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Updated: 10:58
THE GOVERNMENT IS looking to strike a deal with unions that would see all public servants earning over €60,000 face pay cuts.
This morning, the Irish Independent reported that sources at the negotiations said they came to a standstill as unions and government officials could not agree a figure.
Liam Doran, General Secretary of the Irish Nurses and Midwives Organisation (INMO) confirmed this morning that the pay cut was one of the issues on the table.
However he said it was just one of a number of proposals coming to the table and that the organisation would reserve comment until representatives sit down and see the full package.
Bernard Harbor, Head of Communications at IMPACT said that there will be a substantial contribution to savings sought from people on higher pay. “Our own view is that it will be the single biggest element on any single package, if we manage to agree a package,” he told TheJournal.ie.
“The threshold and mechanisms have not been finalised yet and neither has a figure but we’re heading into the endgame of the negotiations this week so these crunch issues will be sorted out in depth.”
Harbor said the vast majority of public sector workers earn below €70,000 but that the union would hope to push the threshold up as high as it can to exclude as many people as possible.
“The figure of €60,000 would be lower than we would have envisaged but that’s still to play for,” he said.
Yesterday, Junior Finance Minister Brian Hayes said that legislation with regards to public sector savings is “inevitable if there is no agreement“.
Despite calls for them to return to talks, the two bodies representing gardaí have said they will not negotiate any deal that involves cuts to their members’ pay.
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Some T. D’S expenses are over 60k, and then there are their wages…
Bare faced cheeek to not start with themselves, it would give some credibility to their argument.
As politicians pay is linked to that of civil servants I would expect that any cuts would also apply to them. They’re not so stupid as to exclude themselves from across the board cuts. Although there are many stupid people here that think they are stupid enough to do so!
Reg, do you not think that the government could lead from the front on this one… Go it alone first in taking cuts… Then they could. with good moral authority, ask others to follow?
A sure what wood we expect. there will be no change with this crowd . they are so bad that the other crowd are passing them out in the pools. that says a lot about them labour an all. but gilmore is going to u.s.a. in March u shoud have herd him on the radio yesterday all the people he is going to be meeting over there it was such a laugh
They didn’t go far enough with the cuts they took when they first came into government Cal, but that ship has now sailed. The problem they now face is, should they go it alone now and take further cuts on their own or wait for an agreement that includes everybody. I think the sensible thing to do is wait and go with the pay cuts that include everybody. If they take cuts now and then don’t have further cuts later when everyone is getting them you’ll still have eejits on here jumping up and down saying they’ve excluded themselves!
Waterford Crystal Employees’ pensions
disappeared, as company insolvent.
Ireland Inc. is insolvent, yet Bertie agus a chairde, like a unique Irish version of royalty, extract borrowed money to pay
Circa €150k pensions, which the population has to pay for.
No wonder The French stormed The Bastille!!
Reg, i hope you remember that comment, when you talk about apologies for the ‘Troubles’…
Direct Democracy in the workplace.
It would be great to see an actuarial value on pensions and benefits so that the true value of public sector salaries is known. Including “sick” days which those in private sector do not have the luxury of taking.
Alot of people can be on 60k gross but by the time all taxes etc and vital expenses etc are taken out, you left with barely anything. I think your nearly better off earning less and paying less tax! Its time for anyone in the public sector to move to the private. Also i think its unfair as there alot of hard working people who dont get acknowledged who are seen just as a drain to the public finances. I think its extremely prevelant in Ireland, which isn’t seen in any other country. Its not public V private anywhwre else. Remember most people went into the public sector when wages were alot lower than the private sector. They had a choice and many did so for job security. They could have gone into the private sector an had a company BMW, instead there driving an 05 Seat
You obviously don’t understand the tax system if you think earning less but paying less tax makes you better off.
Well belly_up he might not be a million miles off, when earning in the higher tax bracket an extra 10k on your salary is worth give r take €80 a week. So if you go from 40k to 80k you earn about an extra €160 a week.. now in most work places that jump in underlying salary cones with a huge jump in responsibility, Longer hours more stress etc etc. Ontop of that you will have people pointing at you saying he/she should pay more tax he earns more… I guess one has to find a balance especially in our system where earning anymore to give so much away and see it squandered just isn’t worth wasting your life with…
You obviously have no grasp of what ‘earning’ money involves. You must be a civil servant.
