected by it, and their behaviour shows it); parents shout at each other; one parent is absent and the other is working all day, so the child is alone all evening/wakes up alone/lives with spoiling granny; parents do not believe in, and show it, responsibility or decency (taking advantage of the social welfare system and proud of it, life is to live it, grab as much as you can); parents smack them but then buy them an iPhone or pay for their nose stud; these among others.” You know that there are as many if not more ”problematic” children in two parent homes .

Interesting that divorce and separation should come up in the discussion of the introduction of laws on the physical punishment of children.
The judgments of family law courts without the moderating influence of reporting has led to to some outrageous decisions regarding custody and access. I am fearful that these new laws will be used to bolster claims made before these courts that will unfairly prejudice the rights of, in most cases, fathers.
I attach a link here to a story I came across written by no less than the feminist Nell McCafferty in the 1970’s about a case relating to a decision of a District Court.
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2011/1217/1224309212710.html

Well said Reada and Eileen Gabbett. Nothing more to be said on that score.

John
That story is 35 years old and is a shocking abuse or misuse of a court’s power. I am surprised too that divorce / separation always comes up in discussions like this too. I take your point tho , that violence towards children can only come from a man , the daddy ….( I say that tongue in cheek) as women can and often are just as violent. People have a lot to learn and nothing is cut and dried when it comes to relationships or the lack thereof.

Eileen.
Indeed the story is 35 years back and that in some respects is my point.
Similar and more recent claims before such courts are not now reported and are not available for publication. You can rest assured that similar unfounded claims are being leveled against fathers in private family court hearings throughout the land admittedly not resulting in such a severe jail sentence though certainly resulting in much worse – separation of parent and child.

John Murphy
I know John . this is why family law should not be dealt with in courts…. and more specially trained people should be involved in divorces / separations.

John, “nothing more to be said on that score”? Nah! Aways more to be said on Journal!

Well…
Just meant nothing that I could add. But feel free Reada. Let em have it!

Think I’ve said enough. It’s keeping quiet I should practice not mouthing off. Going to have to unholster my hip gun I keep shooting from…

So your ‘stress & anxiety’ is the rationalization to beat your children?

I don’t think I could back hand a coworker, my wife, a service worker or even an animal and get away with saying ‘you don’t understand, I’m stressed and anxious’

Andrew Telford
As per usual you deliberately misunderstand the comment above . If you are not a parent then no you do not understand the stresses or anxiety of parents. If you have never experienced the pure joy of parenthood then you can not possibly know the absolute terror when you see your flesh and blood doing something that is mortally dangerous or badly behaved that will ( if not checked) effect them into the future. No body here has condoned beating or back handing anyone , but a slap on the hand or bum serves as a reminder to a small child that this behavior is either dangerous and or unacceptable. A small child does not understand language , only tones and a small slap shows them you are serious and their action/ behavior is unacceptable . It is true that some people do not either get slapped enough or hugged enough when young ….!

I think I understood it perfectly, and read it exactly for what it says, dress it up how ever you like to give validation to your argument for beating a defenseless child… People have for centuries been coming up with pathetic excuse to inflict pain on other human beings for displays of dominance and power, you’re no different.

It’s weak and it’s pathetic and your raising your kids to believe physical violence is a means to get what they want.

If you want to hit someone… At least grow something resembling a spine and hit someone your own size who can defend themselves.

Andrew Telford
I am certainly not spineless and I am not easily intimidated either, I have nothing to prove to you or any one else and as it is New Years Eve I am sure you have some swilling to catch up on . . .

Sorry. Still don’t get it. You can get sacked for smacking a colleague. You can get sacked if you’re in child-care or a teacher and smack a child. But it’s ok to smack the one you love most…

Like what? I have a 2 sisters who teach childcare and they would tell me about the bold corner and trying to reason with a child. this is with children that are 1 to 4 years old. Obviously they din’t hit children in their care and I wouldn’t advocate that anyway but I can’t see how being put in the bold corner is not also humiliating. Sometimes when kids so something so dangerous or stupid I see no other option other than to smack them with an open palm on the bottom. It should not be done out of frustration venting by the parent but as a sanction only reserved for the most serious of circumstances.

