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LAST UPDATE | 1 Oct 2024
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MINISTERS JACK CHAMBERS and Paschal Donohoe have finished their Budget announcements and the reaction is continuing to flow in from the opposition, NGOs and campaign groups.
Jammed with one-off cost-of-living measures and tax cuts, the €2.2 billion package is the Government’s final Budget before a general election takes place.
Pearse Doherty, reacting to the Government speeches in the Dáil on behalf of Sinn Féin, said it was “not a giveaway Budget” but a “giving up on housing Budget”.
Updates by Rónán Duffy, Jane Moore and Órla Ryan (earlier)
Our Political Correspondent Jane Matthews has been taking a look at how the day will play out.
Finance Minister Jack Chambers will deliver his inaugural Budget speech at 1pm in the Dáil, with Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform Paschal Donohoe set to outline public spending immediately afterwards at approximately 1.45pm.
The Dáil schedule is then cleared until 8pm to allow opposition TDs to respond to this year’s Budget.
Voting on the Budget will then begin at 8.30pm and is scheduled to last until midnight.
As is the tradition, much of the Budget is leaked in advance.
Parents will receive a double child benefit payment, and new parents will get a ‘baby boost’ payment totalling €420.
A reduction to the USC as well as increases to social welfare payments and the rent tax credit are also expected.
Our Political Editor Christina Finn has rounded up what we know so far about the cost-of-living measures and tax measures.
While leaking the Budget is par for the course now, it was deemed unacceptable in the past.
Phil Hogan, then-Junior Minister for Finance, had to resign in 1995 after he admitted to leaking details of the Budget.
It emerged that one of his advisers had faxed (kind of like emailing over a landline – look it up, kids) details to the media, causing uproar.
The Rainbow Coalition was in power at the time, comprising Fine Gael, Labour and the Democratic Left.
In the weeks leading up to Budget 1996, opposition parties such as Fianna Fáil had been complaining that the coalition government had leaked more information than virtually any other administration.
More specifically, they said “sensitive market information” was being revealed to the media as a result of inter-party competition within the government.
In the end, Hogan resigned as junior finance minister on 9 February 1995 to avoid “damaging” the government.
Speaking in the Dáil chamber at the time, he said: “I am proud to belong to Fine Gael. A party with the highest ideals and values of honesty and integrity, whose members have always put the country rather than the individual first.
“To avoid any possibility of damaging a government led by Taoiseach John Bruton – a man of the utmost decency and understanding qualities – I have tendered my resignation from government and it has been accepted. The decision to resign is entirely my own.”
More details are emerging about health spending.
It’s understood that the sector will get almost €3 billion extra in Budget 2025.
The total health budget is expected to be a record €25.76 billion, representing an increase of €2.94 billion on the January 2024 allocation of €22.82 billion.
The following increases in spending are set to be announced:
Today is Jack Chambers’ first (and possibly last) Budget as Finance Minister.
As we wait for his announcement at 1pm, let’s take a trip down memory lane with some photos of Finance Ministers of the past on previous Budget days.
Will you watch the Budget 2025 announcement?
Let us know in our poll.
It’s a fairly mixed bag so far.
Here is the latest on what students are expected to get in Budget 2025:
Budget 2025 for students:
— Jane Matthews (@janeematthews) October 1, 2024
👉🏼Undergrads set to see a €1000 reduction on the student contribution fee this year bringing fees to €2,000.
👉🏼Once off reduction of apprentice contribution of €1,000.
👉🏼Post Grad supports will see fee contribution ⬆️ from €4,000 to €5,000.
Health Minister to announce expansion to free IVF scheme to allow couples with an existing child to access treatment. One element of the current criteria sets out that a couple accessing publicly funded IVF must have no living children together.
— Christina Finn (@christinafinn8) October 1, 2024
Health Minister Stephen Donnelly is set to announce an expansion to the free IVF scheme to allow couples who already have a child to access treatment.
It will reverse one element of the scheme’s current criteria which requires that a couple accessing publicly funded IVF must have no living children together.
There are plans to expand the scheme in two areas next year. The first of these will allow couples requiring donor assistance to access the scheme during 2025.
People over the age of 70 will be able to bring another person on public transport free-of-charge under plans spearheaded by Social Protection Minister Heather Humphreys.
The measure, known as the ‘universal companion pass‘, will benefit tens of thousands of older people.
It is understood that Humphreys pushed for the measure in a bid to tackle isolation among older people.
“There is certainly lots of money to go round,” financial advisor Ralph Benson writes in this op-ed breaking down what is expected to be announced this afternoon.
“Tax receipts this year are up a whopping 12.6% on last year, and interest rates are falling.
So everyone will likely see a bit of upside in the announcements.
“But – with one exception, as we’ll see – there is little obvious appetite in the government for real financial reform of the hard problems in Irish society right now, such as lack of accommodation, transport infrastructure, controlling runaway costs on capital projects, public sector costs and efficiency, or dealing with our changing demographics and ageing population profile.”
With less than half an hour to go before the big announcement, Finance Minister Jack Chambers thanks the staff who worked “through the night” to print the Budget documents.
"I'm at the printer in the Department of Finance where staff have worked through the night to complete all the printing of the #Budget2025. I look forward to setting out what we can achieve in 2025 and how we can set out a positive trajectory for Ireland."
