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Dublin: 5 °C Saturday 25 May, 2013

Dáil committee to discuss whether TDs are in breach of ethics laws

The public ethics watchdog believes TDs should declare council positions if they receive a severance pay-off – but of 22 TDs and Senators, only four did so.

Thomas Pringle says the Dáil Committee on Members' Interests, which he chairs, will seek legal advice on whether TDs need to declare their council positions in annual returns.
Thomas Pringle says the Dáil Committee on Members' Interests, which he chairs, will seek legal advice on whether TDs need to declare their council positions in annual returns.
Image: Julien Behal/PA Wire

THE DÁIL’S internal oversight committee is to meet in the coming weeks to examine whether as many as 14 TDs were in breach of ethics legislation by failing to disclose their previous membership of local councils in the Register of Members’ Interests.

TheJournal.ie has learned that the Committee on Members’ Interests will meet within the next fortnight to determine whether some TDs from four political parties, plus independents, fulfilled their obligations under ethics laws dating from 1995.

The meeting comes after this website learned that 18 members of the Oireachtas could be in breach of the Ethics in Public Office Act by not disclosing their previous jobs as local councillors – even though they automatically forfeit those positions when they are elected to the Dáil or Seanad.

The public ethics watchdog, the Standards in Public Office Commission (SIPO), said it believed members were required to disclose any position they hold – or previously held – if it resulted in them receiving over €2,600 while they were a member of the Oireachtas.

It was reported last week that 22 current members of the Oireachtas – including 17 TDs and five members of the Seanad – had received gratuity severance payments from their former councils as a result of having been forced to give up their council seats.

Each of those payments crossed the €2,600 mark (the Irish Independent, which first reported the figures, noted that they averaged €34,300 each) – leading SIPO to tell TheJournal.ie that it believes those TDs and Senators should have listed their council positions on the Register of Members’ Interests for 2011.

Gratuity payoffs

Only four of the 22 members did so, however – meaning the other 18 members could be considered in breach of the act because they did not declare the former council jobs which led to them receiving the gratuity payoffs after they had already taken up membership of the Oireachtas.

Committee chairman Thomas Pringle said the committee would meet the week after next and would be “taking advice” on the issue, including seeking legal input from the parliamentary legal advisor.

Pringle said it was likely that any information received, or decisions reached, by his committee would probably be passed on to its Seanad counterpart, which could then examine whether four Senators had also failed to fulfil their obligations.

The committee itself – chaired by Pringle, with members from each of the three largest political parties – would be the final arbiter on whether any TD had been in breach of the rules, or subject to any potential sanction. The committee has the power to fine or suspend members from the Dáil for any ethical wrongdoing.

‘News to me’

Two of the 18 Oireachtas members – Sinn Féin TD Dessie Ellis and Fine Gael senator Jim D’Arcy – both said they had taken steps to amend their declarations for 2011 after being approached by this website for comment on the matter. D’Arcy’s amendment appeared in yesterday’s Iris Oifigiúil.

Some TDs said they believed they were not required to disclose the council positions because the gratuities were statutory payments – advice contrary to that offered by SIPO when contacted by TheJournal.ie last week – while others admitted to being unaware of the requirement.

Independent TD Tom Fleming said it was “news to me” that he would have to declare his Council position, given that the “statutory payment was in the public domain and on public record over the last year and a half”.

Ellis said the issue appeared to be “a grey area” and that the appropriate laws could “be interpreted two ways”, while Labour’s Kevin Humphreys said he had asked the committee to offer him direct advice on the issue.

Under statutory instruments enacted by then-ministers Noel Dempsey and Charlie McCreevy in 2002 – and amended by Dick Roche and Brian Cowen in 2006 – politicians leaving a local council after more than three years’ service are entitled to a gratuity severance payment when they step down.

Politicians are not eligible for the payment until they are 50 years old, however – meaning other current members of the Oireachtas, who had to give up their council seats after winning last year’s Dáil and Seanad elections, will be in line to receive severance payments in the coming years.

