Its not that the opposition are doing anything right but the government are doing everything wrong.

And the swinging will continue for ever until we believe in all politicians and we have genuine choice based on what they can deliver and not what they keep fecking up.

And my long predicted Fg FF (unholy union) next government moves a step closer. Only surprise was lab holding steady. Will be voting independents myself in case you’re curious.

Next government will Not be FF / FG.

That would effectively be saying they are the same.

@reg – fg/ lab are the same?

They are

Ff + Fg ARE the same…. This country has no real alternative political party, they are all centrists.

It depends what you mean by “alternative”. I can see PLENTY OF alternatives like Independents, SF, People before Profit, Socialist party, ULA, & others.

How do you know what an “alternative” is unless you give them a chance? You keep voting the same hoping they’ll change – never happened.

Far to many people with either an education or a job to vote for socialist parties that encourage neither

With the greatest respect, that’s bollocks – it wasn’t socialists who pissed away the economy

With socialist there would be no economy or Tiger to piss away. There would be no encouragement for individuals to do well, there would be no FDI. Any entrepreneurs would have left for a capitalist society where there encouraged.

FG are just a less corrupt version of FF, policy wise they are not that much different. Both are out to protect a very select few and the rest of the country can go to hell as far as they are concerned.

Sad thing is that FG obviously want FF to survive, there is enough dirt on that party that if Shatter got the Guards to start digging that they would have to close down. We all know that they are as rotten and corrupt a part as has ever existed in European politics.

Tax exiles using Ireland will leave, not entrepreneurs. The vast majority of entrepreneurs consider Ireland a good place for doing business regardless which government is in power. Also, we would have broad public support for budget measures with a socialist government – something that never happens with a conservative government. A socialist government is more connected with its electorate.

Reported above comment for abuse and offense.

Maybe a new party called FFSake

Problem is the pond we have to draw on for our political choices is small and ruled by two big fish….more choices and FF & FG wouldn’t be as strong.

I know what you mean, it would be an absolute shame for millionaires to pay a fair share of their income in tax, in fact it would be an outrage. How dare them peasants suggest it, how did they even get the vote?

Millionaires are genreally so as they achieve money from profitable businesses which employ people, or else by creating a service which people require. They are taxed, if they are heavily taxed them the incentive to be successful is removed and jobs will be lost. Or they will simply leave Ireland and we will be worse off

Reg, your profile more than likely causes more offence.

The entire unemployed don’t “leech”. A hate-based policy will result in you loosing poll support. A gov’t who doesn’t listen to the interests of its voters will loose.

Your right Mark, maybe I should be clearer, i was talking about long term unemployed who were claiming through the good times. The new wave are different.

Yes but under FG gov that have continually failed to lower the live register creeping to 15% now. Their plan to get people back to work has vanished. So the new wave are slowly becoming the ‘leeches’ as it was put above. FG are slowly making things worse for the ordinary family but better for corp’ and big business, who still cut and slash wage and jobs. It’s not working FG have lost that battle.

Could TheJournal hold a poll, or has it already been done recently?

Ryan it’s a global downturn, things could be a lot worse

Socialists obviously haven’t a thick skin. Are you that afraid of people disagreeing that you have to report them for abuse? Anyway, Brian, I agree. I’m afraid the Socialist parties, good intentions are not, are completely unsuitable to run this country. Liable businesses would run a mile. Things would be even worse than with this shower. God forbid. Hobson’s choice!

Might as well report me too reg, because I agree with everything Brian said. I’m lucky enough to have a solid safe job but if socialists came in, I’m emigrating.

It’s always someone else’s fault Brian! No accountability which I believe was an election promise but there ya go!

Celtic tiger only an illusion dude .. Pyramid system operated by ahem non socialists .!

Ryan! I’m surprised that you believe the rate of unemployment is only 15%. Take out all those on government free labour rackets such as job bridge, TUS and CE schemes, and I’d say the real rate is well over 20%. Then you have to remember the people who’ve emigrated. Just imagine what it would be like if Australia’s economy was in the same state as ours.

There’s a massive nightclub in Ibiza called AMNESIA it is full of paddies.

Define fair.

Paul furry, you really sound silly saying that.

Think of the most hideous expletive, pluralize it, put neo in front of it and you have an apt description of our parties.

Eamonn, if there’s no viable alternative and the current government are pants what are people to do?

Neo-Fianna Fáils.

FF aren’t an alternative because they appear to have same policies as Fine Gael. A real opposition party is radically different and more people friendly. The christian right were always doomed to fail in the polls. The only question is whether people want centrists who cannot make proper decisions without bluff.

Sadly there are a lot of dishonest selfish people in this country and FF know that, indeed they thrive on it. They know that they can get that block to themselves and that whatever they do they’ll keep backing them and joining the party. 23-24% of the electorate here couldn’t care less about the good of the country, the good of their neighbours and friends.

One small hope is that the rot seems to be most evident in those that are 65+ FF support is small in the under 40′s so there is hope for the country yet.

The onus is on the honest, hard working majority to fight FF tooth and nail.

Young people would never vote FF because FF made it almost impossible to get a drivers license for work. We now have higher unemployment among young people.

21% is hardly comeback territory. That’s not to say those who said they would vote Fianna Fáil shouldn’t be made wear bells to clearly identify themselves in public places lest they hurt themselves using forks without corks and the like…

No….as much as we have an incompetent government we have an incompetent electorate. I sigh in total disbelief……my only hope is that these polls are skewed as many are…. God bless and help old Ireland…..

Young people like myself would never again vote for the rot that is FF but we have all left these shores ! SF only decent party left that will stop the elite snobbery in this country, people are so easily fooled, anyone who is back supporting FF WHAT IS WRONG WITH YE AT ALL ! Have ye lost it do ye want to see yer great gran kids paying back the mess FF put us in and have the same bunch dictating to them !