— Fianna Fáil (@fiannafailparty) October 1, 2024
Minister @jackfchambers pic.twitter.com/0Nu0YihO15
Here they are now.
Finance Minister Jack Chambers and Public Expenditure Minister Paschal Donohoe presenting the Budget at Government Buildings a few moments ago.
Jack Chambers is now on his feet in the Dáil chamber.
He says he believes Budget 2025 “puts in place the policies and the measures” that will continue Ireland’s “positive trajectory” and “ensure that all our people see a promising and hopeful future in this country”.
“Today’s budget is my first and is also a unique in the opportunity it presents to plan, transform and deliver for the future.
“And that future is not just about next month, next year or the next decade. It is about ensuring that the children born today in Ireland and every day from here on can live prosperous and fulfill lives.”
“Today’s Budget is my first and it is also unique in the opportunity it presents to plan, transform and deliver for the future.”
— Department of Finance (@IRLDeptFinance) October 1, 2024
— Minister @jackfchambers delivers his #Budget2025 speech.@merrionstreet @IRLDeptPER pic.twitter.com/QwwPkTLgL1
Chambers says the economy is in good shape. He says the rate of inflation has been at or below 2% since March, which he says comes as “a welcome relief to households throughout the country”.
However, he says he’s aware that many are still struggling with high prices.
Chambers says Ireland in operating in a global environment where competition for attracting foreign investment is intensifying.
“Maintaining our competitiveness and having the means to improve it is vital to maintaining employment in all sectors of our economy, no matter where those jobs are located.”
He adds: “We know that our public finances are heavily reliant on corporation tax.”
Chambers says a further €1.25bn will be made available to the Land Development Agency, bringing the total amount of funding to the LDA to €6.25bn.
“The LDA will be tasked with deploying this capital in a way that can continue to drive the delivery of social and affordable homes.”
€1 billion will be provided to Irish Water for non-domestic capital investment, Chambers says.
As of 1 January 2025, the national minimum wage will increase by 80 cent to €13.50 per hour.
A personal income tax package of €1.6bn has been confirmed.
The rate of Universal Social Charge (USC) has been reduced from 4% to 3%.
The standard rate income tax cut-off point has increased to €44,000 from €42,000.
The Personal, Employee and Earned Income Credits will increase by €125.
The entry threshold to the new 3% USC rate is being increased by €1,622 to €27,382, in line with the increase to the national minimum wage.
“This means that a full-time worker on the minimum wage will see an increase in their net take home pay of approximately €1,424 on an annual basis,” Chambers says.
“As a result of the cumulative increases to the main tax credits, a single person earning €20,000 or less in 2025 will now be outside of the income tax net,” he adds.
The following credits are being increased:
Employers will be able to give staff bonuses worth up to €1,500.
These benefits must not be in cash.
It’s an increase in the limit from €1,000 in last year’s Budget.
The Capital Acquisitions Thresholds, which apply to gifts and inheritances, will increase by the following amounts:
The rental tax credit will increase from €750 to €1,000.
A couple in rented accommodation could claim €2,000 from Revenue.
The Help-to-Buy scheme will be extended until the end of 2029.
The Government is also extending the relief for pre-letting expenses for landlords until the end of 2027.
The 9% reduced VAT rate for gas and electricity will be extended until 30 April 2025.
The VAT registration thresholds for the supply of goods and services will be increased.
The registration thresholds will rise from €80,000 to €85,000 and €40,000 to €42,500 respectively.
From 2025, landowners will be able to avail for an exemption of Residential Zoned Land Tax if they wish for their land to be rezoned to reflect the activity they carry out on their land.
The Government will increase the price of a pack of cigarettes by a euro from midnight tonight.
It will bring the price of a 20-pack of cigarettes to €18.05. The excise duty hike is twice the usual increase of 50c.
A tax on e-cigarettes will also be introduced, from the middle of next year.
The threshold for when inheritance tax must be paid will increase from €335,000 to €400,000 for children who inherit from their parents.
Read more on that here.
The standard cut-off point for income tax in Ireland is being increased by €2,000.
This means workers will only pay the higher rate of 40% tax on income over €44,000.
Proportionate increases have been announced for married couples.
Chambers also confirmed that USC will be cut from 4% to 3%.
Read more on those changes here.
The rent tax credit is set to increase to €1,000 per person next year.
In another boost for renters, the €250 increase has also been back-dated for 2024 so that people can claim €1,000 for this year.
The higher rate of stamp duty on bulk acquisitions of houses will increase from 10% to 15% with immediate effect.
The rate of stamp duty applicable to residential property valued above €1.5 million will increase to 6% with effect from midnight tonight.
The existing rate of 1% will continue to apply to properties valued up to €1 million, and 2% will apply on values over €1 million, with a third rate of 6% to apply to any property valued in excess of €1.5 million.
The rate of the Vacant Homes Tax is being increased from five to seven times the property’s existing base Local Property Tax rate.
The Motor Insurers Insolvency Compensation Fund levy will be reduced from 1% to 0% from 1 January 2025.
The rate per tonne of carbon dioxide emitted by petrol and diesel vehicles will increase from €56 to €63.50 from next Wednesday, 9 October.
There will be no tax relief for gym membership. However, Chambers says his officials will work on this with a view to making a proposal in advance of Budget 2026.