Read: This is how much your TD claimed in expenses in 2011

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Comments (27 Comments)

  • So you seek and get elected to the Dail and then get compensated for having to leave your less paid job. This is yet again another example of how out of touch these people are with reality.

    Reply
  • Just heard the lord mayor of cork defending his 100,000 + a year ,,, start at the top and work all the way down .How can we let this happen .Mick Wallace got paid last week 40,000 in back pay !!!!!!

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    • Nappy 12/09/12 #

      ya its not right One bit we really need to get of are arses and start protesting and get are voices heard look what all the special needs people did last week and it wasnt easy for them Fair play to them

      Reply
  • David 12/09/12 #

    Another day, another euro.

    Reply
  • Same pigs different lipstick

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  • You could count on one hand the amount of honest, reliable hard working TD’s there are in this country, the rest are only in it for what they can get out
    of it and the exorbitant salerys that are paid to them.

    Reply
    • In fairness, it’s not like they were keeping these positions a secret – it was public knowledge and a matter of public record that they were councillors.

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    • that’s not the point Stephen, they have an obligation to declare this themselves, anyway, it would be a simple procedure to have some sort of form capturing all declarations that are legally required completed by all elected members…..they could stuff their excuses then!!!

      Reply
  • The gravy train continues.

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  • we need more transparency in general in politics.

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  • No wonder councils have had their budgets cut, all these overpaid and underworked muppets have the money.

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  • Nothing changes-lunatics in charge of the asylum………

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  • what can the People do?. Sorry to say we all voted with E nda last time sorry now to say i tought we were going to get real change. , but sure it says one thing it does not matter they ars all the same.

    Reply
  • Nappy 12/09/12 #

    nothing shocks me any more with all their talk in run up for last election with there promises there exact same as f.f. even the independents none have any back bone at all .but one thing there great at is taking money from here there and every where .looks like s.f. will finally get there chance next time round im sad to say

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  • Im sorry but this is now really starting to take the piss. It took them 10 years to find out that Bertie Ahern w lining his pockets with our money and now how long before they,ll realise the rest of the dail is just the same. Yet Bertie Ahern is still walking around on nearly as much as the Taoiseach, also gets his “expenses” paid and also has his legal advisers etc paid for him by us.

    Now if that was me you or another ordinary citizen of Ireland we would be locked up. How is any of this shit that we have to take fair???

    Basically this is how they,ve fukd the country big time;