Put SF in power and see how thankful your grandkids will be.
There isn’t one decent party in this country. Picking the best of a bad lot isn’t good enough.
I don’t have the solution though. We are where we are.

How do you know this , plenty of support for them up the north they represent their citizens well, do you know this because from the corrupt politicians or the bias Denis o Brien media? Or will you drag up the past ? They have never been given the opportunity. Great bunch of people with morals and good values of equality and honesty !

“I don’t have the solution though” … Here’s an idea (which doesn’t seem to be going down too well): http://damoclesbda.wordpress.com/2013/01/02/yeah-well-politicians-innit/

Actually I read everything SF put out in the run up to the last election and decided for myself that I don’t think they are currently fit to run the country. That may change in the future. Time will tell.
I came to this conclusion all by myself using my very own brain. I’ll leave all the childish conspiracy media rubbish to you.

Interesting article Damocles. But unlike the current crop of politicians I know I wouldn’t be capable if fixing things.
But their ego (or perhaps greed) knows no such limits.

I have not always supported SF I educated myself and came to a conclusion all by myself from the roots up SF are a party of decent honest people! As for the media it is a known fact that Denis o Brien owns most of it and I have proof of just how bias an corrupt he is a wrote a comment about it ere and it was deleted! I will say if SF get into power and lie and don’t keep promises believe me I would never vote for then again but I don’t think they would do that !

What are my alternatives vote for 3 parties one that caused the mess and another that is making the mess worse.

Now please stop with the personal shows what kinda person you are and it not making you look too good .

Haha, read back over your borderline hysterical posts accusing people of things just because they did agree with you.
Then get back to me with your “personal”
I’ll be big enough to accept your apology.

*didn’t agree

@man on the street , i am very used to people not agreeng with me i have no problem with that. i have nothing to apologise for as for you calling names i dont expect an apology and really dont want one. what did i accuse someone of ?

I agree with Julie: SF are the only decent alternative.

sorry comment was ment to come from me was using my friends laptop ( bobby)

No need to apologize, Julie. There are a lot of arrogant FG / right-wing posters on here trying to demonize people who vote SF. Don’t let them break you. They resort to insults when they don’t get their way in the polls.

Not talking to you bobby. Myself and Julie were having a wee barney. I should have labelled my posts. Apologies.

Haha, busted. Alternate accounts. From here on in anything you say is worthless. Goodbye.

@mark- only one poll matters. If you want proof, take a quick look at the Government benches in Dáil Éireann. Arrogant enough for you?

@Eamonn. Ah c’mon, sure FF are a whole new different party. Just look at their party leader Micky Martin. Bring back Bev Flynn I say and appoint Lowry.
I want to slap anyone who supports FF, seriously.

Man on the street with your fake name and fake picture I am Julie was on my friends laptop a lovely women was on phone switched to her laptop and posted as her sorry to disappoint you with your fake account who are you ? I am a real person picture and name

Read the whole conversation Mark. You’ll see what I think of FF/FG/Lab.
Just because I don’t think SF are capable if running the country doesn’t make me right wing.
I’m usually accused of being a leftie on this site.
I’m not sure how I’d label myself. More a realist I suppose.

Also I use my phone to go on twitter and journal sold laptop to get money to et out of here only way I could have two accounts would be to delete the app and install it again under a new account as far as I know! I have no problem putting my face to my comments

Eh…you do realise we can all click on “bobbys” account and see that’s its a fake account set up three days ago with the sole purpose of commenting on the journal, right? You do know this, yeah?

Eh u do realise my friend set up a twitter account 3 days ago and commented on the journal because she heard me talking about it she went on once and didn’t like it too many nasty comments , look at my twitter page alway comment as myself and have no problem doing so unlike yourself !

“Sean”
Now, I have shared just as much info about myself as you have, bobby

Young people in rural areas will always vote for the party mammy and daddy vote for full stop !

Irish youth are becoming more and more educated, a lot of mammys and daddy’s screwed it up!

Damocles, if a dog bites my right hand,I wouldn’t give it my left hand to bite too.
I’m not too sure what the alternative would be to tell you the truth. A political party that truly represents us, the people.

You just have to meet the right guy

roflmao steo………………………lol

I’m told many of these poll companies pick up a phone book and telephone random names. It would appear mostly middle – old age groups are mainly listed in the phone book. Many young people do not have home phones.

I’ve been polled twice at my front door, by the same woman, in the space of 6 months, around the time of the last election.

Same door, by the same woman. Perhaps they were trying to pick up on trends by sticking to the same area (I don’t understand the mechanics of polling control), but it just seemed like lazy polling to me.

I’ve been polled a couple of times over the telephone too, back when I lived at home and had a land line.

If you want to take part, then answer the door and blocked phone numbers, get a land-line, and don’t check the “cannot sell information to selected third parties” box.

I was polled at my front door about 9 months ago, before that I never was.

I have been polled. Prison was a horrible experience.

Ex convict,
Adebayo

@Adebayo,

But what about the polling did you enjoy that?

I found it intrusive.

Passed around like an unwanted toy.
Adebayo

@ adebayo,

I assume that in the light of this you won’t be in any great hurry to return.

I suppose that you could say that not only was it intrusive but instructive as well

Do you have wifi under that bridge Brian?

Market research companies use computer generated random numbers and have a scientifically determined formula to get a random sample of the population (it might be only 1000 respondants to the survey, out of the population – that’s why you mightnt have rung you yet Al K Seltzer) . They have to get a certain amount of each age group, males/females, areas etc. It can never be an absolutely perfect gauge of the population but its as close as you can get without actually having an election or referendum.

@dave…i’m gutted………..must get on to a td to see if he can do anything

Wrong market research have box A,B and C to tick before the person is eligible to take part. Professional male, check, 35-50 check, never voted SF ind check. The ‘right’ candidates are chosen tactfully. How go I know this? My wife runs a market research company!! Constantly on the phone ‘looking’ for the right type of people for each topic.