Charities will no longer have to be established for at least two years before they can access the Charities Donations Tax Scheme.
VAT on the installation of heat pumps will be reduced to 9%, down from 23%, in line with the Government’s National Retrofit Plan.
Public Expenditure Minister Paschal Donohoe is now speaking.
He tells the Dáil that, since 2020, Ireland has faced unprecedented challenges including the Covid-19 pandemic, the war in Ukraine, and spiralling inflation.
As set out in the Summer Economic Statement, Budget 2025 sees expenditure of €154.4 billion, an increase of 6.9% on last year.
Donohoe has confirmed a Social Protection package worth almost €2 billion.
Two double child benefit payments will be given to parents before Christmas, worth €280 per child.
The so-called ‘baby boost’ payment will grant a triple child benefit payment to new parents.
From next year, new parents will receive a one-off €420 payment as well as increases to maternity and paternity leave benefits.
Read more on these increases here.
The Government has rejected calls from the hospitality sector to reduce the VAT rate to 9%.
VAT for the tourism and hospitality sectors was reduced to 9% during the Covid-19 pandemic at a cost of €1.2bn to the exchequer.
The previous 13.5% rate was reinstated last August, despite the sector’s opposition.
The Vintners’ Federation of Ireland said it is “gravely concerned” that there is no reduction in the VAT and that measures announced today “fall disastrously short of what is needed to protect a sector on the brink”.
Funding for the National Childcare Scheme will rise by 44% which will result in a reduction in full-time childcare costs by €1,100, Donohoe says.
He also confirmed the following:
Additional funding of €2.7bn will be given to the health sector over two years, bringing the total health allocation to €25.76bn, Donohoe confirms.
He says there will be an increase in the number of people working in the sector, and 495 new beds will be introduced across hospital and community services.
There will also be 600,000 additional home support hours and continued support for women’s health measures, including increased access to IVF and Hormone Replacement Therapy.
The Department of Housing is being allocated €7.8 billion, including the following:
More than €3 billion is being set aside between 2026 and 2030 to invest in climate transition, Donohoe says.
This will be used to support designated environmental projects that could assist with reducing emissions, or improving air quality or biodiversity.
Donohoe says that €472 million will be provided to the Department of Rural and Community Development to “revitalise” rural Ireland.
Over €2 billion has been allocated for the Department of Agriculture in 2025.
Wondering how Budget 2025 will affect your take-home pay?
Find out via our Budget Calculator.
Wondering how Budget 2025 will affect your take-home pay?
— TheJournal.ie (@thejournal_ie) October 1, 2024
Find out exactly how all the changes will impact your pay using our Budget calculator:https://t.co/saRi0UyFdI
Over €1bn will be invested in the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment’s Jobs and Enterprise Development, Innovation and Commercialisation and Regulation Programmes in 2025, Donohoe says.
A €1.5bn package (up to 2030) has been announced for the National Training Fund.
This will include an increase in core funding to Higher Education by €150m per year as well as support for additional healthcare and veterinary places, and an increase in certain PhD stipends.
Funding of €3.9bn was been allocated for the Department of Transport, comprising €1bn in current funding and €2.9bn in capital funding.
“This will deliver more capacity on public transport routes we have,” Donohoe says, including further investment in cycling and walking infrastructure.
The young adult travel card (for 19 to 25-year-olds) and the 90-minute fare will both be extended.
Free public transport will be extended to children aged five to eight.
“This Government is committed to building stronger, safer communities, and, with this in mind, I am announcing a package of over €3.9 billion euro for the Justice sector,” Donohoe says.
He said this allocation will allow for the following:
Donohoe also announced the following:
Here are some more details on the health funding confirmed today:
Donohoe added that funding provided in Budget 2025 will enable enhanced provision of services including:
There were a few items detailed in the Minister for Finance’s Budget speech aimed at incentivising uptake of electric vehicles, particularly among firms with commercial fleets, writes Assistant News Editor Valerie Flynn.
It comes as new figures from the car industry published today showed electric vehicle sales slumped almost a third year on year in September.
So far this year, just over 16,000 new electric cars have been registered in Ireland – that’s down from almost 22,000 in the same period of 2023.
That direction of travel is bad news for the government, which wants 30% of passenger cars to be electric by 2030 to help us meet our climate targets, as well as getting 95,000 commercial electric vehicles on the road and 20% electric lorries.
So what’s in the budget to help turn it around?
Benefit in kind (BIK) reliefs for electric vehicles will remain in place, while an exemption from BIK tax for installing an electric vehicle charger at a worker’s home has been introduced. This is likely to be welcome news for the car industry.
Measures were also announced to incentivise uptake of lower CO2 vans (through a new emissions-based vehicle registration tax regime) and of electric company cars (through changes to vehicle capital allowances).
Minister for Finance Jack Chambers said he hopes this last measure, which will kick in in 2027, will boost the second-hand electric car market.
An amendment to vehicle registration tax (VRT) rules is aimed at ensuring electric commercial vehicles can qualify for the €200 rate.
Sinn Féin’s Finance Spokesperson Pearse Doherty has dismissed the Budget as “spin”, labelling the Government “serial wasters” who treat the public with “contempt”.
Donohoe says Budget 2025 will do little help the “deepening housing crisis”, people on waiting lists for health services, and autistic children who can’t get school places.
