Simple issue really. How much does it cost to give it to everyone compared with how much it costs to means test everyone.

Why all the focus on the Plain People instead of the waste and dishonesty in public bodies?
Eg
WIT hiring a plane to fly someone from Dublin to Waterford?
Wexford town council allowing someone living in Australia to remain as a councillor (Brendan Howlin’s constituency!)
Those with their snouts in the trough are to remain unpunished while you and I will have to dig ever deeper in our pockets!

Bus pass worth f**k all unless you live in a city with commuter bus/rail service. The vast majority of elderly people outside these areas rarely get to use it as there are no services for them in there areas. But to save money Govt should look at the wasters who don’t work and have these passes. I see them in Dublin everyday on the busses strung out travelling around the city without a care in the world. The Govt should not only means test it for these but also take a look at the necessity for these younger people to have it. Why do they need full free travel? Surely most of these people aren’t that unable to walk to the shops etc and living in a city they don’t have that far to travel to a shop Dr etc anyway!!!

I am really not sure on this one….Both my parent have this service and use it a lot but in truth they could easily afforf to pay….Where my beef is that both of them paid tax at the higher end of things for their whole life and they both continue to spend in the domestic economy….
What’s the future vision of Ireland??? Is it a place where a portion of Irish people who basically contribute nothing their whole lives live off those that work hard… I really dont like that vision….
So on this i am torn because the people who have contributed the most will be the ones to get the least while the ones who contribute nothing will get everything…

I was on the Luas one Saturday afternoon recently and a young man got on drunk. He started verbally abusing some people and shouting. The guy checking tickets came to him and asked for his ticket. In a rude manner he told the conductor he had no ticket. The conductor said something to him that I didn’t hear and low and behold drunk guy pulls out a pass. He did not look disabled in any way shape or form. As a tax payer and working girl I find it disgraceful that someone like this has a free travel pass. Definitely needs review. But leave the old people alone. Of course they should have it and as fully entitled after working for this country all their lives.

suppose theres no chance they would actually start with maybe the head of CIE who earns a cool 600k a year for running a business thats actually losing money but hes never once taken a meaningful paycut, the fact the state has to help out the public transport service to the tune of over 10million euro a year seems to indicate that theres far too much being made of the usual hitting the ordinary workers of the buses, trains etc and not starting at the top and slashing the obese wage packets of the management of these services!

Means test all the junkies who get on buses for free. Leave the old people alone but all the people cheating the system means test them for it

I’d say there’s very little to be made from withdrawing elderly people’s free travel. If you take it away then most will probably cease using it rather than pay.

I’d much rather see something done about the junkie knackers that I constantly see getting on the bus in the city centre flashing their pass to the driver, then getting off one or 2 stops later. It seems that these days you’re rewarded for being a lowlife, while the bill is footed by ordinary decent people.

Junkies shouldnt be given them for a start. I always hate seeing them ride around for free!

I have the free pass as a blind person. (will I be means tested?) I have no other way of travelling. Even to go to town to get a bus I rely on family or friends for a lift.I think they should start with reducing the fraud first before they start. a simple photo ID pass would solve a lot.

It should never be means tested for the over 66. They deserve a free transport pass because they have paid so much in taxes over their lifetime.

My grandmother for example, would not leave the house if she couldn’t rely on a free bus every so often to head to mass etc just down the road. If the elderly aren’t active regularly they loose their confidence.

Definitely means test all the junkies etc with free bus passes on “medical” grounds, undeserved and unearned.

This should not be means tested. First of all these elderly people have done their dues and deserve to be left alone from this mess. Second of all, and more importantly, we should be promoting public transport as a means to get unsafe aging drivers away from driving cars.

I would hate to think of my nanny and grandad losing their passes its the one thing they don’t have to worry about especially as most of the family live in different parts of the country, but even just for the day to day things its a big help

Means testing travel…?
I imagine most pensioners travel during off peak times. How can you save money restricting access to a bus seat that’s probably empty anyway. Also surely the place to start is children’s allowance or is that too obvious.

I don’t believe that the elderly should be means tested. They should get free travel. But the numbers i see that use the free pass who are not elderly is extortionate and I believe they should look closely at who has a pass. I feel there’s too many.