The polls are limited in objectivity but then again most people just believe them without question. The best recipe was discovered in France when voters defied the polls in previous elections. This reduced the influence of poll companies on voters.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1lyu1KKwC74

;)

At last a non-trollish, rational response.

Thanks Balthasar!

“Sinn Féin’s economic illiteracy and dodgy past have been flaunted for the world to see”

Not quite as illiterate as your Fianna Fail Party’s policy, Fiachra. Since you previously voiced support for Fianna Fail, I would take what you say with a pinch of salt. You are merely trying to play upon the vulnerable disaffected voters to buy their votes like in 2007. For the record, few people have issue with SF’s past (except maybe the Sindo and a couple of Blueshirts).

Fiachra Maolmordha Ó Raghallaigh.

It is clear you have a Fianna Fail undertone. I read your message and you basically want people to vote FIANNA FAIL!!

Nice try ;D

Fool me once shame on you

Fool me twice shame on me

The country will get the king it deserves

I’m a member of Fianna Fáil, that’s no secret, but explain to me where I advocated an FF vote. I even accepted that the party were asleep at the wheel when the economy crashed. What I really want above all, and certainly put this above my party’s electoral fortunes, is citizens to become more engaged.

Cheers for dragging party politics into a non-partisan issue.

Fiachra, You are too immersed in your own partisan rhetoric to see the disadvantages of voting Fianna Fail after 14 years of complete gutless politics and ineptness.

Asleep at the wheel is kinda playing it down don’t you think? Don’t forget brown envelops and Galway tents they knew exactly what was going on and were involved, They have no morals and don’t deserve a second chance!

Julie, that’s your view and I’m not going to dispute it. My aim wasn’t to be an apologist for Fianna Fáil, but to ask people to become more politically engaged by joining parties or setting up new ones. If I wanted to write a blog post about why people should join Fianna Fáil, I would, however I think the people at fiannafail.ie and ogra.ie have that pretty well covered anyway.

But u support that party being voted back in ? Because of them I am being forced to emigrate and because of people supporting them again there is a chance I won’t be able to return any time soon. Nothing has changed ff same as FG majority of policies of FG were all policies that FF were in favour of before they got cast out and are still in favour of! They need to be kept out!

Fiachra: FF are Not engaging with the electorate. If they did, they would’ve proposed a wealth tax and abolition of property tax for the middle class.

Also, we need tighter citizenship laws. At present anyone can apply for an Irish Passport after just 5 years residence. I propose it be 10 years residence before eligibility.

This kind of partisan language is enough to put anyone off politics.

Goodnight.

Well done Fiachra. Two nails hit on the head – SF’s inability to capitalise on this country’s worst crisis cause they are simply unbelievable. Oh and Pat Kennys salary. Sick of under achievers whinging about it…

Why are people giving Julie thumbs down. Wait, let me guess, it’s all you Fianna Fáil idiots thumbing her down is it. If you had any balls you would have changed your name, you shameless, vile, incompetent goons.

Fiachra, your comment really sums up the future of Fianna Fáil. “This kind of partisan…..” Who do you think you are? You self righteous kid.

I was wondering the same thing! FF did ruin the country with corruption didn’t they, everyone entitled to their opinion I guess I have made my decision on reading facts and looking around me at misery and suffering, People can support who they want but I just don’t understand the support for FF FG labour baffling! Oh well when it all sinks a least I can say I wasn’t apart of destroying the country

“Well done Fiachra. Two nails hit on the head”

lol. Nothing but bla bla black sheep in there!

Who do I think I am? An individual, who happens to be a member of a political party. However I think that I’m entitled to express my own opinions as an individual, without having to defend Fianna Fáil’s record.

Some conspiracy nuts/trolls thought that a blog post I’d written (on why disaffected voters should join political parties or set up their own ones) had a whiff of FF propaganda about it. I proved them wrong, but Mark and Julie thought that this was an invitation to complain to me about Fianna Fáil’s economic record, even though I explained that I had no interest in defending it, and it was irrelevant to the topic at hand.

I’m sorry if I was discourteous to Julie, though my comment was more directed at Mark. It’s simply that while I have my own reasons for joining Fianna Fáil, and my own reasons for continuing to support them, I do not feel obliged to expend my energy articulating them to every single who happens to ask.

Also Phil, I’m not the one making childish personalised attacks to a complete stranger on a news site.

Hey everyone, lay off Fiachra. I read his blog and his comments here, and he seems like a good well meaning lad. Yeah, he’s a member of Young Fianna Fáil, but we all did silly things when we were young. He could be worse, he could be that KPMG girl.

@ Tony, I am myself tired of having to say what you have just said. I think as a nation we like to be the stupid underdog to give us an excuse to moan about how bad it is.

If they get back in we need a REVOLUTION , please people don’t vote for them I wana come back to Ireland nothing will change ye will ruin it for my generation !!!

That’s the stuff Julie, by the ballot box or the armalite… Either way will do!!!

See, you just mentioned Paddy Power. That’s exactly what they want.

because you can gamble on politics so they like to know who people are voting for makes perfect sense to me.
paddy power asked for this to be done and then the journal made it into a story its not like it makes a difference to pp they just want to change there odds is all.

I was polled twice by telephone by Red C in the weeks and days before the last election. A lady called from the UK to do the survey.

yes mr.supafly…..it says it on the polls if you read them.

Ya but who are these young people , the same young people that disgraced us at economic seminar in front of max keiser saying we had a moral obligation to pay the bondholders. I have no moral obligation to pay anyone I never had a loan credit card or any bit of debt in my life. Or the young people you see pat Kenny interviewing ! Come on !

Its our moral obligation to be a brainwashed someway ignorant population who have alter egos and tend not to live in the reality but keep up the chirade that recession is not affecting them because their all ahead of the game. When Australia has enough it will say no and they will have to comeback to a country that does not want them and the moral obligation to pay will become alot realer it will be too late by then though im afraid even Doddy will be broke.