People see through the spin. People hear about the millions and the billions, but they don’t feel better off.
“For most people, it’s about what they have at the end of the week, when the bills are paid. ‘Is there anything left?’ is the question they ask, and the answer for far too many is no.
“Workers and families can’t afford another five years of Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael. And it is in that context that this Budget will be judged, how your parties will be judged also at election time.”
Doherty also said that homeownership has “collapsed under Fine Gael for young people”.
“There are 100,000 less people under the age of 40 that own their own home today than when Fine Gael came into government 14 years ago.”
He said it was “not a giveaway Budget” but a “giving up on housing Budget”.
Funding for an additional 400 staff has been allocated in the Budget to the International Protection Office.
Making the announcement this afternoon, Minister for Public Expenditure Paschal Donohoe said there would be a “significant expansion in the international protection processing system”.
Read more on that here.
Donohoe also announced that €2.1 billion will be provided to support accommodation for “those fleeing Russia’s illegal war in Ukraine and to those seeking International Protection”.
“In addition to the core funding for rural and community development for 2025, I am providing €13 million to help integrate arrivals from Ukraine into local communities,” the minister added.
#Budget2025 in short⬇️
— TheJournal.ie (@thejournal_ie) October 1, 2024
🧒Two double child benefit payments
💡Two €125 energy credits
💸Min wage will rise to €13.50
🍼€420 baby boost
🚬Cigarettes rise to €18.05
🏠Rent tax credit to increase to €1k
💰USC cut by 1%
🏘️Help-to-buy scheme extended to 2029
Something for everyone in the audience? Here are key points from Budget 2025.
Thanks for staying with us so far today. I’m going to hand over the liveblog to my colleague Jane Moore who will keep you updated this afternoon.
Hello! Jane Moore here. Thanks for sticking with us so far.
I’ll be bringing you all the latest on Budget 2025 for the afternoon.
First things first – if you’re wondering how the announced changes will impact you, you can use our handy calculator to find out.
Social Protection Minister Heather Humphreys has announced that the auto-enrollment pension scheme will begin from 30 September 2025.
All employees who are not already in an occupational pension scheme, and are aged between 23 and 60 and earning over €20,000 across all of their employments, will be automatically enrolled.
It had initially been flagged for January 2025. When asked by The Journal why it is now being introduced in September 2025, Humphreys said there is ”a lot of work to be done between now and then to get it all up and running”.
Minister Heather Humphreys has announced that pension auto-enrolment will commence from 30 September 2025.
— Jane Matthews (@janeematthews) October 1, 2024
It was initially flagged to kick in from January 2025. @thejournal_ie pic.twitter.com/DB2HA44cxR
“We’re giving businesses a year median time, because there have been concerns about further expense on business,” she added.
When asked whether every parent in Ireland needs the double Child Benefit payment, the Minister said that anyone who does not need it can give it back.
She said rearing children “is expensive” and that the payment was “very well received last year”.
“You might think that people don’t need it. Well if they don’t need it, they can give it back,” Humphreys said.
On the two double child benefit payments to be paid before Christmas, the Minister says it is being done because the single double payment was “very popular” last year.
— Jane Matthews (@janeematthews) October 1, 2024
She says if people don’t need it “they can give it back”. @thejournal_ie pic.twitter.com/QnQn8P7Awz
There is plenty of reaction coming in to the measures announced in Budget 2025.
SIPTU General Secretary Joe Cunningham has deemed it “fiscally irresponsible”, saying it constitutes a return to the type of pre-crash giveaway budgets.
“Cutting taxes, increasing spending and balancing the books with transitory and unreliable corporate tax receipts is a recipe for long-term instability in our public finances.”
According to Cunningham, the measures will hollow out Ireland’s tax base at a time of slowing growth, while the tax cuts will mean larger tax increases in the future as growth slows to 1% per capita in the years ahead.
“The reliance on temporary cost-of-living measures is cynical and only postpones the fall in living standards when these supports are withdrawn in the future,” he said.
This is a ‘buy the election’ budget that leaves the next government to clean up the mess.
He said that “throwing money into an economy at nearly full capacity” can drive up prices.
“House prices are likely to rise even more with the continuation of demand-led subsidies such as Help-to-Buy. Ireland has one of the highest living costs in Europe. This budget will only make this situation worse,” Cunningham continued.
“At a time of rising poverty, with nearly a quarter of a million children living in deprivation, the cuts in inheritance tax are particularly disgraceful. This tax cut makes a mockery of equality.”
Cunningham said that while the Government is right to use once-off revenue to address our housing infrastructural deficits, spending more money without resolving the labour shortages in the construction sector can potentially bid up costs.
“We could end up with illusory targets and higher prices.”
The Irish Congress of Trade Unions has agreed with SIPTU, calling the Budget “fiscally irresponsible”.
“We are using potentially transitory corporation tax receipts to fuel a pre-election giveaway,” the ICTU said.
“This decision risks pushing higher taxes onto younger and future workers and it simultaneously undermines our capacity to improve public services in the future. It is a return to reckless pre-crash budgetary strategies.”
The organisation welcomed the 80c increase in the minimum wage, saying the Government “must stick to its commitment to raise the minimum wage to 60% of hourly median wages by January 2026″.