Ehh Wha?
Your having a laugh, going from 40k pay to 80k pay is only worth 160 Euro a week. What planet are you on. get some real figures and facts before posting dribble like that.
If you earn 40 k thats 769per week you would pay. 161 tax 607 net
If you earn 80k that’s €1538 per week !
You pay € 400 tax. €1137 net
It annoys me when I hear people moan your better of earning lower wage and pay less tax are you mad ? Ill take the 80 k every time
ah that’s ok us newly qualified teachers would be lucky to be earning half of that!
That was a typo, 60k I meant, 40k to 60k is a diff of €185, now 185 a week is not to be sniffed at.but What I’m saying is its a diminishing level of returns once you go on to the higher tax rate the government gets more of your pay than you do.. and your hours and responsibilities grow in multiples not exact positive to the work life balance..
@ David it all depends on circumstances, if your happy with more hours more travel less family/me time for the extra money thats your choice, or mine as it maybe, its not moaning its pointing out the fact that once you break the tax bracket you pay half and more of your money in tax. Also your tax figures are off take home on 40k for a single person in the private sector is €578. And around €950 on 80k.
I’m all for bringing payments inline with benchmarks and living standards, but it also has to be seen that the savings for the government tarketing cival servants at 60k won’t bring them in much money, what ever they cut them by they will only save half of as they already get half back in tax. Pay ceilings an performance based pay is the way forward imho.
(Disclaimer :p i am neither a public servant nor do I earn 60k)
If you reduce mortgages and general living expenses like fuel and electricity and gas etc well then a cut is fair enough. HOWEVER ALL THE MENTIONED are increasing in price.
Yup, that’s the main issue compadre, everyday shopping is getting dearer.
Paul,mortgages fuel electricity and gas?
But i thought you were all complaining because it was the lower paid 24/7′s that were being targeted. Now you’re complaining because these apparently lower paid 24/7′s have mortgages
im only talking about what dave oshea said nothing else
Paul the cost of shopping went down . But its the shop keepers bearing the loss . And many of them pumped there saving in to try and stay open . . . Rate . Water .rent. foc. Tax .all went up . Some of them have nothing left for them self at the end of the month
If they reduced my living expenses by 20% then cut my pay, I have been cut 23% so far, with no decrease in living cost, I already work 5 hours per week for no pay and get time off when it’s suitable to my employer,
A Prison Officer
@ bud61193
Leave it out. Prison officers are akin to hospital consultants when they look at their pay slips
Never mind the cosy swapping of schedules where sick days are taken to provide overtime for colleagues.
Frank, do your homework. Overtime was discontinued in the prison service since 2005, I love all your comments sounds like government spin to confused public support, RESEARCH PLEASE
Is Enda and his mates not public servants ???
Yes but thy where born more equal that the likes of doctors and nurses .so no wage cut for them
@ tax slave,
But sure there’s no nurses earning over 60k. Is there?
yes they are. now who were all big winners in the famous BENCH MARKINK/? that really broke this country. now let us start there.
Those who can afford more pay more, healthy logic.
It’s all rather depressing. “Your lucky to have a job”? I argue your lucky not to have one. Working/driving/homeowning man fleeced in this country..
Bang on
Seriously considering emigrating with my family. Cannot afford to live in Ireland anymore. Ireland is a failed state
Myself & my husband said the same last nite. Hand the house keys to the bank & leave…seems like the only solution.
I detest Fine Gael so much! Words can hardly express it. But I am with them on this, if they leave frontline workers alone. 60k seems a reasonable figure to begin from.
Sorry Ailis, I accidentely gave up a thumbs up
Difficult enough trying to plan a household budget , without all the stress of maybe cut this / cut that, wish they would put something concrete on the table and get it over with
Just FYI guys, in the period while everyone will be squabbling over the next couple of weeks about which kids should see a cut to their childrens allowance, which workers should see a pay cut etc. there will be €130 million paid out to unguaranteed bondholders by this government, the equivalent of 6 months worth of the total savings sought under the new croke park deal.
Open your eyes, see who the real problem are instead of turning on each other. We are being screwed. The debt that was forced on us has been doubled and most people still refer to it as a ‘deal’ FFS.
Spot on. Your comment should come as a footnote to EVERY article on the journal regarding public service pay cuts.