What?

Not all parties are the same. Nobody has given SF a chance yet, have they? People before profit? Socialist Party? ULA?

Ultimately, voting will entail openness to change instead of just simply voting mainstream parties.

Sinn Fein. Least corrupt. Did you say that with a straight face?

Vincent,

You exposed your support for FG multiple times. You could at least clarify that in your current posts.

I think it’s pretty apparent.

Well what I mean is Vincent, how can a person believe any labour or Fine Gael member when they promise to do one thing before an election an then turn around and do the exact opposite.

Now even you can’t say the current government have done this on numerous issues. The fact is any of these creatures who are a part of the current government would have sold their mother to get into power, because now they can sort out their own wages and their advisers (friends) and families interests. This is their main goal, Ireland’s recovery is a distant second in my opinion. And Fianna Fáil were another 50% worse by the way!

So although I don’t think Sinn Fein would be good for our country, I think there is more of a chance of them keeping their promises than the other goughers both present and past do you not agree?

@philip- the Irish electorate gets what it deserves. I’d like to tell you that if a party stood in front of them & told the unvarnished truth, the people would respect their integrity and vote for them. Ask Alan Dukes about that. FG have broadly stuck by their election promises and are by and large delivering. They have left income tax alone and we look close to returning to the markets. If they bring home the bank deal they will have done as much as I expected. As for Sinn Fein ask people in the North about Sinn Fein’s austerity measures up there.

@vincent
Election promises.
“five point plans”,
“Not a penny more to bond holders”
“Morally wrong to Tax a person’s home”

Post election facts
Not a job created since, more austerity, more emigration, more nepotism, breaking pay caps set by themselves.

Am I missing something here Vincent!

Could you not create one?

This “alternative” thing keeps being thrown about without much thought. According to the facts, Ireland has a diverse range of political parties that are alternatives. I think what the “no alternative” posters mean is they want a far-right Nazi style party.

@ Damocles. For sure. I left during the last hours of the Celtic tiger being utterly disillusioned with a country where I was wealthier than I had ever expected to be but in a totally broken society of selfishness and arrogance and one where I could see my taxes (which I felt I paid too little) had been pi$$ed up against the side of Buswells on a Friday night.

I’d strongly suggest you change your picture. It’s a tad offensive to someone like me ( old fogey from German Jewish family ) and p, added to your comments, it could be misinterpreted that you’re not against the idea of a neo-Nazi party setting up shop in Ireland. SF supporters who reference Nazis ( national socialists ) are opening a can of worms for themselves. Not a criticism, by the way, but you’ve mentioned you’re a young lad, but I’m not, and what’s distant history for you were childhood experiences for my father…

Nikolas is pretending he is another nationality. Not very good at covering this up either.

Kenny doesn’t do q and a the rest do,so if FG hope for a second term in ’16 Kenny will need to be pushed aside.Leo/Simon to me would be the obvious leaders in waiting.But ideally i would like to see a new direction in Irish politics but none of the present “clowns”are capable of delivering i’m afraid.

@norman- charismatic, he’s not. But Enda Kenny is probably the best possible man to have at the helm right now. He’s an effective Chairman of the board- holding together a disparate coalition cabinet every sinew of which must be itching to splinter. As I’ve said, the proof will be in the pudding. In 2016 the electorate will have to ask itself whether the country is better off than when Enda became Taoiseach. I suspect / hope, the answer will be a resounding yes.

Vincent you can hope,but as i advised you last night don’t bet on it.FG got in by default,strongarm tactics by Hogan/Reilly kept Enda in position.He will be dumped when it becomes obvious he is not the one to lead an incumbant government into an election.

when did they let you out?

“the only freedom is death”

Do you need the number for the Samaritans?

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1lyu1KKwC74
;)

I could be said that, as they’ve never been in power, they haven’t had a chance to make those mistakes. I’ve never lost a million quid in a poker-game, but I’ve never had a million to lose, so that’s no reflection of my moral character.

@nik- I think the jury has already came back re: the moral character or lack thereof, of Sinn Fein

I’m not fundamentally against Sinn Fein as such, and I wouldn’t write off the possibility of voting for them in the future if:

1. The old guard voluntarily step down and so sever the connections to the bad old days once and for all.

2. They stop acting like an extremist, hard-line party. They can’t have their cake and eat it, they either fully enter mainstream politics or remain on the edges.

3. They stop selling T-Shirts that celebrate terrorism and killing.

4. They stop spoofing and grandstanding. It only damages their credibility.

5. They rein in their grassroots supporters and show that they won’t tolerate supposed supporters personally insulting and threatening physical violence against those who disagree with them. They need more swing votes, they’re not going to get them by abusing potential voters.

On the last point, I am not saying that the party condones or instigates the behaviour of some of their grass-roots followers, but saying nothing is not enough. They need to vocally condemn this type of behaviour of their followers.

If the above happens, and they have reasonable policies and representatives, then they can have my vote. But not before.

Nikolas. If Sinn Finn did all that and lost the attitude I’d vote for them.

Nickolas Sinn Fein grassroots never voted for Bertie Enda so the last thing SF grassroots should do is change their ways to appease people who did .Missing the point there big time stay through to your beliefs or else your just the same as the rest.I think you will find most of the trolls are Pro Gov.

If SF want to consolidate their position and increase their voting support, appeasing their electorate is the only way to do it. That’s how democracy works. Or do you want SF to remain a minority party that is distrusted by the majority of the electorate? Unless they reform how they present themselves to the nation they will never progress. As a SF supporter, surely you want your chosen party to become more influential, and so bring about the nation that you want to live in? Alienating people won’t help in any way.