It said that what workers ultimately need is collective bargaining, as promoted by the EU Adequate Minimum Wages Directive.
“That, along with expanded public services, is what will really help workers in the long run,” it added.
The ICTU claimed the biggest winners from the tax changes “will be the very wealthiest families benefiting from inheritance tax cuts, as well as those on higher incomes that stand to benefit from all of the changes to personal taxes”.
“The relative losers are those without wealth and workers on lower incomes.”
ICTU General Secretary Owen Reidy said Budget 2025 will be remembered as a lost opportunity “when we failed to properly grapple the crises in childcare, housing and numerous other areas”.
Thanks for staying with our coverage so far today.
I’m going to hand the liveblog over to my colleague Rónán Duffy, who will bring you all the latest updates for the rest of the day.
Minister Paschal Donohoe responds to criticism that there's not much in the Budget for single people, those who don't have children and those who don't own their own home. #Budget2025 pic.twitter.com/BHUxqJ1mcC
— TheJournal.ie (@thejournal_ie) October 1, 2024
Responding to criticism that there’s not much in the Budget for single people, Minister for Public Expenditure Paschal Donohoe tells The Journal:
“The rent tax credit is going up to help those with the cost of renting and if they’re working they’re going to benefit from the changes we’re making in general taxation. If you’re a single person on the average wage in this country, we’re getting closer and closer to the point where you’re no longer paying the higher rate of tax.”
Business group Chambers Ireland has “cautiously welcomed” the Budget but “urged the government to focus on delivery.”
The group said the focus on “essential infrastructure” is appropriate but said that it will “will only have an impact when it is delivered”.
Ibec has similar thoughts, saying that investment in capital and skills “is the most material element of the Budget for business”.
Ibec has also expressed relief that the 80c increase of minimum wage to €13.50 is less than the €1.40 increase last year.
If you want to know exactly how much the income tax changes affect your take-home pay, our handy Budget calculator should sort you out.
But we’ve taken the liberty of taking a look at what it means for people earning €20,000, €40,000, €60,000 and €100,000.
In short, people who earn more money will benefit to a greater degree.
If you earn €100,000, you’ll be paying €1,109 less in tax, whereas if you’re on €20,000 you’ll be paying €250 less in tax.
The government announced today that the Rent Tax Credit will increase to €1,000 per person next year, and that the new amount has been backdated so that people can also claim an additional €250 for this year.
The credit will be applied for in the same way people apply for other tax credits, i.e. through Revenue, but we’ve put together a guide here about how to claim it.
The Rent Tax Credit is back for Budget 2025, and it's now worth €1,000 per person.
— TheJournal.ie (@thejournal_ie) October 1, 2024
Here's everything you need to know about whether you're eligible and how to claim it:https://t.co/we4pn6mX61
Finance Minister Jack Chambers responds to criticism that those on the sharpest edge of the housing crisis have been forgotten about in #Budget2025 pic.twitter.com/b1eDrxMPae
— TheJournal.ie (@thejournal_ie) October 1, 2024
Finance Minister Jack Chambers responds to criticism that those on the sharpest edge of the housing crisis have been forgotten about in the Budget.
“Extending the Help To Buy scheme to 2029, I think it’ll add to the 50,000 people who’ve benefited from it to this point, to give them certainty as they’re saving for the future. But the key focus for me, from a housing perspective, was actually around what we’re doing with the Land Development Agency. An additional €1.25 billion will help drive more social affordable housing for those where buying a home may be out of reach. And then secondly, to support renters, an uplift in the tax credit for this year, a further uplift next year, provides direct support for renters who I know are feeling the pressure with high rents in our economy.”
With all this largesse being spread around, is it a signal that an election is imminent?
Finance Minister Jack Chambers insisted the government had a “job of work to do” and his focus was now on advancing the Finance Bill through the Dail.
“I’m committed to serving in office,” he said.
“As the Taoiseach and others have set out, we still have a job of work to do. I have to try and advance the Finance Bill. We’ve the Planning and Development Bill and other important pieces of legislation that we’re keen to advance.”
Asked about the prospect of an autumn election, Minister for Public Expenditure Paschal Donohoe told the PA news agency: “The government still has plenty of work to do. We’ve just literally only announced the budget.
“We now have to do all the legislation to underpin all the spending for next year and Minister Chambers has to do the Finance Bill, which always takes time to do.
“So it’s up to the Taoiseach (and) the party leaders to discuss the timing of the next election. We’ve plenty to do now in the coming weeks and months.”
There’s been some debate about whether the bumper child benefit payments should be paid to everyone regardless of means.
The government confirmed today that two double child benefit payments will be paid before the end of the year, one in November and one in December.
This is unprecedented in that it’s usually just one bonus payment, often referred to as the ‘Christmas bonus’.
But should wealthy parents benefit to the same degree as less well off?
“You might think a lot of people don’t need it, well, if they don’t need it they can give it back,” Minister Heather Humphreys said this evening.
With that, I think it’s time to call an end to today’s liveblog.
Thank you for joining us today for today’s giveaway, sorry Budget.
We’ll have plenty of reaction and analysis coming up over the coming hours and days so stay tuned and if you have any particular topics or angles you’d like us to take a look at please email: news@thejournal.ie .
All the best.