Whoever red thumbed the comment willbe rooted out and put against the wall first when the revolution starts.. ;-)
Why didn’t the national debt management agency, or whatever it’s called, buy the bonds at a major discount and take the benefit rather than the speculators? But in any case, there is a multiple of billions being wasted each year by government and public agencies that needs to be sorted . Hopefully the Euro collapse will sort that out. Otherwise we will never get out of the debt trap we’re in.
In the name of all that’s holy can these brains in government not see the domestic economy is totally stagnant take out a billion more in pay cuts will send us all over the edge more people who borrowed on the strength of their income will fall behind less money to spend each week more business will fall disaster all round union leaders have no mandate to even be in these talks get out now and support the front line union’s and say no let them try and legislate the time has come for the people of this country to clearly say more these austerity policies are a complete failure
Add to that aib raising interest rates in the coming days, with the other lenders to follow shortly – ecb will start to raise theirs eventually and then it’s end game for many Irish mortgage holders. Brace yourselves.
So it won’t hit someone near the top end of Gardai or Nurses, so fair enough I say, 10% 60 – 100K, 25% 100K – 250K
the problem with that is some1 who has worked through all their service and is mabye making 60k gets a 10% pay cut. a bit unfair. 6000 to a person making 61000 is a big hit on top of 2 already. thats about another 500 a month. ive already lost 1200 a month. how is that fair????
Stephen good points, but there is nobody in nursing, gardai or fire service getting 60K+ salary who is not in a managerial position.
So managers earning 60k now earn 54k and the person on 59.9k loses nothing?
Sandra, exactly, it happens in industry all the time people get promoted and go from being hourly paid to being salaried. If this is truely about protecting frontline pay and services than lets do that and not managerial pay.
You know managers work on the front line too right? They do night duty etc?
Sandra could you clear something up for me, do shift working managers provide frontline services or do they provide managerial services to frontline workers?
@Sandra,
You’ve got the wrong idea of how these cuts would be implemented. If you earn say 65k and you take a 10% cut under this scheme then that 10% will come off your earnings above 60k. So instead of losing 6.5k a year and earning less than someone on 59k you’ll lose 500 a year. Not a big cut at all in comparison which will offer little savings.
Unless of course they go with a blanket 10% cut for all staff on all earnings which, while saving much more, will not be feasible as those on the frontline are already at breaking point.
Exactly Sandra.. Nighttime managers are responsible for the whole hospital! This is the “frontline” for managers!
@Jason if that’s the case then fine. I haven’t seen the proposals so don’t know what they are suggesting
It has to be a percentage across the board or else redundancies. Those on or above the suggested cut amount have mortgages based on that salary. Treat everyone fairly as an employer just like the private sector usually operates.
Trouble with your comparison with the private sector is that in the public sector a person on 75k that is useless can only be handled the same way as a work demon on 25k. This would never happen in the private sector. Real performance based assessment is needed, then cut.
Pablo, Fingleton no more needs to be said,
Plenty in the private sector hiding their incompetences , while claiming big wages and perks , cope on
Agree to some extent that civil servants aren’t monitored for competency unlike nursing staff
Mrbuzz – re: mortgages I have to disagree, while no doubt some do have mortgages, many of our fine grey haired citizens have no or very small mortgages. As was pointed out on Matt cooper yesterday, people in Ireland have €100,000,000,000 in savings. It’s the 20,30 and 40 year olds who are feeling this depression.
@shay, fair enough, add ‘in my experience’ to my comment above, having worked in both sectors. Bear in mind however I was not a CEO in my private sector job, just a normal ‘worker’.
I earn €60,000 gross. Exactly 50% is taken from my gross earnings every fortnight. My net income per annum is €30,000.
With that, I pay for everything. Two kids in 3rd level, mortgage, food, heat etc. etc. Naturally, my kids don’t qualify for any grants, no medical cards nothing. Husband is self employed & with the down turn the work he gets is sparse to say the least and even when he gets some work, people are sooo slow to pay! Being self employed all his life, he qualifies for no supports, no unemployment supports for him, despite paying taxes all his life.
I know my wage seems like a very decent wage but the reality is, we are just about keeping afloat and managing to pay the bills and I have never lost sight of the fact that we are the ” lucky ones” at the moment. I just genuinely can’t see us being able to pay everything if they cut my income.
I believe that if my actual salary had been cut at the outset instead of imposing more and more levies on my gross wage that I would possibly be better off.