SF have a mandate and will stick to their mandate because if they change the public will see that they break their word and promises just like FF FG L GP PD.. SF will stick to what the party is all about and if democracy is a game of twists turns broken promises and deceit pandering for power just to rule then democracy is what intelligent people think it is DEAD.

Nikolas, that’s basically saying Sinn Fein should abandon their roots and beliefs and move to the centre, to be more populist so as to attract more voters.. Isn’t that part of the problem with Irish politics? Too many parties sitting on the fence and playing us for fools..

Democracy is dead? That’s the party line? Why are SF taking part in the democratic process then. Surely you can see that you’re shooting yourself in the foot with this type of argument. It’s exactly what I meant about the impossibility of having your cake and eating it. I take from what you’re saying ( maybe I’m wrong ) that you want SF to remain a hard-line fundamentalist party. I’m sure many supporters do. But even more potential supporters don’t. And it’s those more mainstream voters that pushed SF’s popularity up to 20% last year. It is those people who voted in an unprecedented amount if SF TDs at the last election. You need those people for the party to move forward, and you need those people to feel that they are respected. If they feel like they’ve been conned, SF support will drop and many of those TDs will not be able to retain their seats. It’s either /or for SF, mainstream or hard line and, to be honest, the middle management and the up and coming leaders have been doing their best to publicly brush the extremist past under the carpet. Sooner or later, one side will win out, or there’ll be a pro-democratic / anti-democratic split in the party not completely unlike that in the seventies, although this time it won’t be between nationalist and socialist, it’ll be between hard line exclusive and more centrist inclusive.

Like Jamie said Nikolas .Democracy is dead if we are to uphold the modern version of it.if you dont stand for something you stand for nothing and respect comes with wisdom and the majority of Irish electorate need to start wising up.

OH Nickolas i say democracy is dead because right wing parties killed it you get your vote you vote for the same two partys with the same policies and they lie to get the vote and the break their promises so your vote is worthless hence democracy is dead until people bring it back to life be wising up and holding politicians accountable lies deceit and deflection is not democracy.

But then the party ultimately end up outside looking in, without any political power with which to bring about change. Which was the reason why SF took such an active part in the peace process and changed it’s stance on not recognising the validity of the Irish democratic system. If you reject democracy, you’ll remain true to your mandate ( which is no longer the official SF mandate ), you’ll remain a purist, but you’ll have absolutely no influence or power. Like I say, shooting yourself in the foot.

Look i know what you mean but if you want to be a party that stands for your principals then you must stat true to them principals if them principals are relevant then people will find their own way to S.F it has to be a natural thing because for a Political party to remain credible it has to stand for its beliefs and people vote for you or not ut you must not lie to get the vote in time people will see that S.F will offer an alternative the enter twined Partys that have ran us into the ground if you care for your people you must not mislead them and people must know what the are getting that is democracy in my view i a 34 and i want change .change for good.Good evening to you.. shalom.

Nikolas Koehler,

Lol. You exposed yourself as being aligned with the Rightwingers. Apparently, you brag about someone’s avatar while supporting a policy akin to the Adolf Hitler. I read a collection of your previous commentary over the past year and it is clear to me you are purporting to be another nationality! You’re just using that to your advantage when it is obvious you are Irish and a FG supporter! Take me advice: BE YOURSELF!

To run a country is a vocation not a vacation your first principal as Leader and Gov must be the immediate well being of your people to assume responsibility of the framework to the vision that you have promised pre election if you become leader you must carry out that vision whole heartedly because it is the peoples vision that is why you recieved their vote in the first place .This mentality has been lost on Irish politicians and if we are to succeed in getting our country back we need people with these values and i believe S.F have them .

@ Mark don’t be an ar*e please. It’s well-known on this site that I’m a socialist of the old “taxation is good as it moves wealth out of the hands of private citizens” stripe. I’ve said this often enough last year, and have been criticized for it both by pro-Government posters and by the news breed of wannabe socialists who are in fact anything but. I’ve also clearly said my age, 64, my former political party membership ( Worker’s Party and the early days if democratic left ), and I’ve bemoaned many times this new thread of willful ignorance and anti-intellectualism I’m modern wannabe socialism. Lastly, I’ve said before and I’ll say again my family background; I’m Irish born and bred, but my father and his patents came to Ireland in the thirties because they were German Jews and my grandfather a socialist to boot, who chose Ireland primarily because of James Connolly and the naive notion that the Irish, have been oppressed, would be sympathetic towards another oppressed people.

Now all that’s said, if you want to have a serious political discussion, then I welcome it. If you want to continue your slack-jawed shouty shouty activist without a clue persona, then I would kindly ask you to b****r off and bother someone else who likes that kind of thing, because I don’t find it impressive and I’m not coming out to play.

Jack- most Sinn Fein grassroots people don’t have a vote in the Republic so they couldn’t vote for Bertie or Taoiseach Kenny.

Jamie- this country is centrist. That’s why centre parties dominate. And terrorists are confined to the peripheries.

bit harsh vincent…. let’s not mention what the blueshirts did at knocknagoshel

Nikolas Koehler,

My comments got more positive recommendations whilst yours got none. The fact you lambast my points suggests you are a mouthpiece for the Kenny administration.

I disagree. I think we may see ff getting stronger & maybe the new parties also getting support from fg lb & sf voters & the new small parties supporting ff in a coalition. Its happened so many times before its not beyond possibility. I would like to see new parties on all divides but this is the most likely outcome.

@ SCP1,

It’ll never happen. The PR system has the traditional parties comfortably lodged. New parties don’t have the networks and the landscape is littered with the remains of any that tried or it may be that FF is the kiss of death, PD’s Greens. Only chance is significant breakaways from traditional parties coalessing

I seriously doubt it. The mindset of Irish voters has and remains consistently centre right, in the majority. Thus we flip flop between two parties that most concur with that stance. New parties with left leanings will not impact on that mindset. There is something fundamentally embedded in the Irish psyche against change!