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Heard them on the radio yesterday complaining that they haven’t got a pay rise in 8 years. Well guess what most people haven’t. If I was given an 8% pay rise over the next 2 years I’d take hand and all
You should join a union then mickmc. Solidarity with bus drivers, the Luas drivers, the Tesco and Cadbury workers, the 999 operators, the nurses, the teachers and all workers struggling to obtain a greater share of the wealth which we create. As the data clearly shows, the trend over the past few decades has been overwhelmingly in the opposite direction with greater and greater wealth accumulating to capital owners and less and less to the workers. This has disastrous consequences for society and it’s long past time we reversed the rotten system which sees 62 individuals now holding the same wealth as the poorest half of the globes population, 3500 million people.
I was in a union once. Paid my sub’s for 6 years. When there was a meeting with management Siptu sent out the most useless sods god ever invented. Management wiped the floor with him. Our shop Stewart did all the dealing after that with him sitting in the background like a little school boy.
Maybe they are right then to move it in order to get that pay rise instead of moaning about no pay rise on the Journal…
@paul Please speak for yourself,
you should have picked a better shop steward
Ah Wally, You cant beat a bit of copy and paste first thing at the morning :-)
The faster we have self drive public transport the better.
along with a totally private health system, old gabby?
In fairness Mickmc it sounds like you should look at a new job…unless you pulling 6 figures and a raise impossible.
Billy, bus drivers are not creators of wealth. They work in a subsidised loss-making industry. You say to joina union but most people can’t do what transport workers do. If we demand more than our employers can afford or are willing to part with, our employers go out of business and we lose our jobs. If we want more money, we have to provide more value. There’s a limit to how well somebody can drive a bus, and thus, necessarily, a (quite low) limit to how much one can earn from doing so in a free market.
So your shop steward did a good job then mickmc? Most workers benefit from the battles won by earlier unions. 40 hour week, minimum wage, workplace health and safety etc etc etc. The cause of the majority working class is only ever advanced significantly and sustainably through collective action, solidarity and struggle against the capitalist system. The lives of the majority are only bearable because of the many battles fought and won by the earlier socialists and unions. None of these concessions to the working class were willingly gifted by capital but we’re fought and won over centuries of socialist struggle.
Derek,
The public transport system is a form of real wealth as the 400k commuters who use Dublin Bus daily will understand. And it’s not mean to be a profit making enterprise, it’s a public service which is a collectively held resource.
And the fact that a public transport system is loss making in monetary terms should not matter in the slightest because at a macro government/central bank level money is instantly available to those entities issue the currency. They don’t need the public transport system to generate money.
It’s important to differentiate between money and real wealth/ resources. Money is how we measure wealth and also a claim on society’s resources. Our fiat currency money is created (and deleted) at will on the computer keyboards of the world’s commercial and central banks. At a macro level there can never be a shortage of a fiat floating currency like the Euro, sterling dollar etc.
In contrast to the instant availability of money, the real wealth of goods and services that we all depend on (including the transport network) is created by the labour and skill of the working class from the raw material of the planet. Everything from the food in our bellies to the clothes on our backs right up to the most sophisticated technology is made by the workers.
Money is a claim on that real wealth produced by the working class and this is where money derives it’s power. The capitalist system peddles the illusion that there is a shortage of money (balance the books, reduce the deficit, live within your means etc) in order to oppress and control the working class who are the real creators of wealth.
@prouesse – no not at all.. what is the correlation between driverless public transport and private healthcare?
Every boss in this country says the same thing. My company is running at a loss and we can’t afford to raise wages. Then they drive their new BMWs home to their mansions and relax with a nice Cuban and a glass of champers. Of course they are telling the truth. They are pillars of the community and have great respect for their workers. Sure they do.
Billy, thanks for the warmed-up Marxism 101.
I’m not denying that public transport is a valuable service, or even that it should be subsidised. What I object to is the idea that those of us who actually have to produce more value to get more money should pay for those who do not. This is surely something you can get on board with.
I, as a skilled labourer, a real creator of wealth, can earn in proportion to the level of my skills and the quantity of my labour. If I want to earn more, I will have to learn more or do more. I will have to create more value. I can’t keep creating the same amount of value and expect to earn ever more money.
Bus drivers see things differently. They want to do the same job to the same level but be paid ever more for it. As much as you think this can be done by printing more money, the reality is that it comes from bus users and from taxpayers.
If all Dublin Bus drivers were suddenly wiped out, do you think there would be a shortage of applicants for their jobs? Do you think people with all the necessary skills to drive and press buttons would stick their noses up at the paltry conditions Dublin Bus is offering? Or do you think there would be hundreds of applications for each available job?
Dublin Bus drivers can demand such high salaries not because they are irreplacable creators of wealth but because they have formed a powerful cartel that is able to hold the city to ransom.
@Billy. The shop steward did. I wasn’t paying him my sub’s every week. We were paying Siptu who were happy to take our money but didn’t want to do anything in return. They’re only interested in the big companies where they can keep themselves in the headlines.
@Tuot Tuot. Thanks for your concern but I’m happy enough where I am. I’m on reasonable good money. Probably a bit above the industrial norm for my profession but that not down to any unions, that down to hard work and a proven track record over many years.
Derek,
What you’re advocating is that all workers stay isolated and disorganized so that capital can exploit them to the maximum possible degree. Worker’s organizations (unions) are the antidote to that exploitation.
