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FIANNA FÁIL LEADER Micheál Martin has said his party is attempting to devise a system where its TDs and Senators will be permitted to vote as they see fit on certain major issues.
Speaking exclusively to TheJournal.ie this evening, Martin said a committee would be set up to try and identify red-button topics where personal opinions were too sincerely held to be comprised by a party vote.
The Fianna Fáil leader was speaking after a meeting of his parliamentary party had decided not to impose a party whip on any votes relating to the forthcoming abortion bill – allowing members to either approve or oppose the legislation as they see fit.
The decision marks the first time in several years that a major party will have allowed its members to participate in Oireachtas votes without any direction on how they should act.
Though Martin said the whip system did have value as a tool to ensure a government’s work was not unduly disrupted, he said there was a balance to be struck “between governance and parliamentary representation”.
Asked what subjects might be considered thorny enough to warrant a free vote among Fianna Fáil members, Martin pointed to recent examples in Australia where MPs were given a free vote on matters like abortion, euthanasia and the death penalty.
The former minister said the protocol would try to identify a “narrow range of issues” upon which the whip would not be applied – but insisted that politics would “evolve” so that more major parties would allow TDs to vote with their conscience on divisive social matters.
Though he believed Fianna Fáil was going through “a period of renewal”, Martin acknowledged that FF could have lost some of its more experienced Oireachtas members if it had enforced either a supportive or opposing stance to the Protection of Life in Pregnancy Bill.
“I didn’t want to lose people,” he admitted, saying there were “people of calibre” who would now feel safe to contribute to the party.
There had been roughly a 50-50 split among Fianna Fáil’s 33 parliamentarians when the substance of the legislation was first discussed about a month ago, he said, explaining that many members had problems with allowing the risk of suicide as grounds for an abortion.
“Others, like myself, felt the Bill was restrictive,” he said, outlining that a woman at risk of suicide does not currently need to undergo a mandatory psychiatric assessment before being put forward for a termination.
“Others are worried about the impact down the line, and I respect that.”
The irony of the most corrupt party in Europe, a party with a long track record of selling their votes and policy setting to the highest bidder calling for a free vote.
This is partly emblematic of the fact that FF is little more than a franchise at this stage. People with vastly different beliefs and no leader in charge.
A free vote here is because the party cannot all walk in the one direction and many of its members are following others commands.
Same old FF.
….. or maybe people strongly disagree about what’s the right thing to do!
In other words, Micheal hasn’t got any authority over the parliamentary party, especially when it comes to tough issues, but he’s trying to make it look like he’s doing them (and all of us) a favour.
People on all sides of the debate re the abortion bill consider it literally to be a life and death issue. That Micheál Martin can’t convince all of the parliamentary party to support this bill only shows that people have different opinion’s on the effect this bill would have.
Can’t deny there’s different opinions! And of course, that’s everyone’s right to express them.
I have a feeling that allowing a free vote will leave more scope for politicking, and that votes will be cast for the benefit of politicians, not on the merits or otherwise of the legislation itself.
And I’m no fan of the whip system either, I hasten to add!
This is an excellent move and long overdue in Irish politics, shame FF only make decisions based on what’s popularity and lack any sincerity or integrity…
I don’t believe him,
It’s par for the course for politicians to say one thing in opposition and the opposite in government. MM is just another gombean politician who would be just at home in Fine Gael as he would in Labour or Sinn Fein.
There are only 2 parties in Irish politics. The party in power and the party out of power. Whoever lies the most convincingly gets to be the party in power, the others just have wait their turn. :-(.
It is the idiots that put them into power you should be condemning! You condemn Sinn Fein a party I do not have any affiliation to. However Sinn Fein have never been in power, therefore you are conforming to the propaganda of the other three mentioned parties. People including me are beginning to see through the decades of misinformation and propaganda spread by successive Irish and British governments.
Wake up and smell the swinging carrot!
How about you just vote to disband your party, Micheal? Chemotherapy treatment for the body politic in Ireland.
O Vincent you are so blinded by that blue shirt you wear.what I hate is parties saying one thing in opposition and another thing in power.like burn the bond holders and other untruths.
I’m more annoyed by parties that bring economic Armageddon down on our country & surrender 80 years of economic sovereignty. But that just me.
vincent
im in a quandry here as to weather i should have a go at that party of corrupt crooks that nearly bankrupt this country or you, or a muppet like you, for peddling the fascist claptrap of the current group of gombeens but then i realise….
your both cheeks on the one arse!
So Vincent ff were ruling Iceland Spain Greece,Italy
and so on, grow up and smell the roses the people spoke in 2011put Ff out and rightly so, but you and others sold us a pup the Berlin way or no way.
David- what’s most pathetic about you is that you’re so ashamed of FF that you come on here disavowing yourself of them yet your Facebook page betrays you. You’re a soldier of destiny ashamed to admit it yet lemming-like enough to keep voting for the party of Charlie Haughey, Ray Burke, Padraig Flynn, BC Flynn, Bertie Ahern, Liam Lawlor, Ivor Callelly etc etc etc. You are everything that is wrong with this country. Incapable of independent thought you mistake political parties for football teams, demanding unconditional support, always. You’re pathetic. And you and your ilk are why we are where we are. You’re are a disgrace as an Irishman.
Weirdo- how about you set aside that difficult question & learn how to spell?
O Vincent I must realy hit a nerve the people of this country spoke in 2011 not you but the Irish people passed judgement on ff all the hope of that election is gone ;any way back to the vote on abortion, at 12 weeks my wife and I lost a twin at the hospital I saw my sons heart beating and they saved Jack and he will be 11 next week thank God,on abortion it should be an open vote I hope ff are gone from the day of one leader one voice.