@stephen. I never mentioned left leaning. I want a little to the right of centre right

5 years ago if someone said there’d be more independents than FF TDs and that FF would have no seat in Dublin they have been funny farmed.

FG promised new politics and people voted for that in their tens of thousands. And we got same old stroke politics.

I for one will in future vote new party, independent, far right, far left. Id even give SF a low down transfer. But never again FF/FG/Lab

@ Stephen,

I agree with you. Leftist parties do moderately well as a result of a shock . a bit like we’ve had in last few years. What is interesting is that left leaning parties recognise that long term, to achieve any sort of base ,must move to the centre, This is partly to blame for the incestous bickering within the Labour party at the moment and may ultimately lead to a split

Was that not the progressive democrats? (More right leaning)

Indeed I would almost say labour are currently right of centre, thanks to their democratic left members. Without that leaning though they would probably never get a look in.

PDs had two major problems (a) they were made up of mostly existing politicians (b) their timing was bad

There has never been a better time for new political organizations to start and I suspect there will be 3 or 4 new parties with seats in the next dail. Who knows though. We cud well end up voting FG back in. I think if the election was tomorrow that’s what would happen anyway due to lack of any alternative

Oh Scrap. Splendid innocence. FG at 29% in midterm in the immediate aftermath of the Savita Case and the budget. That’s actually a good figure. Flash forward 2 years, a bank deal & the troika sent packing and FG will command 35% at the next election. Sorry to burst your bubble.

What about the effects of property tax, increased emigration, complete failure in the domestic economy and two further austerity budgets to come. I think you are the one displaying innocence or maybe naivety. This bank deal your pinning your hopes on is a fanciful idea, with no substance. It’s a long way from an election but there is not much hope of FG halting this trend unless they radically change direction, also they will need a strong leader, they will not get to hide Enda next time, which should cost them at least another 3%

SF supporters will always support SF because unlike ff FG and labour they have given their supporters no reason to not support them they have not let them down like the corrupt lot past and present! I think it is a injustice to people of Ireland that SF have not been given the opportunity to represent this country, ira was a past issue we have a new one and they the only ones making sense we must rem majority of the party were babies during the troubles and have no connections! Brilliant media and spineless politicians who are afraid of there wages being cut will continue to use this as a tactic to fool the Irish public and deny them good honest representation !!

Stephen. It’s not even a deal. Even if they lowered interest rates to zero. It’s not our debt. It was forced on us to save the euro.

Vincent. I’m delighted for you that you can hold up the Savita case and an inhuman regressive budget to show how well FG support is holding up. Maybe ur right actually. Time will tell

Sadly vincent is right, I feel. FG, so long as something resembling a decent bank deal is done and we’re in recovery / growth, will walk the next election ( I still contend with ff as junior partner ) as all they have to do is play the ‘don’t rock the economic boat’card.

SF were given an opportunity 2 years ago in the last election. They will be given the same opportunity in the next election.
So really what you are saying is “it’s not fair that people won’t pick the party I like”, which is the rational of a child.

@scrap- FG’s first significant jolt in the polls was within 10 days of the Savita debacle. That is an irrefutable fact.

I made no personal attack on you so why would you make a personal attack on me , very childish of you I must say. Oh but that is how ff, FG operate attack someone personal if they say something you don’t like. Grow up a small bit ! Rotten media and rotten politicians ! I have had enough in out of Ireland if ye want to sink it work away sick of trying to talk to people. What about Sinn Féin politics do you not like the equality part leave the sick disabled and poor alone ?

@julie- You’re a Sinn Fein supporter. You embarrass yourself when you condemn others for the manner in which they attack you. Because unless the attack involves tar, feathers, bullets, baseball bats or Semtex, members of the party which you hold up as the epitome of integrity have done a whole lot worse. You know. Murders. Kidnappings. Robberies. That sort of thing.

Ah Vincent now seriously I’m 23 troubles are in the past , has nothing to do with me and a party that is made up of a majority of people who had no IRA connections seems kinda childish using that! Please stop calling me childish it is insulting I in no way think I am childish! In the present it is really you who should be embarrassed that you support a party that have destroyed and are destroying lives and our country! If you want a discussion please refrain from personal attacks as you seem to feel it is okay to attack me because I support SF. I didn’t always support them I just look and I listen to what the likes of Mary Lou and Pearse say a lot better than listening to Gilmore Kenny talking about cuts to welfare disability and prop tax water charges etc etc ! Cap wages 100,000 wealth tax etc better alternatives to destroying the most vulnerable in society !

@Julie- Dessie Ellis- implicated in 50 murders. Gerry Adams (of West Belfast, not Louth) and Martin McGuinness- lobbied for the early release of the murderers of Garda Jerry McCabe. Dessie, Gerry and Martin- I believe they remain in your party, yes? I know Sinn Fein want people to forget what they did. But the reality is: they haven’t gone away, you know.

“What is interesting is that left leaning parties recognize that long term, to achieve any sort of base ,must move to the center”

Haha that’s why Labor are suffering a Massive decline in their support.

In France, people embraced a socialist government and did the world collapse? No. Life still goes on…

@vincient , please that is 3 people, as far as i have heard dessie was not found guilty of any of them murders. look IRA doesnt come into it for me, i look at present why would i judge them on a past that is a past, hasnt their been a thing called the peace process. these troubles were up the north. how come they are one of the biggest parties up the north, these are people who were directly affected by the troubles if they can move on surely we can too. now lets get back to politics and leave the past where it is.

That’s Sinn Fein’s leadership!

Julie you’ll find that while Vincent is an educated intelligent able debater who is *usually* courteous if a little arrogant, that he is a dyed in the wool FG man and is not for turning. You on the other hand have switched allegiances based on your observations – an encouraging sign from one so young. Take a look at Direct Democracy Ireland. We might convert u again! :-)

Just one thing. When u say cap pay at 100k I assume u mean Public Service. Private sector can earn whatever the market will pay

It’s interesting how Vincent places his faith in BRITISH government documents…!! Also, he apparently gets his info from the Sindo – a paper which is no stranger to inaccurate stories like the Polish story which the Polish embassy had to correct them upon.