And you’re not paying for the Dublin bus drivers. Money is never a constraint at a macro level as explained. It’s just a tool to measure and allocate the real resources that society has created.
What you’re really paying for is your boss’s profits, through your labour. Capitalist enterprise will not create a single job or produce a single product or service without the expectation of that profit. Therefore capital only ever employs labour in order to exploit it to a greater or lesser degree. The sole objective of capitalist enterprise is the accumulation of profit and that profit is generated by the workers in the excess value they create over and above their wages. That is the essence of capitalism and it’s inherently exploitative. That profit is maximized by paying labour as little as possible and working people as hard as possible. This is the class divide and why the interests of the classes are always opposing.
So labour never receives the full value of the wealth it has created and over time this inevitably leads to the vast inequality with the majority labour class working to enrich an obscenely wealthy oligarchy. In addition, capital rents out its accumulated assets (e.g. property) back to the working class garnering further profit for itself while producing nothing.
We can see the logical result of this system as in the earlier example where the 62 richest individuals on the planet now hold the same wealth as 3500 million people, the poorest half of the globe’s population many of whom starve to death or survive in abject poverty. None of this in inevitable. It’s the inevitable result of the dominant socio economic model which will ultimately have to be replaced by a system which gears economic activity to meeting peoples’ needs if we want to improve the conditions for the vast majority of humanity.
@old gabby
Your point of view is the correlation.
Billy, I’m not suggesting that workers shouldn’t organise, merely that the only reason this particular group of workers is in a position to make demands is because they are part of a powerful cartel who can hold the city to ransom.
They are not up against a fat cat businessman who must make the choice between a smaller profit margin and going out of business. They are fighting the average worker who, to earn the paltry share of the wealth they create, must at the very least turn up for work. For some, the cost of a taxi will wipe out anything they can earn that day. (Incidentally, are taxi drivers scabs, capitalist profit-mongers or organised wealth creators?)
I accept that your goal is the complete collapse of society and that this is the reason you support the bus drivers but for those of us who would like civilisation to continue (if, ideally, somewhat modified) the demands of these drivers are absurd.
What wealth? We’re still borrowing money to pay for current expenditure. Yes, it’s wrong that so few control so much wealth, but the bus drivers aren’t going to get their pay rise from those 62 people, it’s the taxpayer that’ll be left with the bill, or else we’ll have to increase government borrowing even more, saddling our children with a huge debt to be repaid
You write a lot of words without knowing what they really mean. How can money measure wealth if it is limitless? If the central banks create a tonne of money they just cause inflation and asset bubbles because funds get misallocated when market effiiciencies are interfered with. The fact that Dublin Bus is loss making means that it is inefficient and the govt is subsidising those inefficiencies with real wealth ectracted from elsewhere in the economy.
I had to explain why we can’t just print more money to my 11 year old niece recently, at least she has an excuse for being simple minded , she is a child , what is your excuse Billy ?
What about the guards ?
You support them too
It’s not Dublin bus that are putting unnecessary inconvenience on us. Stop trying to shift the blame SIPTU.
How is it unnecessary? The fact DB will let the strike go ahead shows how little they think of their staff and the general public. I’m fully behind the drivers, got myself a nice push bike on done deal for the strike.
Yeah, this is rich all right. The unions think it’s okay to have THREE 48-hour stoppages affecting all commuters who use the buses for work, school, etc. Now they’re crying ‘unfair’ because of a three hour break in service from 9 pm onwards, when it’ll mostly only affect socialising. What a shower of hypocrites and muppets.
Only effect socialising? ?,, so shift workers and late workers don’t count . DB are playing the propaganda game again and where is Mr Late Late shane Ross in all of this ? Silent as usual only willing to mouthpiece on portfolios not his
I said MOSTLY. Of course some shift workers and others in things like the service industry will be affected. But in nowhere near the same numbers as the regular working hours people and students will be over the following 48 hours. Stop being so blinkered, open your eyes, and read what was actually written.
Alan I totally agree with you, jumparoo is obviously home as snug as a bug after his/ her half five finish to realise that half the city actually work past nine !!!!!
so there’ll be a few days without buses, stop crying like a little baby
“Half the city work past nine”. Where is that statistic from?
This union is a joke BLAME BLAME BLAME EVERYONE ELSE BUT US Your union is going on strike they want busses back in their garages safely and now the company at fault JOKE
HI HOW ARE YOU
I knew since the luas strike it would come to this. Thanks Luas drivers. You share of f~~k who started this. Now me with hundreds of commuters are going to be down wages. I wonder will Wally has something to say about this. he’s been on every comment section about the Luas strike.
so the bus drivers showed be cowed by the managers and give up their right to agitate so you won’t have to make alternative travel arrangements? stop navel gazing.
@gunnarsahn, while the drivers absolutely have the right to go on strike, they’re not entitled to sympathy from the public that is being inconvenienced by their action, and let’s face it, the public transport on the whole is an absolute shambles, not only in Dublin, but Ireland wide, which is not the driver’s fault, but the fault of shortsighted politicians and management, but the drivers will have to bear the anger of the public.
And frankly, i don’t understand someone who turns down an offered pay rise only to go on strike for twice as much as has been offered, because they feel like it.