Kids that young don’t understand when they have been bold so I think smacking them is just as useless as a bold corner. But when they get older taking away something that is important to them can work. Like their TV or Lego or even books if they were like me as a kid. Of course there are kids who can’t be punished and I wouldn’t have a clue what to do there.

Yes they do understand . They know when they cry they will be picked up, they know if they do something cute and people say AW , they will do it again and they know when they do something bold . I love childrens’ intelligence , their knowledge and self awareness and their ability to be in awe of the new .

Lisa they certainly do understand when they are being bold at that age. I have a crawling baby who thinks the fire and the christmas tree are both called “Ah-Ah-NO”, because that is what I say when she tries to get to them. She stays away from them both now, but at the start there was the glance at me first, then the bolt for them. Testing boundaries.

This law suggestion is unenforcable unless they put cameras in all our homes, and hence a waste of time.

And other options are not humiliating? The withholding of warmth and affection would be the most psychologically damaging. How does one legislate for that? Corporal punishment is an easy target for utopians

If you can bring up your children without smacking them, then kudos to you. But if you fail to discipline them, then I will never forgive you.

The following is addressed to everyone and no one:

If you fail to teach your children discipline, the rest of the world gets to hear them shriek in a restaurant. If you fail to teach your children respect, the rest of the world gets to listen to their sulky snide tone in the department store. If you fail to teach your children anger management, the rest of the world has to clean the blood off of the walls.

Your children will be running this country someday. I live in this country. So when you are in the process of breeding the next generation of emotionally stunted cons, welfare mothers and career criminals, I get to comment since that directly affects me. Quit failing and I’ll quit commenting.

What consequences?

Grumpy Jack…

I totally agree. Violence never solved any problem. Progress is made through honest communication and teaching and explaining. That is what works in the,end. Children. Are very clever and violence breeds violence.

What a load of PC nonsence .
Good for you Susan if you believe you have the two best behaved children born to man kind . As for the rest of man kind an odd slap does not go astray when the naughty step does not work or there is imminent danger to the bad behaviour , or when good communication and a special talk does not work.
I worked with a man who believed that no matter what the provocation slapping his child was never necessary until one day he arrived at work and I noticed a dirty big scab on his arm , I asked him what happened and he told me that his beautiful child then 5 had bitten him in temper and she took the piece ….To get her to release her grip from her teeth he had to slap her. He was I remember very upset that A) he had slapped her and B) she had been so cruel as to do that to him .They had been getting complaints from people about her behaviour but put it down to other peoples lack of understanding .
I do not tolerate badly behaved children.
I will say it.
I will not have them in my home or company.
Your child , your responsibility.

Very good Jack. However I’m afraid you’re also guilty of plagiarism: http://www.violentacres.com/archives/52/frequently-asked-questions/. I think you’ll remember reading point two, at some stage in your life. Unfortunately for you, you also frequent the blog of the most quotable women in blogosphere.

There are obviously degrees. If you can accept that then, in its mildest form, think of it as a means of communication, albeit at its most primitive and crude. We are physical beings.

Spot on…

Lisa…..what ages are your kids ?

So I’m mentally unstable and a drunk now Lisa.

Watch your mouth.

Me too neuromancer:) ,but the thing is I do not drink alcohol or take drugs nor am I mentally unstable ,I dont think ….. Hey Lisa What country are you from and if it is so fantastic why oh why are you living herre among us mad drunk drugged people x x x

Aw lads. It’s ok here in Ireland. Not elsewhere though. Let it go. Imagine a world where parents have the maturity and imagination to bring up kids with love and nurturing. Peace and love. Cue thumbs down…

I’m Irish born as were my parents so not sure what country I’m supposed to go back to.

Lisa I don’t know what country ,but it is probably a country on what ever planet you are living on ! Happy New Year ! Comment when you have children thaqt you love . No one on this thread condones violence . A sharp reminder as one person puts it , and is how most people see it .