Ahh VD
your getting desperate now
the journal spelling policeman
hahahaha
as i have said to you countless times
deflection is a pathetic arguement………
David FF are gone from one leader one voice I can assure you on that, we passed the OMOV at last years Ard Fheis its gives the ordinary members a say now in party policy and other important decisions within the party…
I have rejoined ff since 2011 we are building a great new moment.
agree with Micheal Martin on this.
It is an important issue.
No politician or legislator should be forced, (by the party whip system), to vote for something, that is against their own deeply held values, ethics, or moral conscience.
Should our elected politicians, who are mostly men, get to decide about something that affects not their lives but the lives of women?
Even if you ignore the fact it is ridiculous to claim the issue is only for women to decide upon.
They are still elected officials voted for by women as much as men so yes is the answer to your question.
Shane, you’re right many women voted for these TDs. But voted for them on what issues? What did we give them a mandate to govern on? Economy, jobs, taxation, bank bailouts, public service pay, social welfare allowances? Those were the election issues. I don’t recall abortion legislation being an issue in the last election. The candidates therefore don’t have a mandate to represent us on this issue.
But we don’t need them as we have decided this issue in numerous abortion referendums already. Now it’s time for the legislation in accordance with the decisions of the public – not in accordance with decisions of predominately male TDs.
The fact remains however that gender is as relevant as race in this debate. By which I mean completely and totally irrelevant.
An inability to recognise that is juvenile.
I think it would be far more effective to have a public voting app. The government proposed changes. The public votes and the majority wins.
This idea of a public representative is nonsense.
Like asking an alcoholic if free alcohol should be available on all Street corners
The point of opposition is to oppose or support the government in their policies. Micheal is being spineless by not offering a constructive opinion on abortion and then has the brass neck to spin it as a positive. We are not that stupid. Are we?
I don’t see any problem with him not voicing a personal opinion, that’s not his job. Like.as if, anybody should look to the personal opinions of Micheal Martin in a search for moral certitude. I am all for abolishing the whip system but pulease, why on only red-button topics. And who decides what a red-button topic is? Stop the spin. This is not red nose day.
Who said personal. Fianna Fáil won’t offer an opinion. That’s my gripe.
I wish they’d just dissolve themselves and spare us their crap
If he was in government he wouldn’t be saying it!! He couldn’t bring his party with him and now is spinning it!!
It’s called “democracy” mr Martin. Freedom of choice. The right to an opinion. Party whip is dictatorship. The country is run by dictators.
the government dont vote,, the government dont have a say,, only about ten make decisions, and rest have to shut their mouths and take tax payers money,, i feel we need a people vote, as our government are living in lala land and only their to get their pay check, fg and labor will criple this country as they know they will never again be voted in
It’s obvious really. For years we’ve been electing representatives based on their policies – “keep the local hospital open, less TDs, more Gardaí” and so forth. But once they’re elected to government they’re forced to vote against the very policies they were elected upon, thus significantly reducing the chances that they will be re-elected (see: Fianna Fáil 2011).
Giving them a free vote will at least give them the opportunity to save some face amongst the electorate and represent their constituents rather than the party – and thus provide a government for, y’know, the people. Just allow TDs to vote according to the reasons they were elected for in the first place rather than whatever is for the so-called “greater good” and we could – dare I say it – rebuild confidence in the political system. Or is that idealistic?
Just how many of these politicians got elected because of their declared views on abortion? I don’t remember abortion being an issue during the last election.
Good man Michael, the Ballinlough two step, he has no control over the party and is trying to make a virtue of necessity & looks like he is giving the Party a choice. This drops Enda in the crap as he stands to lose a lot of members if he is forced to allow a free vote in the party.
There should be a free vote on all issues, not just the important ones. The whip should be done away with, that way we get the representatives of the people deciding what they are the representative bunch of the population want not just the few elitists at the top deciding and everyone else voting yes or no.
Tony Gregory appealed to all parties fto allow a free vote in 1993 when he introduced his Bill to ban hare coursing. He didn’t get it and many TDs who were outspoken opponents of the bloodsport were forced to walk with heads bowed through the lobbies to vote down the Bill. (Alan Shatter defied his own party whip on that occasion to vote for the Bill and gave an impassioned speech advocating free votes on issues of this kind). I can see why the whips might be needed when some major economic issue is at stake, or to get through vital day to day measures, but on so many issues a little leeway could be provided. It wouldn’t spell the downfall of democracy and might even enhance it.
Nothing changes with fianna fail same old spineless leadership
Thanks for reminding us of your inability to lead the country in good or bad times
The whip system should be illegal. If I give my vote to a TD then I want him or her to vote as he or she thinks, not as Micheal Martin or Enda Kenny or Eamon Gilmore thinks. In the US everyone does that and you can see from a politician’s voting record whether you agree with their views or not.
The ‘free vote’ system is not a particularly good idea and just typical of Irish politics – play to the audience and commit to nothing. If you are a member of a political party people are voting for you as a representative of that party and the values and manifesto of that party. There should be party or independent in the Dail that does not have a clearly defined intent on, say, the abortion issue. This has been on the agenda since the ’90s so plenty of time to prepare for that.
Free votes allow TDs to vote according to opinion polls rather than they said in their manifestos or programme for Government. It’s not in the public interest. Also, they have to remember that they are public representatives and they must represent the public interest when voting.
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