My mum says the free travel pass is great .She is 72 years old and gets around the country to see all the relatives and friends.The staff on Irish rail and Bus Eireann are very friendly as well she says.

My fear is that if you withdraw free travel from an older person instead of paying for it, they just won’t travel. And that’s in nobody’s interest. Free travel should be restricted to off-peak hours, however.

If revenue and social communicated then everything could be (and should be) means tested.

The elderly have paid their taxes for the past 40 odd years so the least they deserve a bus pass.

What are there so many idiotic comments like ” why should I have to pay if they don’t” , we have to pay for transport , and it seems to me two different issues , 1 do we want people over 66 to receive free public transport and 2 Can we better manage the system for scammers and people abusing the statement. Something misguided in my opinion by not targeting the many inefficiencies in the public transport system but saying that there’s more fares to be made targeting old people , there has been old people here a long time and I see Lucas manage to operate public transport system efficiently by factoring in the numbers…Dublin bus in particular has historically has been heavily unionised with a lot if legacy issues that are outdated and cost a fortune and could do with root and branch reform before needing To target the old.

Means test or not I bet the junkies still get it

So charge the pensioner on low benefits €4 return to get to a supermarket where in hope she can buy cheaper products than those in her local Centra and Spars. This would lead to them to being unable to get the bus to the doctors to community social groups and shopping plus other examples leaving them more isolated in old age or disability.

Has anyone in that building got a clue? There seems to be a lack of creativity or forward thinking, which is nothing new for our governments, but was hoped for this particularly bad time.

If a man needs an advisor to do his job, then he shouldn’t have the job.

the elderly have built this country during the shit times and deserve there things like free travel, heres an idea why don’t ya means test free travel for ministers, TD’s and any of these advisers who go on junkets on behalf of the government in which the taxpayer foots the bill. Then when that happens and we cut out wastes of money on travel like sending minister donkeys abroad for no reason other than to pretend there doing something worthwhile and we start saving there can we look at other aspects in society!

Trying to take something else away from the elderly instead of facing the bigger problems with our bloated system, cf the admin staff numbers in the HSE. – yep, just the government’s business as usual and it’s disgusting. Free transport is the very least we can do for the elderly citizens who have already given so much to this country.

Pick on the vulnerable yet again. If it’s means tested you’ll quite probably find that those who don’t qualify don’t ever use public transport anyway if they can afford to run cars still? More administration, more fear for elderly people who treasure their travel as a means of retaining a little independence and enabling them to visit family/friends. These fools really need to cut where it matters – their salaries, their benefits, top earners and only once they’ve cut back on the excess should they attempt to attack any other group. I haven’t as yet made it to any protests but I damn well hope that if they proceed with this that every person with a free travel pass turns up en masse to change their minds – and that their families turn up too.

Means tests should be considered for lots of things – as a self-employed business owner believe me it makes me very mad to see the lifestyle some people have been accustomed to and they don’t need to work to get the bills paid.

Every single day these fools prove exactly why the “anybody but FF” vote in the last election wasn’t the right solution, sooner they’re gone the better!

Free travel should only be available to Old People (who worked all their lives) and Disabled one (who would work but can’t). The social welfare fraudsters and their ilk should not travel for free. They have no jobs to travel to. They can buy fags and booze locally. No need to travel to city centre to meet their ‘friends’ or travel to court.
Often I see young ones or youngish with free pass – why do they have it?
Very unfair system.

Taking from the elderly again cause of a minority…When will it end? Seriously, it’s never ending …. :-(

Absolutely, once it doesn’t cost any more to administrate. Everything should be means tested.

Do you know a better way to cut losses at the state owned transport services? Make sure the services run on time and show up when they’re supposed to. That would increase the frankly shocking level of reliability of the service and make it a viable alternative to owning a private vehicle. It stands to reason that more customers would follow.