The British Government, the Garda oh and let’s not forget the dogs in the street. Lets ignore the fact he got off on a technicality though as that’s very unhelpful. By your logic no newspaper is believable, as they have all got things wrong. Sure we shouldn’t believe that Sinn Fein/IRA are responsible for the deaths of 3,500 people on this island, many of which were women and children, not to mention catholic.

I am not alone in my switch from my observations , young people have had enough! I have heard of that party and think it is good to see new parties emerging I just fear that it is always going to be a repetitive cycle of FG and FF I just don’t understand how people still support them. I think no matter what they do the sheep will follow. I think start by capping TDs salaries and abolishing stupid allowances my view is the guys inflicting the cuts should take the cuts first! I will look more into that party and will be in touch.

@mark- Do you see the SINDO on the shelf when you’re picking up An Phoblacht On Sunday? I believe the girls in balaclava edition is excellent

So Julie/bobby, people are sheep because they don’t agree with you? But I thought you didn’t do name calling?
Tut tut. I’m disappointed.

Ah come on now , people are sheep not because they don’t agree with me because they keep following parties that are attacking the most vulnerable in society, Julie only thanks do some more trolling I always comment on things from my account, who are you? Why not your real identity ? It’s your choice but seen as you brought it up

What real account? You give one name. You share no more info than I do. Not that I have a problem with that. But it seems to get to you.
But at least I only use one account.

It seems you don’t really fully take in what people are saying and just come back with random. Look at my account I always post as myself and have already explained to you ,do some more trolling before you make accusation. There is no way of knowing you only have one account you could have 10, 20 who knows! My account is a bit more real and I don’t care one way or another if people want to use their own names or not that’s their decision.

SF don’t want to leave the past where it is they keep asking for both governments to conduct a truth and reconciliation programme but neither will why not ? Strange isn’t is !

not surprising at all….maybe you are surprised because you talk to much about history and not the future

46% of people have a problem with a democratic vote. There are a lot of damaged people in this country, sad to say.

no it doesn’t say that. nice way to twist it though you should probably go into politics.

Labour had the chance to be stronger in govt and show leadership and voters would have rewarded them next time round with more seats and a stronger say, but blew it, going to be a lot of one term labour TDs is time and only the self to blame. And I have voted labour last 3 times but never again as long as Gilmore leads. There far from prefect but could have taken on ff and fg

No sorry Paul, I’m not an armchair republican, far from it… But I do believe it’s unnecessary for a flag to be flown 365 days a year in Belfast, when it’s not flown in other major UK cities. This is to simply suit a unionist community who still feels it has a right to dictate over it’s nationalist neighbours. Those days are over… Also, it was a democratic decision… Remember?!

And more fine-gaelers than fianna-failers approve of the decision! the mind boggles

i know it was a democratic decision well done lads we all got that. just because its a democratic decision doesn’t mean we have to agree with it though. hence the poll. people think it was wrong because it was up and there was no trouble and now its down and there is they should have just left it up and no one would have given a shit.

and also if Fianna Fail get voted into office next can people not disagree with that because after all “it was a democratic decision… Remember?!”

Ff are coming back…get ready

Free ink cartridge with vote perhaps

If FF are forgiven so quickly by the electorate then we definitely are getting what we deserve and we ll get plenty more of it. Until politicians are held accountable and shunned at the ballot box for corruption, lies and incompetence – they ll never change. We ll end up like the US, two options on the menu, both rotten to the core, working for the elite owners of the Federal Reserve and the military industrial companies.
A new form of democracy needed.

FF aren’t forgiven so easily. People just don’t want FG. There much of the same anyway. I’m voting FF next GE. Anything to get FG out if power. They are handing our country over to Europe on a silver platter garnished with shamrock. No thanks I’ll stick to a party that looks after its own at home not for those big boys in Europe. Thumb away

And to add. While I let you all know my voting power. If there was a chance that FF would get into bed with FG my vote would go to SF. I have no party alliegence and will vote for who ever 1: reverses the property tax 2: stands up to Europe 3: fixes my road. :)

Wow Ryan your ignorance astounds me. FF got us into the mess FG are continuing with plans made by FF voting for one to rid us of the other is a wasted vote in my opinion.

Poor you, Ryan

Isn’t it a shame us ignoramus can have a vote Karen. Sad for you that I have an opinion. Thanks for the insult, I would have expected more from a young lady but obviously not.

Ireland just doesn’t produce people who are capable enough to run a country. It’s time to let some other country take charge of us.

It was FF how handed over the country to Europe and don’t forget it. they should never be in power again

@rodrigo,we have people capable of running the country as in proper business people who can make the country profitable again not the teacher as taoiseach half the dail are farmers the rest are just useless..we take in loads of money in but it is wasted compared to other countries

Eh ff and fg are the spin masters .. Sf are coming down the track and both right wing party’s know it!

@ Pierce2020… Is that all you’re worried about??!! I’d be more worried about the eejits with the short memories in regards to FF….

And u seriously believe that FF will implement a different strategy to current Lot. That most delusional statement I’ve read in yrs.

Who are the most likely party to not bend to the eu and their demand SF No one can say otherwise FF FG and labour are useless in the situation we are in

Loads of people could say otherwise. They might be right, they might be wrong, but they can say it and they have the right to say it. Free speech and all that.

“Labour support seems to have more or less bottomed out”
We’re not half way to the next election yet. A bit premature to claim it’s “bottomed out” when it could fall more. The real picture will come once water charges get introduced – SF seem to oppose water charges, FF support water charges. Same issue with a property tax. If FF supported a wealth tax, they would attract more support.