    Ireland’s economy, weighed down by the legacy of the near- collapse of its banking system, is struggling to grow as international growth prospects weaken. The IMF repeated its call for Europe to help the state lower the cost of rescuing its financial system, which has cost the government about 64 billion euros ($82 billion) so far.
    Irish Economy 2012: Preliminary estimates for the first quarter of 2012 show seasonally adjusted volume declines for both GDP (gross domestic product: -1.1%) and GNP (gross national product: -1.3%) compared with the fourth quarter of 2011. However, the Central Statistics Office (CSO) says that compared with the same quarter one year ago there were constant price increases in both measures: GDP (+1.2%) and GNP (+0.2%). 2011 GDP was revised up to +1.5% while GNP remained at -2.5%. The current account was in deficit with a value of €1bn in the quarter.
    The Balance of Payments current account was €1.04bn in deficit in the first quarter of 2012. A merchandise surplus of €8.28bn was more than offset by an invisibles deficit of €9.33bn
    Irish GDP growth was 1.4% in 2011, double the 0.7% indicated by the previous release;
    The revision reflected stronger exports (5.0% versus 4.1% in the first release) and a shallower (2.0%) decline in consumer spending;
    An upward revision in nominal GDP from €156.4bn to €159bn means that the government debt/GDP ratio has been revised to 106.5% from 108.2%.
    The quarter 1 figures for 2012 were somewhat disappointing, showing a quarter-on-quarter GDP decline of 1.3%, but the seasonally adjusted quarterly data need to be treated with particular caution. Exports were still growing, but there was a significant spike in imports; this may well be reversed over the coming quarters. The imports increase may also be a precursor to stronger export activity over the remainder of the year. The annual figures show that services exports grew by 12% in Q1, which is reflective of the overall strength of the technology sector in recent times.”
    To put this in context; the direct cost of €64.1 billion is equivalent to :
    - 41% of GDP
    - approximately seven times what the state spends annually on education.
    - over four times what it spends annually on health
    - over three times what it spends annually on social protection
    - almost twice the state,s total tax revenue
    28 November- the European Union agreed to a €85 BILLION rescue deal of which €22.5 BILLION from the EFSM, €22.5 BILLION from the IMF, €22.5 BILLION from the EFSF and bilateral loans from the UK, Denmark and Sweden.
    24 Novemeber 2010: Cowen unveiled a four year plan to stabilise the economy by 2014;
    - Drastic cuts in social welfare
    - lowering of the minimum wage
    - increase in value added tax
    - maintaining the state,s low corporate tax
    On 21/07/11; ENDA Kenny announced that an agreement had been reached by Eurozone leaders to reduce Ireland,s interest rate by 2% and extend the repayment period.
    ENDA Kenny also said that it will move Ireland towards a manageable DEFICIT OF 3% of GDP BY 2015.
    In 2011,s Budget;
    - public spending was cut by €2.2 BILLION, and taxes were to be raised in the amount of €1.6 BILLION.
    Also ENDA Kenny said; we,re shutting down dysfunctional banks and we,ve recapitalized the remaining one,s at a lower cost than expected by imposing losses on some bondholders (lies).
    The main purpose for 2011,s Budget; and their four year strategy was;
    - creation of jobs four our people ( in 2011 more than 100,000 people LOST their jobs and he only plans on trying to create 100,000 jobs over the next 4 years and we,re supposed to be grateful?????)
    -we will leave income tax untouched
    This is what was involved in the 2011 Budget;
    . No reduction in state pension (how convenient)
    . €10 reduction in Child Benefit rates
    . €8 cut for social welfare, jobseekers payments
    . 4c on petrol, 2c on diesel from midnight ( which government will not suffer due to “fuel allowances”)
    . Revised air travel tax of €3 from March
    . €40 payment for fuel allowance recipients
    . New minimum wage not in tax net
    . Public service pay will not be cut
    . Public sector salary capped at €250k
    . Public service pensions over €12k cut 4%
    . Taoiseach salary cut by €14k; ministers by €10k ( however taoiseachs salary was raised back up to €211,000 a few months after).
    . Next President’s salary to be capped at €250,000
    . Employee PRSI/health levy pension relief gone
    . Income/health levies to be replaced by single universal social charge. Rates on the charge will be 0% below €4,004 a year, 2% up to €10,036, 4% from €10,036 to €16,016 and 7% above this level
    . Pension contributions subject to PRSI and Universial Social Charge
    . Employee PRSI contribution ceiling removed
    . Increase in the PRSI rate for the self-employed, higher earning public servants and office holders
    . 1% tax on residential transactions up to €1m; 2% over €1m
    . All stamp duty exemptions abolished
    . Car scrappage extended for six months
    . No change to Ireland’s corporation rate
    . Value of tax bands and credits to be reduced by 10%
    . DIRT increased by 2%
    . Online betting will be subject to the same betting duty as in bookie shops
    . Carer’s Allowance for those under 66 to be cut by €8 to €212 a week
    . Disability Allowance being cut by €8 to €186 a week
    . Business Expansion Scheme to be revamped
    . 15,000 activation places for unemployed
    . Third-level student charges are to rise by €500 to €2000
    . Student grants are to be cut by 4%
    . New passport fees for over 65s
    Notice how it’s all the average joe soaps of Ireland who suffer, and come 2012,s budget we will see our salaries slashed even more, 2013,2014,2015 and 2016 will see the worst cuts imaginable brought down on the citizens of Ireland whilst the high up classes keep their nose up the ars of the banks, IMF, ESMS and ESFS.
    They couldn’t run a brothel!

    http://www.change.org/petitions/supporting-the-irish-nation-step-down-from-government

    Reply
  • S.F, lol now there’s a laugh 52.000 for ink give me a break there all the same every on of them for years they been ripping the life out of ppl

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  • A list naming these T.D.s and detailing there questionable reasons for keeping quiet about nice little earners, rather than a link to another publication would be appreciated. Name and shame.