The less people have to spend the more business close down . More people out of work . If one of our bright sparks in government opened there eyes when thy are driving around in there free cars thy might see the ghost high streets in our major town shops bordered up etc every one of them means the min of 3 jobs lost
@ tax slave ,
and so the answer is to pump even more money into an inefficient non productive public sector. Genius
No what i am saying is that if people had some spending money left . Less business would close down . But we are been sucked dry by the high cost of living and taxes
@ Tax slave,
So what’s your solution. Give public servants more money that they can spend and so save the Domestic economy ?
John, cutting low paid wont help the country recover, they spend most of their money in the local economy
Agree that doesn’t apply to the rest of us in the public service, we just feel we have taken the cuts, and enough is enough
@john burke, unfortunetly these guys don’t do healthy logic. I would add that if it means an office worker on 9-5, or a worker on shift, both earning 60k, both get cut the same, its not fair.
I am a PAM – a member of the professions allied to medicine. 16 years qualified with additional specialist Masters. I am stilling horrified at the latest news on hitting salaries. Thanks to cuts I no longer earn over 60k which maybe a saving grace – but who is to say I won’t be hit other ways? I have no issues working hours other than 9-5. I agreed to that a long time ago – I don’t care if I get the same salary (never had premium payments). In fact I’d be happy to work wends if needed! I’m not alone. I’m off today on annual leave days but so far I’ve been called in to work 1 day due to sick leave and maternity leaves as staffing was at crisis levels…dangerous levels. With a use it or lose it policy for annual leave I’m now taking what I’m entitled to – mainly as I’m exhausted… Last week I worked far in excess of my contracted hours like some of my colleagues. Like any place there are those that don’t pull their weight. This was to provide skeleton cover – not adequate cover!! Skeleton means we do what’s urgent but after a while everything becomes urgent…. I am at a stage that the writing is on the wall – why stay in a service that doesn’t valve you? We have highly trained staff – we won’t have much longer and we cannot be blamed for seeking pastures greener – where we are valved. Ps I get the same salary as those that sat on their arse since they qualified… Top point now 59k.
All I’ve heard for the last few months has been calls to protect those on the least and hit those earning the most. Now they suggest a possible cut for those earning over 60K a year and all of a sudden even those earning more can’t afford to take the cut. There’s no winning!
Ahh yes Ted but they never for one minute suspected that the noose would be tightened at this level. Ohh no !
I sometimes feel I have zero understanding of how an economy should work when I read about cuts etc etc …. It would make a little more sense to me if the mortgage problem was solved… Here goes ( and red thumb me if my logic is shite) the main outgoing in any household budget is the above mentioned mortgage, if a household is genuinely suffering with the repayments a moratorium should be set in place for the capital payment and the interest only scenario should be set up… I imagine that if a family can get some breathing space for three or so years it may kick start some sort of progression…. Those who are defaulting because there money lending institution won’t play ball will be brought back into the fold and their contribution to the overall intake by banks etc would balance out those paying interest only… So in essence , everyone is paying something instead of the few paying everything… Does this make sense????? In general…
It makes sense Dave, but doesn’t go far enough. Every mortgage in the country should be adjusted in accordance to what the property is actually worth right now. This obviously means that lenders take a big hit in the short term. However because people will automatically have more disposable income, this will invariably boost the economy again. People will start spending this income, therefore creating jobs, which will create demand for mortgages and personal loans etc, which ultimately means that the lenders start making money again. It all seems so simple, I mean what have we got to lose? It has to be better than the Japanese torture policies this crowd in power seem hellbent on pursuing.
Dave,
Over the past 4 and half years, I’ve been off work due to operations, 5 times. Usually for about 2 months and once for 5 months. Each time , we approached the mortgage company and they gave us interest only for the duration and beyond to let us get back on our feet again. We even had a 3 month mortgage holiday at one stage.
The company have helped us in any way that they could. We gave them all our details and it was sorted out in no time. Including right now. I’ve been off for 2 months.
I don’t understand why this isn’t the case for everyone. I read horror stories about families on the breadline. Why are they not being helped by their mortgage companies is beyond me.
24/7 Allaince 75,000 strong.. No cuts in Pay!
@59k I earn the least of all my college friends. I am the only one in the public sector. Not one of friends would swap a day with me and i do not blame them! Interestingly I’m the highest achiever. Go figure! If Ireland wants a high quality health care staff they need to support it but if I’d my time all over again – I wouldn’t have chosen a profession in health!