Privatize Dublin Bus now……
So dublin bus workers are complaining because luas drivers got a raise and want the same… hummmmmm wonder what would happen if I told my boss the restaurant down the road had given their staff a rose n I wanted the same, short answer is I’d be told to drop my cv down to them as I wasn’t getting it off them !!!
He might think you’re hitting on him.
Try look at the facts before trying to compare apples and oranges. DB staff had been approved a 6% rise in 2007/8 but DB pulled this. DB staff have contributed 4 different major productivity deals which included earnings reductions and increased workloads WITHOUT increase in earnings to bring the company back into profit, which we succeeded only for the government to reduce subvention again and again and the NTA taking more than 2 million from the profits of DB. Staff are not Luas they are DB and are only seeking what is fair and due from all the productivity deals already given.
Paul you need to stand up for yourself in your workplace a bit more. stop letting your boss walk on you like a doormat.
In which week did DB make a profit?
2013/14/15
Rickshaw workers out next !
Could the journal do it’s research, drivers, clerical, maintenance and inspectors are taking industrial action, so kindly don’t blame the drivers, but when did doing research ever stop the journal, twitter posts are all that count on this site
its actually page-views and ad revenue
Drivers are taking industrial action so don’t blame the drivers. Okay.
If you want more money, put the effort in and get an education. You get paid for doing what the rest of us do getting to work….drive. With a tax payer funded guaranteed pension, you’re already overpaid.
Plenty of staff in Dublin Bus have an education I’m sure, no???
I am a tax payer and my pension ,shit as it will be is funded by me not the government purse. Also I have an education 3rd level, I have also given service to this country as a member of the DF before I joined DB. While you sit in your judgemental B licence vehicle as I presume single occupant car look to your left and watch the vehicles carrying up to 90 passengers at a go negotiating the road systems. You do not do what public /private transport providers do you just drive.
Lets be honest here, everyone is talking about Dublin Bus and the Unions but everybody appears to be ignoring the huge elephant in the room – the disgraceful level of subvention by The State in our Public Transport system. This subvention has been been regularly cut back since 2008! Ireland in fact has one of the lowest if not THE LOWEST subsidy in the EU for public transport! If we look to countries in Europe who we are always pointing out have “best practice” for this that and the other we can see that their subventions are 10 to 20 times higher than that of Ireland’s! Public Transport is supposed to be for the Citizens of the whole State not just for Citizens in selected areas of it! The profitable sections of Public Transport along with State subvention are supposed to subsidize the non profitable areas while maintaining a coordinated practical Public Transport across the whole country! Motorists in this country are also been crucified for cars that are not a luxury but a necessity due to the lack of proper Public Transport. Not a great little country for Public Transport!
@warthog, this report seems to indicate state subvention has actually increased, but the biggest contributor to cost both at Dublin Bus and Bus Eireann are the wages
Larissa…Here you are from the Irish Times this morning:
Two sources
Dublin Bus in essence receives its money from two sources; passenger fares and exchequer funding. Unions say that in most European countries this ratio is about 50:50, but in Dublin Bus 75 per cent of revenue comes from fares.
The level of State funding has fallen from €64 million in 2013 to €57.7 million last year. However, the company has benefitted from a growing economy and falling fuel costs. It recorded profits of over €11million in 2014 and €10.3 million last year.
Thank you, that clears things up
Good fight for the wages you are owed the days of companies bullying employees with unfair wages and conditions need to be halted. The luas drivers were owed that pay simple as, privatise Dublin Bus really maybe get Apple to take it over…..
There is 13 billion Rotten Apple money that is unneeded according to government. I think the DB pay rise can be afforded.
Dumbest comment so far
Bunch of greedy ignorant w@nkers. There was not a person in this country that couldn’t see this coming when the Luas drivers got their undeserved raise. Now the public transportation will be held hostage yet again…
In 2011 they earned 39,900 after ten years service. 4th highest anong 75 cities including berlin, london etc.i think that is more than enough considering they require no actial qualifications
Really Karen, iv to renew my license every 5 years with full medical, must complete a CPC course each year and I’m continually updating my driving skills through in house training syllabus. Compare cost of living to each country and then see how the figures stack up.
Compare the cost of living in those other 75 cities. Dublin is very expensive – do you expect people to live on fresh air pet?
Perfect timing with the beginning of operation transformation. Everyone walk or run to work. It will add years to your life.
Innocent kids are been slaughtered in Syria.
Negating everything else?
I’ve to drive into Dublin myself on Friday. I imagine there’ll be more cars than usual on the road, because of the strike. What’s the story with driving in bus lanes on a day when there’s not actually any buses?
We’re a city with 24 hour bus lanes although buses dont run 24 hours, so I cant imagine them opening the bus lanes over the strike period, even though they probably should
The bus lanes won’t be open to private cars according to this piece
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/five-things-you-need-to-know-about-driver-action-35028288.html
Bus lanes should be open to vehicles with three or more occupants….
Just drive in the bus lanes. Dint be looking for permission.
If you’re stopped, just sing “Nee Naw” so people know you’re driving an ambulance, be grand.
Bus Lanes are used by more than just Dublin Bus, hence they won’t be open. Air Coach, Bus Eireann, Mortons, Cyclists etc.
“If you’re stopped, just sing “Nee Naw” so people know you’re driving an ambulance, be grand.”
God, you’re an idiot!
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