    Reply
    • The 22 who got the gratuities are as follows: (those who disclosed it in their annual declaration, and therefore aren’t in question here, are marked with an asterisk)

      Catherine Murphy TD*
      Joan Collins TD*
      Mary Mitchell-O’Connor TD*
      Brian Stanley TD
      Derek Keating TD
      Dessie Ellis TD
      Eamonn Maloney TD
      Eric Byrne TD
      Heather Humphreys TD
      John Halligan TD
      Kevin Humphreys TD
      Michael Colreavy TD
      Robert Dowds TD
      Sean Crowe TD
      Sean Kenny TD
      Tom Fleming TD
      Tony McLoughlin TD
      Sen Terry Brennan*
      Sen Cait Keane
      Sen Jim D’Arcy
      Sen Jimmy Harte
      Sen John Kelly

      The Irish Independent published the exact amounts they got, and they’re on the Indo’s website.

      Reply
  • The key issue here for me is not whether politicians declared or did not declare their previous roles as councillors. These are already on the public record.

    Instead the severance payments to councillors is more important. Although small change, these and all other expenses incurred by councillors should be looked at by Brendan Howlin. There is no justifiable reason why someone sacked by the electorate from a supposed part-time job should receive these payments. Councils in this country need to cut, cut, cut these expenses.

    “Under statutory instruments enacted by then-ministers Noel Dempsey and Charlie McCreevy in 2002 – and amended by Dick Roche and Brian Cowen in 2006 – politicians leaving a local council after more than three years’ service are entitled to a gratuity severance payment when they step down.”

    Reply
  • Anybody have any idea how much the total bill is for all our elected representatives salaries? Probably have to break it down into ‘before and after’ perks (expenses, tax exemptions, attendance fees, lecture fees,company directorships, et al, ad infinitum). Roughly then how much do they cost the country every year? How many million/billion? Is it covered by the State secrecy act? How much does it cost to run the country?

    The reason I ask is, —IF we were to fire them all on grounds of corruption and incompetence, Take the total amount saved, put the running of the country out for tender, and see what entrepreneur or corporation might be willing to make a success of “Ireland Unlimited”.

    Reply
  • This appears to be a question of understanding the law as this is covered under, The Ethics in Public Office Act.
    So my question is how many of the above have legal qualifications?
    If they do not have legal qualifications can we honestly blame them for being ignorant of the law? If we can’t blame them for being ignorant of the law who should we blame?
    I know why don’t we blame ourselves? Sure was it not us the elected them in the first place? Let’s face it they are not going to blame themselves.
    So in the end the only people to blame are the citizens of Ireland. Sure haven’t the poor TD’s and Government been trying to do what’s best for everyone?
    I would like to point out I am in a very sarcastic mood today!

    Reply
  • I’d say theres comedians round the world using the laid back approach of the irish people to being taxed and cut to death and been economically destroyed while these lot live it up as a sketch on there acts such is the view of the world probably now of how we haven’t marched and smashed the place up to demand justice and fairness!

    Reply
  • Nappy 12/09/12 #

    nothing shocks me any more with all their talk in run up for last election with there promises there exact same as f.f. even the independents none have any back bone at all .but one thing there great at is taking money from here and there and every where .looks like s.f. will finally get there chance next time round im sad to say

    Reply
  • The TD’s are going to have a serious chat with themselves? Is this the comedy half-hour?

    Reply

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