Pensioners & the disabled should not be means tested in any way shape or form for the travel pass. The junkies & degenerates who have them should have them taken off them & have to reapply & asses every aspect of their entitlements reassessed. As a bus driver I am sick & tired of these wasters barging people out of the way only to disappear upstairs to drink & smoke in peace. Our famed RPU never seem to appear in certain parts of our city or suburbs but will pounce on people who make genuine mistakes!
Elderly people as already stated built this country when most of us were in nappies or weren’t even a twinkle in the eye.
Again our govt take the soft option instead of doing the job they promised to do & were elected to do. This same govt as we all know have shamefully attempted to attack the most vulnerable in our society ie the disabled.
Drivers are actively discouraged by management from inspecting passes but have the right to do so. However some including myself do. Should the CIE group wish to maximise revenue then it’s simple as I have said before, check tickets, purge the dirtbags who pay for nothing but consume everything & most importantly LOWER the fares to pre 2007 levels at least for 6 months to allow time to accurately assess passenger numbers to determine future demand.
Restricting the hours that pensioners can travel would be a step in the wrong direction & if it were to be reintroduced I for one will ignore it. As for who issues the passes might I direct your attention to the department of social protection, CIE have no role in the issuing of said passes.
I am led to believe the current pass format is to be withdrawn & replaced with a card format with photo & hologram type strip. If this is true this is the perfect opportunity to make every junkie knacker justify why they should have such a pass. Society must stop rewarding the lowest common denominator.

lets cut out all this nonsense bring back the concentration camps and incinerate them then the children the unemployed the disabled and sick anyone who disagrees with the government journalists ect this will solve all our ills then the politicians can continue to live in the style they so richly deserve

Pensioners have contributed to taxation over their entire working lifetime. The majority of them, in my estimation, would not be wealthy, certainly not the ones I know in rural areas. Therefore, the cost of means testing would be counterproductive and pointless. And to not extend travel concessions to our elderly citizens would be mean and churlish. Of course, if this government WANTS\to be seena s mean and churlish . . . . . . .

The government are scrapping the barrel

Would this actually make much of a saving, a lot people wouldn’t travel unless it is free so we wouldn’t collect fares from those currently using it. The cost of means testing would probably be higher than the revnue taken in.
Allowing a pensioner sit on an otherwise empty bus seat hardly breaks the bank. There is far more wastage in the public service and social welfare budgets that should be tackled first.

As a carer for my daughter, I received the free travel pass and have used it once for a train trip home from Dublin. Had I just been asked if I needed it during the application process, I would have said ‘No’. Perhaps that is where the department needs to start, a simple yes/no tick box on the application form.

Cmon, have a real survey and ask Should the existing government be thrown out, Yes or NO.

If this is true, then once again the Government are breaking their pr-election pledges and targeting the poor and vulnerable sections of our country, simply to appease their EU/IMF masters. Most people who have free travel have earned it because they worked hard for it. Especially during other recessions when they were taxed to within an inch of their lives, to pay for the lavish lifestyles of certain politicians and their fat cat buddies. A lot of free travel pass holders are also those with physical disabilities and mental issues, so how Enda Kenny can praise our Paralympians for their achievements and even consider this measure against their peers at the same time is beyond words.

How about means testing TD’s and Senators for their travel expenses. A.K.A free travel.

@Denise, Well done to your mum for using the travel pass Im sure she worked hard all her life.The customers in the pub where I work say they will protest if their travel pass is stopped. Ps Good few in this morning sure its a great country.

Ireland Incorporated has finally lost the plot. Should we just shoot anyone over 30 and be done with it in case they get I’ll? Has it skipped the bean counter’s attention that most public transport is completely empty for the restricted times that are valid for OAPs etc? Why be so anal about it, if they have money presumably they earned it by a lifetime of working whilst paying taxes (often punitive for this generation of pensioners 68%) . Let’s not become a nation of begrudgers for the sake of the cost of our banks’ christmas party!

I would like to know how much the Government pays CIE and Irish Rail per annum for each senior/ disabled?. My husband and I use the local bus on average once a fortnight and in 4 years have never used the train. We know many like us and there is photo ID required for the main person not the partner/carer.
There are many senior citizens in rural areas who need to come to Dublin for hospital appointments or to visit the centres of excellence created by Mary Harney.Many elderly people cannot afford cars or are unable to drive.Incidentally in many rural areas there are no bus routes to avail of. They certainly couldn’t afford the cost of trains Just some of my thoughts. so to get back to my original question how much does the Government contribute for each person’s free travel?Perhaps that would help them make a more rational decision OH working Group!