Reality – salary 59k – take home 1230 every 2nd wk. Total take home 35k. Don’t get me wrong it’s a good take home – the rest is tax, USC etc. I do pay 50e in to a PRSA mainly as I think my pension will be worth feck all if I last to retirement age. I would prefer to pay the 400e pension levy/month in to my prsa and take my chances! I’d happily work extended hours and wends and not ask for a premium to do so. We cannot have it every way and I know that. Extending hours even 8-8 for services such as clinics could have a huge knock on for service provisions. However it needs support – admin, IT! I have to do all my own clinic bookings (manual!!!), changes of appointments, type clinic letters, reports on a shared OAP PC! I “waste” clinical slots doing the paper work needed to keep the service running! I asked for admin support – 3 hours a week – gives me a full day back for clinic time… I got told No! I worked 5.5 days a week in the Middle East for a lower salary admittedly tax free but it was the respect I got that is probably going to draw me back. And yes we had an admin system second to none! Missing charts never happened!
AVC’s are the way to go! I was in Saudi .. best place I ever lived! But that’s another story! LOL
60,000 salary is on the table and not the gross pay ! Sounds like nursing top increment for DoN, AD..Public health directors ets .. top end nursing… This is still a paycut to nursing… Unacceptable!
The highest non managerial grade in nursing has a salary on 47,497, where are you getting your figures?
INMO!
http://www.inmo.ie/salary_information
You will see the highest salary is for a Senior Dual Qualified Nurse/Midwife at 47,497 so it is not included
Just salary. Yes!
What is also being tabled is an increase workweek of 5 hours which is another 6-10% pa and loss of top increment..
Adding it up now 14%+10.6%+6%= 30.6%+increase PRSI
+
Increase : +electricity+Home heating+property tax+health insurance (optional), septic tank charges+increase variable morgage rates+ future water charges.possible decrease in childrens allowance… = 180,000 public workers in morgage arrears and climbing!
40 hour week for all, why not , forget adding 5 hours , just 40 hrs for all ,
Imagine having to live on 54k per year? Heartbreaking.
Between myself and my wife we earn 59,000pa combined ,
and believe me , it is heartbreaking , at the end of each week we have nada , nothing not a €1 , last Friday morning I had to borrow money from my dad in order to put diesel in the car just so as I could get the child to the creche and get myself to work ,
The normal hard working Joe publics are the ones heading for the poverty scrap heap , we give everything and getting nothing back
Is it though? I may be wrong but don’t a family with 3/4 children on social welfare get 38,000 + free medical? This may include children allowance. Bear in mind that 38,000 is a net pay and not taxed. How much would 54,000 be after tax? And wouldn’t we have to allow for travel costs to work whether they be fuelling a car, public transport, pay parking etc and possibly childcare. I mention these because a family on social welfare wouldn’t have these overheads where as a working family would. I’m just pointing out that 54,000 doesn’t necessarily mean you’d be rolling in it and no my partner and I are nowhere near a 54,000 salary!
My husband and I have an annual gross income of 46k. We manage, we can go on holidays every year. We look after ourselves well. All week there has been loads comments from 24/7/365 staff on here stating that they didn’t want the lower paid workers to be hit. NOW they’re complaining that people over 60k will be cut. The government cant win. Considering one salary is more than my whole family income I find it hard to listen to this BS. If you are making over 60k and struggling to live you’ve obviously made some poor decisions, this is nobody’s fault but your own. Karolyn, some people like to go to work rather than claim benefits, I wouldn’t be putting the two scenarios against each other.
Yes opinion but do you have a mortgage taken out between 2000 & 2008
Ah opinion8d, do u have a 2006 mortgage of 300,000 like myself though? We’re 3/4 of our income goes to our mortgage and that’s on interest only? You clearly don’t because there is barely enough food, let alone a holiday and if u do what’s your secret?Your reference to me about “some people want to work” makes no sense to me? Don’t most people want to work?….. Ah ignorance is pure bliss…
No cuts in pay.. bottom line Pierce!
If you go on with that attitude, you’ll probably get you way. There will be no cuts in pay but there will be cuts in numbers and therefore services
I hope so!
So you want poor services and less people in employment.
Off coarse not! I was referring to the strong stance!