@Paul Anthony- wishful thinking my Fianna Fáil member friend. This is undoubtedly the weakest moment of this Government’s life. FG have essentially preserved their core 30% support. And the country’s economic position is improving steadily. At the next election centre right voters will have a choice: more of the same- a Government you don’t love but who have improved things steadily or Fianna Fáil- the party who got us into this mess, with a front bench nobody knows. You think a risk averse electorate is going with the latter? Not so much.

Check the road death stats… RSA is surely something that can be considered a success

Enforcement has been a success – not the RSA. The Department of Transport handled it more efficiently and better. Penalizing new drivers with tortuous bureaucracy is perhaps why there is a shortage of Bus drivers. It’s now more easy to get a UK license than Ireland. It’s also cheaper in the UK to get a license unlike Ireland.

Rationale:

The RSA has to justify their existence so they find new ways of “regulation” – too many people are employed in the RSA. It should be closed and re-merged with the Department of Transport (like before).

Are you not a member of that same electorate? Insulting potential voters for the party you support mightn’t be an effective way to boost their standing amongst those voters.

If you are a fool you are a fool and it wont be me that will boost my partys voter base it will be the individual itself so if you want things to stay the same work away but if you dont and still vote for the same partys that made you want that change in the first pace.Then you are a fool because that is how fool think with a complete neglect for a underestimated thinking process called common sense sadly lacking on these fair shores.

Then why not leave if you despise and are so disgusted with your nationality? A nation and a national identity is simply the sum of the people of that nationality after all. Me, I’m Irish, I’m proud to be Irish and I genuinely like and respect the majority of the people I meet in this country.

Why would i leave this country maybe its time the people who are destroying it leave Corrupt politicians Corrupt Bankers an the fools who keep voting them in if they all left maybe we would have a chance.Why vote in a government that has destroyed your country why persist with a government that has every intention of making it worse.Why should i leave i was never taken in by such blatant propaganda Bertie Brian Enda only a fool would believe them and its the same fools that are ruining my country by endorsing them.The electorate should wise up or f-off .

The whole of the electorate should f- off if they don’t agree with your, a single person’s view? There’s a word for that kind of thinking, and it’s not “democracy”. You could of course go and set up the Anti-People Political Party. Don’t know how well the meetings would go down though; “f- off!” “No, you f- off! Etc. etc. etc. Not a lot of votes to be won there.

Who wants a vote of a fool only political partys who aim to fool SF are looking for people who are not pre occupied with the enhancement of their own personal lives but the whole countries because if you enhance your countries your enhancing your own .Now your like media man jumping all over oneword said and missing the point i was making which is if people are in dire straits and there only plan out is to bring back the ones who put the them their then they are not only ruining the country even more but also for the people who want to change it but cannot because the common dominator are asleep and afraid.A true Irish man Michael Collins said the Irish people are too dam careful and cautious hinting at the fact it took them an age to actually do something so he just went away and took on the establishment himself.Either wake up and change or suffer but SF supporters never fell foe establishment lies and always resisted it just like now so to anyone that is unhappy and fed up and sees only future monotony of misery ahead vote SF or Join SF and give people who warned the population against what was going to happen and has happened a chance to turn it around .SF will fight for the Irish because it is the only way out.

But people won’t vote for SF if SF insults those same people by calling them fools. It’s a vicious circle. try a little love and understanding, instead of offering abuse and fighting.

Ive being called a fool many times in my life and if the person was right then they were right .Like all lessons learned in life you ask yourself why you have been foolish and dont make the same mistake again hence wising up and enhancing your mindset to protect you your family your country your wealth your education your well being. Such is life.

I respect the people not the politicians that have forced me out have to leave to get job ( vote for Lisbon vote for jobs more lies) our reputation has been destroyed because of a small few corrupt self serving politicians making bad decisions because they have no clue and shouldn’t be in the positions that they are in , IRISH is slowly disappearing and becoming European. We are losing our national identity anyway !

hahaha love the last bit,
what scares me is the anti government protest vote seems to have gone to fianna fail and what even scares me more is the labour party has remained stable

Don’t be scared, Frank. Slowly, steadily, effectively Fine Gael will reverse us out of the ditch Fianna Fáil drove us into. You’ll be ok.

*blinkers* Vincent just be great full that your party got a shot. Won’t happen next time. If there is a chance that FF and FG would go into bed together and either form a FFG party or coalition I would definitely vote SF. Your party is hemorrhaging voters to beat the band. And I can see lab doing a greens and pulling out at the last min to save the little they have left. BUT as I’v said before the only poll that matters is voting day…….then we shal see Mr.D, then we shal see :)

hahaha vinvent
that was just as funny as your last comment.
highest disparity of wealth this country has ever seen
i think not my friend!

sorry *Vincent

@ryan- the next two years will see this country’s prospects improve and economy grow. Labour won’t walk because the only road to redemption for them is ultimately sell the accomplishments of this Government. Fine Gael and Labour will comfortably retain power. If after the last 4 months FG have retained a commanding lead in the poll the future holds little fear. Devastated not to have your vote, of course but they’ll battle on regardless.

Bullshit

More fortune telling. Can we stick to the present please where FG are slipping in the polls due to the continuing hardship put on the average Irish working family. This expense is for bondholder gain! Yes FG are GREAAAAT

Sure thing. At present Fine Gael are the biggest party in the Dail and in the polls and in both instances they are the biggest by a country mile. Better?

Very true.

Here is the problem. Like many other FG’s the above need and desire the Tweedledum and Tweedledummer show of Irish politics to continue. How can the country change or improve when the 2 big parties both serve the same select few.

@twitch- if only SF were in power, we could tip into the nearest Northern Bank as and when required to replenish the nations coffers. Nirvana lies therein.

I think you got that a bit mixed up there Patrick come on like that’s a stupid thing to say after what FF did to the Irish people