Hands off Enda and Co. Stop hitting the vunerable in society. Hit the money people which includes yourselves but you wont do that These people have served there time and worked hard all their lives. Deal with the issues relating to the money still being squandered in various government dept. It proves the muppets yous are the fact yous need so many advisors and spin doctors to advise on running the country.

I don’t think the elderly should be means tested, as any I know who are on it certainly do depend on it to travel around. I do however think those who aren’t elderly should be means tested, most don’t have any reason to have a pass! If they can get them, why should the rest of us be paying?

I think the vast majority of old people in this country should qualify for it, even with means testing. The average joe who worked all his/her life and is now on state pension would have to come under the threshold and hold on to their free travel pass.
However, there is a minority of older person whose income would still be considerably higher than average. Perhaps consider means testing them? I would imagine very few of them travel on public transport anyway, so savings wouldn’t be substantial.

Bus fare is so expensive nowadays. I don’t even want to go to town paying 2.65 for the bus in Dublin >.<

Typical Irish response will be :

1. Does it affect me directly ?

2. Will I lose money ?

3. Will it affect me watching Eastenders and Coronation Street ?

4. Will it affect my potholes being fixed by a backhander ?

If answer to all of the above is no, then don’t really give a shite.

I think that TDs and others senior C service should be ‘mean’ tested, most of the old ones don’t or cant use the system anyway because they haven’t a bob to spare….

Again the same people being targeted. The same vulnerable group in society. What about cutting Rich Consultants pay and leave the sick and poor alone.

it should b means tested because I go to college and have to spend 50 euro a week to use the bus and there are other people I know on the bus with me getting it for free by cheating the system

I agree with means testing but soon will there be anyone who wants to or can afford to live in Ireland and pay for absolutely everything through the nose?

Means testing is unfair. Just look at how it was used when the payouts of the SSIA was done. An individual that would have been on benefits and scrimped and saved to save the money over the five years would have then lost benefits at the end of the five years as they had means. An individual who was on the same benefits, and decided to drink or smoke their money for the five years and save nothing gets to keep theirs.

Why should someone that has tried to make their future more secure be denied something where someone that had the same job but didn’t make provision will be looked after?

The same pensioners who were allowed to keep their medical cards should be allowed to keep their travel passes. Anyone on big pensions doesn’t need a travel pass

Why do people with cars get a free pass, how come some people get two careers allowances for minding the one person and two home helpers . restbite , new car over 6o,grand every three years supposedly payed for by the revenue , and can work for upto thirteen hours a week , and get every other thing free that they can , how dose that work out , there are people out there that are fighting every day for help and can’t get any ,

Every house hold in this country should means tested owned or not. it would be the fair thing to do , never mind the cost , the banks has cost more to this country , the government can do it and they can damn well afford it , it would pay big time in the future , the future is what were talking about here , , do you we want a better future or just live in the naffing dirty past that has been in this country for years , its time to clear the crap , and we will always have pain of some kind or other do we want an honest state or not , then its up to every man woman and child for a better future ,i know what is going on and so do most of us so what are we going to do
about it ?

In the case of over 66 it should be a reduction in travel ie 50% off normal prices. Still reasonable enough and fairer than means testing. I don’t think partners who are under 66 should get free travel.
In the case of a disability it should be free.

Yes, bus passes for elderly people should be means tested. But the means test should be based on one’s cashflow, not the size of their pensions. E.g. You could have two pensioners on big pensions, one with signifigcant nursing home or medical expenses and another without such expenses. The pensioner with little outlay should not be the one entitled to a travel pass.

The wife of a deceased Garda has free travel and medical card as do most civil servants whose partners passed away. Is that to be means tested?

Everybody should pay public transport fares without exception.

scrap the free travel and just have an new fare for over 66, 20% of the standard fare or something like that.

Shouldn’t they pay SOMETHING towards the cost? I mean diesel is extremely expensive, every little helps.

Dont know bout means.testing may cost too much with all paperwork etc but maybe increase the age of people eligible by say 2 or 3 years??

Should be half fare for senior citizens, same as under 16s.

Those who could afford to pay, don’t use public transport anyway. Carrying out a means test would be a further waste of public money.