The labour force has already been cut with more coming…skeleton staffing everywhere.. the frontline is treading water to stay a float.. but we do our best in providing safe quality care!
Does anyone remember the queens and Obama visit to our shores, total bill came to €40million, that broke down to €1million for the defence forces and €39million to an Garda, even though the boots on the ground ratio was at least 20-1 army vs gardai just saying, you don’t hear about these sort of figures much in the media
Keith you are so far off with your ratio… Or maybe not did we have 60,000 guards on duty for those visits because there were just under 2000 army either on the ground, on call, ceremonial etc
I think you will find dave that I am bang on target with the ratio, and by the way since when do we even have 60,000 gardai in the whole force. Please look into it before you make another ill informed comment thank you
@keith.. That was my point exactly.. I was on duty that day and the total number of Defence forces personnel that were directly or indirectly involved in the two visits was a little under 2000, so by your reckoning that woud mean 40,000 guards( 60,000 was bad maths on my my behalf) for a ratio of 20:1 and in my reckoning there are less than 15,000 serving officers and I can assure you that 750 military men and woman is a little light on each day.
@dave, what I’m saying is for one garda there was 20 soldiers, but yet the garda bill came to €39,000,000 and the defence forces bill came to €1,000,000 even though the army where out 24/7 and the gardai were working shifts, I remember seeing all those army tents at the back of the airport 24/7 where the troops stayed for the duration unlike the gardai
@Keith.. oooops sorry . picked it up wrong
@dave no worries buddy
`PS have already lost 15% of their pay and they are back again such an easy target!!! PS are being bullied and with bullies you dont lie down, you stand up to them. All workers earning over 100K should be taxed at 65%. All tax reliefs to businesses and wealthy people should be cut they can afford it. The PS did not sup at the table and should not have to pay the bill for the sheer greed of the private sector and the greed of some sections of society. PS accepted the original cuts as the country was in crisis but they should not have to take a third cut in their families income which will sink many.
After years of slogging… still we don’t get paid what we are worth!
People don’t get paid according to what they percieve to be their worth.
“Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted.” Albert Einstein
This is about our lives, our children, our society and our country and it does count and should be counted!
So for the purposes of these negotiations for the disgracefully protected, 60K is now the de facto minimum wage in our public sector, below which you are considered too poorly paid to be able to take a pay cut.
Then yesterday James Reilly announces that from now on, HSE staff who are regularly absent without a cert, will have to, wait for it, make sure you are sitting down for this one, they’ll actually have to sit down with their line manager and explain face to face to their manager, why they are casually calling in sick on a regular basis!!!
The more you read about how affairs are conducted in our public sector, the more you fear for the future of this country.
Policy’s for sick leave have existed in every place I’ve worked in the HSE. We have always had to explain sick leave and certify if longer than 2 days. I had a day recently thanks to norvo virus and after being sent home ( I dragged myself in to work – was not aware what was brewing) got a call from occupational health checking I was actually sick!! Admittedly it was a friday. That was after projectile vomiting on a ward round! I’d a back to work interview on the Monday. It’s always been this way. I’d major surgery a few years back and was off 3 weeks in total! Added bonus was being rang almost every day asking when was I coming back to work from my manager. However I have had a situation where a colleague went off on “work related stress” for 9 months refused to engage with occ health/management and no body was allowed “talk” to her… She left behind 6 months of backlog in a post she had been in as many months!! Eventually she came back to work…. Only to go out again on yes “work related stress”. She came back to her cock up sorted by people like me. Eventually she got what she wanted a “move” to another area…
So for the purposes of these negotiations for the disgracefully protected, 60K is now the de facto minimum wage in our public sector, below which you are considered too poorly paid to be able to take a pay cut.
Then yesterday James Reilly announces that from now on, HSE staff who are regularly absent without a cert, will have to, wait for it, make sure you are sitting down for this one, they’ll actually have to sit down with their line manager and explain face to face to their manager, why they are casually calling in sick on a regular basis!!!
The more you read about how affairs are conducted in our public sector, the more you fear for the future of this country.
What is also being tabled is an increase workweek of 5 hours which is another 6-10% pa and loss of top increment..
Adding it up now 14%+10.6%+6%= 30.6%+increase PRSI
+
Increase : +electricity+Home heating+property tax+health insurance (optional), septic tank charges+increase variable morgage rates+ future water charges.possible decrease in childrens allowance… = 180,000 public workers in morgage arrears and climbing!
And don’t forget there will be a increase in income tax, the property tax and the old reliables which now include motor tax and travel fares.
Years spent in college to qualify 5.5. Starting salary 12k punts 16 years ago! My friends In factory work earned a hell of a lot more and thought i was mad. Ok my salary has gone up – but it reflects training, experience and responsibility. I also spent my own time and money adding on a specialist Masters. For that I get nada extra to those that sat on their arse since they got a job! The HSE needs an over haul but it won’t happen if we lose our best and brightest. Looking back I think I’d have been better off spending the k’s on travelling/life rather than trying to progress my career. Harsh reality check. My sibling is an accountant – time off to study, time off for exams and a bonus when exams passed as well as a raise… Oh ya – courses paid by employer…. To be valved however is priceless.
So this number would “incorporate all non managerial grade” in nursing at 47,000.. That means everybody takes a pay cut! By the way see INMO salary scale before you put numbers for the average frontline worker! That number is for Senior Dual Qualified Nurse/Midwife and not the average fronline nurse! Staff Nurse (including…Registered Midwife Registered Sick Children’s Nurse Registered Mental Handicap Nurse) ,
31,710, 33,189, 34,666, 36,137, 37,408, 38,683, 39,952 41,222, 42,469 by year of service! PS INMO salary scales Pierce! Staff nurse-45,954, Dual qualified- 47,497… Point to make no incentive to be CNM1-CNM2 as you fall back Nursing grade during your first year.. you actuall take a cut!!! This is also not acceptable!
Michael,
I think the point made earlier, was that this kite flying exercise is to cut salaries over €60,000 pa.
None of the salaries you’ve mentioned is above €60k. So they won’t be touched if this proposal is implemented.
It’s very difficult to follow you around this article, could you stay still for a moment and stop confusing salary and gross pay?
Point well taken! 60,000+ salary.. to many assumptions on Salary v.s gross.. I’ll have to wait to hear the outcomes to make proper judgement.
i seriously doubt they will be cutting salaries at 60k. more like earnings at 60k.and to answer pierce’s question about frontline managers. yes they are frontline workers. i’m in the prison service. in charge of a wing with 140 prisoners. and i’m also in charge of 8 staff. thats what i get to deal with 140 prisoners. and i do the exact same shifts as the staff and i work in the exact same places. that is fact. not the ration of 1:1 like we’ve heard so many times. almost 20:1.
I pointing out the 60,000 and above issue on gross! .. at 47,000 with premuims is 60,000 gross and above!
Does that include themselves?
http://www.nospinireland.com/Gardai.html
The above is just an example. Everytime you hear a public sector member complain about hardship send them to the above and tell then to contrast that with the average wage of 35,750 in the public sector then tell them to shut up. Then direct them to.the CSO website to have a look at the live register. There is only 1 class of citizen in this country despite what some of our public sector brethern think. The sense of entitlement is disgusting
If it was 60,000 gross there would be no premuins for shift work in nursing…
Premium payments are calculated on the basis of salary. Seems like a pretty clear choice.
1. Adjust premiums to private sector levels and leave salaries alone.
2. Cut salaries and leave premium payments where they are.
1 Hurts the low paid shift worker 2. Hurts the 8 to 5 worker regardless of salary
Pierce, if you cut basic , you also cut premium which is off course based on basic
So 2 does not effect only 9-5 workers
This site always puts these post out of order!!! Find your way through it Pierce! My numbers are right!
Use the reply button! You are making me dizzy!
Michael, use the reply button….
Too funny Sandra!
The reply buttons don’t work at the best of times
http://www.hse.ie/eng/staff/Benefits_Services/pay/salary_scales_new_entrant2011.pdf
Sets out current salaries for people joining health service.
Still an attractive career?
Danny.. point well taken on the kite flying but this this reality… 14,000 over 5 years = 60,000 and now CNM-3 at 62,000 top increment will lose it if it becomes reality!
PLEASE use the reply button!
Michael I agree staff that do shifts should not be cut, you’re not doing yourself any favours with your comments though..
I usually don’t refer to indivdual comments out of respect and dignity Pablo so please do the same!
In conclusion systemic oppresion through austerity in Irish society is unacceptable!
“Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted.” Albert Einstein
You’ve got problems man
No time!
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